Brilliant artists not fully recognized by the public&sabhas

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 12 Sep 2010, 21:17

Sreeni Rajarao wrote:Track # 7 is Nedanuru Krishnamurthy.

Sorry
MS Balasubramanya Sarma

narayan · Post by **narayan** » 12 Sep 2010, 23:49

Dear mankuthimma,

As someone who has benefitted immensely by several unknown people recording and archiving music, I must first of all thank you for all that you have done and continue to do.

My question in this thread is "what exactly is the problem with obscurity"? If some musicians are forced into dire circumstances because of economic reasons, it is one thing. But fame and fortune and public approval of thousands or hundreds or whatever the right number is for CM, anyway comes to very few, and that is probably how it will always be? That is why I would hope that the art thrives in many more forums than the concert stage and that rasikas can be found in places other than auditoriums. In fact, obscurity, forced or chosen, can play a big role in peaceful development of a style away from the public pressure of having to please instantly. Only strong minded or committed persons can probably do that, but there are enough people with that passion, I would think.

The modern concert/sabha/recording-industry type music is quite competitive and almost by its nature, very few can hope to make it big, so to speak. It is not just a sour-grapes statement to say that all a musician really needs is ONE good listener. That one listener is enough to change an activity from totally reflective to a communicative art and that is often all that is needed. Therefore, I would still try to see how to foster the small concert, the chamber recital in an informal forum, the closeness of hearing a natural voice or instrument and being involved in the actual thought and delivery of music as a low input, low stake, but very satisfying and sustainable activity. Going by the exact wording of this thread, I doubt if any "brilliant" artiste can sustain brilliance for too long in the public glare. A public success has to cater to so many tastes, that it is very difficult to take risks and stretch oneself. That some of the top performers of today actually do so sometimes is a great credit to them.

By the way, I did see the video clip of the ghatam/grinder business, and I was mildly tickled by it, that was about it. My definition of classical art is something that can be formalized and taught over a long period of time, with slowly changing values, and this will have its place for sometime to come. Let everyone else have their say, we don't own the stage!

I would like to reiterate my support for your continued passion to support the art in so many ways. The most important one is your giving your time to listen to so many people over so many years.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 07:39

Narayan
Thanks. You are probably taking off from the title of this thread . Yes we had a dilemma , how to title it - the earlier one said something about artists who could / did not climb up the ladder . I now recognise that this one is more confusing.

Be that as it may , my personal interest here , is to have an internet hall of fame , where atleast the worthy singers are heard at least for a fraction of an hour , If not more . In the hope that they will not sell their grandparents tapes to the raddiwallahs for 5 Bucks a piece .
My own journey changed course after I saw a 50 year old housewife , belonging to a family which had featured SSI's concerts for all the marriages , spanning across three generations - explain to me how , for one of those marriages , she heated and re-formed old useless Lps into exotic shapes. And gave them as gifts. And that act was a rare hit in their family circles.
We spent , sometime later , figures like Rs 1500 for one tape of 60 minutes having 20tracks of 78 RPM recordings of 3 mts each . For about 40 such tapes . I am happy we did before that greedy seller's childtren recycled them for roadlaying.

This problem has little to do with issues of obscurity and more with a question of timing of technology .
Classical Music will survive . And will always cater to a small segment .
A good Yachtsman knows that his chances of his going off-course is more likely when he has a favourable wind behind him.

These artists did not have that advantage . The least , I thought I could do , was to set the clock back .Just a bit.

I have got a bit virulent these last couple of days because people who have seen better days tend to push many of the ills plaguing today , under the carpet.
The fact that only one artist could be indentified by a set of 36 downloaders , tells me that I can go up to the Hundred I promised /
And You ain't heard nothin yet . Watch out .

Thanks for posting your views.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 07:42

And talking of chamber Music settings , I will be once again tracing the series of 25 concerts we have hosted . In a series of clips .

And most of these concerts - of the audio clips - were held far far away from metros . In obscure countryside.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 08:51

But fame and fortune and public approval of thousands or hundreds or whatever the right number is for CM, anyway comes to very few, and that is probably how it will always be?

You are right . There was a time I would listen to only the stars of the day . And My Dad would prod me with the words :

The woods would be silent , if only those birds sang . The ones that sang best .

And put me on a journey of a lifetime .

pattamaa · Post by **pattamaa** » 13 Sep 2010, 08:51

mankuthimma wrote:I thought One was obvious to you . Where Rathipathipriya is touted as sharadapriya ( veena Venkatagiryappa's composition )
The case where someone gave up a career in science , for one in art :tmi:

Vachaspathi was by Uppalpatti Ankiah . Our Guruji Akella Sarma is on the violin here. MSG's Ekalavya

Sharadapriya by Dr K Vageesh...Nice mokshamu galada too, rendered in chowka kalam...

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 09:03

On the spot .Pattamma.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 09:34

http://www.mediafire.com/?hmashqsen8m9s05

ML Narasimham

gmohan · Post by **gmohan** » 13 Sep 2010, 10:42

mankuthimma wrote:http://www.mediafire.com/?hmashqsen8m9s05

Artist - 8
Shares the first two initials of his name with a flamboyant allrounder of yesteryears. Who flew in as a replacement , in Australia , drove to the ground , and hit a century.
The track is a bit long for this purpose . But please persist with your downloads.You will ask me for the full concert.

I know the cricketer

, Brisbane 1968, but not the musician

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 10:57

ok . first half is ML
second half ...well ... death at his hands ....neither inside nor outside ... death not by a man . nor an animal

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 13 Sep 2010, 11:06

M.L. Narasimhan ( just guessing based on the clue, also Narasimhan is mentioned in the beginning of the audio clip ).

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 11:29

thanks vk.you are correct.
hope that induces a thorough listening of the tracks . my trick of leaving more footprints.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 13 Sep 2010, 13:55

http://www.mediafire.com/?bxpbns3vo5x5c4h

Track 9 - A lovely track - Moves as a cool breeze from a rarely heard Diskhitar composition , through that favourite of mine -sangeetha samrajya sancharini , a sombre E Ramuni made poular by Somu and his Guru and setttling down to .....

Shares one half of his name with a Cricketeer who looked and played very much likr GR Viswanath He played a few tests for India too.

Sreeni Rajarao · Post by **Sreeni Rajarao** » 14 Sep 2010, 03:42

mankuthimma wrote:http://www.mediafire.com/?bxpbns3vo5x5c4h

Track 9 - A lovely track - Moves as a cool breeze from a rarely heard Diskhitar composition , through that favourite of mine -sangeetha samrajya sancharini , a sombre E Ramuni made poular by Somu and his Guru and setttling down to .....

Shares one half of his name with a Cricketeer who looked and played very much likr GR Viswanath He played a few tests for India too.

Ashok Malhotra is the only cricketer name that comes to my mind but I am not familiar with any Artist with that name.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 14 Sep 2010, 07:45

Modumodi Sudhakar

Enna_Solven · Post by **Enna_Solven** » 14 Sep 2010, 08:48

mankuthimma wrote: Track 9 - A lovely track - Moves as a cool breeze from a rarely heard Diskhitar composition , through that favourite of mine -sangeetha samrajya sancharini , a sombre E Ramuni made poular by Somu and his Guru and setttling down to ...

Lovely, lovely indeed! More details about this artist please.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 14 Sep 2010, 08:55

http://www.mediafire.com/?tm6w46l7l0e14rw

Track 10

My question in this thread is "what exactly is the problem with obscurity"?

Narayan
I wrote about this problem with obscurity here , sometime ago.
http://chennairasika.wordpress.com/?s=tadepalli

A big track . But worth labouring through the download. After a hesitant start , it starts getting brilliant at the Panthuvarali..
my my !!!! what a neraval !!! )
So many wonderful nooks and corners there.
And by the time Kharaharapriya is introduced as RTP - it gets sublime .
I take a break here and move a bit towards my Kannada Land for such artists

Sreeni Rajarao · Post by **Sreeni Rajarao** » 14 Sep 2010, 16:01

Regarding post # 113, I thought about Sudhakara Rao (Karnataka cricketer from 70s and 80s) but opted for Ashok Malhotra because Sudhakar Rao played in only one test (if I am right).
Anyway, thanks for this very interesting thread and for sharing your bounty with us!

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 14 Sep 2010, 19:08

http://www.mediafire.com/?c4jzt41ldjjb8h7
Track 11
Sukanya Prabhakar,
An alapana fit for the Gods !!!
Such a lovely raga ,this. Lathangi.

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 15 Sep 2010, 03:13

mankuthimma wrote:http://www.mediafire.com/?c4jzt41ldjjb8h7
Track 11
An alapana fit for the Gods !!!
Such a lovely raga ,this. Lathangi.

this is top class. And the neraval too.
who is the artist?

Sreeni Rajarao · Post by **Sreeni Rajarao** » 15 Sep 2010, 04:03

My guess - Sukanya Prabhakar, recording from a few years back?

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 15 Sep 2010, 08:05

Yes Sreeni . I have updated the original post .

Quite a vintage concert from Vijayawada Kannada Sangha.
Suji . I agree . It is simply brilliant .

venkatakailasam · Post by **venkatakailasam** » 15 Sep 2010, 18:58

While on the subject, what strikes me most is the time we spent in locating the songs of the greats of yesteryears from whatever source they are available-the discarded tapes and the Lps
when so many songs of them are already available-most of the songs are only repetition with only the venue and the time being different. And, in the process, I tend to feel, that we fail to encourage the not so popular artists of the present day as well as the young talents who are trying to establish themselves by engaging ourselves in the process mentioned above.
Legends sing in the same way they sing earlier in their career - perhaps with some variation in more elaborate raga alapana or in the swara sanjaras in some cases.
I have also made a few comparisons in this regard.

I am reminded of the following:
After a wedding reception performance by the late Shri. Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar, the groom's father told the music legend:

'Your recital now is much superior to what you sang last year. '
Ariyakudi replied " Ivvidam pattu appidiye thhaan irukku.

Avvidam dhaan gnaanam konjam vandhirukku. Adhanal dhaan appidi theriyaradhu

In this context I wish to submit that some time back I was in search of a Varnam in the Raga narayani composed by Shri Poochi Iyengar.
I have searched hundreds of varnam in all popular sites , but, I could not come across the one which I sought. Evidently, this was not a popular one-or put it differently , this was not considered by the stalwarts for being rendered in their concerts while certain other Varnams were being sung time and again by them

Can we not make it a point to make available more and more the concerts of these young talents and make positive criticism instead of showing apathy so as to make them more popular instead of going in for a repetition of songs already available.

If I am wrong in my views I seek to be excused.

venkatakailasam

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 15 Sep 2010, 21:57

Whenever permitted, recordings have been made by mankuthimma of the concerts organised by himself and friends. The age range of artists presented covers something like seventy years, from teens to eighties. Both encouragement and archiving have been done!

I think, too, that many good young artists do get good audiences, and are encouraged. I hope they are!

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 16 Sep 2010, 07:24

http://www.mediafire.com/?fu6ph6v7ze3y26w
BELLARY BROTHERS
Nick. You are right.
Are there any takers for a second tour of our 25 concerts ? Purplestream interested ?

sreecons · Post by **sreecons** » 16 Sep 2010, 07:37

venkatakailasam wrote:I am reminded of the following:
After a wedding reception performance by the late Shri. Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar, the groom's father told the music legend:

'Your recital now is much superior to what you sang last year. '
Ariyakudi replied " Ivvidam pattu appidiye thhaan irukku.

Avvidam dhaan gnaanam konjam vandhirukku. Adhanal dhaan appidi theriyaradhu

Classic!!! 8)

vidya · Post by **vidya** » 16 Sep 2010, 23:02

mankuthimma wrote:http://www.mediafire.com/?bxpbns3vo5x5c4h

Track 9 - A lovely track - Moves as a cool breeze from a rarely heard Diskhitar composition

Gifted voice , but I wonder how exactly did this version ie a retuning of Dikshitar's lyrics (as long as it's not ardhradesi it's not a Dikshitar composition!) make it all the way to Andhra that too to someone of a Parupalli school?

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 16 Sep 2010, 23:20

Yes... And I got this bit of advice too , from DRS.
And keerthi asked the same thing when I told him over phone
Many similar minds thinking the same thoughts. Wow !!!!

[update]Let me explaiN. SrI gaNESAtparam was set by MD to ArdradESi , a janya of MMgauLa the 15th mELa; and that is how it SHOULD be rendered. What he sings here is in one of those innumerable new rAgas- vINAvAdini, a janya of harikAmbOdhi. A better way to get a handle on this rAga is to say it is hamsadhvani with a different niShAda (kaiSikI). A pleasing rAga no doubt under different circumstances, but...... :devil:[/update]

Only goes to show that , on the very few occasions I add some words to describe the links , I better shut up ...

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 16 Sep 2010, 23:25

mankuthimma wrote:Only goes to show that , on the very few occasions I add some words to describe the links , I better shut up ...

Please do not!! People like DRS and Vidya are 'outliers' (I mean that in a very positive, and envious way), and they will continue to educate you along with the rest of us!!

vainika · Post by **vainika** » 16 Sep 2010, 23:29

Obviously talented singer, excellent voice and manOdharma, but his south-south learning seems to have perilously skipped the state with tiruvArUr...

vidya · Post by **vidya** » 16 Sep 2010, 23:44

mankuthimma,
That certainly was not the intention and thanks for these tracks in the first place.
I guess the 'MD Mafia' does get a little touchy about these things! I loved the 'a lovely raga under other circumstances' note

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 17 Sep 2010, 00:36

[update]Goodness: I never knew about this "update"![/update]

Thank god it doesn't say "updation"

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 17 Sep 2010, 07:22

Vidya... Thanks . It was all in jest. Now I know how to smoke you all , out of your hiding places.

Track 11 was Bellary Brothers

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 17 Sep 2010, 12:36

Track 12
Vishnubatla Sisters
http://www.mediafire.com/?qgi5bbe2ifc4vp8

Sreeni Rajarao · Post by **Sreeni Rajarao** » 17 Sep 2010, 16:51

Regarding Track # 11 : Bellary Brothers - Sheshagiriachar and Venkateshachar! Wow! Do we know the accompanists? M S Govinda Swamy on violin (my guess). mrdanga ??

Thanks for sharing these treasures! I will have to get in touch with Morching Gururaj and let him know of this recording (he is Vid. Venkateshachar's son).

hariniraghavan · Post by **hariniraghavan** » 17 Sep 2010, 17:08

Now Bellary M.Raghavendra is picking up. He is good. I heard him a couple of times recently on Chandana channel
Harini.

Sreeni Rajarao · Post by **Sreeni Rajarao** » 17 Sep 2010, 17:42

Yes, I understand Bellary Raghavendra and M S Vidya (Sheshgiriachar's children) and Gururaj (Venkateshachar's son) are carrying on the family tradition.

hariniraghavan · Post by **hariniraghavan** » 17 Sep 2010, 17:58

M.S. Vidya has done creditable job with regard to Haridasa kritis.
Harini.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 17 Sep 2010, 18:11

There is a whole sector of brilliant musicians that are not fully recognised by public or sabhas. Indeed, they are even, on occasioned, maligned as a group --- and I'm betting that one or two responses to this post might not be positive...

The Violinists who sit modestly in their places by the main artist.

Putting aside the handful of elder greats, and their relatives, how many solo violinists? How many concerts are made available to those who want to play solo? Given the opportunity, I am sure there are more than a handful that would shine.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 18 Sep 2010, 07:20

Track 12 was Vishnubatla Sisters

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 18 Sep 2010, 12:51

http://www.mediafire.com/?ijwt7ai4s4jutii
JAYALAKSHMI SANTHANAM
A lovely Track

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 19 Sep 2010, 10:04

Track 1 http://www.mediafire.com/?1tm8k5958g4gy18
Upplapatti Ankiah - Akellaji

This Vachaspathi RTP is very good. Thanks Thimma.

BTW, what is the thala? I counted 20 beats arudhi to arudhi and matched it with: Trisra Ata, Misra Jampa and Chathusra Matya. Of the three, Chathusra Matya seems to fit the best. Can someone listen to this and offer your impressions?

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 19 Sep 2010, 10:11

Inspite of So many clues...... ;(
# 141
JAYALAKSHMI SANTHANAM

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 19 Sep 2010, 10:17

MT, I just download that and listened to Sari Evvare. I would not have guessed the singer.. but now that you mention, I know which clue you are talking about

It is an excellent track indeed. Sari Evvare just flows from her effortlessly.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 19 Sep 2010, 11:49

Yes VK
That was a brilliant Track indeed....

thenpaanan · Post by **thenpaanan** » 20 Sep 2010, 00:13

Nick H wrote:There is a whole sector of brilliant musicians that are not fully recognised by public or sabhas. Indeed, they are even, on occasioned, maligned as a group --- and I'm betting that one or two responses to this post might not be positive...

The Violinists who sit modestly in their places by the main artist.

Putting aside the handful of elder greats, and their relatives, how many solo violinists? How many concerts are made available to those who want to play solo? Given the opportunity, I am sure there are more than a handful that would shine.

True, but the CM system/tradition is as much to blame for that. With the prominence given to kritis to the point of exclusivity in the CM concert platform, instrumentalists have yet to find an independent place in the pantheon. In HM at least sitar players have been able to carve a separate identity for themselves with compositions meant for sitar. Nothing comparable has happened yet in CM for vINA players. But one is hopeful. These are still early days in CM innovation.

-Then Paanan

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 20 Sep 2010, 00:50

True, but at least the veena and the flute manage to keep their heads just above the water, whereas the violinists ...well, ok, I guess they probably appear on stage far more often than the flautists and the veena players, and they do get a share of each concert they accompany, but a solo career, still is largely denied them.

mummani_fan · Post by **mummani_fan** » 20 Sep 2010, 07:58

vidya wrote:
Gifted voice , but I wonder how exactly did this version ie a retuning of Dikshitar's lyrics (as long as it's not ardhradesi it's not a Dikshitar composition!) make it all the way to Andhra that too to someone of a Parupalli school?

Hi

There was a CMANA concert years ago (I think in Y2K) by Rudhrapatnam Bro's, a thematic one on rare compositions of the trinity. Some songs I remember were the Kalagada krithi Parvathi Ninnu nera and the ArdradEsi krithi. Perhaps, some of the forumites may have a recording of this concert.

Thx
Mummani Fan

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 20 Sep 2010, 08:09

mummani_fan wrote: There was a CMANA concert years ago (I think in Y2K) by Rudhrapatnam Bro's, a thematic one on rare compositions of the trinity. Some songs I remember were the Kalagada krithi Parvathi Ninnu nera and the ArdradEsi krithi. Perhaps, some of the forumites may have a recording of this concert.

Thx
Mummani Fan

Rudraptnam Brothers track is here
http://www.mediafire.com/?bptx69lltn2lrv0

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 20 Sep 2010, 08:10

Maku thimmanavarE!
Regarding #141...
First of, I'm still a download-impaired person.
I have a poor success record in this. I could not downlaod it, was busy all day, asked for K's help and how I relished your gift! Shame on me, I wasn't even aware she had sung a national program concert

The announcement for s.pantuvarAli was in hindi. Wondered if it was Akellaji on the violin.
Hope Rajesh, Bharath and others who like her music get to listen to this. My chikkamma's sAvERi AlApane was reminiscent of her bro VVS.
She was a child prodigy singing at seven kaTTai. I did not hear her at all for many years (because I lived away from India), and then her singing here in the US, once in a house concert at our place too...
Of course, now I hear her every year without fail, this veteran vidUshi!
A typical case of how not living in Chennai is and always has been a disadvantage for musicians

Once again, what a gift from you, and it isn't even my birthday! Let me get a bit greedy and ask the near impossible--but for the stray bits which have been floating around, is there any early VVS concerts you can find for us? 2014 would be his centenary year!