Please let the admin know if you face any errors.

TM Krishna@nAdhasudhA(velachery) on June 23rd,2009

Review the latest concerts you have listened to.
rajeshnat
Posts: 7242
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Post by rajeshnat » 24 Jun 2009, 17:53

TM Krishna@nAdhasudhA(velachery) on June 23rd,2009
--------------------------------------------------
Accompanied by amritha murAli - violin and K.ArunprakAsh - mrudangam

1.shree mahAgaNapathim bhajEham(S) - atAna -JCWodeyAr
2.lambOdara - kAmbhOji - mysore vAsudEvAcharyA
3. dhyanamE Varamaina (R)- dhanyAsi -T
alApanai for 7 mins and violin return for 4 mins

4. mAyE tvam yAhi (R,S)- tAraNgini - MD
5. aRuL seyya vEndum ayyA - rasikapriyA - Koteeshwara Iyer
6A. manasu swAdhInamaina(R N S T) - shankarAbharaNam - T
neraval in rAja rAjEsha niraNjana nirupama
alApanai for 17 mins , violin return for 8 mins, neraval for 6 mins and swaras for 7 mins
6B. tani for 9 mins

7. mahAdeva shiva sambhO - revati - Tanjore shankara Iyer
8. jAnarO (javAli not padam)- kamAs - Tanjore Chinniah not dharmapuri subbarAyar
9. tirupathi venkataramanA - sindhubhairavi - PD
10. mangalam kOsalendrAya - brief rAgamAliga in sindhubhairavi + vasantA +? + madhyamAvati

The concert was held near gurunanAk college in velachery. It was close to my work place and i got parking , to that extent this sabha held in a marriage hall was perfect. TMK's concert was from 06:35 to 8:50pm.

Pluses of concert:
------------------
The start in atAnA with a crisp round of swaras was great.The KAmbOdhi was very good , he dwelt in a more madhyama KAlam and was well presented.The pick of the day was in his version a more authentic tArangini (infact he also explained for few minutes how different is this tArangini than the more often heard tukkadA mAyE). I liked his charged rendition with a round of swaras in tArangini. I also liked his rendition of rasikApriyA which was filler before main .

THe pick of the day was certainly shankArAbharanam alApana very detailed especially he dwelling on few mandarA stAyi phrases in alApanai was excellent to outstanding.One can safely say he is one of the finest shankArabharanam singers in the present generation .He also excelled a lot in the dhanyAsi alApanai kind of getting that tranquility was perfect.

The post main especially TSI's revati was rendered beautifully , I crave for this revati krithi incidentally the last time I heard in live was by trichur rAmachandran in tiruvAnmiyur , certainly the rendition was emotive and had the right thrust and lift of revati.The sindhubhairavi was also quite good.

Both the accompanist excelled, particularly amritha's dhanyAsi was top class.Incidentally arunprakAsh mridangam was very good in most of the krithis excepting one.There was a lot of thOppi usage that lifted the concert.

Fem minor shortcomings of concert:
----------------------------------
1. At times TMK does bring in lot of lung power but could bring in more sowkhyam. Towards the end in mel Kalam swaras in kAmbOdhi I heard it as too ballistic kAMbOdhi.

2.The neraval and swaras in main were censored perhaps he felt for this sabhA this would do, he could have dwelled it more, both neraval and swaras was not dwelled much in mEl kAlam and also was not adequate.

3. The kAmAs javAli was kind of too cryptic and stretched .When TMK stretches a lot , arunprakAsh decides to go in for bit of slumber or dharnA mode that kamAs rendition appeared bit mediocre .

Big distraction:
---------------
The biggest distraction was TMK 's loud clapping during tani , he kind of intruded a lot ,the tAlam being rupakAm TMK had more loud sound . Would be nice if TMK keeps it to a minimum sound and not intrude tani that much.

Overall the concert was a short one ,I called the sabhA earlier he said TMK would sing possibly till 9 pm .THe concert was ticketed too , I paid 100 bucks , but TMK winding up in 2 hours and 15 minutes was a definite letdown.When concerts is advertised to start at 06:15pm why cant it go for 3 hours?

The concert was overall a very good to excellent concert.
Last edited by rajeshnat on 24 Jun 2009, 22:19, edited 1 time in total.

rajaglan
Posts: 709
Joined: 29 Dec 2006, 21:34

Post by rajaglan » 24 Jun 2009, 18:27

I agree with you , he is one of the best in sankarabaranam. Once when he was
singing the alapana in Odukathur mut in Blore, a lay rasika was so impressed and
got up and asked what is the raga? Though it became a bit emabarassment for the rasika later (not sure whether he realised) , we can understand that a lay rasika can enjoy through a main alapana of the artist which usually happens after lots of listening.
Last edited by rajaglan on 24 Jun 2009, 18:32, edited 1 time in total.

rajeshnat
Posts: 7242
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Post by rajeshnat » 24 Jun 2009, 20:46

bala747 wrote:"he kind of intruded a lot ,the tAlam being rupakAm TMK had more loud sound "

Minor quibbles but thani avarthanam should have been in Misra chapu and not Roopakam.

Padam singing is an art, and if not rendered properly can be torture to listen to. Full on open throated singing is the enemy of the padam, nowadays artistes seem to be intent on bringing paint down from the ceiling by voice power alone, wihch is good for other parts of the concerts and when delivering raga alapanas in major ragas but the more delicate ragas get butchered as a result.
Possible bAlA about the tAlam,it could have been mishrA chApu. I think you are meaning excess vocal power is enemy to the padam.Open throated may not be the enemy. TMK certainly did not sing the padam with full power but it was over stretched a bit, kind of gave me a feel of slOkham like at more places .

BTW just forgot to mention about another shortcoming,kAmbOdhi and shankarAbharanam in the same concert, could have been avoided for sure.
Last edited by rajeshnat on 24 Jun 2009, 20:47, edited 1 time in total.

keerthi
Posts: 1309
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 14:10

Post by keerthi » 24 Jun 2009, 22:00

rajeshnat wrote:8. jAnarO (padam)- kamAs - dharmapuri subbarAyar
This is a very interesting song.. T. Viswanathan used to sing it on his flute..And he said it was by chinnaiah (of Tanjore quartette) However it is also listed in chellam Iyengar's book of puchi srinivas iyengAr's songs.. Where he calls it a jAvali..

gravikiran
Posts: 114
Joined: 14 Sep 2006, 08:46
Location: Chennai
Contact:

Post by gravikiran » 24 Jun 2009, 22:02

jAnarO is a javali and not a padam.
i don't think dharmapuri subbarayar composed padams....

rajeshnat
Posts: 7242
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Post by rajeshnat » 24 Jun 2009, 22:22

keerthi/gravikiran
Thanks , googled janarO kamAs in google to get the first few links as padam and subbarAyar. U are right changed the first post .

doyoucare
Posts: 46
Joined: 07 Jan 2009, 23:11

Post by doyoucare » 24 Jun 2009, 23:33

rajeshnat wrote:BTW just forgot to mention about another shortcoming,kAmbOdhi and shankarAbharanam in the same concert, could have been avoided for sure.
hmm...or perhaps the whole concert could have been avoided ;)

ganeshkant
Posts: 886
Joined: 05 Feb 2010, 11:59

Post by ganeshkant » 25 Jun 2009, 12:56

Overall it was a good concert.TMK really gave his 100% in spite of the venue being Velachery.

His shankarabharanam was very good which was typical SSI style in singing in kizhkalam for good time and settling there.He stayed in R,G,M region for atleast 3-4 mins.

He said Tarangini should be sung as janyam of Charukesi with shudh.dhaivatham and the arohana & avarohana is:

SRGPDNDPDS & SDPGRSRGM

(G.Ravikiran,pl.correct me if I am wrong)

Arulseyya was sung bit faster which gave the feeling that TMK was playful with Muruga and not really praying him for his blessing..Another innovation may be !

The mangalam was sung in vasanta,varali,manirangu & shree.

Amritamurali played well.But may be if she can control her azuthamm here & there and bring in a bit of modulation in her bowing, it will be more pleasing to the ears of a lay man rasika like me.

Rajeshnat where is ur office? I live in Vijaynagar.

The ticket was Rs.50 only.I don't know how U ended up paying 100 !(rest may be donation from you!)

Rasika911
Posts: 521
Joined: 09 Mar 2009, 06:11

Post by Rasika911 » 25 Jun 2009, 14:04

Whats the deal with people timing an alapana and swarams eg 17 mins tmk 7 mins violin swarams 6 mins =P
Quality> Quantity ;)
That being said tmk always sings brilliant alapanas. TMK die hard fan :)
Last edited by Rasika911 on 25 Jun 2009, 14:05, edited 1 time in total.

rajeshnat
Posts: 7242
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Post by rajeshnat » 25 Jun 2009, 18:52

ganeshkant wrote: Rajeshnat where is ur office? I live in Vijaynagar.
....
The ticket was Rs.50 only.I don't know how U ended up paying 100 !(rest may be donation from you!)
ganeshkant
My work place is in OMR. I came in at roughly 6:25 pm inside(concert started at 06:35pm) , I was told only 100 Rs is available.

In general few sabha organizers look at the crowd , they start with 50 when there is less crowd and then when there is enough crowd they just say only 100 is available. As such they did not tell me to sit more in the front to middle , so that kind of rules out the theory that 50 Rs ticket is full.

rajeshnat
Posts: 7242
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Post by rajeshnat » 25 Jun 2009, 18:57

Rasika911 wrote:Whats the deal with people timing an alapana and swarams eg 17 mins tmk 7 mins violin swarams 6 mins =P
Quality> Quantity ;)
In majority cases Quality is directly proportional to quantity :) . Of course there are few exceptions where there are cases where quantity drags and dilutes quality ;)
Also it is usually a miracle to produce quality with very minimal quantity ;)
Last edited by rajeshnat on 25 Jun 2009, 18:58, edited 1 time in total.

Always_Evolving
Posts: 215
Joined: 16 Oct 2007, 08:33

Post by Always_Evolving » 25 Jun 2009, 19:49

rajeshnat wrote: In majority cases Quality is directly proportional to quantity :) . Of course there are few exceptions where there are cases where quantity drags and dilutes quality ;)
Also it is usually a miracle to produce quality with very minimal quantity ;)
Can't agree with this! I find v little correlation. In fact I attended one of those Mudra single-raga 4 hr concerts some years ago -- the artiste was TNS, no less. And it was awful. Somehow the artiste had to stretch each part of the RTP for 45-60 mins and it was really contrived.

Of course its easier to do justice to a major raga if one takes a little time over it -- I daresay a 15 minute kambodi would show more than a 5 minute one. But I've heard amazing short 5-10 minute raga sketches, from great artistes like Chitravina Ravikiran. Don't tell me it's miraculous!

coolkarni
Posts: 1729
Joined: 22 Nov 2007, 06:42

Post by coolkarni » 25 Jun 2009, 20:20

..
Last edited by coolkarni on 27 Nov 2009, 07:23, edited 1 time in total.

MaheshS
Posts: 826
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36

Post by MaheshS » 25 Jun 2009, 22:23

Coolji, do you remember the 1 minute Mohanam clip [thought to be Viswanatha Iyer] you played for me at home? Mesmerising stuff :)

If you upload that maybe Rajeshnat might be convinced?

Lakshman
Posts: 9677
Joined: 10 Feb 2010, 18:52

Post by Lakshman » 25 Jun 2009, 23:31

Listen to Narayarao Vyas singing a rAgamAlA on two 78 rpm records here:

http://ww.smashits.com/player/ra/ondema ... .asp?83150

gravikiran
Posts: 114
Joined: 14 Sep 2006, 08:46
Location: Chennai
Contact:

Post by gravikiran » 26 Jun 2009, 18:06

let us not mix the two mela systems here.
tarangini IS the 26th raagaanga raaga in the older venkatamakhin system while charukeshi is the 26th melakarta ragam in the modern-day sampurna mela padhati.

calling tarangini a janyam of charukeshi would be mixing the two systems.

keerthi
Posts: 1309
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 14:10

Post by keerthi » 26 Jun 2009, 22:47

gravikiran wrote:let us not mix the two mela systems here.
tarangini IS the 26th raagaanga raaga in the older venkatamakhin system while charukeshi is the 26th melakarta ragam in the modern-day sampurna mela padhati.

calling tarangini a janyam of charukeshi would be mixing the two systems.
Not really,

The 'latest' lakSaNa grantha, the slightly dubious Sangraha cUDamaNi which gives the kanakAngi-ratnAngi set of ragas also lists each mEla from the VEnkaTamakhin scheme as a janya rAga of the corresponding 'sampUrNa' mEla.
The SC raga-lakSaNa-s rather closely conform to tyAgarAja's treatment.

It is another matter that the scale and swarUpa given in the SC may not match the raga swarUpa as we understand it from the SSP..

For instance, the SC gives a lakSaNa gIta for both mAnavatI and manOranjani;(in both of which thyagaraja has composed, evaritO nE and atukArAda). There is a MD krti in manOranjani too, (bAlambikE pAhi)

Now, the SC lakSaNa gIta-s will better describe the atukArAda species of manOranjani, than the bAlambikE version..

Point I am trying to make is, that it isn't really wrong to call a venkatamakhin mELa a janya of the respective krama sampUrNa meLa..

sureshvv
Posts: 3587
Joined: 05 Jul 2007, 18:17

Post by sureshvv » 27 Jun 2009, 12:11

coolkarni wrote:
I had to go back to a 200 second Shudh Sarang by Basavaraj Rajaguru to validate this :)
He sketches everything I KNOW about the raga in this first 45 seconds !!!!!!
I remember this concert at AVM Rajeswari kalyana mandapam a few years ago, when one of the Hyderabad Bros. cleared his throat briefly and Kalyani jumped out instantly. The elderly gentleman sitting in the row in front (a regular who would bring his teenage daughter/grand-daughter along) remarked that identifying ragas is much like identifying people - sometimes you recognize someone close to you from a mile away with just a momentary glimpse.

grsastrigal
Posts: 728
Joined: 27 Dec 2006, 10:52

Post by grsastrigal » 27 Jun 2009, 16:06

rajesh- you are lucky to listen to few selected beauties from TMK The previous concert of TMK was at PS High School, Mylapore (Hindu carried a review). It was boring. He took Atana for 35 Minutes and lost his energy resulting in slowest Bairavi followed by Swara Jati.

He rendered a kriti on "Marga desi" raga and a kriti of MD. He also explained the structure of this raga.

sridhar_ranga
Posts: 794
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 11:36

Post by sridhar_ranga » 27 Jun 2009, 18:50

GRS - I liked the PSHS concert a lot...in fact I was happy that the Bhairavi swarajati was not as slow as I had expected, having sat through slo.....wer numbers from TMK on earlier occasions. Loved his Bilahari RTP as well.

gravikiran
Posts: 114
Joined: 14 Sep 2006, 08:46
Location: Chennai
Contact:

Post by gravikiran » 29 Jun 2009, 14:11

keerthi wrote:Not really,

The 'latest' lakSaNa grantha, the slightly dubious Sangraha cUDamaNi which gives the kanakAngi-ratnAngi set of ragas also lists each mEla from the VEnkaTamakhin scheme as a janya rAga of the corresponding 'sampUrNa' mEla.
The SC raga-lakSaNa-s rather closely conform to tyAgarAja's treatment.

It is another matter that the scale and swarUpa given in the SC may not match the raga swarUpa as we understand it from the SSP..

For instance, the SC gives a lakSaNa gIta for both mAnavatI and manOranjani;(in both of which thyagaraja has composed, evaritO nE and atukArAda). There is a MD krti in manOranjani too, (bAlambikE pAhi)

Now, the SC lakSaNa gIta-s will better describe the atukArAda species of manOranjani, than the bAlambikE version..

Point I am trying to make is, that it isn't really wrong to call a venkatamakhin mELa a janya of the respective krama sampUrNa meLa..
I disagree with you here.
In my opinion, and as you have rightly hinted, the dubious nature of the Sangraha Chudamani does not help make things better.
Since it is the 'latest' text, it conveniently pulls in ragas from the Venkatamakhin system and classifies it under its system.

Having said this, there is no known composition in tarangini under the Sampurana Mela system. By that I mean that there is no known composiiton in tarangini apart from that of Dikshitar's. Hence it is an exclusive Dikshitar/Venkatamakhin raagam.

rbharath
Posts: 2145
Joined: 05 Feb 2010, 10:50
Location: Madras
Contact:

Post by rbharath » 30 Jun 2009, 10:48

srikant and i reached the venue as TMK was singing tarangiNi AlApanai and were told that only Rs. 100 tickets were available. we silently walked back.

keerthi
Posts: 1309
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 14:10

Post by keerthi » 30 Jun 2009, 13:05

gravikiran wrote:

In my opinion, and as you have rightly hinted, the dubious nature of the Sangraha Chudamani does not help make things better.
Since it is the 'latest' text, it conveniently pulls in ragas from the Venkatamakhin system and classifies it under its system.

Having said this, there is no known composition in tarangini under the Sampurana Mela system. By that I mean that there is no known composiiton in tarangini apart from that of Dikshitar's. Hence it is an exclusive Dikshitar/Venkatamakhin raagam.

1. does absence of a krti from the 'non' venkatamakhi school make a raga exclusively Dikshitar/Venkatamakhin..?

What then about all other raga-s.. Can/Do we call manoranjani, vegavahini, bhinnashadjam, vasantabhairavi,kiraNAvaLi, nabhOmaNi,jIvantikA etc janya-s of respective the Govinda mEla-s (only) because there is a composition of tyagarAja in them..?

2. sangraha-cUDAmaNI notwithstanding, the krama-sampUrNa nomenclature definitely existed in MD's time.. internal evidence for this can be found in his usage of the names like sUlini, hEmavati in the krti-s in rAga-s saila-desAkSi and dEsI simhAravam..

the dubiousity? of the SC extends only to the lakSaNa gitams in it, and not to the raga-s it enumerates..
It is more than likely that the two nomenclature schemes were contemporaneous..

I don't want to appear contrary or hair-splitting, but while tarangini the meLa is distinct from CharukESi the mELa, I feel it is technically not wrong to list tarangini the rAga as a janya of chArukEsi the rAga..

I make this argument merely on a technical basis.. I personally do not see much significance in the janaka-janya rigmarole.. No offense intended..

bala747
Posts: 282
Joined: 20 Mar 2006, 12:56
Location: Singapore

Post by bala747 » 01 Jul 2009, 19:15

In majority cases Quality is directly proportional to quantity :) . Of course there are few exceptions where there are cases where quantity drags and dilutes quality ;)
Also it is usually a miracle to produce quality with very minimal quantity ;)
My late grandfather used to say that there was no way you can sing Shanmukhapriya badly. U Srinivas proved him wrong when I attended his concert sometime in the early 2000's. Close to an hour of the worst Sanmukhapriya I have EVER heard. I never thought it was possible to screw up Sanmukhapriya this badly till I heard a U Srinivas RTP in it. I don't mean to knock the guy in general, but that was an hour long rendition of what should have been confined to 3 minutes. Painful to listen to.

rajaglan
Posts: 709
Joined: 29 Dec 2006, 21:34

Post by rajaglan » 04 Jul 2009, 11:25

bala747 wrote:
In majority cases Quality is directly proportional to quantity :) . Of course there are few exceptions where there are cases where quantity drags and dilutes quality ;)
Also it is usually a miracle to produce quality with very minimal quantity ;)
My late grandfather used to say that there was no way you can sing Shanmukhapriya badly. U Srinivas proved him wrong when I attended his concert sometime in the early 2000's. Close to an hour of the worst Sanmukhapriya I have EVER heard. I never thought it was possible to screw up Sanmukhapriya this badly till I heard a U Srinivas RTP in it. I don't mean to knock the guy in general, but that was an hour long rendition of what should have been confined to 3 minutes. Painful to listen to.
Bala,

Just to highlight that it could be a bad day for him....
I heard U Srinivas play an RTP in Shanmugapriya in Odukathur Mutt. It was definitely very good. And the pallavi was too good too.
I was keen to know what he played , but he didnot say it in words.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests