Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Carnatic Musicians
annamalai
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by annamalai »

Sorry for the digression on Palghat Mani Iyer thread -
uday_shankar wrote:The mridangist who seems to have perfected best the art of sustained, "grainy" vibration of the valandharai seems to have been C S Murugaboopathy. How did he manage that and what am I missing ?
Uday - great point. As a novice, I have wondered about this a lot; How can mridangist generate a sound with that frequency (almost a metallic sound) from a leather/wooden instrument. Is it one of the magic of the mridangam makers (Selvam, ...) to add some special "maanja" like concoction for the black spot. I am fascinated with the mridangam tone of CSM almost blending with morsing; I sometimes feel like I want to open up the box to check; the way Hockey officials wanted to inspect Dhayan Chand's hockey stick if it had a magnet !

shripathi_g
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Joined: 30 Mar 2005, 08:25

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by shripathi_g »

Actually, I'm more fascinated by the sound of his thoppi. There's a MMI AIR concert with a thani for Marivere with CSM, Vinaykram and a Dholak. The thoppi sound in that concert is really amazing. The bass sound he produces in that concert is similar to the one UKI produces in the epic thani avarthanam played by PSP and UKI for GNB's Brochevarevarura.

mohan
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mohan »

Nice selection of photographs at http://www.thehindu.com/arts/music/article2828385.ece
Note the absence of the microphone in most of the images.

In the Edinburgh image, Is the person behind Mani Iyer, his mrudangam technician?

semmu86
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 09:39

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by semmu86 »

Lovely pics, made for some splendid viewing that day @ the MA in that ambience

mahavishnu
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mahavishnu »

Excellent pics. Although many have been in circulation in the public domain, it is very nice to see them in the context of the PMI centenary. It is amazing how young Sri LGJ & TNK were when they started accompanying the stalwarts of the previous generation!

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Mahavishnu: YES-those were Golden days and it was a treat to watch how much respect and encouragement PMI gave to TNK,LGJ. LGJ has tons of stories of his train travels with PMI to Delhi,Bombay and Calcutta. In one of these conversations GNB was also involved. It was a discussion on how to balance rasikas' expectations with the Musicians' ability to meet them. PMI will keep quiet in the initial phase of the conversations between GNB and LGJ. GNB will wonder aloud how realistic audience expectations can be --if we give 100 % today what if it becomes the benchmark and the audience would naturally expect 110% in the next concert and if this goes on how much can the artiste do to meet those rising expectations--to which the young and eager LGJ will respond saying--these rasikas go to great lengths and sacrifices in terms of their time and money and attend our concerts despite difficulties they may be having at home--Is it not our duty to perform to a level exceeding their expectations and the discussions between the two would go back and forth at which point a "Daniel" in the form of PMI will come to a judgement--"we the artistes are the ones who spoil the rasikas by raising their expectation levels.It is not that we should not try to give the audience the best we can offer but we should also recognize that at some point the spiral of expectations will have to end and we need to temper our performances accordingly. PMI goes on to say --as he has done in several speeches that he gave--To a rhetorical question WHO is a TRUE Kalaignan(Artist_--the ONE who makes the rasikas forget all their worries for 3 to 4 hours.
PMI was an enigma no doubt to even some of his contemporaries!!

In those early days--TNK started accompanying all the Senior artistes--encouraged,promoted and touted by SSI--since he was 16/17 years old--LGJ although younger to TNK by 2 years started when he was twenty --although he had concert-level talent--his Father Lalgudi Gopla Iyer was advised by Tiger(who died in 1950) --who had heard him a couple of years earlier during the Thiruvayaru Aradhana -- is reported to have told Gopala Iyer,''Nanna Vasikkiran anaal enna avasaram_ meaning let it "marinate" a little more!!
Sure enough when LGJ burst on to the scene --- Chowdiah,Rajamanikkam Pillai and Papa Venkatramiah were still active on the concert circuit--but both TNK and LGJ took the Carnatic Music scene by storm with two distinct styles and flourished. Although MSG was not too far behind them in age and was also awesome talent-wise--MSG/MSA's father Parur Sundaram Iyer was not in favor of them being accompanists and made them do lots of solos

. Back to the PMI thread-- PMI after the concerts would advise TNK or LGJ(strictly on an one-on-one basis)what were the points that need their attention--be crisp in your raga alapanas,do not try to do too much in every kriti etc etc.
PMI encouraged Kanjira Vidwan Swaminatha Pillai(son of Pudukottai Dakshinamurthy Pillai) and interceded with sabha authorities to give him chances(once he wanted my Father to give chances in 2 or '3 concerts accompanying PMI and also PSP--PSP turned it down for reasons(I have narrated this story in one of my posts on the PSP thread). PMI had tremendous loyalty and respect for Dakshinamurthy Pillai--although early in his career--the latter had raked PMI over the coals--yet to honor Dakshinamurthy's wishes after his death to take care of his son--PMI championed his cause whenever he could .Likewise,at SSI's request PMI would recommend Umayalpuram Kodanda Rama Iyer(Ghatam Vidwan and also Ramnad Krishnans father-in-law) for his concerts at Shanmukhananda Sabha--although UKI was quite old .

If I remember right in the early forties Kalpathy Ramanathan used to accompany MSS at PMI's behest)--one of our forumites I recall is a relative of Kalpathy Ramanathan and could possibly corraborate this.
PMI was a Great Man--unfettered by praise,undaunted by Musical Challenges,highly principled(perceived to be stubborn--although he had his reasons!!),a good family man,loyal to a narrow circle of tried and tested friends reminiscent of Shakespeare's Hamlet:(Polonius advice to his son Laertes)
"THOSE FRIENDS THOU HAST,THEIR ADOPTION TRIED,GRAPPLE THEM TO THY SOUL WITH HOOPS OF STEEL-BUT DO NOT DULL THY PALM WITH EACH NEW UNFLEDGED COMRADE".

mahavishnu
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mahavishnu »

If I remember right in the early forties Kalpathy Ramanathan used to accompany MSS at PMI's behest)--one of our forumites I recall is a relative of Kalpathy Ramanathan and could possibly corraborate this.
Yes, that is true. Kalpathi Ramanathan was my grandfather.
PMI was like a graduate advisor that went beyond the call of duty and became a father to many, my grandfather included.

From your recollections above, it sounds like he took an almost paternal interest in the careers of TNK and LGJ as well.

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

Has PMI played with S Kalyanaraman, TRS ,madurai somu and Maharajapuram santhanam. Any audio recordings /photos to indicate that combo is appreciated.

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

cool has uploaded lots of great photos of Shri PMI. Scroll and You will enjoy till the end.
http://rasayanakarnatic.wordpress.com/p ... mani-iyer/

Any reply to my previous post #108.

thanjavooran
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 04:44

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by thanjavooran »

Rajeshnat Avl,
Many thanx for the excellent link. Enjoyed till the end.
Thanjavooran 16 02 2012

semmu86
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by semmu86 »

Unbelievable collection. Thanks for the link

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Rajeshnat: Great collection!! If you can numver the pics(if at all possible!!) I will identify some of the old friends and musicians in those pics.

For starters, the group photo(sitting for the group) with GNB,Rajamanikkam,PMI and PSP is Circa April 1950 @ the Shanmukhananda Sabha in Mumbai-- in the second row just behind GNB is TR Balu his disciple and TRB is sandwiched on his right by my Father K.S.Mahadevan(who was the Secretary and instrumental to arrange the FIRST concert in Miumbai with PMI/ PSP. The gentleman on TRB's left was my uncle P.S.Sitaraman wo was a committee member in the Sabha and who in the Eighties was secretary to an Ernakulam Sabha. For this concert Rajamanikkam gave up his regular remuneration9without any request) to accommodate the High-Budget concert with the Giants!! What a magnanimous gesture!!

More later on the pics-- this is some collection worthy ofbeing enshrined in a Museum!!

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote:Rajeshnat: Great collection!! If you can numver the pics(if at all possible!!) I will identify some of the old friends and musicians in those pics.
MKR Sir,
I was just pointing to the url, I am not sure how easy or difficult to add numbers by Cool , possibly I will pick up just few group photos and upload them so that you can name all of them there. They are just priceless and the names can be attached to faces for posterity

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

MKR Sir
Cool has given a serial no for all photos. You can give names for the two group photos (photo #19 and #35), the #19 in shanmughananda sabha with your dad and uncle and the #35 where PMI is seated between MSG and BMK.

Also I would like to know the disciples behind GNB and SSI in photos #34 and #38 respectively.

srkris
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by srkris »

Wow, what an excellent repository. Thanks to Coolkarni, and to Rajesh for the link.

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Rajeshnat: Pic #12--PMI with his Guru Tanjore Vaidyanatha Iyer--a story I heard about how dedicated a Teacher Vaithanna(affectionately called by his peers) was especially towards PMI.

It seems PMI would visit Tanjore from Palakkad to learn some advanced lessons--the previous night Vaithanna would pace up and down -restless and when somebody asked him WHY he was so restless I believe he would say "Tomorrow morning Mani will arrive and I do not know what I can teach him--his grasp is so quick and I may not have enough to teach him for the whole day!!
Pic#10 PMI with a young Kamalakar Rao.

#15 Mali--the person to the right of Mali (behind)--the boy with glasses is my brother M.S.Sekhar who incidentally was one of the organisers of the PMI Centenary celebs in Chennai and recently(2 days back) in Mumbai(Any Mumbaikars who may have attended the function held at the Shanmukhananda Hall??? Would appreciate a report!!)
#35 Sitting from Left to right:- (unknown),trichy Sankaran,Guruvayur Dorai,MSG,PMI,BMK,Dwaram(???) and Kamalakar Rao. The ones standing I have no idea.

#36 SSI with lGJ--the sishya is the late V.R.Krishnan(excellent Teacher and the one who can "yank" SSI's chain more often than most people!!!). behind PMI on the Ghatam is Umayalpuram Kothandarama Iyer (Father-in-law of the late Ramnad Krishnan.) Mani Iyer had great respect for UK because of his excellent nadam on the Ghatam) to the left of UK is UK's son Narayanaswamy(Pattu as he was known)

#38 SSI-LGJ-PMI and Swaminatha Pillai (kanjira)--s/o of Pudukottai Dakshinamurthy Pillai-- SSI's disciples in the pic are V.R.Krishnan and P.S.Narayanaswamy(Pichai).

#50 Thiruppamburam Swaminatha Pillai(Flute),PSP.

#52--Palladam Sanjeeva Rao(Flute),Tiruvalangadu Sundaresa Iyer(violin)

To be Continued---

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

More on other pics in the PMI chain of pics:
#66 GNB flanked by SSI and the late R.Renganathan(br-in-law of GNB--sister's husband and Father of the late Visweswaran--husband of Chitra Visweswaran). Renganathan and his brothers were staunch friends/sycophamts of SSI.

#68 GNB-TNK-PMI with Madras Venu Naicker(kanjira)--the latetr had accompanied MSS in many concerts in the late forties.

#75.My guess is this pic was taken in Alleppey in Advocate Parthasarathy's House(Mr. Parthasarathy seated in the center is the father of Aleppey Venkatesan). Mr. Parthasarathy was a leading successful advocate, a connoisseur with very discerning tastes,a good singer-- learnt from ARi who was a staunch family friend (so was KVN,TNK et al. As an amateur he had given several performances in his friends' family weddings . He was affectionately known amongst the Musicians' circles as Aleppey Papa Mama. His house it seems would be like a Travelers' Bungalow with musicians darting in and out!! Great patron of Music and Musicians,notwithstanding Samuel Johnson's indictment of Patrons (" definition of a patron: "COMMONLY A WRETCH WHO SUPPORTS WITH INSOLENCE AND IS PAID WITH FLATTERY".

Continuing

The person in the left extreme(right of Mr. Parthasarathy and PMI is Mr. C.K.Venkatanarasimhan(Babu Sir to his friends)-- one of the leading criminal lawyers in Chennai in the forties and fifties. CKV was for a long time the Secretary(along with Dr.V.Raghavan) of the Music Academy and had the unenviable task of forcing the musicians to adhere to the time schedule--the Enforcer you may call him. Although I liked him for his enforcement work,I did not relish his chasing MMI when the great artist had to wind his evening concert in MA during the Season by 8: 30 P.M. so as to accommodate the 9 P.M. performance.
CKV was a great friend of ARI/PMI and GNB--PMI always stayed in his house --in Pilathope Mylapore whenever he came to Chennai for a concert--the beauty of it I have been told was that they hardly met and chatted during his visits--PMI minding his own business tending to his instruments and CKV tending to his practice!! Their friendship never wavered and withstood the vicissitudes of the times although there may have been misunderstandings between CKV and GNB at times .

An anecdote involving CKV,ARI,and GNB.

GNB and CKV were engaged in a heated discussion(although they were very good friends I believe they would have frequent arguments about Music or Institutions etc). ARI comes from behind GNB and interjects in Tamil "What is happening? GNB was so engrossed in the debate that he did not turn around to see where was the comment coming from or who was commenting. Without turning his head he says irritatingly in Tamil "Neengal Summa Irum ganum Engalukkulle Ayiram Irukkum"(rough translation in English; You keep quiet, there will be thousand things between us). ARI replies: Adukkenna Ainuru Ainuru aaga Pangittukkalame(why not split 500 between the two of you!!).

The other two artistes in the pic are Rajamanikkam Pillai and GNB in the picture.

Most of the other pics I am sure would be identifiable by the Forumites.

As I finished writing this piece after a long pause and several interruptions, I was wondering what is the use of all the trivia that I have thrown about which 99.999% of the Forumites would be indifferent to or could not care less about or some --like "DOYOUCARE" may legitimately order me to "cease and desist"!!--like the old tabloid newspaper Indu Nesan's warning to celebrities of those times .
THIRUNDA VIDIL PENA MUNAYIL THODARUVOM (If you do not mend yourself we will hound you on paper!!)-- If such an admonition does come from some or all of the forumites, I will still adhere to my Journalistic credo(learnt from the former CM of Tamil Nadu--MK)-

-A Journalist before he writes any piece must think that the whole world is literally waiting with bated breath for what he is going to write about and then reconcile himself to the fact that after it is published not a soul would have read or cared for what has been written--only if you have a such a thick skin you can survive in the journalist world"--in an radio interview given to the India Club of Columbia University in 1971(when MK had visited the US as CM)--I was one of the interviewers!! It is with that indomitable spirit I chose to write this much of useless trivia--Crave the indulgence of the indulgent-forumites!!

Rajeshnat I blame you for provoking this piece!!! Just joking!!

rshankar
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rshankar »

Sri MKR, please do continue...I think you may have misunderstood Doyoucare...I think all he was saying was that the story of the stainless steel pAtram did not sit well with him.
I'm sure all of us read and enjoy the insights that people like you and RaviSri give us. Reading what people like you write (at least for me) invoke in me the feelings of watching the 'sound and light' (son et lumiere) program at the lAl khilA....the same bated breath, the same feeling of sneaking a peek into history, while all the time being romanced by the storyline....

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

MKR Sir
Thanks for taking the time , for sure we all like what you are doing?
In photo #19, can you name others (the photo where GNB is flanked by rajamanickam pillai and PMI) and Trichy Sankaran is above GNB and your dad is in the row above.

Also who is singing in #58(young spectacled vidwan), I think violinist is A Kanyakumari or T Rukmini , with PMI in mrudangam

annamalai
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by annamalai »

my guess of #58 could be TRS TRSubramayan ? or Neyyantikara Vasudevan.

I have heard that TR Rajamani (son of PMI) has written a sequence of reminiscences of Palghat Mani Iyer for a Malayalam weekly magazine. It would be nice if those can be translated to English. I have heard some of those.

After a concert @ Trichy, Mani Iyer was staying @ Alathur Subbier's house. There was a festival procession at Mathrubhutheswarar (rockfort) temple and TN Rajaratnam was performing. Lying down on the Thinnai ,half asleep,they were listening to the concert in a semi-conscious state. TNR was elaborating some raga (I forgot) with all different prayogams and finally in the still of the night, TNR hit the thara thayi panchamam. At that point, from the half sleep state, Subbier and PMI, blurted out "sabash, ...".

Nick H
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Nick H »

MKR, sir, if you do cease or desist, we will hound you until you begin again.

Your stories, and those of other elder members of the site, are a nectar to us all. To those of sufficient age to remember the same times and the same people, they must be not just the nectar, but the perfume of the flowers themselves, wafted over the decades.

(Hope you don't mind me calling you "elder." I was quite upset, recently, by a reference to an "old person" of fifty or sixty!" :)

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Nick: Thanks for your encouragement--you do not realise what you have gotten yourself into!!
I am like the Village Preacher in Oliver Goldsmith's Deserted Village--long after the congregation has left,he would continue his homily--how can one dislike a forum where one could write anything without the fear of a rotten tomato/egg being tossed at!! By the way I do not take umbrage at references to age. Whenever anybody asks me how old I am-- I simply reply"I am just that old when on my birthdays the candles cost more than the cake!!!

Seriously though,I enjoy writing about the people whom I had known since the time I was young,reminiscing about the events--constantly juxtaposing within myself the polar opposite opinions I had about the incidents and the people at that time and the more charitable and hopefully understanding opinions I have learnt to cultivate in my twilight years. In other words I can confidently say I am slowly emerging from a state of cocksure ignorance to thoughtful uncertainty.. I hope to demonstrate this realisation when I resume the SSI saga which has been dormant for quite a while.

bilahari
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by bilahari »

Sri MKR,

Your ancedotes, as Ravi has eloquently said, give us rare but ever so meaningful glimpses into the rich history of our music and musicians.

You must continue. And I'm not taking no for an answer!

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Bilahari: Thanks.

Any mumbaikars who attended the PMI function in Bombay@the Shanmukhananda sabha(Punarvasu?) Looking for the report as to how it went. Ofcourse I heard from my brother as he was one of the organisers of the function in Chennai and Mumbai--BUT I am looking for an UNBIASED account!!

nadhasudha
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by nadhasudha »

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote:As I finished writing this piece after a long pause and several interruptions, I was wondering what is the use of all the trivia that I have thrown about which 99.999% of the Forumites would be indifferent to or could not care less about or some --like "DOYOUCARE" may legitimately order me to "cease and desist"!!--like the old tabloid newspaper Indu Nesan's warning to celebrities of those times .
MKR Sir - I like reading the trivia that you write. It gives us a glimpse into the life and times of these great vidwans. Similarly your anecdotes on MS Amma are very good too. We are able to get a peek into the personality of these great artists. Please continue your writings.

I have been many a time guilty of just reading but not letting you know how much I appreciate your taking the time to write. Hope to correct that with this post. Thanks for sharing these anecdotes. Looking forward to more of your posts :)

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Joined: 05 May 2009, 08:33

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Nadhasudha: Thank you for your comments. I never ever imagined that in a forum like this-- where several music topics are being discussed in the most illuminating manner--(I have learnt a lot--) there would be so much interest in artistes' lives--especially when these have been analysed threadbare leaving me to think what else is there to write about. Even my close family members commented to me often as to how come I had not shared these with them. As I had mentioned in one of my earliest posts since I came to know of this forum.I used to listen to Sangeethapriya recordings but never blogged or wrote any article to any Music Magazine despite my late father's repeated exhortations to write(as you may be aware he was a prolific writer and music reviewer --for the Indian Express)--the one exception was I wrote one essay on GNB in his book Musings on Music and Musicians released in 2003 on the occasion of his 90th birthday. One of the dilemmas in writing about these personalities is a fear of transgressing their privacy and how persons close to these celebrities would feel about details of their lives being "bared" open although it is confined to only my personal experiences with them.

I have still not got over that reticence and discretion but I will wade thro them slowly and cautiously so as not to embarass the concerned persons. However I have no desire--despite requests from several well-wisher forumites--to write a book for the general public- but in the case of the forum which I have come to regard as a large caring family I am hoping the chronicles would be received and treated with sensitivity and discretion. So far my wishes have been honored by the forumites more than I expected and more than I have a right to expect.

To the younger forumites who may have had similar interactions with the stalwarts of today, I would appeal to them to share their observations and experiences so that we have a good perspective of not only how music has evolved over the generations but also how the present day artistes' mores and relationships have morphed from the erstwhile artists' times.
Won't that be great for posterity?

doyoucare
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Joined: 07 Jan 2009, 23:11

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by doyoucare »

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote: One of the dilemmas in writing about these personalities is a fear of transgressing their privacy and how persons close to these celebrities would feel about details of their lives being "bared" open although it is confined to only my personal experiences with them.
Exactly my point in the other thread (Alathur). I am as much a fan of aruvai as the next person, but I guess my definition of what constitutes an aruvai joke is different ;)

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote:Won't that be great for posterity?
Not sure how vetti vambu helps posterity. But then maybe it is just me!

cacm
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by cacm »

Dear do you care,
YOUR STATEMANT:
Not sure how vetti vambu helps posterity. But then maybe it is just me!
REPEATS YOUR self appointed expert& guardian role of what is proper or improper to write in this forum esp. by others. YOUR own observations while "smart alecky" do not convey much of anything most of the time....The forum is a place where people can say anything they want to without "holier than thou" pronouncements. Be tolerant. VKV

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

DOYOUCARE: LOKO BHINNA RUCHIHI--Tastes differ--it would help if you could illustrate what would be deemed purposeful and meaningful by you so that I may be clear as to what you consider as Vetti Vambu and avoid the same in future posts.

You have completely missed my point--I have been writing about artistes who flourished 50/60 years ago with whom I have had associations. I do not have much close interactions with the current crop of artistes. I was trying to 'coax" forumites -- who may have interacted closely with the contemporary artists to come out with their perspective and insights to avoid the 'laud-the-past-bemoan-the present" stigma that may be attached to "old geezers" like me(Nick how do you like this term for Seniors like me).

Nick H
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Nick H »

"old geezers" like me(Nick how do you like this term for Seniors like me).
Do you spend a lot of time geezing? :lol:

kalyani_ragam
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by kalyani_ragam »

--
Last edited by kalyani_ragam on 02 Mar 2012, 10:26, edited 1 time in total.

anandasangeetham
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by anandasangeetham »

Getting an insight into the private lives of celebrities is nothing wrong and IS NOT VETTI VAMBU as long it does not create an unsavory view....(perceptions do differ)..but this throws much light on their greatness, why they perform the way they did...etc....Sri Bhimsen Joshi is known to hit the bottle quite often and it did impact his performances...though the habit is purely personal nothing wrong to write about it as long it does not cross the limit thereby creating an image of a drunkard....Sri MKR has been very very careful not let such opinion even assumptions about the yesteryear greats....Posterity does not necessarily mean to portray only the greatness of an individual but also the persons weaknesses (if any), idiosyncracies, etc....

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Thanks anandasangeetham-I could not have put it better-in fact part of my tardiness in continuing the SSI or MSS saga in these forums(apart from the usual lethargy and other preoccupation reasons)is my ambivalence as to how far I should go in narrating an anecdote to illustrate a trait or point when there is a danger in the anecdote getting the better part of attention than the point I am trying to make.

Not to belabor the comment that triggered all these side bars,whenever an anecdote I believe reveals a facet of the artist's personality--be it their thrift or their 'wiliness",I have to remind myself constantly to underscore the period or context of that anecdote to put it into perspective. I have noticed in one of my posts(which topic I do not remember) a tangential but specific reference to the remunerations of the artistes in the fifties,drew a comment from one rasika that it was too intrusive into the artistes' privacy. My intent was to highlight thro that anecdote how understanding the artistes were in those days in understanding the financial limitations of the Institutions and the general public and make the necessary accommodations . In our current economic flush times none of our present day artistes --no matter what tier they belong to-- face that predicament so that any talk of financial difficulties that the senior artistes may have faced is difficult for a younger forumite or rasika to relate to- WHAT I omitted to mention and deliberately so was the contrast with many of today's visiting artistes--mainly USA(I do not know what is the state of affairs in other countries) demanding remunerations under the presumption of milk-and-honey in the USA-- without regard to the sponsoring institutions' economic situation( Our Forumite VKV from his organisational experience in the Sixties and seventies and Sruthilaya currently can testify to my observation) . I do not intend to start a new controversy on this topic because it does not belong in this thread.
Nevertheless I can can quite understand the sensitivity of some forumites to what they believe should remain private.

Notwithstanding all these caveats and sidebar detours, I intend to continue my 'poking-and-probing" to bring out my own "takes" on these issues. If there is overwhelming revulsion or ambivalence on the part of forumites to these revelations, I will cease and desist!!!!
Keep those brickbats coming!!!!

mahavishnu
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 21:56

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mahavishnu »

MKR, I find your stories to be extremely endearing and on top of that your narration is quite charming. These vignettes present a wonderful side of these personalities that many rasikas are not privileged to have experienced. So let me join the others in requesting that you continue being the great raconteur that you are.

Ramasubramanian M.K
Posts: 1226
Joined: 05 May 2009, 08:33

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Thanks mahavishnu.
let's get back to the main theme here--PMI!!
PMI is very well known for his reticence-long before Media became so ubiquitous and intrusive,by nature he was not into any kind of championing of a theory of mridangam or any lofty pronouncements of what has to be done to preserve/foster and improve CM. In one of his speeches he virtually downplays the art of playing mridangam by claiming that to "pass F.A.--the old Intermediate or B.A. is much more difficult--you have to study by-heart(his words) for a long time-night and day--whereas in Mridangam one needs to study only some basics,learn them well and practice assiduously". Before a concert be it in Chennai(where he used to stay with Babu Sir-CKV--Secy of Music Academy --identified in one of the group photos posted before) or in Bombay(where he would stay in the Shanmukhananda premises),if people drop in to see him--phones were not ubiquitous and his "Old" friends many from Palkkad would take the liberty of dropping in without notice. PMI would politely greet the person and the next couple of minutes will be nothing more than Hmms and OHs--an icy monologue with PMI an indifferent listener . If the caller has a particular personal issue on which he needs some guidance he would give it but very concisely and tersely. If not if it is about the state of CM ,what he(PMI) thinks of present day musicians etc etc PMI would make a noncommital remark--his famous words whenever he is faced with having to give an opinion -- when he did not want to --would be in Tamil" EDHU EDHU EPPADI EPPADI IRUKKANAMO APPADI APPADI IRUKKUM"(whatever is meant to be will be!!). By this time the visitor would get the hint and bolt.My father has told me that it has happened to him on some occasions(knowing my father--the journalist hound in him would have tried to provoke/elicit some comments from PMI on some heated topic of the day only to be deftly deflected and parried much to my father's amusement and chagrin!!).

LGJ once told of a famous Veena artiste(name withheld) who had visited Tanjore for a concert--hearing of PMI's presence there(PMI had his establishment in Tanjore for a couple of years) decided to drop in unannounced and unexpected . I believe beyond just greeting the man PMI did not speak a word and despite desperate attempts by the artiste to coax PMI into a conversation PMI maintained a sphinx-like silence and the artiste took leave naturally disappointed but did not blow it into any big controversy--only because everybody knew it was not personal.From PM's perspective he simply was not given to idle talk and like a master chess player would anticipate in advance what the other person would do with a chance remark by him and avoid it. On this he did not discriminate-it was not as if he would be gushing all over with ARI or Raghu or KVN just because he happens to like them. He appreciated this trait of studied reticence in persons close to him--an anecdote, as told to me by my father.

When Palghat Raghu returned from Edinburgh (where he had accompanied KVN) to Chennai it appears organisations like NGS or MFA( I do not remember which one) were planning to give him a reception but when they met him after his arrival from London to propose the reception,he demurrhed and left for Palakkad the same day. Apparently one of the Secretaries lamented to my father about Raghu's indifference. Some time later when PMI had come for a concert in Chennai,my father went to meet him and while chatting remarked about Raghu's turning down the invitation hoping that PMI would show surprise or hear the account fully. No sooner had my father broached the subject, PMI cut him off saying "AVAN SENJADHU DAN RIGHT"(What he did was the right thing). Why all the fuss about being honored abroad as if our music needs validation by foreigners--I would rather be appreciated by a knowledgeable Palakkd or chennai crowd-- Raghu I am sure feels like I do--end of conversation. Now this could be debated ad nauseum whether it is the right thing--he did not go on to a soapbox advocating his philosophies on Public relations or Publicity nor did he pooh-pooh Institutions choosing to honour Muscians for what they believe to be worthy of pride and recognition .

Whenever he did choose to respond to a wise-aleck remark he would do it with a sting that would singe you for ever--I have been the recipient of one such whiplash!!

More later-- the third bell for my Dinner has been announced --I better rush!!

Ramasubramanian M.K
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K »

Continuing my verbal joust with the Master ending in a nose-cut.

August 1969--Bombay PMI had come for a concert staying in the Shanmukhananda Sabha- I was working for ESSO(Oil Co) as Sales rep in Bombay--I had decided to come to the US for further studies starting Sept 1969. I had gone to see him to let him know my plans and take leave of him(I must mention that his son Rajamony was 2 years junior to me in Engng College in Karaikudi and I was kind of mentor to TRR- and so his interest was in me more than the son of his friend).
He was alone in his room--after the greeting he raises his eyebrows as if to see what is the occasion for the visit--especially on a working day--I explain to him my plans--he pauses--no question WHY are you not happy with your job etc etc--he says I think it is a right move--I was shocked that he did not probe any further(typical pf PMI if you have made a decision you must know what you are doing and besides I do not have expertise in that area !!). he volunteers saying things are not good the country is not headed in the right direction(mind you this is 1969-what would he have said today had he been alive you can imagine !!). I asked him about Rajamony--at that time I think Rajamony had settled in a job either in Guindy(before he left for Alwaye--I do not remember). Seeing him alone I asked him whether he would like to go shopping or visit friends nearby(there were many in that area). Then he paused and said YES --he would like to see one of his friends who happens to live closeby but does not have his address. I recognized the person he was referring to which was on a street parallel to the Sabha Road and I vaguely remembered the building and felt I could locate it with a little effort. He gets into my car and I had to make a couple of rounds around the block(too embarrassed to ask people in the neighborhood before PMI when I had valiantly boasted to PMI!!). Finally I located the building and as we were getting out of the car I thought I would make a smart-alec remark I said in Tamil
'EVVALAVU SUTRINALUM EDATHUKKU VANDUTTOME"(No matter how many times we went round we have come to the place,) In Mridangam parlance after a round of Korvai you end up in the edam where you started the Korvai --there have been instances where the mridangist would miscalculate attempting a complex korvai--may have started off at the wrong finger and realise towards the end that he is going to miss it and cover it up by attempting again till he gets it right. I thought I had converted an embarrassing moment into a 'pun" in mridangam parlance.

The master quietly said with his usual teasing smile--"anal timethukkum varaname" meaning you should finish in time --implying going round and round to get the edam is no feat--get it right the first time!!

The Master never attempted impromptu on the stage be it a speech or a Tani and he preached the same to his disciples and aspiring vocalists who being thrilled that PMI would be playing for them would come up with some complex pallavi(not necessarily to test the Master but to show off that they are good in layam) and ask his opinion before going on stage--PMI would ask have you sung it before an audience after rigorous practice--if not-- his advice would be "VISHA PARIKSHAI VENDAM(actually told to Ramnad Krishnan in Bombay before a concert when RK approached him with the idea--PMI nixed it and went on to say I know you have learnt several pallavis of Mazhavarayandal Subbarama Bhagavathar why not choose one of them?

His thought process was always very clear and consistent and that is the reason why very few critics could trap him with inconsistency. Even in the Mike controversy his position was steadfast as forumites may be aware(the article/interview in the Hindu reproduced in this thread by one of the forumites would prove that).

Truly a great man of principle!! Despite the fact that he had prominent businessmen friends who were close to him and who do him any favors that he wanted, he never wanted to be beholden to anybody(I think in this thread there was a story told by Rajamony to one of the forumites about an invitation to lunch by a prominent person which PMI turned down because he was afraid there would be an obligation when the host would-- besides lunch-- shower him with gifts obligating him to visit the person again later!!)

semmu86
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by semmu86 »

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote:(I think in this thread there was a story told by Rajamony to one of the forumites about an invitation to lunch by a prominent person which PMI turned down because he was afraid there would be an obligation when the host would-- besides lunch-- shower him with gifts obligating him to visit the person again later!!)
Rajamani Sir told this in the centenary function @ the MA too

mohan
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mohan »

Palghat R. Ramprasad's relates some anecdotes about his grandfather: http://www.thehindu.com/arts/music/article3476411.ece

sreebeecane
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by sreebeecane »

mohan wrote:Palghat R. Ramprasad's relates some anecdotes about his grandfather: http://www.thehindu.com/arts/music/article3476411.ece
Wizard with rhythm was indeed a wizard with logic as well. I loved the grandmother-bicycle episode. Brilliant! :D

rajeshnat
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Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

Indeed a great debut
http://www.thehindu.com/features/friday ... 787632.ece

In general in the article , it is mentioned that PMI's father (i think his name is palghat subba iyer) is a supporting vocalist. May i know which artist he supported?

Mahavishnu,
Is your grandfather and Kalpathy Viswanatha Iyer mentioned in the article related ?

mahavishnu
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 21:56

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by mahavishnu »

No, my grandfather was Kalpathi Ramanathan who was PMI's first student. You can see more about their early interactions here: http://www.palghatmaniiyer.org/1_27_V.S.-Mani.html

sridhar_ranga
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 11:36

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by sridhar_ranga »

Posting this on behalf of a friend........Sridhar


A day with Palghat Mani Iyer

You are invited for an interesting day long event titled "A day with Palghat Mani Iyer" on the 11th Aug 2013 @ Ragasudha Hall from 9.00 a.m onwards...more details closer to the date.

sridhar_ranga
Posts: 809
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 11:36

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by sridhar_ranga »

SWARA RAGA LAYA presents “ A Day with Palghat Mani Iyer”


Date: 11th August 2013
Venue: Ragasudha Hall, Luz

Schedule:

9.00 a.m. to 9.30 a.m.: Lighting of the kuthuvilakku by Dr N Ramani and Vidwan P.S. Narayanaswamy, Welcome & Introduction, highlight of what can be expected in the day long event, pictorial representation of the legend Palghat Mani Iyer

9.45 a.m. to 10.45 a.m.: Ariyakudi & Mani Iyer--the 20th Century Partnership - by Sri Alepey Venkatesan, assisted by Sri R Ramesh on the Mridangam

11.00 a.m. to 12.00 p.m.: A Vocalist/violinist perspective of Sri Palghat Mani Iyer - by Dr. Sriram Parasuram

There will be fillers with Video Recordings of Sri Palghat Mani Iyer

12.30 p.m. – 4.30 p.m.: Break

4.45 p.m. to 5.45 pm.: excerpts from speeches/concert recordings explaining the significant role of the percussion in the success of the concert - by Balaji Narasimhan

6.00 p.m. to 6.45 p.m.: recollections and anecdotes by musicians - Violin Maestro Sri T N Krishnan and Vidwan Sri T V Gopalakrishnan

7.00 p.m. to 9.00 p.m.: rendition of favourite kritis of Sri Mani Iyer with accompaniments and concluding with Anjaneya Utsavam and Mangalam -Palghat Ramprasad, Padma Shankar, Bombay C N Balaji


All are welcome.

rshankar
Posts: 13754
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rshankar »

Best wishes for the program!
Sridhar, long time no see. Good to see a post from you.

advaitin
Posts: 103
Joined: 07 Dec 2010, 18:05

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by advaitin »

Nice article from Manoj Siva's blog

http://nmanojsiva.blogspot.in/2015/06/v ... -iyer.html

rajeshnat
Posts: 9906
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:04

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by rajeshnat »

Wonderful writeup by vidwan Manoj Siva . immensely enjoyed every thing that too with contextual soundcloud upload .

All
I had access a year or two back of a series of writeups by PMI that krishna gana sabha , it is a collection of writeups that was published in 80's . I wish some good samaritan scans that and publishes it as softcopy . Extraordinary writeup of this mahavidwan.

randomhari
Posts: 9
Joined: 27 Jan 2012, 03:48

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by randomhari »

Can someone identify the vocalist (and the violinist?) in this clip (link below)?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVbLF9EwV20

kvchellappa
Posts: 3596
Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by kvchellappa »

From sangeethapriya.org:
Interview with Sri Rajamani in Tamizh:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peAmre1zdDQ

Rsachi
Posts: 5039
Joined: 31 Aug 2009, 13:54

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by Rsachi »

Mr. Chellappa,
what a wonderful interview. Thank you very much!

For me, Sri Palghat Mani Iyer is the most inspiring Carnatic musician!

By the way, I have been told by people who knew Sri Mani Iyer closely that he had really poured all his art into his son Sri Rajamani. That seems to be borne out by this interview. Hats off to Sri Rajamani!

kvchellappa
Posts: 3596
Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Palghat T.S. Mani Iyer

Post by kvchellappa »

FB post of Flute Jayanth:
Palghat Mani Iyer Ghumki
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzdvmSoNpmU

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