Acharyanet: 'Master Video Lessons Taught by Legends'

[asangeetha]

Acharyanet (http://www.acharyanet.com) , an online service launched to help students of Carnatic Music has recently launched a new feature which offers Video Lessons, taught by some of the great gurus of Carnatic Music today.

The video lessons currently available are taught by Padmabhooshan Shri P.S Narayanaswamy, Smt Rama Ravi and Shri Chitravina N Ravikiran. We will we posting more lessons soon and hope that students can use this method of learning to supplement their existing learning process. No learning is complete without the guidance of a guru so we highly recommend that these lessons be used as supplemental means of learning only.

We will be offering new lessons periodically from eminent musicians/gurus. If you are interested in receiving periodic updates and information on the latest offerings from Acharyanet , please register at http://www.acharyanet.com. I will also try to post new lessons on this forum as they are put up on the site.

Feedback and Requests for new lessons are more than welcome.


All the best!
Sowmya Acharya

[mankuthimma]

I would like to see the video of that Carnatica sponsored debate again.

I was arguing for the use of Technology and one of the Gurus listed here, put me down :
Who is this guy ? What does he Know ? It took me 6 months to master some sangathis from SSI .

To which Sulochana Pattabhiraman bent towards me and asked :
You mean to say there will be another SSI through these methods .

I vaguely remember talking back :
Your generation was in love with a unique flower called SSI .
Todays generation is more into Flowers , Botany .... times have changed . I am a different kind of Engineer than what my Dad was . And my son will be different . .
Nice to see Times catching up with some of the masters .
Good Luck for these nice initiatives.

[msakella]

As this site is meant to truly serve the aspirants this must be made more transparent by introducing the mostly needed feature ‘Discussions’ not only to bring out their doubts either on the lessons taught or on the methods of teaching of the great legends but also, in turn, to get replies to their doubts. Hope this feature will certainly be introduced at the earliest for the true benefit of the aspirants. amsharma

[msakella]

Dear Shri Chitraveena Narasimhan garu, Pranams. In respect of the ‘Swaroopa Pancha Nadai Korvai’ furnished in ‘acharyanet’ I would like to mention the following for the benefit of our aspirants.

01.In the terminology it was mentioned ‘Akshara – Fundamental units that make up a tala. A tala can be expressed in terms of the number of Aksharas. Normally Adi tala would be considered to have 8 Aksharas’. But, basing upon the Kriya-prana of Taladashapranas any Tala should be defined in terms of its consisting Kriyas either sounded like beats or un-sounded like finger-counts at the first instance and only later if needed in terms of Aksharas consisting in each Kriya. Thus, as Kriya always indicates the action, Adi-tala must be considered to have 8 (eight) Kriyas i.e., actions only but not Aksharas. The total number of Aksharas could be furnished basing upon different speeds i.e., 1, 2 & 4 Aksharas in 1st, 2nd & 3rd speeds or different Gatis, if needed.

02.As per the treatise, Sangeeta Ratnakara, in Taladhyaya it was mentioned that the time taken to utter five short syllables (ka-cha-ta-tha-pa) must be called ‘matra’ which should neither be shortened nor elongated basing upon the Gati. This should only be used in measuring the duration in Tala but not Akshara. I never knew that this is erroneous?

03.Thryashra is the Prakrithi-form and Trisra is the Vikrithi-form but not Tishra at all.

04.In the 5-figures pertaining to the five-gatis, while two-fours under each Kriya for Chaturashra-
gati, two-sevens for Mishra-gati, two-fives for Khanda-gati and two-nines for Sankeerna-gati
are correctly furnished two-sixs are erroneously furnished for Trisra-gati instead of two-threes.
In such case it must called ‘Divya-sankeerna’ but not Trisra. msakella

[asangeetha]

Dear Sir,

Thanks for your feedback. You have addressed Shri Chitravina Narasimhan but he is in no way connected with the posting on Acharyanet about the laya terminology on our blog post. We were proud to record his brilliant ideas on the pancha nadai korvais and have posted that on our site.

Having said that, we appreciate your sharing of ideas on the subject. I think there are different schools of thought on what terminology should be used. We have used the terms according to what is in vogue today. Since even experts cant agree on what is right and wrong on many topics, I think the debates will continue for generations about certain sensitive musical topics not only on laya. We hope that some panel can be created for the benefit of all future generations to come to some common understanding of what terms should be used by all.

Regards
Sowmya
Acharyanet

[msakella]

Chi. Sowmya dear, Even though you didn’t respond to my 3rd post you have, at last, come out to reply to my 4th post. However, your reply is not the proper answer to my points raised irrespective of the person who brought out the ‘terminology’.

Having seen my good old, knowledgeable, well-disciplined and affectionate friend, Shri Narasimhan in the video I liked to address him with affection.

You may not be able to properly understand this heart-burning problem of our aspirants. Had you truly understood it you yourself would have certainly come out with such a panel for the benefit of all future generations. You cannot do it and even the Madras Music Academy the Great will not do any such thing except giving away the ritualistic awards every year. This is our great country.

Recently I happened to go through two video clippings of Sangeeta Samrat Chi. Chitravina N.Ravikiran, 1. the lesson on 7 & 35 Tala system and 2. the lesson teaching the Gita in Anandabhairavi and felt very unhappy about taxing the brains of the kids.

1.We have a Shloka bringing out the seriatim of our Suladi-seven-talas, Dhruva, Mathya, Rupaka, Jhampa, Triputa, Ata and Eka-talas. While explaining this system of these Talas to the kids there is nothing wrong in following the same seriatim and he explained it very well.

But, while furnishing them in his book for practical purpose, unfortunately, he had followed the same seriatim starting with Dhruva and Mathya. In fact, there are compositions only on finger-counts in these two Talas and even stalwarts avoid these Talas even to sing the bare compositions once in a month or even a year. In such case, how is it justifiable to tax the kids by starting the Alankaras in these Talas?

The brain-less, useless, adamant and illogical conservatives never want any change in the system even if it is more harmful and not at all useful to the small kids. Unfortunately, I have also been taught in the same seriatim by my teachers and in the absence of any teacher-training-course or even any training methods to be adopted, I too have taxed my kids following the same seriatim teaching these Alankaras and teasing them for 40 long years. Only later, in my introspection, I realized my mistake and accordingly modified it with Eka, Rupaka, Mathya and Dhruva in the first segment devoid of longer-notes and Jhampa, Ata and Triputa in the second segment along with longer and odd-number of notes.

More over, it will be more helpful and gives enormous rhythmical strength to the kids if one or two Alankaras of these 35 Alankaras, at the least, are taught in the least odd, Trisra-gati. Unfortunately this was not done.

2.In the olden days when no other compositions than Gitas were existing people were singing only these compositions and Gurumurthy Shastry having composed 1000-Gitas even got the title ‘Veyi-geethaala-Gurumurthy Shastry’. But later many other compositions came into existence and while Kritis are occupying the prime position among all the Gitas are not used at all to sing on any dais. Now, having lost their importance, these Gitas can sparingly be used only to give acquaintance with all the 12 notes and taught with plain notes and the different oscillations must be taught beginning from Varnas only. amsharma

[msakella]

In continuation to my last post I would also like to add that, we, here at Secunderabad, have a music-institution called Swarabhangima, in which we are following the newly found qualitative-method in teaching music since last 4 years and presently we have 65 kids in all, mostly of below 12 years of age, among which all the 65 kids can very ably render all the 28-special-rhythmical-exercises, 23 kids can render 9 Varnas in full @ 4, 6 & 8 notes per beat and also demonstrate them efficiently writing them with symbolised Gamakas and 7 kids of them can efficiently give a 1 hr. concert along with many of the rhythmical intricacies, even though none of them did learn more than 7 usual Alankaras of the 35 Alankaras or more than usual 6 Gitas. I shall be happy if any of the legendary music-teachers can do so. amsharma

[msakella]

Chi. Sowmya dear, In your post No.5 you have mentioned that Shri Chitravina Narasimhan is in no way connected with the posting on Acharyanet about the Laya terminology on your blog post. But, in such case, you should have either mentioned the name of the person having connection with this posting on Acharyanet about the Laya terminology on your blog post or you could have arranged for the clarification of the points raised by me even in the interest of the aspirants. Surprisingly, since last four days, except remaining yourself silent conveniently, you didn’t do either. If you don’t respond at the earliest it should be presumed that you are not in a position to find a logical and rational answer for all these points raised by me even in the interest of our aspirants.

I can’t agree with you that even experts can’t agree on what is right and wrong on many topics. If the discussions are strictly logical and rational any expert must agree with them if they are sensible enough. But, as many of these so called experts, veterans and maestros are able performers only without much of proper Lakshana-jnana they may not agree as they are not logical or rational teachers. Adding fuel to the fire they never want to standardise the things in a disciplined manner like our western counter-parts in making the process easier and quicker. That is why, like in the case of Subbarama Dikshitar, they all are used to always praise him very highly for bringing out a symbolised system of notation in his Sampradaya Pradarshini but, in turn, they will never do anything

You wrote that you have used the terms according to what is in vogue today. It is not correct. Many are sensible enough to recognise the difference between Kriya, the action and the Akshara, the letter but not action at all.

In your terminology, in respect of the Subunits i.e., different Gatis, it was mentioned that they are the units contained within an Akshara which are erroneously referred to as ‘matras’ by some. It was also mentioned that the term ‘matra’ actually refers the duration of 4 Aksharas. In fact, even in Sangita Ratnakara it was not mentioned that ‘matra’ consists of 4 Aksharas only. As per the 16th Shloka of the Taladhyaya of Sangita Ratnakara, ‘panchalaghvaksharoccharamitha matreha kathyathe’, the time taken to utter five short syllables, ka-cha-ta-tha-pa, is called ‘matra’ which is approximately equal to one second of time. In this duration of time if 4-units or Aksharas are rendered it becomes Chaturashra, 3-units - Trisra, 7-units - Mishra, 5-units - Khanda and 9-units - Sankeerna but the duration of ‘matra’ never changes. Many other treatises also furnished the same in respect of ‘matra’. Even in respect of the way of rendering the Angas of the Tala the Kriya-prana of Taladashapranas furnishes different names of Kriyas and their way of rendering very clearly. Even though many of the so called experts, in the absence of proper Lakshana-jnana, are used to erroneously call the Kriyas as Aksharas the Kriyas have never been referred as Aksharas in any of the treatises and, till now, I did never come across any treatise in which these Kriyas have been named after Aksharas. More over, surprisingly, it was also mentioned that you have adhered to this original definition in musical treatises and ‘matra’ itself is erroneous. When even these sub-units of Trisra, tha-ki-ta, Chaturashra, ki-ta-tha-ka, Khanda, tha-ka-tha-ki-ta, Mishra, tha-ka-tha-ka-tha-ki-ta, and Sankeerna, tha-ka-tha-ka-tha-ka-tha-ki-ta themselves are the Jati-syllables or Aksharas I do not understand how they could again be made part of another Akshara. Even if you take the meaning of Akshara, the letter which cannot be destroyed and Kriya, a physical action, Kriya aptly suits in the present context of the different actions of the Tala either for beat or waving hand or finger-counts but not Akshara. However, I shall be obliged if the full details of these treatises having this original definition are furnished at the earliest.

When even Chi.Ravikiran rendered 3-units, tha-ki-ta in the video of his demonstration for Trisram I don’t understand how two boxes consisting 6-numbers each are furnished under each Kriya in the figure No.2. I do not understand the logic why the figures relating to only Trisra must defer while all other figures of other Gatis strictly followed a particular discipline. Hope you will arrange to answer all the points I have raised in detail at the earliest even in the interest of all the aspirants.

I am posting this both in the comments of Acharyanet and in this thread in the interest of the aspirants and I hope you will also do the same while replying. amsharma

[mohan]

Sri Akella I am having doubts about terms like 'akshara' and 'matra' and 'kriya'

Can you please explain these terms in reference two these two kritis
1. vatapi ganapatim (adi tala 1-kalai)
2. cakkani raja (adi 2-kalai)

How many aksharas, kriyas and matras are there for these compositions?

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, mohan, The required details of ‘Kriya, Akshara and Matra’ are furnished hereunder.

01. Vatapiganapathim Bhaje-Hamdasadhvani-Adi-tala of 1-kalai: Being Adi-tala this, in total, has 8-Kriyas. As in 1-kalai 2-notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units are running per each Kriya this belongs to Chaturashra-gati as 4, half of 4 which is 2 and half of 2 which is 1 pertains to Chaturashra-gati only. Always strictly following a particular discipline is very difficult and also it is the natural human tendency not to strictly abide by a particular discipline or to make amendments of his/her own to any discipline. More over, in the olden days we do not have a machine like the ‘Metronome’. Thus, since many centuries the discipline of ‘matra’ has conveniently been skipped off by all the musicians. More over, this ‘matra’ has totally been removed from the Kala-prana of Taladashapranas and a useless list of items like Kshana, Lava, Kaashta, Chaturbhaga etc., is furnished presently in all the music-books. Thus, the relevancy of ‘matra’ has wantonly been skipped off. Thus, this Tala has 8-Kriyas, 8 x 2= 16 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units and basing upon the tempo of the singer sings it should be finalised whether he/she is adhering to ‘matra’ or not.

02. Chakkani Rajamargamu-Kharaharapriya-Adi-tala of 2-kalai: Being Adi-tala this also, in total, has 8-Kriyas. As in 2-kalai 4-notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units are running per each Kriya this also belongs to Chaturashra-gati like the above. In respect of ‘matra’ the same thing appllies like the above. Thus, this Tala has 8-Kriyas, 8 X 4=32 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units and basing upon the tempo of the singer sings it should be finalised whether he/she is adhering to ‘matra’ or not. amsharma

[mohan]

Thank you Sri MS Akella. If matra is adhered to, is the following correct when adhering to chaturashra gati:
1. adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 4 matras per kriya, that is 32 matras per cycle
2. adi tala 2-kalai (eg cakkani raja) has 8 matras per kriya, that is 64 per cycle

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, mohan, Duration of matra should not be linked with gati. Both have different entity. While the matra has a fixed duration of one second and could be applied for any Kriya the gati irrespective of its value i.e., Trisra or Chaturashra or Khanda or Mishra or Sankeerna or any other gati must be rendered in this duration. Thus you have to correct your version furnished in your post in the following manner.

1. adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras

2. adi tala 2-kalai (eg cakkani raja) has 4 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 notes running in the duration of 16 matras per cycle. amsharma

[vasanthakokilam]

Thanks msakellaji. I am sure Mohan will come back with any further clarifications as needed, but let me echo back to see if I understood you correctly.

a) Mathra is a specification of tempo in real world ( clock ) time. Old CM books may not have specified it units we are familiar with, say seconds, but they used things like 'the real world time it takes to say those 5 syllables' but the important thing is mathra is indeed a unit of real elapsed time.

b) Mathra is a specification of overall tempo in real time, 'Akshara, Amshas or units' are specifications of speed/gathi ( which are relative to that overall tempo specified in mathras in terms of real word realization )

c) This is sort of analogous to western music notation where at the top right they will write something like 'quarter = 60bpm to indicate that the tempo is 60 quarter notes/minute'. Granted, as you noted before, the CM treatises specify that the convention is to specify that real world time,namely so many mathras, for the entire tala cycle and not for individual notes, but they both specify the same kind of thing but at different aggregations.

d) If, for example, someone wants to sing the number 1 above at a slower tempo, would it be correct to specify it as follows?"

( as written above )

"adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras"

A slower tempo specification is

"adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 16 matras"

and further slower tempo as

"adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 32 matras"

Plese feel free to correct any of the above. Thanks.

[Nick H]

Specification of tempo in "real-world" terms requires clock. Was there any such thing when the theory was laid down. and, if there was, did the theoreticians listen to its tick.....tock....tick.....tock as they pierced lotus flower petals with pins?

[vasanthakokilam]

Nick, I am cutting and pasting from what msakklla wrote which may answer your question

"As per the 16th Shloka of the Taladhyaya of Sangita Ratnakara, ‘panchalaghvaksharoccharamitha matreha kathyathe’, the time taken to utter five short syllables, ka-cha-ta-tha-pa, is called ‘matra’ which is approximately equal to one second of time."

High degree of accuracy and granularity is really not required in tempo specification since only a handful of tempos are used in practice anyway, like fast, medium, slow and possibly very fast and very slow as further extensions.

[Nick H]

Mathra is a specification of tempo in real world ( clock ) time. Old CM books may not have specified it units we are familiar with, say seconds, but they used things like 'the real world time it takes to say those 5 syllables' but the important thing is mathra is indeed a unit of real elapsed time.

I see you'd said it already. However, taking the time to say a number of syllables is rather going to depend on the speaker.

And the whole Akshara/ Mathra thing just makes my head hurt. I suppose I jut have to deal with under it depends who I'm talking to...

[msakella]

vasanthakokilam: Until you maintain the duration of one matra or second strictly there is nothing wrong in singing as many number of notes as you like in that duration. Thus, you can sing a note stretching it to 2 or 3 or 4 or even more matras or you can also sing 16 notes or even more in a matra. That depends upon the need and ability.

Nick H: The Akshara/Matra thing will never hurt you, dear. The perfect indiscipline of our imperfect musicians in its usage only hurts you. Our musicians never want to become restricted by one discipline or the other. They always want a free hand without any restriction whatsoever. That is why they never want to standardise anything to have that flexibility. That is why the ‘matra’ has later been eclipsed by the huge list of items starting with piercing lotus flower petals with pins. Even after the invention and introduction of Metronome they never prefer to use it. The same thing applies to Shruti also and, that is why, mostly all the Tamburas certainly have one kind of dissonance or the other and now, mostly all the musicians have become immune of this dissonance. amsharma

[mohan]

1. adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras

Sri Akella thanks for the clarification. For a kriti like vatapi there are 32 (8 x 4) notes per cycle
eg in the last sangati"
GPNS RGGR SNPP GRSN|P,,R ,,S,|R,,, SNSR||

If these are not aksharas, then what is the correct term?

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, mohan, This particular sangati you wrote has 32 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or Units in this cycle. They all are in the next higher degree of speed and in the same duration of 8 matras only i.e., running 4 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units in each matra. amsharma

[vasanthakokilam]

Akellaji: I am confused.Now I am not sure what I wrote above in post #13 is correct or not.

Let me ask the question in a different way.

Let us say, artist A sings Vathapi as you wrote before.

Let us specify it as follows:

adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras

Each tala cycle will take 8 seconds ( 1 mathra = 1 second ).

Artist B sings the same song, in the same 1-kalai at half the tempo. For that artist, it will take 16 seconds to complete. How will you specify this artist B?

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, vasanthakokilam, For example, while artist A’s ‘vatapi’ is in medium tempo and occupies 8 matras i.e., seconds B’s ‘vatapi’ being in the lower slow tempo occupies just double of that which is 16 ‘matras’ i.e., seconds. Thus the duration of the ‘matra’ is not changing but the notes having been elongated in the lower slow tempo. If the person is ‘matra’ you should only size the pant according to the person but not the person according to the pant, dear. amsharma

[vasanthakokilam]

Thanks akellaji. That is clear. So we can specify Artist B's vathapi as follows. Correct?

adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle
running in the duration of 16 matras

[mohan]

or as per the clarification in Post #19
adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 4 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 notes per cycle
running in the duration of 16 matras

This really is getting confusing!

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, vasanthakokilam, As far as ‘matras’ are concerned it is correct. But, in respect of Kalai also to make it tally, as it is of the lower speed, it should be of 2-kalai and as follows:

adi tala 2-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 longer-notes (or 4 shorter-notes) or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 longer notes (or 32 shorter-notes) per cycle running in the duration of 16 matras. amsharma

[vasanthakokilam]

Akellaji: Until you brought the 2 Kalai with respect to Vathapi, I was all very clear. I thought 2 kAlai can be present even for songs that are sung fairly briskly, like, ElAvathara, Mukhari.

Aside from that, let me reproduce the important statements and ask if these are all consistent and correct.

adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras

adi tala 2-kalai (eg vatapi) has 2 longer-notes (or 4 shorter-notes) or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 2=16 longer notes (or 32 shorter-notes) per cycle running in the duration of 16 matras.

(and re-writing what Mohan worte in #23 )
adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 4 (short ) notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 short notes per cycle
running in the duration of 8 matras

adi tala 2-kalai (eg cakkani raja) has 4 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 notes running in the duration of 16 matras per cycle.

=======

In all these statements, there are only two constants.

The duration of the matra is a constant ( let us consider that as one second )
The number of Kriyas for a tala ( 8 for Adi tala, no matter what the kalai is )

Everything else is variable including number of aksharas per kriya, number of aksharas per matra and the duration of the akshara.
These are all variable according to need and ability, as Akellaji said.

One important corollary is: The number of matras for each kriya is also not fixed for a particular song (e.g. vathapi ). It varies according to the tempo picked by the artist. Vathapi, in theory, can be sung in different tempos. Different tempos in essence define different number of matras for each kriya but once the tempo is picked for a particular rendition of that song, it does not ( typically ) vary within the song.

Is this all correct?

[msakella]

Dear brother-member, vasanthakokilam, I am hereunder giving the correct version. It may be confusing but it is correct.

Matra carrying 4 short-notes in Chaturashra-gati is approximately equal to one second.

1-Kalai always carries 2 short-notes and 2-Kalai carries 4 short-notes. But, in terms of matra these 2 short-notes of 1-Kalai must be treated as 2 long-notes or 4 short-notes as they occupy one second and 4 short-notes of 2-Kalai must be treated as 4 long notes or 8 short-notes as they occupy two seconds. Short-notes of Kalai mst be treated as longer in respect of matra. Thus,

adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) having 2 short-notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya carries 8 x 2=16 short-notes per cycle and if it is sung in terms of matra it occupies 8 matras i.e., 8 x 4=32 short-notes.

adi tala 2-kalai (eg vatapi) having 2 long-notes (or 4 short-notes) or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya carries 8 x 2=16 long-notes (or 32 short-notes) per cycle and if it is sung in terms of matra it occupies 16 matras I,e,m 16 x 4=64 short-notes.

(and re-writing what Mohan worte in #23 )
adi tala 1-kalai (eg vatapi) has 4 (short ) notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 short notes per cycle running in the duration of 8 matras. This is ok.

adi tala 2-kalai (eg cakkani raja) has 4 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 4=32 notes running in the duration of 16 matras per cycle. (This must be: adi tala 2-kalai (eg cakkani raja) has 8 notes or Aksharas or Amshas or units per kriya by which it carries 8 x 8=64 notes running in the duration of 16 matras per cycle) amsharma

[asangeetha]

For having posted some laya related terminology on my site at http://www.acharyanet.com/10/blog/laya- ... tic-music/, I encountered much criticism from Shri Akellaji. As a student (or anybody for that matter) , one needs to have an open mind and take constructive criticism in the right spirit and use that as an opportunity to learn. However, it is difficult to respond to unfair comments (which seem to have disappeared from the thread now mysteriously) and have nothing to do with the actual content of debate ... especially coming from an elder from whom one seeks blessings or a gentle manner of guiding students.

I would like to say that Acharyanet is privileged to work with only the reputed gurus and at this juncture, there is no need for me to defend any of them for their teaching methods. Their achievements, actions and their student's achievements speak louder and clearer than anything I could possibly say. And thats where I end my response to that criticism. I neither expect laurels for my service nor am I deterred by negative comments. The fact that students anywhere in the world can benefit from the teachings of great gurus when they themselves would not have an opportunity to learn from them , gives me the motivation and fulfillment to work on this initiative. And neither do I regret giving up an alternate lucrative career in technology to learn and help propagate good music which by the way is essentially the opposite of lucrative. No matter, I love what I do and can afford to do so.

The content posted on the site was based on terminology widely used today based on what the more recent musical treatises have given us. (From the time period of the Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini) I am not a musicologist and neither do I claim to be an expert on this subject, but what I had written is what I had learned from very reputed gurus and experts in the past. Still, I decided to use this opportunity to look at references and not just believe what was taught to me, and this is what I found. I am not here to convince anybody to follow this, but the answers are always available to anyone willing to put in the effort to read, listen and internalize and then decide what makes sense.

1) Tishra is the terminology widely used today. It has even been used in Dr Harikesanallur Muthiah Bhagavatar's Tamil treatise, Sangeeta Kalpadruma. He has mentioned in his foreword that he has published the book after researching many earlier works inlcuding Sangeeta Ratnakaram, Sangeeta Damodaram, Sangeeta Parijatam and about 10 more books. Although Trishra was the term used earlier, just as many things have evolved and changed so has this and this is accepted as correct today.

2) Aksharas - No confusion here. Its is pretty clear in almost every single book dated as far back as when the Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini was written. It is used as the basic unit of measurement of a tala. It does not refer to the subunits. Subunits or the beats inside an Aksharam can vary depending on the kalam (1 for 1st speed, 2 for 2nd speed .. ) or gati (3 for tishra, 5 for khandam and so on). The subunits may be called as 'Ul-Aksharas' (Tamil) or internal Aksharas. In Prof SR Janakiraman's book, 'Essentials of Musicology in South Indian Music' , on pg 231, he has mentioned Dhruva tala as having 14 Aksharas, Matya tala as having 10 Aksharas and so on. And in Muthiah Bhagavatar's Sangeeta Kalpadruma, pg 175, similar terms are used. He has also used the term subunits and not Aksharas. How can subunits become Aksharas?

3) Matra - Nothing to do with physical time duration. This refers to 4 Akshara duration as I mentioned before. In the Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini, pg 60, it specifically says that in the earlier Sangeeta Ratnakara, matra was equal to the duration of 5 Laghvaksharas but that has changed and that these days talas are reckoned with 4 Aksharakalas per matra. By that token, a a dhrutam is half matra, Laghu is 1 matra, guru is 2 matras and kakapadam is 4 matras. This is also mentioned in the treatise, Raga Tala Chintamani by Poluri Govinda Kavi of the 17th century. In this it is said that the Simhananda tala is of 128 Aksharas or 32 Matras. So how can one use the term matras for subunits?

4) Talas are defined by Aksharas and Angas. Angas are defined by Kriyas which dictate the action on how to render the angas. Adi tala has 3 Shashabda kriyas and 5 nishabdha kriyas. Talas should be expressed only in aksharas and angas, and the kriyas define the action for the angas. And I didn't say this. Pls refer pg 249 in Prof SR Janakiraman's book 'Essentials of Musicology in South Indian Music'. I quote "In some quarters, every akshara of the tala is referred to as a Kriya. It is therefore said that Adi tala has got 8 Kriyas. That is not correct.."

In conclusion, I would like to say that many great great minds have helped the music system evolve to the form in which it is today. They have simplified and removed the redundant and given us the essence of the great and truly important concepts. Music has evolved. I personally would not be compelled to follow something written 800 years ago as the standard, although its good to know how things used to be once upon a time.

Regards
Sowmya
http://www.acharyanet.com

[msakella]

Chi. Sowmya dear, Now I am 75 and you are not even half of it. In the same manner, having served for 35 long years in the Govt. Colleges of Music, Andhra Pradesh officially as Lecturer and Principal but un-officially in almost all the cadres of non-teaching and teaching posts, having also simultaneously lived among our parasitical artists as a successful parasite and, at last, only by the grace of the Almighty, having fully realised and repented, now, I am aware of umpteen heart-burning problems all relating to our kids only of which many of our honest musicians or music-teachers are not at all aware. At this age and fag end of life I need not have any ulterior motive in bringing out the harmful lapses in the interest of our kids which naturally irk the opponents.

In this context only, when, at the first instance, I brought out some points I did not get proper answers.
By that, only in the interest of our kids, I was compelled to bring out some more points relating to the methods of teaching only. However, I did not get proper logical answers to my points.

Teaching Alankaras starting from the usual Dhruva-tala followed by a reasonable number of Gitas with Gamakas does not make a professional performer an efficient, honest and reliable music-teacher but a so called guru of repute. In my service, I also taxed my kids un-knowingly in the same manner which successfully helped only to elongate the process of teaching but not to maintain the standards at all. A true music-teacher sings or plays the minimum but mostly initiates the aspirant sing or play the maximum within a minimum time frame and the end result only proves him/her a true teacher. Since last 15 years I have been searching to find such a true music-teacher but in vain. I have even uploaded nearly 700 videos to ‘youtube.com/user/msakella’ pertaining to the relevant teaching-material open and free of cost to all on the globe. Even though I have obtained amazing results as mentioned in some of the above posts through these novel methods of teaching making the process ‘time-bound and result-oriented’ and uploaded the respective videos of the talented kids to Youtube none of the money-minded music-teachers are willing either to follow them or to upload the respective videos of their methods of teaching free of cost. Thus, very sadly, they all are trying their level best only in finding ways in properly utilising the modern technology to earn as much as they can than utilising it in making the process of teaching or learning music quick and efficient.

In the 3rd para you have mentioned that the content posted on the site was based on terminology widely used today based on what the more recent musical treatises have given us from the time period of the Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini. But, inconsistently you have furnished some material pertaining to Ragatalachintamani pertaining to 16th-17th century also.

1) In Sanskrit while ‘Thryashra’ is the Prakrithi-form its Vikrithi-form is ‘Thrisra’ and in general, in all the Sankrit treatises the Prakrithi-form ‘Thryashra’ only was used. Thus, in Sangeeta Ratnakara the Prakrithi-form, Thryashra was used but neither the Vikrithi-form nor your funny form, Thrishra. But, you wrote ‘Tishra is the terminology widely used today. It has even been used in Dr Harikesanallur Muthiah Bhagavatar's Tamil treatise, Sangeeta Kalpadruma. He has mentioned in his foreword that he has published the book after researching many earlier works including Sangeeta Ratnakaram, Sangeeta Damodaram, Sangeeta Parijatam and about 10 more books. Although Trishra was the term used earlier, just as many things have evolved and changed so has this and this is accepted as correct today’. Even the term earlier used was Thryashra only but not your term Trishra at all. By this deliberate lie it was proved beyond any doubt that Dr. Harikeshanallur Muthaiah Bhagavatar was also a lying person and I cannot rely upon his statements.

2) Even in Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini, in Kriya-prana, it is very clearly mentioned that either the beat or the waving hand or the finger-counts must be called as ‘Kriyas’. Thus, while defining a Tala the name of the Tala like Chaturashra-jati-triputa-tala carrying the name Adi must be brought out at the first instance and later the Angas, Chaturashra-jati-laghu followed by two Drutas totalling to 8-Kriyas and only later the total of the running units of either 8-Aksharas @ 1-Akshara of every Kriya or 16-Aksharas @ 2-aksharas of every Kriya or 24-Aksharas @ 3-Aksharas of Trisra-gati of every Kriya and so on must be brought out. In any case, if you call these Kriyas as Aksharas, then what is the Sanskrit name you like to give to these subunits?
While certain versions in respect of Shruti are proved incorrect by the knowledge showered on me by the internationally reputed musicologist Prof. Mysore R.Sathyanarayana and I myself have found certain versions of Tala also incorrect, I cannot rely upon the statements of Prof. S.R.Janakiraman. More over, as I myself have found some of the versions pertaining to Tala incorrect even in respect of Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini also I cannot rely even upon the Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini.

3) Even in respect of Matra I did nowhere mention Matra as units contained within an Akshara as you wrote in your terminology. I have mentioned that the duration of Matra is always constant and it should not be shortened or elongated basing upon the constituent subunits. Accordingly, Chi. Ravikiran also ably and aptly rendered in his video all the different Gatis in the same duration of the Matra. It would have been more helpful to the kids had you made it more clearer in respect of other Gatis also instead of mentioning that Matra actually refers to duration of 4 Aksharas only.

4) In the 5-figures pertaining to the five-gatis, while two-fours in two-boxes under each Kriya for Chaturashra-gati, two-sevens for Mishra-gati, two-fives for Khanda-gati and two-nines for Sankeerna-gati are furnished and Chi. Ravikiran correspondingly, ably and nicely rendered them in his video, the two-sixs furnished under each Kriya in the figure 2 are not tallying with the rendition of two-threes of Chi. Ravikiran.

Hope you will sincerely do the needful in the large interests of our kids.

With all best wishes,
amsharma

[msakella]

Chi. Sowmya dear, Glad to find the modified figure of Thrisra-gati in acharyanet. amsharma

[msakella]

Mother is the supreme being on the earth. She never feeds un-necessary husk to her kids but the healthiest. In the same manner the Guru should also feed his/her disciples affectionately with energetic food but not any husk. Thus, the Guru’s duty is far more responsible than the mother as the so called Guru should keep the kid healthier mentally also in all respects while the mother tries to keep the kid healthier more physically in the tender age.

Having already successfully failed as a responsible teacher in my Govt. service and having later realised it I sincerely and honestly feel it as my responsibility to give correct information to our kids and in this process only I am used to point our the mistakes of several persons but not with any enmity. But, unfortunately, nowadays, people are not ready to realise this but to find fault with me doing nothing positively even in the high interests of our kids. amsharma

[msakella]

Chi. Sowmya dear, Recently, few days back, when I have accidentally visited acaryanet.com, I felt very unhappy to find my photograph in your home page being misfit in that group. However, yesterday, when I have visited again, I felt very happy to find that it has been deleted even without charging anything from me for which I am thankful to you. I have posted the same in your site also. amsharma