gamakakriyA

[bhakthim dehi]

Vasanthakokilam, the authorship of many geethams given in the SSP, with the name Venkatamakhin is always debatable. Its of general opinion that Venkatamakhi mention names like Govinda and Nagamamba (name of his parents) in his compositions which are said to be authentic. Examples include Atulita, a geetham in Reethigowlai (govindhadhvarina nagambambika nandana venkatamakhi), Umatilaka prabhandam in Mechabowli (govindamakhi nagambika sutha venkata), Kaivara prabhandam in Narayanagowli (govindavari nagambika sutha venkatamakhi). All these ragas were mentioned in his treatise Chaturdandi prakashika!!!!
Now, its up to us to judge.

[maduraimini]

gmohan,

Thanks for MMI's 'Intha paramuga'. I don't remember hearing him sing this. It was wonderful ! Sounds like he sang this in his younger years. Thanks for posting this.

[keerthi]

Bhaktim dehi, vk, munirao,

I have a bit to say about the prevalent versions of pUrvakalyaNi. There a few sancAras that I understand as being definitive of purvakalyANi that have now almost disappeared from the rAgas, as it is sung and played by (most) contemporary musicians. At the same time, new sancAras and sancAras that were probably meant to be rare sancAras occupy a position of pride. Fortunately we have excellent compositions like ninnu vinAga mari, mInAksi, paripUrNakAma, ekkAlattilum and the magnificent varNam of SonTi venkataramanayya as a robust lakshya substratum to understand it.

We could move to the gamakakriya/ purvakalyani thread, and resume this discussion??

[Rsachi]

Keerthi
Please give some audio with links at least for a lay person like me to understand what is the real face of Purvi Kalyani and what has changed.
I can reasonably well recognize the presentday PK within 4-6 seconds of presentation. If that is an imposter, I would like to see the asli chehra please, with your help!

[munirao2001]

Keerthi
Myself and R.K.Srikantan Sir were listening to the tillanas of Veene Seshanna at the Gayana Samaja, a special program commemorating the Vaggeyakara's Day. We realized the raga svaroopam of those times and the later times have changed so much. Written music came in to being much later and the karna parampara system of preservation of music is bound to have both positive and negative sides. While the Bani was traceable to a Guru, a school of music or a region of a patanthara, the styles with no respect for the patanthara, is bound to have differences both in the raaga and sangati ornamentation. With few exceptions, the tradition being the body and works of excellence, we have a heritage, unparalleled in the world music. Research, not a hearsay or statements, must be done on the raaga development history for the knowledge of the treasures lost and found.
Back to Poorvi kalyani and Gamaka Kriya, I just wanted to inform about its history. Leaving aside mythical stories of 'Meenakshi me mudam dehim', let us continue to enjoy the full majesty of poorvi kalyani in this composition revealed in its original vilambakala, not in the madhyamakala (only giving the glimpses of the original beauty) even if it is handled by Great Maestros like ARI, GNB or MMI.

munirao2001

[bhakthim dehi]

Keerthi
That's not only with purvikalyani, many ragas have faced this kind of metamorphosis. I think it will of some use if we can start a special thread for this

[vasanthakokilam]

As per request, I have moved the gamakakriya/purvikalyani discussions from http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23724

[cacm]

Dear RSachi,
YOUR REFERENCES TO MMI & SOMU(in Parvathi concert article) MOVE ME BEYOND DESCRIPTION.
In my opinion MEENAKSHI MEYMUDAM RENDERINGS ARE THE BEST BY the MAESTROS FROM MADURAI-MMI, MSS & MADURAI SOMU-& I have discussed at length ( my good fortune& luck!) the pLace for Niraval & both mss& somu marvelled at MMI'S RENDERING ESP. NIRAVAL LOCATION! MMI also marvelled at MMS& SOMU RENDERINGS......I just wish to point out that B.V.K.Sastry ( the most knowledgeable critic of our times) that MMI'S background& rendering of Dhikshithar is the most authentic (tho' MMI was very careful to point out that DKP&DKJ were experts & S.Rajam also had learnt from Ambi Dhikshithar).
Incidentally SOMU'S PARVATHI CONCERT IS THE BEST EXAMPLE IN EVERY RESPECT for my contention that THE BEST CONCERTS OF STALWARTS TOOK PLACE OUTSIDE OF MADRAS! Even the choice of accompanists like Chalakkudi& Upendran not to mention the compositions& how they were rendered are PERFECT EXAMPLES!......VKV :-BD :ymapplause:

[munirao2001]

cacm

Quote "I just wish to point out that B.V.K.Sastry ( the most knowledgeable critic of our times) that MMI'S background& rendering of Dhikshithar is the most authentic". SSRao/DKP/BRI/KS(Kalpagam Swaminathan) learnt from T.L.Venkata Rama Iyer, Authority on Mudduswamy Dikshita, a direct sishya parampara. All of them meticulously followed the patantharam, patantharam in vilamba kaalam. MMI/GNB/ARI were rendering Dikshita compositions in madhyama kaalam, which suits their voice and styles but in deviation. The very soul of visradhi in both the raaga and saahithya bhaavam in this composition was lost. MMI was honest and correct. BVK Sastry was wrong.
This is one perfect case on the effect of style affecting the pataanthara. Rasikas, with idolization, hailing the version as the best! This is how the quality in Karnatik Music suffers.

munirao2001

[cacm]

Dear Sri.Muni rao,
Ambi Dhikshithar was the great grandson of M.D. The question of PADANTHARAM is a questionable one as there are NO written records from the composerI S.Rajam learnt from Ambi D & MMI did learn from T.L.Vekatarama Iyer & S.R. DID LOT OF RESEARCH ALSO.This BOGEY MAN ARGUMENT ABOUT VILAMBAKALAM VS SOME OTHER KALAM IS NOT VERY MEANINGFUL. Each artist renders at pretty much suited to render at their comfort level.As matter of fact MMI tho' he rendered Vathaphi thousands of times & was appreciated by lots of rasikas said he was still looking to render it perfectly at least ONCE! It is a crutch by which unsuccessful artists claim comfort.The KEY to return to RSachi's point is the NERAVAL which DISTINGUISHES THE CREATIVITY & UNDERSTANDING OF THE COMPOSITION.......PUTTING DOWN KNOWLEDGEABLE CRITICS LIKE B.V.K.SASTRY only shows your ignorance. VKV

[munirao2001]

Dear Sri VKV Sir,
I am aware of the lineage of Ambi Dikshitar and other information you have posted. Ambi Dikshitar and T.L.V.Iyer patantharam were not different.

You opine "This BOGEY MAN ARGUMENT ABOUT VILAMBAKALAM VS SOME OTHER KALAM IS NOT VERY MEANINGFUL". Meanings to be known by listening and the Great Maestro statements.

You opine "It is a crutch by which unsuccessful artists claim comfort". Most successful artists statements only you access and also veracity of whether the 'unsuccessful artists" used the ideal of patanthara suddhatvam as a crutch or for higher values in Karnatik Music and its tradition.

Your judgment of "PUTTING DOWN KNOWLEDGEABLE CRITICS LIKE B.V.K.SASTRY only shows your ignorance". Yes I am ignorant. Seek the opinion of Great Maestros forunites and give your judgment.

I urge you to listen to the Great Maestros vilambakalam singing of this great composition, afresh, unconditioned and arrive at your conclusion. This ignoramus self had the privilege of listening to all the Great Maestros and realized the values. My posting was a true reflection of my realization. I have also realized that Great Maestros are not greater than the Tradition and Karnatik Music and no one claims as such. Also that idolatry creates prejudice, rare instance in pride. Pride and sense of comfort in the knowledge. Knowledge is experience in memory. When this is questioned, retention challenge of this memory urges rejection, at times vehemently.

munirao2001

[hanquill]

Reg comparison of Gamakakriya andPoorvikalyani let me add:
1.gamakakriya is a Mela raagaN0 53. according to venkatamahin Padhadhi-followed by Muthu.diskshithar in his krtis.Arahonam and avarohanam are same as O=Poorvikalyani.MD made out kriti -Meenakshi...."

2. Poorvikalyani- is a Janya raaga of Mela Karhta -no 53-Gamanasrama.with full scale-.-These are the technical difference..-By hanquill