Ragam of THIS shaMbho mahAdeva - MArga-Bandhu Stotram

[Sundar Krishnan]

11/11/11

Requesting for Ragam Identification and the Taalam of the Viruttam “kara charaNa” and the following “MArga-Bandhu Stotram” : “shaMbho mahAdeva ...”
in THIS rendition, uploaded at :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/rm6fe2

Thanks in Advance (TIA)

PS :
The Lyrics for the Viruttam - Prayer for Forgiveness - Kshama Prarthana, is given at :
http://shivadarshana.blogspot.com/2007/ ... eness.html
and the Lyrics for the main MArga-Bandhu Stotram is given at :
http://www.shaivam.org/ssmargab.htm

...

[vasanthakokilam]

Nadanamakriya, Adi ( khanda nadai )

[mohan]

and the Lyrics for the main MArga-Bandhu Stotram is given at :
http://www.shaivam.org/ssmargab.htm

That sites gives the line
phAlAvanamratkirITaM phAlanetrArchiShA dagdha pa~ncheShukITam |

Should it be:
bAlAvanamratkirITaM bAlanetrArchiShA ... ?

[Sundar Krishnan]

15/11/11

vasantakokilam,

Thanks for : Nadanamakriya, Adi (Khanda Nadai)

Mohan,

I just provided the link to the Lyrics, but I have myself not read through it minutely.

...

[Sundar Krishnan]

15/11/11

vasantakokilam,

On 2nd thoughts, I tried listening to another song in MIO in the Ragam : Nadanamakriya :

http://www.musicindiaonline.com/#/searc ... na+Jaladhe
The 1st one is : KaruNa Jaladhe by Nityashree
and the 2nd one is the same song by Nisha.

And repeatedly, I tried to listen parts of Nityashree's song and Shambho Mahadeva (of Post # 1) to see if the tunes match. [I opened both - one in RP and one in WMP, and played and paused each in turn.]

I am afraid, to me atleast, the tunes don't appear to match.

Can we have another opinion on the Ragam (and Taalam) of the song uploaded in Post #1 ie, :
the Viruttam “kara charaNa” and the following “MArga-Bandhu Stotram” : “shaMbho mahAdeva ...”
in THIS rendition, uploaded at :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/rm6fe2

...

[mohan]

The raga is Ahir Bhairavi (roughly equivalent to Chakravakam)

[Sundar Krishnan]

15/11/11

Mohan,

I was just preparing to draft a post on Ahir Bhairav vs Chakravakam, and toying over whether I should start a new Thread or ... , when I happened to see yr above Post # 6.

Since you mentioned Ahir Bhairav ...

I have uploaded 2 songs sung in Ahir Bhairav :

1) PibarE RAmarasam - composed by SB :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/4puz5c

[The same song and same Ragam, can also be seen & listened to, at this Video Link (this Video recording event / time is diff from the above Audio rec evnt / time) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug6bfEDvppw :
However, I personally feel that wrt quality of singing and melody aspects etc, the above uploaded Audio, is better than this Video.]

*************

2) sAdhO sAdhO main vairAgan hari kI - Meera Bhajan :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/mcp7oc

[
Murali Ramanathan has also put up his own audio of this song at :
http://www.muraliramanathan.com/blog/20 ... hajan.html

But he also writes : ... a Meera Bhajan 'Sadho Sadho' in the raaga 'Aahir Bhairav' which is same ? as 'Chakaravakam'.
]

{
But http://www.karnatik.com/ragasa.shtml#Ahiri%20bhairavi states :
Ahiri Bhairavi (Ahir bhairav) |17 - sUryakAntam| S R1 G3 M1 P N2 D2 M1 P D2 S | S N2 D2 P M1 P G3 R1 S

16 | chakravAkam | S R1 G3 M1 P D2 N2 S | S N2 D2 P M1 G3 R1 S
17 | sUryakAntam | S R1 G3 M1 P D2 N3 S | S N3 D2 P M1 G3 R1 S
}

*************

Mohan,

Again, I am afraid, to me atleast, the tune of the Shambho Mahadeva Song (as uploaded in the Post # 1 sendspace link), does not appear to match with the tunes of the above 2 songs : PibarE RAmarasam and sAdhO sAdhO.
The Viruttam “kara charaNa” part is perhaps tad closer to the above Ahir Bhairav tune, but this too, I am not sure, since it is sung at slow pace, and for a short duration. He then appears to launch the main Shambho Mahadeva Song in an other Ragam ??

I can also NOT agree with Murali Ramanathan when he says (in his above blog site) that Aahir Bhairav and Chakaravakam are the same.

Welcome yr comments and confirmation wrt Ragam Identification ...

*************

Can we also have other opinions on the Ragam (and Taalam) of the song uploaded in Post #1 ie, :
the Viruttam “kara charaNa” and the following “MArga-Bandhu Stotram” : “shaMbho mahAdeva ...”
in THIS rendition, uploaded at :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/rm6fe2

...

[vasanthakokilam]

Mohan, if you are sure about Ahir Bhairav/Chakravaham, I am fine with it. I was also toying with Chakravaham as a possibility but since the song seems to spend a lot of time in the purVangam, it was hard for me to see if there is a use of 'D2' and 'N2'. Do you hear those notes? Which parts? Thanks.

[mohan]

VK, I am familiar with this stotram since I was a small child. My dad used to sing it whenever we went on travels. It is by Appayya Dikshitar.
D2 and N2 come in the 2nd line of the charanams. Another version at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oWnCGvDZN4

[Sundar Krishnan]

16/11/11

Mohan,

The photos in the Video are good.
Who / which orchestra has sung it in the UTb ?
See also (*) below.

But my doubt on the Ragam still remains.

We can listen to Chakravakam Alapanai in Yesudas's good voice of 1968 in :
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/#/searc ... hakravakam - the 3rd in the list.

Or Balachander's Chakravakam - 6th in the List (Virtuso of Veena).

My impressions - within [ ... ] :
[
These 2 above Chakravakam(s), the Ahir Bhairav of (Sadho-Sadho & Pibare Ramarasam songs) and the Shmabho Mahadeva Tunes all (ie, 3 Tunes here) appear different to me.

However, Kunnakudi's Mishra Chakravakam : 7th and 8th in the List : Hjhothumu Thodapiya appear tad closer to Shambho Mahadeva tune, still doesn't appear to be exactly the same as Shambho Mahadeva's tune.
]

In Post # 17, I gave the Ar / Av of Ahir Bhairav as given in karnatik.com ...

I would like to know the Ar / Av of Mishra Chakravakam.

******************

[ (*) : In general, I have observed in UTb that unfortunately, many people don't give the actual Event's Recording date ; the Uploaded date is of no use. Often they also don't put up the Artiste(s)' name(s) - as in this case. Lyrics are OK, but they could have also added Lyrics' source url and the Ragam info etc.]

...

[mohan]

15/11/11

But http://www.karnatik.com/ragasa.shtml#Ahiri%20bhairavi states :
Ahiri Bhairavi (Ahir bhairav) |17 - sUryakAntam| S R1 G3 M1 P N2 D2 M1 P D2 S | S N2 D2 P M1 P G3 R1 S

16 | chakravAkam | S R1 G3 M1 P D2 N2 S | S N2 D2 P M1 G3 R1 S
17 | sUryakAntam | S R1 G3 M1 P D2 N3 S | S N3 D2 P M1 G3 R1 S

Not sure why Ahir Bhairav is classified under 17 Suryakantam when there is no N3 in it.

The tune of the marghobandho stotram is a pretty simple one and fits in with the notes of Chakravakam. As it seems to be rendered in madhyama sruthi, there is a more Ahir Bhairav feel to it.

[Sundar Krishnan]

16/11/11

Mohan,

>> Not sure why Ahir Bhairav is classified under 17 Suryakantam when there is no N3 in it.

This was bothering me too.
Good that you have brought the focus to this pt.

For now, I will write the Filename of Shambho Mahadeva song in my Disk, with Chakravakam as the Ragam.

Thanks.

Wrt Post # 10 :

Q1 : >> Who / which orchestra has sung it in the UTb ?

Q2 : >> I would like to know the Ar / Av of Mishra Chakravakam.

3) Wrt Chakravakam Alapanai (28:21 m in MIO - 3rd in the List's Link I gave), I feel that the Violin Alapanai (after Yesudas's Alapanai) has tilted a subtle shade more towards Pibare Ramarasam tune.
Do you agree ?
If I were to listen to the Violin Alapanai alone, I would guess it probably as Pibare Ramarasam itself for most parts of the Violin Alapanai ie, Ahir Bhairav instead of Chakravakam.

Both Alapanais are well sung / played.
I tried searching for the Album details for the Violinist's name, but couldn't find any links.
Any guess on who the Violinist is ?

...

[vasanthakokilam]

Mohan, see if you can clarify my confusion here. When you said 'madhyama sruthi' that gave me this thought to ask. I have a 'G' kattai flute. I can play along with him at that sruthi with what sounds like 'Sa' matching the 'Sa' of my 'G' flute. So in the G flute, the opening lines approximately translating ' G3 M1 P.. M1 G3 M1 G3 R1 S.. S..' He mostly wanders between Sa and Pa with occasionally touching what I thought was a D1. In this setup, he does not go to N etc. Am I latching on to the wrong adhara shadjam to map to these swaras?

[mohan]

VK - OS Arun's clip seems to be in C# (1.5)-madhyamam which corresponds to the Sa matching to F# (4.5). If you are playing with the G (5) flute then you will be a note off.

[vasanthakokilam]

Thanks Mohan. If I want to bring the effective sruthi to G so I can follow along on a G flute, how much should I boost the sruthi of this recording: One half step or 6 half steps?

[mohan]

If you increase the recording's sruti by one half step then it should match the Sa of your G flute.

[vasanthakokilam]

Mohan, I did that and followed along. I still do not see him going to N2 let alone D2. It feels more like D1 is the max he goes to.
To make sure, I am in sync, can you check me on the following.
1) The "Sambho Mahadeva ...." line is approx G3 M1 P. M1 G3 M1 G3..R1 S. S.
2) And majority of the song hovers between S and P.

The folk song that Mali used to play often had the same starting melody 'nandavanathil Or Andi'. In that song, Mali does use ' P. M1. P D2 N2. D2 P P. M1 G3 M G3 R2 S. S. G3 M1 P. M1 G3 M1 G3 R1 S. S. ' which maps to Chakravaham swaras.