Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Carnatic composers (other than performing vidwans)
mannari
Posts: 33
Joined: 04 May 2011, 14:08

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by mannari »

hamsa wrote "It is so hilarious that this statement is made by one of the emptiest vessels in this thread " . I totally accept your judgement and I am not ashamed of it. Contrats ! for the first time you are correct ! you said emptiest vessels which is in plural. Thanks for being my partner. Also it needs slightly broader mind to understand what it was all about when i said SOME ONE might have created in the name of sriOVK during 1940 on odd kruthis. Instead of watching a statue, it is better if it is learnt what triggered the debate at that time, on whom and why his kruthis or name is not on par with other greats if all those krithis were created before trinities or explore why trinities , say Sri Thyagaraja did not mention ovk's name, when he gracefully mentions, say Sri Purandaradasa. May be he inculded his name in his Endaro Mahanubavalu .

uday_shankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by uday_shankar »

mannari wrote:SOME ONE might have created in the name of sriOVK during 1940 on odd kruthis.
Sir/Madam, I have some questions:
1) How did you come to this amazing, and in my opinion unlikely, conclusion ? Especially after all that has been discussed ?
2) What's special about the year 1940 ?
3) Also, why are the kritis any more "odd" than you...or me ?

chitravina ravikiran
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Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

S R Iyer wrote:
Sri Rangaramanuja Iyengar also mentions that OVK compositions, preserved over centuries, were tuned in the early twentieth century.
RRI was wrong about this.

1. The compositions were very much tuned by OVK (although there could be a few exceptions where original tunes may not have been accessible). NKB has been categorical in maintaining that his family has preserved orally the songs over generations and also made copies of them periodically.

2. My book - OVK Life and Contributions lists more than 30 melodic and rhythmic features that not only show that OVK was a great vaggeyakara but also someone with original thinking. The kind of talas and the compatibility of dhaatu and maatu seen in his compositions as well as the 10 or more distinct ways he has handled madhyamakala alone would suffice to show us that it is his musicianship.

3. As RRI himself states, even a common form like krti took varied dimensions in OVK's hands and the tillana attained great heights in his hands. RRI has overlooked the obvious - how could they if they were not his tunes?!

4. These compositions were already handled by people like Raju Shastri and Krishna Shastri in mid 1800s - which means that they were not tuned in early 20th cent.

5. I have recently made an Excel spreadsheet (not yet completed) which lists Raga population and clusters seen in OVK's compositions and he has at least used 100 plus ragas - obviously some have more than one composition in them.
SSI rendering OVK...?
Good question. I had lots of opportunity to ask him about this and he confessed that by the time he got to realise the composer's worth, it was too difficult for him to learn new songs and render them to his satisfaction. In fact, his quote was made sometime in the 1990s. Others who did render them include Musiri, Madurai Mani Iyer and perhaps GNB (though I have not heard audios of this). Dancers Kamala Laxman and Dr Vyjayantimala Bali and others in the Kuchipidi tradition like Dr Vempatti Chinnasatyam took up more songs fairly early on...

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

Vazhuvoor Ramiah Pillai's son claimed in a recent TV program that it was his father who first chreographed some of OVK' s songs for stage performances. Perhaps RK can contact him at chennai for more info...

sr_iyer
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by sr_iyer »

Sri Ravikiran, sincere thanks for your responses.

Uday, reference your ask for the exact words as quoted from the book, RRI mentions, while writing about OVK. "At the dawn of this century, there were two boys. With extraordinary pluck, they clothed the words with appropriate music culled from other classical compositions." -- pp 215/216, Chapter 18, from "History of South Indian (Carnatic) Music. From Vedic Times to present. 1972"

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Ponbhairavi »

others who did render them include Musiri, Madurai Mani Iyer and perhaps GNB (though I have not heard audios of this). Dancers Kamala Laxman and Dr Vyjayantimala Bali and others in the Kuchipidi tradition like Dr Vempatti Chinnasatyam took up more songs fairly early on...
chitravina ravikiran

Not only SSI ,surprizingly even MSS who had the astounding felicity to learn quickly new compositions from various sources and languages had ( to the best of my knowledge) not rendered any composition of O V K. I have used the word even because she was one of the pillars of the Tamil Isai movement and has sung thirupugazh and excerpts from silappadikaram and Alwars

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

..or even VVS who helped tune Ambujam krishna, P Thooran etc., or DKJ too who brought life into P Sivan's compositions.. Too bad DKP didn't get to know of OVK or even Alatthoor who introduced Tiruppugazh to CM and the redoubtable ARI who certainly would have given OVK an elevated status :(
It is indeed a mystery that none of the stalwarts did not get to know him.
Was NKB very possessive?

rshankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by rshankar »

cmlover wrote:Vazhuvoor Ramiah Pillai's son claimed in a recent TV program that it was his father who first chreographed some of OVK' s songs for stage performances. Perhaps RK can contact him at chennai for more info...
He did choreograph the rAgamAlika version of tAyE yaSOda for his student, (as she was then) Kumari Kamala - it may have been the first recorded instance of this.
Ponbhairavi wrote:Not only SSI ,surprizingly even MSS who had the astounding felicity to learn quickly new compositions from various sources and languages had ( to the best of my knowledge) not rendered any composition of O V K.
May not be entirely true. In a program announcement for one of the dance performances of Kumari Radha and Kumari Anandi, with a statement that Smt. MSS would be singing for the abhinaya pieces, the list includes tAyE yaSOdA. Again, the choreographer would have been vazhuvUr Sri rAmaiyyA piLLai. Cienu may be able to check with his mother about which version came first chronologically, her's for the stage, or Smt. Kamala's for a movie.

cienu
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cienu »

Dear CML and Ravi,
Checked with Amma.

Thaye Yashoda was choregraphed by Sri Vazhuvoor Ramaiah Pillai for Amma and she first danced to this in 1944/45 or whereabouts with Smt MSS singing the same. It was Sri Musiri who taught MS and Radha the song .

At this particular stanza,

"bAlanenru tAvi aNaittEn aNaitta ennai mAlaiyiTTavan pOl vAyil muttamiTTaaNDi
bAlanallaDi un maghan jAlam migha seyyum kriSNan nAlu pErgal kETka colla nANamigha lAgudaDi"

Roughly translated meaning (courtesy Karnatik.com)

Quote:

"Seeing such a beautiful young boy (or child? - baalan) I leapt (taavi) to embrace him (aNaittEn). But to the one who embraced him, me (yennai), like a husband (maalai iTTavan - one who garlanded) he planted a kiss (muttam) on my lips (vaayil)! Yashoda, your son (un magan) is no boy - who plays all these tricks. I feel ashamed in front of others for this kind of embarrassment he gave me. I feel very bad, when many people hear this, what they will think about me, for what he did without my consent. "

Unquote:

the audience would burst into laughter seeing Amma's portrayal of embarrassment :) Rasikamani T.K.Chidambaranatha Mudaliar in particular was a great fan of Amma's dancing and would say repeatedly how wonderfully she was able to bring this stanza to life.

Unfortunately there exists no recording of this song sung so many times by Smt MSS. :(

rshankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by rshankar »

Cienu - thank you! Lovely description. Sad that these (both the dance and the music) were not recorded for posterity.

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Ponbhairavi »

To be honest, in the last century bhajanai sampradaya bhagavathars and their music were considered infra dig by the kutcheri bhagavathars(who after the generation of Chembai and Muthiah bhagavathar etc. preferred to be called vidwans).So also dance singers and accompanists and even harikatha accompanists were considered lower level. Reputed kutcheri violinists and mridangists would not play for bhajans and dances as they considered it below dignity. A little of male chauvinism was also a component. But the upsurge of atheism and anti brahmin mentality were the main factors for the ostracism to bhajanai.In common parlance the word bhajanai had even acquired a pejorative connotation( yenneda office le bhajanai pannriya !!)
the fact that OVK has composed songs in praize of Jeyadevar and Radha shows that he is essentially a bhajanai bhagavathar ( hence his propensity to dance and jathis as distinct from other composers ) and therefore his compositions were considered "untouchables ' by the kutcheri vidwans . This trend started relenting after the advent of swami Haridos giri and now with the resurgence of Bhakthi, growing popularity of swamijis,Gurujis, Yoga etc. we find sampradaya bhajans even in the programme schedules of reputed sabhas with the changed nomenclature of Nama Sangirthanam. Good. Let OVK be resurrected fully though belatedly.
rajagopalan

anoopnm007
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010, 09:48

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by anoopnm007 »

Hi,

A small digression. On a lighter note, I think this is the right place to post.
The so called Backfire Effect was the output of a research... Please read, those who are interested.
http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/ ... #more-1218

Regards

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

Thx cienu!
Next time on a big get-together you should ask Gayatri to sing Thaye yaSoda and request mom to do the abhinayam. We will have yet another historic video clip at your efforts!

I do remember how much TKC was a fervant admirer of MS who was also a strong force in directing her towards Tamizh Isai.. It is unfortunate that OVK was almost unknown in the 40's and 50's...

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

Ponbhairavi
You are on the dot in your assessments. Folks tend to forget that T himself was only a bhajana brahmin. No doubt OVK was ignored because of his compositions connected with Bhajana and Harikatha and the lack of the powerful shishya parampara..

I think the time is ripe for making a movie on OVK with the available info on his life and a good rendering of some of his kritis by a talented musician ( RK :D
If I were in India and much younger I would have loved to launch that project which will be the crowning glory for CM (Tamizh Isai). Somebody should spark the idea to JJ which will persuade a capable enterpreuneur to undertake the project...

rshankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by rshankar »

Sri Ravikiran, do you have any idea when his compositions like SrI vighnarAjam bhajEham, and svAgatam kRshNA were adopted into the kucipuDi repertoire?

hamsaa
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Joined: 06 May 2011, 21:32

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by hamsaa »

cml,

Here is a link to the rendition by D K J Sir, of a brilliant masterpiece of OVK in Anandabhairavi

http://www.musicindiaonline.com/#/album ... _DK_Vol_1/

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

Thx. Brilliant indeed!

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Ponbhairavi »

the name is mentioned as Oothukadu Subrmanya iyer--V and K are missing. I am afraid that someone might claim that this is another person !!
rajagopalan

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Shankar:
Sri Ravikiran, do you have any idea when his compositions like SrI vighnarAjam bhajEham, and svAgatam kRshNA were adopted into the kucipuDi repertoire?
I don't know exactly but would imagine that Dr Vempatti Chinnasatyam would have been one of the pioneers. There have been many Kuchipidi and BN dancers who have taken lesser known songs of OVK in recent times from me and presented them.

I must also share you my experience with about 30-40 (Indian and Sri Lankan origin) students and their gurus in Sydney the last weekend where they took up 6 pieces of OVK for a special presentation in the Sydney Music Festival. They did a commendable job considering that they learnt all the songs from our recordings on the net from sites like www.acharyanet.com or youTube. This included two Saptaratnas - Jatadhara (Todi) and Alavadennalo (Paras), Sundara Natarajam (Kharaharapriya), Gowrinatham (Vakulabharanam) etc.

PB:
he is essentially a bhajanai bhagavathar
Actually, that was considered a commendable thing since even those like Tyagaraja were similar. And OVK was never only into bhajana. He has displayed full vidwath in absolute musical terms. Some of his compositions would challenge artistes of the highest calibre - in fact, improve them enourmously, as Shri T N Seshagopalan sir mentioned in a recent video interview with me. And he has shown a great mastery in dance and operas too. These were much more closely intertwined at that time, than a few decades later, IMHO. The problem, I feel was that these remained outside the purview of 'mainstream' for quite sometime which is why a few top people wondered about its authenticity (also because they only heard a handful of relatively simpler songs initially). However, deeper study and analysis have helped us get a much clearer account of the composer's true genius.

CML:
Movie on OVK...
Great idea and I have been contemplating at least a docu-feature for sometime. It would enable dissemination of a lot of information on him.

rshankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by rshankar »

chitravina ravikiran wrote:I don't know exactly but would imagine that Dr Vempatti Chinnasatyam would have been one of the pioneers.
If kucupiDi dancers and kalAvantulu danced to these compositions even before Sri Vempati, it will be another point in dating the compositions.

Again, the point that Venkata Kavi came from a time when music, dance, and dramaturgy were not distinct should also help date him.

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Again, the point that Venkata Kavi came from a time when music, dance, and dramaturgy were not distinct should also help date him.
Precisely. Those are some of the things I have used in cross-referencing the date. But based on hard core information, there is no doubt that he was a contemporary of Serfoji, Bhaskara Raya etc. The other surmises merely strengthen and verify this.

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Ponbhairavi »

Again, the point that Venkata Kavi came from a time when music, dance, and dramaturgy were not distinct should also help date him.
The fusion of dance, music,and drama ( in telegu) for the propagation of bhakthi was in practice in full force and vigor during the Nrisimha jayanthi week-long celebrations known as bhagavatha melas and which were held in public in front of the temple regularly at Melatur and Saliamangalam hardly ten miles from Oothukadu.These melas which are being held for several centuries ( and which are continued annually even now) might have also been a source of inspiration to O V K and may perhaps be useful to fix his period
RK wrote: ......
even those like Thyagaraja were similar
May be there is some slight nuance in the category overall called as bhagavathars. Neither T nor the other two of the Trinity nor OVK called themselves as bhagavathars. T, a pious person, practiced unchavrithi did his daily pooja privately in his house for his idol[/i] and did even dolotsavam
. Of course some of his relatives or sishyas might have been present for those pujas. He did not perform any Radha kalyanam (Krishna jayanthi) or Sita kalyanam (sri Rama navami ) in public nor composed anything about Radha or Jeyadevar author of ashtapathis.It is very likely that he would not have even mentioned about Gita Govindam(because it is a Shringara maha Kavyam)
There is another category of devouts ( in which lineage have come kumbakonam Balu bhagavathar, Tiruvidaimarudhur venkataramana bhagavathar etc. of the last century). Besides their personal worship and pujas, they performed in public the bhajanai paddadi evolved and codified( by including compositions of Jeyadevar marathi sanths, Mira etc.) by the bhajanai Trinity ( Govindapuram Bhodendral, thiruvisanallur Sridhara Ayyaval and Marudanallur Sadguru swamigal) popularly known as marudanallur sampradaya bhajanai. The presence of bhajanai matam in almost all villages of TN let alone big places like Tiruvarur or Thiruvaiyaru attest to the widespread prevalence of this group worship.They perform Radha kalyanam and Sitakalyanam in public and in which jeyadavar’s Gita govindam and Narayana Thirthar’s tharangam form an integral part and in which dance and abhinayam find a place during Divya namam (Deepa pradakshinam). I think that OVK might have belonged to this category.

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

The fusion of dance, music,and drama ( in telegu) for the propagation of bhakthi was in practice in full force and vigor during the Nrisimha jayanthi week-long celebrations known as bhagavatha melas and which were held in public in front of the temple regularly at Melatur and Saliamangalam hardly ten miles from Oottukkadu
You are right. But Oottukkadu was itself one of the five centers of BM tradition at that time. The other two being Soolamangalam, Vaidyanathapuram. Sadly, today only Melattur is surviving.
Neither T nor the other two of the Trinity nor OVK called themselves as bhagavathars
Actually, T has shown a great reverence for bhagavata and bhajana sampradaya, which probably led to him creating a specific repertoire in that direction (utsava sampradaya and divyanama sankeertanas). MD, though scholarly - was liberal enough to have artistic exchanges with dancers and SS hailed from priest-clan. Probably each of these was considered a plus in its own way at that time. (Or in the least, none was considered a minus.)
There is another category of devouts - besides their personal worship and pujas, they performed in public the bhajanai paddadi I think that OVK might have belonged to this category.
OVK was very much into bhajana sampradaya and revered bhagavatas. And he was also probably into daily worship at home. Each of the charanams in his Sundara nandakumara - (Madhyamavati Saptaratna) offers arghyam, achamanam, dhoopam, deepam tamboolam etc, which are part of the 16 offerings.

But so far we don't have references/evidence from his songs which suggests that he was into public pooja/even Radha Kalyanam. Even though he composed numerous operas, he is not known to have been into musical discourses like Gopalakrishna Bharati... He was a brahmachari who shunned family bondage and reserved his communication skills only with God.
It is very likely that T would not have even mentioned about Gita Govindam(because it is a Shringara maha Kavyam)
Actually, no CM composer has mentioned Radha much and Jayadeva not at all. OVK has composed several pieces on Radha and a set of songs on Radha-Kalyanam. But he has also composed a set of songs on Rukmini Kalyanam. Both are brilliant and contrasting pieces of work.

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Ponbhairavi »

R.K.
Thanks for all your authoritative confirmations.
But so far we don't have references/evidence from his songs which suggests that he was into public pooja/even Radha Kalyanam.
I think that the very fact he has composed songs on Radha and jeyadeva and on radha kalyanam and rukmini kalyanam( which as you have said no C M composer has done) can be considered as enough internal evidence to show that he was participating in Radha kalyanam ,Sita kalyanam ,Rukmini kalyanam , which is a form of mass worship usually held in bhajanai matams or temples or in public places.
....
.He is not known to have been into musical discourse like Gopalakrishna Bharathi...
Morethan 90 % of the bhajanai sampradaya bhagavathars were not in the musical discourse, so also O.V K. Discourse is a different art form altogether. Those who are well versed in scriptures ,puranas and dharmasastras and endowed with communication skills become upanyasakars or pravachana karthas and among them those who have also godd knowledge of music distinguish themselves in musical discourse.
Quite interesting to see how many nuances!!
rajagopalan.

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

I came across a oartial recording of one of NKB's performances for Raga Tarangini, held at Avvai Home, Besant Nagar. It also contains a short speech by Smt Rukmini Arundale, founder of Kalakshetra.

There is an interesting segment where NKB explains the confusion in some circles between OVK and Svarnakkadu Venkatasubbiah (which was of course resolved soon after by him). I have requested Uday Shankar to upload it somewhere and share the link with rasikas at his early convenience. This also throws light on a few other things, as we will observe.

uday_shankar
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by uday_shankar »

chitravina ravikiran wrote:There is an interesting segment where NKB explains the confusion in some circles between OVK and Svarnakkadu Venkatasubbiah (which was of course resolved soon after by him).
Here's that portion of the audio:
http://www.mediafire.com/?pozdod9unxd7kjl

cmlover
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by cmlover »

Thanks Uday.. Do you have the full audio? Pl post..

Always_Evolving
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Always_Evolving »

A labor of love by Bhargavi Balasubramaniam assisted by a few others, is this new website on Venkata Kavi.

http://www.venkatakavi.org/

The website is inspired by Chitravina Ravikiran's research into and revival of the multiple facets of this composer's works; he has also contributed to the content.

It was launched this evening at Hamsadhwani's inaugural of their 2013 festival and followed by the energizing Namasankeertanam of Udayalur Kalyanaraman. Sri Kalyanaraman also spoke about the signal contribution of OVK to Bhajana sampradaya and sang a lovely version of 'enna punniyam seideno'.

-radhika

rajeshnat
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by rajeshnat »

shri ravikiran , bhargavi and many many more this is just a lovely website

bagyamananthu41
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by bagyamananthu41 »

I am giving lyrics of two compositions of venkata kavi..
no artists have rendered these songs,as it appears from my search of the net...except that of Shri Kiranji..a commercial one..

Have any one got the audio link..kindly share..

Pallavi: ஜடாதார சங்கரர் தேவ தேவ ஷஷங்கதர மங்கலகர கங்காதர புஜங்க-வலையிடலன்கர

Anupallavi

நகனனந்த சிடம்பரானந்தா லஹரி விஹாரா ச்வச்ச்சந்த குடர பிணக குரங்க கொலஹல தண்டவ கலந்தக கிரிட கிரட கிரிஜா சமேட கிரிஷ சிடிக்ஹண்ட உட்டண்டவர

Charanam

1.பழைய லோகம் அதுன பரம பவன பாக்ட ஜனவன

2.மடமய தருக வன முனி மனோஹர நிபுன-மகடன டனதனட

3.பாமரஜன குமுட கன்ற பாகடேய நிலகந்த வர்ச துரங்க para பரமேஷ பாசத்ர மடஹர பஹு வர டாக மது முரஹாரி சன்னுட

4.நிரவதி கமனிய ரமனிய ரமணி முக்ஹா ஜ்ஹல ஜ்ஹல மதுபா முக்ஹா ஷரனகட ஜன பலான தமசடி ஹர பாசதர கன்ற பண்காமுக்ஹா

5.சமகன ராசா புரிடஜா முக்ஹா சது மனச நிரந்தர காரிட
நகப்ஹோக பரிவிடமட்புட விரஜிட்டாங்க வபரஜிட்டாங்க வர

6.பழைய லோக அதுன பரம பவன பாக்ட ஜனவன
கல கல கபால விதாரண கைலாச கிரி சடன த்ரிநயன





Aganita mahimadbhuta Venkata kavi..

Gaula

Adi tala



Pallavi :

Aganita mahimadbhuta Ilia sada karsita rajasadi sadhyatmaka
Prapanca paripala ananta paryanga shayana namo namaste

Anupallavi :

Khaga turanga karunalavala madhukaitabadi suraripu kulakala

(madhyamakalam)

Kamala mukha kamalashillmukha suragana sajjana natangriyuga

Charanaml :

Namo namaste purusottama namo namaste narayana purusottama
Namo namaste punarapi punarapi narayana ananta lokapate

Charanam2 :

Shrtajana kali kalmasa hara danavakula bhanjana rama ramana (namo)

Charanam3 :

Manasamrga nanavidha mukti vidhayaka caracaratmaka rupa (namo)

Charanam4 :

Vidura kuyoginam pada pankaja vinuta janavana ramita paramlsa (namo)

Charanam5 :

Dana sau mana tapoya sadaya tantra mantra phala dayaka mangala
Gana sampada naradadi muniglya manavara klrti vidharana (namo)

Charanam6 :

Ksira paravara taranga mrdu tarala panka japataye
Ksiti japataye ksitlpadaye dinakara candra padaye padaye
Sadhu janampadaye vrajapadaye tana yoga japatapa sadhana
Sanglta paramoda vidhayaka padaye madhu muraharaye (namo)

Charanam7 :

Divya mangal vigraha shobhamana jaladha varna gambhlra shubanga
Dhlra dharonnata vilasa bhasura deva deva mahanlya uttunga
Bhava timira ghora haramikira koti vijita kamaladala karuna panga
Bhavita vlhita nimitta sad prema bhagavata jana hrdayanta ranga

Charanam8 :

Candra jatadhara bhagavannata daitya varya manu kutumbavena

Janakanka dhruva mucukunda videha gati raghu nakusa mandatanu

Candanu bali randi deva pippilada bhurisena dillpa

Udanga devala sarasvata shakara parashara vijaya vidura adurt-

Tayambarlksa vibhisana atishaya mahimottama citta bhava

Maruta tanaya pramukhadi bhagavata vinuta nirantara mano ramana (namo)

Samoda gopijana brndaraka sarasanga sundara radhapate

Sarvada bharita gogana govardhana tarana bhujanga shirasl natana (aganita)

Above got from net..

bhargavi_b
Posts: 9
Joined: 15 Jan 2013, 08:46

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by bhargavi_b »

bagyamananthu: Here is the link to the correct lyrics of all the Saptaratnas of Oottukkadu Venkata Kavi in English. Please refer to these. http://www.venkatakavi.org/ovk/images/p ... Lyrics.pdf

The notations for the same are available in this link : http://www.acharyanet.com/oottukkadu-ve ... tna-krtis/

Listen to a preview of some of the Saptaratnas by clicking on the player given on this page : http://www.venkatakavi.org/ovk/2012-07- ... tnas.html#

The audio CD used to be available as part of Rajalakshmi Audio. I am not sure if the audio company has given away the rights or still has it.

seeksha
Posts: 20
Joined: 02 Apr 2008, 00:17

Chora - composition by Venkatakavi

Post by seeksha »

I was listening to Sri Ravikiran sing chora, a compostion in Gaula by Venkatakavi.

http://www.venkatakavi.org/ovk/audio-video.html
I found very interesting phrases in this composition. Here is a translation attempt of the charanam.

gōparāja tanaya - The son of the Lord of Gopas (Nandagopa)
bhuvana mangaḷa – The very auspiciousness of this world

kumuda hita charaṇa jāla – Has the moon like toe nails
pāpaharaṇa dinakara - the sun that removes sins
(kmudahita denotes the Moon and dinakara the Sun.)

manasi-ja-vrṣha – The most superior one that manifests in a(devotes) mind.
bhānu nandini taṭalōla – plays in the banks of Yamuna (bhanu nandini)
(vrshabhAbu nandini is Sri Radha, bhanu nandini is Yamuna..)

Venkatakavi is one of the earliest composers from the south to have sung about Srimati Radha. Several of his compositions point to her leelas with Krishna. There are exclusive compositions on her like Brindavana nilaye, madhava hridi kelini etc.

In many of the Brindavana Sampradayas there is a general rule as to not mention Sri Radha directly, but rather use gUDa (secret ways) to point to her. Sri Vallabhacharya uses phrases like Priyaa, sridhama sahodari etc as alternate names. The gosamis of Chaitanya Sampradaya have interpreted the ‘yugala gitam’ of Srimad Bhagavatam to point to the dual Radha and Krishna, but with indirect phrases.

Venkatakavi seems to be very familiar with this tradition. He uses the phrase ‘vrisha bhanu nandini’ to denote Radha, but the meaning of the words do not point to Radharani. This shows his acquaintance with saints from the Brindavan tradition.

( An alternative interpretation would be to read taTa as body curves of Radha Rani, but I am not sure of such an usage. Then manasija could mean cupid.)

neepa taru – Kadamba tree
nikara - heap
tarasā - quickly
adirooḍa – mounted
neerada – cloud

He looks like a quick rain cloud that has descended under the Kadamba tree platform. This is an abhuta kalpana, meaning an unrealistic, but an apt comparison. A cloud doesn’t descent under a tree, but the dark Krishna sitting on the platform under the dark Kadamba tree makes the composer wonder as though a rain bearing cloud had descended under the tree.

agaṇita – the inconsiderable one.

kanakachēla – One who wears a golden dress

santāpa timira – Destroys misery

kalikalmaṣha hata – Destroys the pangs of kali

parandhāmā - the eternal aboard

paramabhāgavata chitta chora – the one who steals the heart of the ultimate Bhagavata.

Radhe Krishna...

bagyamananthu41
Posts: 25
Joined: 15 Feb 2012, 09:09

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by bagyamananthu41 »

Some of the unsung compositions...

Ragam Shuddha Saveri

Thalam Roopakam



Pallavi

THakku nigrailla swami –yengal,

Sarasa Rajagopala Sawmi,

Tharu vennayum podadendru, marupadi oru thotharavidum



Anupallavi

Vanathin maamalar veesi vandhe nindralum,

Kanatha chaya kondayil thogai katti nindralum,

Manathin azhagellam mugathil kaanuthe ,

Vambu cheyya yendru vandharpor thonuthe-un,

Gunathai yennavum , yen manam naanuthe,

Kottavaa , yen manam kollayai poguthe.



Charanam

Yengal yasodaikku ippadi oru pillai yeno vandhu pirantheeo, oho,

Pongu paalkadal poi thuyil thythathum , podhathu yendru ingu vandheeo-aanaal,

Angayil thangidum theenkuzhal yeno-un,

Azhaginil mayangathaar yarukkum thano,

Pongum uvagayum punnagai yeno ,

Podakuraikku indha vambugal yeno.


2) Ragam Vaantha

Thalam aadhi



Pallavi

Thedariya selvame , vaa,

Thingal chadaimudi gangai aninthidum ,

Yengal irai tharum ingithame .



Anupallavi

Needoli Mahendra neela mani kooti,

Nerthi perum magudam aarayum chooti

Kooda un nethiyidai sindhooram theeti,

Kozhi neerum kunkumum theeti mukuram katti,

Kothodu manam Kadamba malar maalayum,

Muthamidum vagayara ,

Kundamaravinda makarandhamodu gandhamura,

Vindayani munthuravaga,

Kurui nagai tharam polivura kanda ,

Kollayai pona manam kooda,

Athikamarai veethikal pala nithiyariyum padi muyala,

Mathiyamukha ninathu kazhal pathiyavena yengum.


3) Ragam Nayagi

Thalam AAdhi



Pallavi

Varunikka thiranillaye ,

Mathavam ulla Nanda gopa Maharajanum , yasodai yenum antha,

Madarasiyum kadalodu Kannanai vari anaithidum chedhi anaithayum.



Anupallavi

Darani mudhalana lokam,

‘Darani mudalana pathinalu lokam,

SAnkyam thathuvam pala pala yogam,

Param porul ithuvennum pazhamurai Vedam,

Parthathum illai , yengum kettathumillai , indha,

Paravasathil veru ondrum ninavum illai.



Charanam

Chalangai ondru noothanam -kattiya neram,

Thalar nadai nadantha pothu olithana kalam,

Kalangi acham pol yenthai yena padum,


4) Raga Gowri manohari

Thalam AAdhi



Pallavi

Virundhu ondru aaguthu paarum-ulle ,

Vena idam kidakku vaarum



Anupallavi

Arunthavamana suka muni eenthaan,

Aanandammai oruvan undu magizhhndaan,

Thirumba thirumba kodi kodi per undaar,

Seekiram vaarum , umakku nalla yogam thaan.



Charanam

1.Eeraru vidamana pakam –itharkku,

Eedo inayo nala paakam –ingu,

Varatha perkalellam kaakam,

Vandiruntha perkalakku nalla yogam



2.Chathira kuzhambu konjam podavo,

Sandekathukku konjam podavo,

Thaanai mathiram irandirandu podavo-indha,

Panthiyil innum yenna sangosamo



3.Kannan narum kadahye payasam –engum,

Kana kidaikkathu ithuve nijam,

Vanna vanna rasa leelaye rasam-Kaiyal,

Vangi vangi unnum umakku ulagengum kaivasam.

Will the artists take note?

priyaram78
Posts: 393
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:57

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by priyaram78 »

Lovely composition. Thanks for sharing. Yes there are many compositions of sri Venkatakavi which have not been rendered. Wish musicians with their bhakthi filled voices make us feel Sri Venkatakavi has come back to life and give us a glimpse of his devotion by rendering his compositions !

Lakshman
Posts: 14019
Joined: 10 Feb 2010, 18:52

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Lakshman »

The shuddhasAvEri song is tanakku nigarillA ..,,

thanjavooran
Posts: 2972
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 04:44

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by thanjavooran »

A share from my friend
in Tamil

Oothukadu Venkata Subbaiyer


கண்ணபிரானை நேரில் தரிசித்து கவிபாடிய அருளாளர்களில் வடநாட்டு ஜெயதேவருக்கு இணையானவர் ஊத்துக்காடு வேங்கடகவி. இவருடைய பிறப்பைப் பற்றிய வரலாறு கிடைக்கவில்லை. ராமச்சந்திர வாதூலர் பரம்பரையில் வந்தவர் இவர். தந்தையிடமே ஆரம்ப இசை நுணுக்கங்களைக் கற்றுக்கொண்டார். எனினும், ஊத்துக்காடு வேங்கடகவிக்கு பகவான் ஸ்ரீகிருஷ்ணனே குருவாக இருந்து அருள்பாலித்ததாகக் கூறுவர்.

தஞ்சை அரசர்களின் மானியமாக ஒன்பது கிராமங்கள் ராமச்சந்திர வாதுலருக்கு அளிக்கப்பட்டது. இவரது தந்தையார் ஏழைகளிடம் இரக்கம் கொண்டவர். தானதர்மம் செய்தில் ஆர்வம் உள்ளவர் என்பதை ""ஏழைக்கு இரங்கும் ராமச்சந்திர அய்யன் எப்போ வருவாரோ அரசரடிக்கு'' என்று நாட்டுப்புறப்பாடல்கள் குறிப்பிடுவதைக் காணலாம்.

ஒன்பது கிராமத்து மக்களுக்கும் திருமண சடங்குக்காக ஒரு தாலியும், பொன்னும் அளிப்பதை இவரது முன்னோர்கள் கடமையாகக் கொண்டிருந்தனர். ராமச்சந்திர வாதுலருக்கு இரண்டாவது மகனாகப் பிறந்தவர் வேங்கட சுப்பிரமணியன்.
வேங்கடகவியின் குடும்பம் சிறிது சிறிதாக பொருளாதார வளத்தை இழந்தது. ஒன்பது கிராமங்களும் அவரது குடும்பத்தை விட்டுச் சென்றன. இதன்பின், வேங்கடகவி தவயோகியாக வாழ்ந்த கிருஷ்ணயோகி என்பவரைத் தேடி நீடாமங்கலம் காட்டிற்குச் சென்றார். அவரே, தன்னுடைய தாய்மாமன் என்ற உண்மையை உணர்ந்தார். ஆனால், கிருஷ்ணயோகியோ வேங்கடகவியை சிஷ்யனாக ஏற்க மறுத்தார்.

இதன்பின், தன் தாயின் ஆசியுடன் ஊத்துக்காடு காளிங்க நர்த்தன கிருஷ்ணனை தன்னுடைய மானசீக குருவாக ஏற்று தியானத்தில் ஆழ்ந்தார். அப்போது வானில் அசரீரி ஒலித்தது. ""இன்று முதல் உமக்கு யாமே குருவானோம். கோயிலின் ஈசான மூலையில் உள்ள துளசி மாடத்தருகே உமக்கு இசை ஞானத்தைப் போதிப்போம்'' என்பதைக் கேட்டு அதிசயித்தார். இந்நிகழ்வை, ""கூடப் படித்தவன் குசேலன்- ஆடற் கொடுத்து வைத்தவன் காளீயன் - பகவத்கீதை கேட்டான் விஜயன் - சங்கீர்த்தனம் கேட்டவன் அடியேன்'' என்ற பாடல் மூலம் நமக்கு உணர்த்துகிறார்.

வேங்கடகவிக்கு நீலமேக சியாமளனாக கண்ணன் பலமுறை நேரில் வந்த காட்சி அளித்தார். கண்ணனின் அருளால் மனித இயல்புகளான ஆசை,கோபம், காமம் ஆகிய துர்குணங்கள் மறைந்தன. வயிற்றுப்பசிக்கு மட்டும் சிறிதளவு உணவை, அன்னதானம் இடும் ஊட்டுப்பறைகளில் பெற்று வாழ்ந்தார்.
ஒருசமயம் தஞ்சை மன்னன் வயிற்றுவலியால் அவதிப்பட்டான். செய்வினைக்கோளாறால் ஏற்பட்ட நோய் என்று சொல்லி மந்திரவாதி ஒருவன் மன்னனை ஏமாற்றி வந்தான். இவ்விஷயத்தை அறிந்த வேங்கடகவி, அரண்மனைக்கு சென்றார். வழியில் பல்லக்கில் மந்திரவாதி வந்து கொண்டிருந்தான். பல்லக்கை தூக்குபவர்களுடன் வேங்கடகவியும் சேர்ந்து அரண்மனைக்குள் நுழைந்தார். கண்ணனைப் பாடி மன்னனின் வயிற்றுவலியை முற்றிலும் போக்கினார்.

மற்றொரு சமயம் நாதஸ்வர வித்வான் பெரிய ருத்ராதிபிள்ளைக்கு, வேங்கடகவியின் தெய்வீக இசையைக் கேட்கும் வாய்ப்பு ஏற்பட்டது. இசையின் கடினவழிமுறைகளில் ஒன்றான ஸ்ரீருத்ர சப்தமான கனம் வழியில் அவர் பாடிக் கொண்டிருந்தார். ருத்ராதிபிள்ளை அவரின் ராகத்தை மறைந்திருந்து கேட்டு, அதை நாதஸ்வரத்தில் வாசித்துக் காண்பித்தார். வேங்கடகவி அவரைப் பாராட்டி ஆசி அளித்தார்.
மன்னார்குடி ஸ்ரீராஜகோபால சுவாமி திருவிழாவில் வெண்ணெய்த்தாழி சேவைவிழா நடந்து கொண்டிருந்தது. அவ்விழாவை தரிசிக்க தனவந்தர் ஒருவர, ஒரு சிறுவனை அழைத்து வந்திருந்தார். கூட்டத்தில் சிறுவன் காணாமல் போனான். தனவந்தர் தவித்துக் கொண்டிருந்தார்.
பஜனைக்கோஷ்டியினருடன் பாடிக் கொண்டு வந்த வேங்கடகவி தனவந்தரிடம் இரக்கம் கொண்டார். கண்ணபிரானைத் தியானித்து, ""கண்ணா! எழுந்திரும் பிள்ளாய்!'' என்று பாடினார். வேங்கடகவி பாடத் தொடங்கியதும், எங்கோ உறங்கிக் கொண்டிருந்த சிறுவன் எழுந்து ஓடி வந்தான். அச்சிறுவனைக் கண்ட தனவந்தர் அடைந்த மகிழ்ச்சிக்கு அளவே இல்லை.

திருக்கண்ணபுரத்தில், அபிராமி என்ற நங்கை பரதநாட்டியக்கலையில் தேர்ச்சி பெற்றிருந்தாள். காசி சென்று, அங்குள்ள அரண்மனை நாட்டியக்காரி சித்ராவளியுடன் போட்டியில் பங்கேற்று தோற்றாள். ஒருமுறை, திருக்கண்ணபுரம் கோயிலுக்கு வந்த வேங்கடகவியைக் கண்டு தன் வருத்தத்தை தெரிவித்தாள். அவர் அவளுக்கு நடனத்தில் "லய நுணுக்கங்களை' கற்றுக் கொடுத்து மீண்டும் காசிக்கு அனுப்பி வைத்தார். அவள் சித்ராவளியைத் தோற்கடித்து வெற்றிவாகை சூடினாள்.

வேங்கடகவியின் தொடையில் கண்ணன் இருந்ததால், ஆயுள்முழுவதும் தாளம் போட்டு பாடியதில்லை. திருமணம் செய்து கொள்ளாமலே வாழ்ந்து வந்தார். இவர் பாடிய பாடல்களில், "தாயே யசோதா', "காயாம்பூ வண்ணனே', "ராஜ விலாஸம்', "புல்லாய் பிறக்க வேணும்', "அலை பாயுதே' போன்றவை இன்றும் இசைமேடைகளில் ரசிகர்களால் விரும்பிக் கேட்கப்படுபவையாகும். இவருடைய இறுதிக்காலம் பற்றி அறிந்து கொள்ள முடியவில்லை.

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

I was just going over this thread and noticed a typo by me about Sharabhanandana tala in the very first page. It should be 79 units (not 69 units)! I must thank my guru Chitravina Narasimhan for pointing this out...

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Also, thanks to the poet's descendant Kalaimamani R G Murthy, the Family Tree of OVK is now available. This also makes it clear that Kattu Krishna Iyer, who was said to have been in King Amarasimha's Court in Tanjore was OVK's nephew.

http://www.venkatakavi.org/ovk/home/family-tree.html

Shri Murthy has shared several details in various media interviews about the family deity (Devi) idol has been in possession with them for over 10 generations. Venkata Kavi's personal ishta daivam was Lord Krishna, of course - and the majority of his operatic works, including Ramayana, Mahabharata, Daksha Yagam etc have been based on Bhagavatam. Even his Kamakshi Navavaranam set ends with a prayer to the Goddess (presumably by the gopis) to give an introduction to Lord Krishna (haladharAnujam prAptum vayam Agata dEvi dEhi in Manirangu)
Last edited by chitravina ravikiran on 20 Apr 2015, 10:11, edited 1 time in total.

keerthi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by keerthi »

... Kattu Krishna Iyer, who was said to have been in King Amarasena's Court in Tanjore was OVK's nephew.
Amarasimha..?

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Yes, Amarasimha, sorry about the typo... Have edited the other post too!

satyabalu
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Joined: 28 Mar 2010, 11:07

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by satyabalu »

[quote="Singer_USA"]I would like to share another piece of information that will help verify the time period of Shri.OVK. In the first Saptaratna krithi Bhanamrta, in Nattai, the composer salutes to all great composers he has witnessed (
It must read as"Bhajanamrutha "

tsshreevidya
Posts: 8
Joined: 22 Apr 2018, 12:33

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by tsshreevidya »

Sir /Madam ,
I want to know the angas of sharabhanandana tala so plz can u send me angas of sharabhanandana tala and if possible plz do send any pallavi in sharabhanandana talam

SrinathK
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Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by SrinathK »

http://www.venkatakavi.org/ovk/audio-video.html

This link is a valuable resource to audio files of several OVK compositions.

sankark
Posts: 2321
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by sankark »

srikanthamshastry wrote: 05 May 2011, 16:21 1.shastreeya gamaka 2. lalitha gamaka;in some ovks compositions,for ex.swagatam krishna, it gives a filmy sangathis than classical.parallels like gaga sarigapa garisada;riri padasari sasadapa.....are exists in alaapa,not in usual kritis.
An alternative explanation: This actually could be a key point to prove that OVK lived when dance-dramas were very much in vogue - the film equivalent when films weren't around - an was inspired by them and imbibed whatever he wanted and used when applicable. So the key question: when were such filmy equivalents very prevalent around oothukadu - assuming he didn't venture out geographically much.
He could have simply composed such songs for dance dramas# with that equivalent filmy tune/sangathi.

In the name of making it classical* (samskritam-ization) later comers could have excised certain practices that were prevalent then.

#irrelevant that they didn't see the light till very late; he might have totally enacted those dance-dramas in the biggest stage - his imagination
*For some one it could simply be said biassed - I don't like this so I won't use it.

bhakthim dehi
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Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by bhakthim dehi »

Those sangathis could have been a later addition.

tsshreevidya
Posts: 8
Joined: 22 Apr 2018, 12:33

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by tsshreevidya »

chitravina ravikiran wrote: 19 Apr 2015, 10:52 I was just going over this thread and noticed a typo by me about Sharabhanandana tala in the very first page. It should be 79 units (not 69 units)! I must thank my guru Chitravina Narasimhan for pointing this out...
Can u plz share more details about sharabhanandana tala like angas, history, any compositionsor any pallavi[ plZz

Suryasriram
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Joined: 11 Sep 2015, 22:27

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by Suryasriram »

tsshreevidya wrote: 17 Jun 2018, 09:38
Can u plz share more details about sharabhanandana tala like angas, history, any compositionsor any pallavi plZz
It would be better if you posted this directly in the viewforum.php?f=8 Tala Thread as more people will notice it.

tsshreevidya
Posts: 8
Joined: 22 Apr 2018, 12:33

Re: Oothukkadu Venkata kavi - a pre trinity composer?

Post by tsshreevidya »

Suryasriram wrote: 20 Jun 2018, 20:35
tsshreevidya wrote: 17 Jun 2018, 09:38
Can u plz share more details about sharabhanandana tala like angas, history, any compositionsor any pallavi plZz
It would be better if you posted this directly in the viewforum.php?f=8 Tala Thread as more people will notice it.
Tq so much

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