Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sofware

To teach and learn Indian classical music
kmrasika
Posts: 1258
Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 07:55

Post by kmrasika »

The big change is support for the "grantha Sa" character i.e. the one for Siva Sakthi (the one you find in Slokam books).
arunk: Thank you for the update. This will be certainly useful for us.

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

A new release (v1.2) of the CM Notation Typesetter is now available at http://arunk.freepgs.com. This release has the following features/enhancements:
* Improved Look and Feel
* Open/Save feature - now you can save notations to a (text) file on your computer and open it later in the typesetter. Previously you had it do this manually by copying the contents to clipboard and pasting it into notepad or a text editor.
* Support for Khanda triputa
* Bug fixes for Tisra Eka and Tisra Triputa

Please let me know if you have any questions or run into problems.

Arun

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

A new release (v1.3) of the CM Notation Typesetter is now available at http://arunk.freepgs.com

Details can be found here: http://arunk.freepgs.com/wordpress/cm-t ... lease-v13/

It is basically a minor release.

Arun

raguanu
Posts: 94
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 11:48

Post by raguanu »

arunk wrote:Note that this software is under what is known as Gnu Public License (GPL), which means it is free.
Arun,

Thanks for the wonderful program, and especially for releasing it under GPL. But I couldn't locate the source code in your site. Please release the source code (perhaps in google code?) so we can chip in to improve the program.

Here are some of the problems I encountered :

1. Telugu letters are rendered incorrectly in Firefox 3. (r n ga sa etc. )
Image

Rendering is fine in Google Chrome, and Internet Explorer 7. Firefox renders other Telugu web pages correctly.

2. Printing Issues:
- Only First page gets printed (as pdf).

- Only first few lines are printed unless everything is zoomed out completely.

- some more funny symbols when printed as pdf (Firefox 3)
Image

Code: Select all

s:  sa ;  ni` ; | da` , p`| p` p` p` p` ||
- Chrome and IE prints include the scroll bar.


Cheers,
Ananth

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

Thanks for the feedback Ananth. The source is under SVN on sourceforge.net: http://cmnt.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/cmnt/

I will look at the other problems when I have more time. Chrome - I have not yet worked to get it working on it. As for PDF etc. which PDF driver are you using? There is no firefox vs. IE specific code - and so I am not sure what the telugu script problems are etc. It is possible that it is related to Unicode Indic support not enabled (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia: ... ng_support) - I am not sure now, but I think this is mentioned in the manual. I dont see what you are seeing w.r.t either Firefox or the funny chars for PDF.

Arun

raguanu
Posts: 94
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 11:48

Post by raguanu »

Arun,

I'm using the open source PDF Creator (http://sourceforge.net/projects/pdfcreator/). I also tried with PDFill PDF editor's printer driver, and print to file (ps).

Those funny symbols in Tamil seem to be my pdf creator's problem. Direct printing was fine.

Thanks for the help man.

Cheers,
Ananth

tapas
Posts: 1
Joined: 22 Oct 2008, 22:12

Post by tapas »

hi i would like to know how do i use ur software for me to print carnatic classical songs with swaraas and sahithya.

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

You can check out the examples (as suggested by the website) at http://arunk.freepgs.com/wordpress/nota ... -examples/

Also pl. consult the manual: http://arunk.freepgs.com/cmnt/manual.pdf

Arun

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

raguanu,

I did notice now that with the last release printing is messed up with scroll bars appearing. I will take a look at this and fix it.

Thanks!
Arun

raguanu
Posts: 94
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 11:48

Post by raguanu »

oh, Thanks arun.

It's an immensely useful software. It'll be a pleasure to see it gets improved.

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

The above mentioned printing problem (a regression introduced in the last release) is now fixed. Printing also is now easier as I have added a Print button.

Thanks
Arun
Last edited by arunk on 28 Nov 2008, 02:51, edited 1 time in total.

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

Version 1.4 of the Carnatic Music Notation Typesetter is now released (http://arunk.freepgs.com/wordpress/cm-typesetter/about/).

This release contains the following improvements:
* Support for new talas: All 35 talas are now supported in catuSra gati. You can use the Assist button to select these talas.
o To use other gatis with these talas, you can use the Gati directive. Note however that the typesetter may not layout the notations appropriately for more more complex gatis with longer talas. In such cases, you now have an alternative with the Manual tala as explained below.
* Manual Tala mode and SongBreak directive: There is also support fora new tala called Manual. With this tala, you take control over the notations - particularly the tala markers as well as line breaks. Tala markers are put out only if you explicitly specify them (as | or || ) in the swara directive lines.
o In order to make the typesetter to go to the next line of notations, you must explicitly specify a break via the SongBreak directive (also new to v1.4)
o Note also that with Manual mode, the notation typesetter would be unable to align successive lines at the tala anga markers.
o The Manual tala is useful for capturing snippets of a raga alapana, or for typesetting notations for a song whose tala layout is too complex to be automatically handled by the typesetter.
* Bug Fixes: This version also includes some bug fixes.

Thanks
Arun

MuseOfLife
Posts: 2
Joined: 05 Jun 2009, 16:40

Post by MuseOfLife »

Personally I use this PDF Creator. It is also free and generates good PDF.

niyer
Posts: 131
Joined: 17 Oct 2007, 13:21

Post by niyer »

Hi Arun

Started using the software and it is amazing. Im facing a small issue.

Im using IE 7.0 and noticing that the gamakas from the input pane are not getting relected in the typesetter pane . What could I be missing. My sample notation is as follows

Layout: Krithi,Compact
Tala: Adi
Heading: "Eeswara Kshemam Vendi",bold,Center,22
Gati: Tisra
S: n , s' p , , p , p p m r s s s r m p p~ , n p , ,

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

Thanks. Let me check it out. Have not tried IE 7.

In the meantime, please try on FireFox if you can.

Arun

msakella
Posts: 2127
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 21:16

Post by msakella »

mohan wrote:vg - it is widely recognised that there is still no perfect system for notation of Carnatic music. Whatever symbols we use it is very difficult to notate gamaka. Sri Subbarama Dikshitar and others have attempted it but the notation system needs to convey the exact gamakam required on every single note of a composition. I think this impracticle. The bhava which you refer to comes largely from the gamaka in the ragas.
I agree with you that ‘there is still no perfect system for notation in Carnatic music’ but, at the same time, I cannot agree with you that ‘it is very difficult to notate gamaka’. Till now, many have not even attempted for it and nobody made it very easy to a common man. That is true. But, basing upon umpteen experiments, I have symbolised almost all the oscillations and I can assure you that I can notate any composition far nearer to the song sung than any other notation. At the same time I shall also feel that this is not the final and, being Carnatic musicians, our duty is to always remain optimistic (but not pessimistic at all) and evolve to make it fool-proof to a common man. amsharma
Last edited by msakella on 29 Jul 2009, 19:40, edited 1 time in total.

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

niyer,

I tried on IE 8 (I guess it is the recent one - so I installed it), and it seemed to work fine for me (?)

akella-ji: Although I am not sure when I can spend enough time on this, I would like to get your permission to be able to represent your gamaka symbols in my online software - but obviously only if it is ok with you (just FYI: that the above is free software)

Arun

msakella
Posts: 2127
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 21:16

Post by msakella »

Dear brother-member, arunk, I am trying my level best to properly notate all our oscillations in music with symbols. In this process I brought out some symbols and each and every symbol resembles the travel of sound only. I never think this is my property to take my permission to use them. I always think this is our property and any body can use them to evolve a fool-proof system of notating our compositions. You can use it in anyway you like to serve the cause of our music. amsharma

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

Thank you akellla-ji. Your outlook and attitude is an inspiration to all of us.

Arun

msakella
Posts: 2127
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 21:16

Post by msakella »

Dear brother-member, arunk, Everybody is supposed to behave magnanimously. Nowadays, as very few people are behaving like that, I have become conspicuous among them. There is nothing new in me. We don’t bring anything along with us and, at the same time, we are not going to take anything along with us except the invisible list of bad and good things we do when we are alive. That is why everybody must try to increase the good things of that list. That’s all.

I shall be very happy if you work for the betterment of these symbols in writing efficient notation of our compositions and inform me accordingly. amsharma

niyer
Posts: 131
Joined: 17 Oct 2007, 13:21

Post by niyer »

Hi Arun

I installed Firefox 3.5.1 on my laptop but still cant get the gamaka symbols to work . Will check with my desktop and update

thanks narayan

niyer
Posts: 131
Joined: 17 Oct 2007, 13:21

Post by niyer »

Hi Arun

The gamaka symbols did not show up on my desktop as well. Is there something I need to do to map the gamaka symbols to the glyphs in the typesetter pane? some system settings/IE settings ? Really wish I could get past this constraint and use your software which is very powerful

thanks and regards
narayan

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Post by arunk »

I am not sure. Let us hoop via email and we can dig into this deeper. Once we find the problem and solution, I can post the details here.

Arun

balakk
Posts: 130
Joined: 05 Feb 2010, 06:56

Post by balakk »

Interesting. Now that you are planning to notate even the gamakas, you should have a fairly accurate representation of the music.
From there, wouldn't it be possible to translate the notation to MIDI, and play it out? Might be a fun exercise, and would delight your users. I'm kinda interested in the reverse process though; extracting the swaram from a rendition. I understand there are some WAV to MIDI converters that do this to some extent, but doesn't look like a solved problem by any means.

tpchakrapani
Posts: 3
Joined: 22 Nov 2010, 07:44

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by tpchakrapani »

can anyone send me a link to download the software regards

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by arunk »

You dont have to download anything. It is a "web application" and so is intended to be used/run via your browser itself while connected to the internet. You can simply visit http://arunk.freepgs.com/cmnt/newsong.html and start entering the notations, and use your browser's print facility to print. To create PDF files, you can install onf of the many free PDF print drivers (e.g. primopdf).

Arun

raguanu
Posts: 94
Joined: 12 Oct 2008, 11:48

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by raguanu »

Suggestions/Feature Requests:
  • Code Comments
  • Smarter Lyrics-Sync: don't count the commas
With Comments we can include author, date, Name of the software (arun's carnatic notation typesetter!) in the code, which need not be rendered in the output. This comes extremely handy when sharing the notation source with others. (plain text files right? people may not know what to do with that).

Code: Select all

% Written for Arun's Carnatic Notation Typesetter v 1.4 
% see [link]
% Ananth, Mar 07, 2011
Lyrics-Sync
Calculating and putting underscores is the only time taking element when scoring with this software. At present, we have to put an underline for every note the phrase spans including the commas (,) and semi-colons (;). A new syllable doesn't commence on a comma/semi-colon in swara part. So, if we don't have to put an underline in Lyrics part for those commas, it's much easier to count the actual swaras and align the lyrics accordingly.

Code: Select all

g , r , s , ; n` s r g r r s n` 
Ja la ja ksha _ _ _ ni _ _ _

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by arunk »

Thanks for the suggestions. Both look like good ideas. Give me some time to implement this. A while ago, I was actually toying with an even "smarter" lyrics scheme where you could type in jalajAksha (i.e. no spaces in-between) and it would try to intelligently split (additional matras done with dots as in ko...ri... ) but I think that can be unreliable. Your suggestion is a more reliable one - although it may be more verbose.

Arun

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by arunk »

Sorry it took so long.

But finally I have a beta version which has an easy way of implementing lyrics as indicated above.

You can also enter comments (lines starting with # are considered comments) although I now realize that I forgot to mention it in the manual for this beta version.

There are also a few other enhancements. Among them:

- support for english/roman diacritics as a "language"
- also some enhancements to "manual mode" - in particular a mode, where-in the tala markers are shown above the notation (as opposed to in the same line as swara). This has an advantage of generating notations such that the musical phrasings are grouped together in a more intuitive way such that one can have a better idea of the underlying melody.

For example, instead of usual notation format as below for one of the charanams for jagadAnandakAraka (which allows for attractive looking notation, properly aligned but one in which the musical phrasings that make up the melody is obvious):
Image

one could generate the following
Image

Here the tala markers (including outer-beat) are indicated but there is no alignment at tala boundaries. The grouping of the individual musical phrases take precedence.


You can use the latest version at: http://arunk.freepgs.com/wordpress/cm-t ... e-v15beta/

Thanks
Arun

asangeetha
Posts: 137
Joined: 19 Oct 2006, 12:21

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by asangeetha »

I have just started using this notation system, its actually very intuitive. I quickly browsed through the manual and got started and it worked just fine.

Had some questions ...

I wanted to define the krti details at the top such as raga, scale, composer etc. I am using the 'Heading' directive currently for all these things. But I wanted to find out how to add space or tabs within the heading.

Example : Heading: " Raga: Nata Tala: Khanda Chapu"

If I do this, the spaces are not taken into account

Also, when I want to use subscripts for defining scale as in S R3 G3 .. etc its not possible.

Would appreciate any input on this. Thanks!

asangeetha
Posts: 137
Joined: 19 Oct 2006, 12:21

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by asangeetha »

I am using the latest Beta version. I have tried on various browsers and on Mac and Windows and have the same problem. When I save as pdf , the dots are missing for tara stayi , mandra stayi etc.

Is this is a known issue? Thanks.

Sowmya

arunk
Posts: 3424
Joined: 07 Feb 2010, 21:41

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by arunk »

Thanks. Spaces to do alignment is not supported.

For subscripts in heading you can enclose them in ~ (tilde). For example

Heading: "S R~2~ G~3~ M~1~ P"

These special markers like ~ are (as noted in the manual) based on Wiky - you can check out http://goessner.net/articles/wiky/ for info.

Regarding the problem with stayi dots not appearing in PDF, please ensure that your browser print settings are set to print background images and colors. How to set this differs from browser to browser.

Thanks
Arun

asangeetha
Posts: 137
Joined: 19 Oct 2006, 12:21

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by asangeetha »

Thanks Mr Arun. The stayi problem is solved. I will look into the subscripts and let you know.

Sowmya

tanyaroy
Posts: 5
Joined: 02 Sep 2013, 12:56

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sof

Post by tanyaroy »

That's a really nice move and esp you've kept it free.. :)

sarojaraman
Posts: 17
Joined: 07 Mar 2016, 11:25

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sofware

Post by sarojaraman »

Arunk

Well done . It will be useful to many teachers ,students and also others. How to get this format. Pl guide me.

jayakrishnam
Posts: 23
Joined: 12 Jan 2017, 00:32

Re: Create Carnatic Music notations online with this new sofware

Post by jayakrishnam »

Hi Arun,
I purchased your app- Swarasthana. I found it very helpful to improve my swaraznana. But unfortunately, it stopped working saying it’s not available in your region. I live in Al, US. But my friends are still able to use it. Would appreciate your help to reinstall the app
Thank you
Jayakrishna

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