Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Carnatic Musicians
bilahari
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#76

Post by bilahari » 21 Jan 2009, 08:28

Ragjay, yes please do so when you find time. Thank you.
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shripathi_g
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#77

Post by shripathi_g » 22 Jan 2009, 22:13

I've uploaded what I think is the concert that Ragjay is referring to.

http://www.sangeethamshare.org/sripathy ... ARI-09.zip
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Ragjay
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#78

Post by Ragjay » 25 Jan 2009, 14:58

Hi Sripathi thanks for your upload. I am referring to another concert where the pallavi is PARIMALA RANGAPATHE and it is a 3.5 hrs concert. I shall upload it in sangeethamshare and provide the link Bye Ragjay
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pgaiyar
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#79

Post by pgaiyar » 26 Jan 2009, 07:12

To:Ragjay

Please upload this concert with the RTP,"Parimala". God bless you.

Regards

Guru
26-Jan-09
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krishna212001
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#80

Post by krishna212001 » 25 May 2009, 13:30

G.N.Balasubramaniam regarded Shri Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar as his Manasika Guru.
While GNB would start with a Raga Alapana it would have a few touches of ARI's bani in them.

Regards
Krishna
Last edited by krishna212001 on 07 Sep 2009, 11:10, edited 1 time in total.
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krishna212001
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#81

Post by krishna212001 » 25 May 2009, 13:33

srkris wrote:Hello Everyone,

Can you share your thoughts on Ariyakudi please. I will also contribute whatever I know.

Here is a picture of Ramanuja Iyengar
Image

The Photo is not getting displayed.

Regards
Krishna
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krishna212001
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#82

Post by krishna212001 » 25 May 2009, 13:41

Ragjay wrote:Bilahari Please listen to his Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan concert with the same set All major ragas sung and a brilliant Khamboji RTP and brilliant violin and mirdangam playing . Probably one of the best recordings in circulation Raghavan

Hi

Any chances of listening to that prestigious Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan Concert.
If available please do share them.

Regards
Krishna
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krishna212001
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#83

Post by krishna212001 » 26 May 2009, 08:51

Mahesh wrote:I agree with Bala, I've never been able to appriciate his concerts, maybe because there are only a very limited amount of his concerts in circulation.

Oh, in the first pic above, I *think* it's [a young] KVN on the thambura.

Hi Mahesh & Bala

I think you have not understood the essence in Iyengarval's Music.
Please do listen to his music more and more and then you will start understanding the Bhavam and
technical aspects in his Music.

In the Picture it is not KVN it is (a young) Madurai N Krishnan on the Thambura

Regards
Krishna.
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coolkarni
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#84

Post by coolkarni » 26 May 2009, 09:04

..
Last edited by coolkarni on 27 Nov 2009, 17:35, edited 1 time in total.
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Ragjay
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#85

Post by Ragjay » 03 Jun 2009, 21:57

Coolkarni it is indeed true that perhaps I am orbiting elliptically. The Ariakudi concert spool tape is damaged beyond redemption. I have transferred it on to cassettes and I am trying to figure out who took them. I shall certainly retrieve it and upload it .
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rajeshnat
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#86 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by rajeshnat » 30 Jul 2010, 14:10

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rajeshnat
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#87 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by rajeshnat » 30 Jul 2010, 14:44

Old timers who had a chance to hear Ariyakudi (MKR , VKV,CML , Arasi , veeyens )
Quick question to you all. When I hear ariyakudi in the few available recordings, I am unable to connect to "ahA oHO excellence " that every musician and old timers have said .To me and personally only to me , I would not rate him say in the league of say GNB, MMI and SSI .

At the same time wheneven greats like GNB,SSI have talked so much about the greatness of ariyakudi , I am assuming his great concerts are not available as recordings, possibly you all may have heard him in 40's and 50's . If you can recollect his concerts and take me to that perceived "ahA oHO excellence " that would be great. Anecdotes like his proportion , paddhAti creater along with his guru shri poochi IyengAr etc are all great achievements , but musically what was this "ahA oHO excellence" ,is what I would like to know from you all old timers.

MKR sir
Possibly you can recollect your dad's experience too.
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vasanthakokilam
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#88 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by vasanthakokilam » 30 Jul 2010, 23:40

Just a couple of thoughts based on listening to ARI recordings...

1) His alapanas are quite succinct.
2) Rajesh, as it happens in all fields, those who stand on the shoulders of giants may be able to look far and out but they acknowledge the debt they owe to the giant without whose shoulders they could not have gone farther than the giant. ( borrowing from what Einstein said about Newton )
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cacm
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#89 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by cacm » 31 Jul 2010, 01:35

Rajeshnat,
I consider ARI to be the ULTIMATE creative Genius & perfect Creator of Carnatic Music since 1930's. It will take at least an hour to present the case & if we ever meet I canpresent the case. This forum is not the suitable place.....VKV
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vasanthakokilam
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#90 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by vasanthakokilam » 31 Jul 2010, 02:06

vkv: That indeed is a great topic for a rasikas get together.. If you ever do this, please record, so all can partake in the experience.
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Ramasubramanian M.K
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#91 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K » 31 Jul 2010, 06:04

Rajeshnat: I had just the SAME feeling when I first heard him in the late forties and fifties--myself and my father would have arguments on this--I did not need any persuasion with regard to GNB,MMI Musiri or MVI but about ARI I was ambivalent. Over the years when I listened more and more--we have a few reel-to-reel and cassette recordings languishing in my archives here in NY--need a VKV to help me-am afraid to even touch them!!---I have developed admiration for his music.

In my opinion if you are looking for the Bhavam as in SSI,you may not find it. If you expect the Thodi to be different from one concert to another you may not find it. But you would find an inexplicable "Jilu JIluppu" in his music--I can demonstrate that when we meet--the paradox is that ARI's Shadja will always be slightly on the higher side(whereas GNB's Shadja will be lower and a trifle discordant)--yet ARI's would not sound bad whereas GNB's sruthi kuraichal(I do not know how to explain it-only by Demo can this be done) will be noticeable.

More importantly the Pangeedu(sense of proportion in the whole concert or the balance betwen the Ragam,Krithi Swaram etc is exemplary and worthy of emulation. After hearing a # of Kutcheris--hearing a whole gamut of kritis in Thodi(Thygaraja or MD or Syama sastry) I started to appreciate the merugu" in his singing--the classics like Hariharaputhram,Entharo,Sree Subramanyaya namaste etc(the neraval in vasavadi-one could predict how the neraval would go how the swarams would flow--yet it would seem as if you heard it for the first time.(for example in the Kanada varnam Neranamithi invariably the first swarm would be (after the Charanam) -Ga Ma Dha Ni--(Sarasuda)-listen to any # of concerts--it would be the same--likewise the second piece would be Panthuvarali followed by Poorvikalyani--soemtimes the order would be reversed--the alapana would follow a set path or trajectory reaching the Mel Shadja in a flash
--generally the two rags are too proximate that they are rarely sung one after another but ARI broke those rules and can still bring out the difference promptly-listen to some of the present day musicians,,they would be ambivalent in their alapana and you would be speculating if it is Purvikalyani or panthuvarali.

Most importantly his performance never varied much from one concert to another and if you are looking for change of pace etc you would not find it.

My father worshipped the ground that ARI walked on and GNB and SSI would not STOP praising ARI's music---no formal obligatory courtesy opinion but genuine admiration--PMI openly averred that every vocalist should try to emulate ARI!!
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arunk
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#92 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by arunk » 31 Jul 2010, 06:42

I for some reason liked him from the beginning - a few specific tracks (mArubalka, Sri nArada and endaro) from MIO were perhaps instrumental. At that time I had not heard much GNB and SSI. I was sort of starting out into seriously listening past-masters and on reading up found ARI was a pioneer and gave him a try before trying GNB and SSI. Later on I enjoyed the expansiveness of GNB (I still remember once amazed when he started tAnam in tODi and me thinking "now how long was the alapana portion", and it was 1 hour!!!! It passed so quickly!), and the intensity of SSI (an RTP in kIravAni was the one which hooked me to SSI). I came to love their expansive renditions - that style.

But even now, when I listen to ARI - despite the tremor in the voice, despite the terseness of main songs (20-25 mins max), there seems to be a freshness, a feeling that the concert was laid out perfectly in proportion - every piece seems sumptuous. I cannot explain why. BTW, for me, his endaro is THE best (even more than MDR's - a singer who can truly shine with SrIraga, and sings endaro expansively, and a singer I very VERY highly regard)

Arun
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mankuthimma
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#93 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by mankuthimma » 31 Jul 2010, 10:22

A Beautiful passge from an essay by Chesterton that is so relevant for Ariyakudi
Quote
And another symbol from physical nature will express sufficiently well, the real place of mysticism before mankind. The one created thing, which we cannot look at, is the one thing in the light of which we look at everything.
Like the Sun at noonday, mysticism explains everything else by the blaze of its own victorious invisibility

Unquote
Ariyakudi's music is like that to me . Nothing explains the nature of the Title Poochi better than the way Ariyakaudi handles Sadhbhakthiyu.....
He is an immortal fluttering bee , hovering around the sweetest spots .
.
His sense of proportion is a Gift from the Gods.
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varadharajan
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#94 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by varadharajan » 31 Jul 2010, 14:22

The lack "ah ah's" in iyengArvAL's music is probably due to the quality of recordings available. Sadly not much of his quality recordings exist and whatever exists i assume it is after the mid fifties when he was way past his prime. My dad used to say that iyengArvAL's peak period was from 1930-1950..

When i first heard him sing at Allepey in 1952, i was totally spell bound..The kind of fluent ease with which he sang, be it "subramanyAya namasthE" or "oruthi maganAi pirandhu" simply blew me away.. It may sound so simple but when we try to sing like that, the sangathis just wont fall in place. Each and every phrase was so perfect, i initially thought that he had memorized everything, only to be later explained by semmangudi mama that such is the high degree of polished music that one can expect from iyengAr. Semmangudi mama told me that not even Poochi Iyengar could match iyengArvAL's presentation and the sense of proportion.

IyengArvAL to me was and shall remain to be the greatest reader of people's mind. He would read the collective opinion of the public within the varnam and would plan his concerts then and there. In fact i have seen people coming out of the concert boasting that iyengArvAL sang exactly what they had in their mind and hoping for those songs to be sung. And lastly as people discussed here, his sense of proportion is something which remains unmatched by musicians till date. His crisp niraval and one avarthana swaras is something which am sure many old timers will testify.
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rajeshnat
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#95 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by rajeshnat » 31 Jul 2010, 22:30

Ramasubramanian M.K wrote:we have a few reel-to-reel and cassette recordings languishing in my archives here in NY--need a VKV to help me-am afraid to even touch them!!---I have developed admiration for his music.
MKR Sir
You have to do something to those reels , perhaps those are the pre 1960 recordings(which only you have) which will give "doubting Thomas" like me to change my opinion from ariyAtha to ariyakudi . Possibly you can carefully bring that to chennai this season . I like his koteeswara iyer's krithi kalitheera vandarul in tOdi and parthAsarathi in madhyamAvati a lot.
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ragam-talam
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#96 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by ragam-talam » 01 Aug 2010, 01:26

rajeshnat wrote:Very good write up on ARI
http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/fr/2010/0 ... 050400.htm
The following statement appears in the article: "Dr. V. Raghavan attended as a representative of the Music Academy, the strained relations between Ariyakkudi and that organisation notwithstanding."

Does anyone know what this strained relation was about?
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cacm
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#97 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by cacm » 01 Aug 2010, 06:26

It had to do with M.A. giving M.S.S. MORE importance& prominence over ARI ACCORDING TO ARI. It was SUCCESSFULLY RESOLVED by MMI & he was probably the ONLY one who could do it because of the UNIVERSAL RESPECT all the artists had for MMI. VKV
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arasi
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#98 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by arasi » 02 Aug 2010, 01:38

Rajesh,
I bet you're happy with all that has been said. No more to add except highlight what they said: viu viruppu (liveliness) jilu jiluppu (sparkle), a beautifully balanced edifice of a concert. Even then, I was partial to MMI, I've to admit.
kaccitam (terseness). While one can easily get a bit bored if more or less the same fare is served every time, in his case (and in MMI's), it did not happen. Even as a child whose attention wandered in a concert (unlike today's young ones who listen intently, bless them), I remember listening to him eagerly.
As for the balEs, I don't remember. Perhaps Rajamanickam Pillai and Chowdiah got them. Young Krishnan too? Anyway, he wouldn't have been lavish in them, I think!
Poochi's legacy truly came out in his tiruppAvai tuning. They all sound like a breeze, but a lot went into the process. About his off-sruti singing: it sounded fine. kAndalum oru ruci! , I've heard folks say about it (ever so slightly burned food can have a certain flavor too).!
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vs_manjunath
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#99 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by vs_manjunath » 02 Aug 2010, 16:29

mankuthimma wrote: Ariyakudi's music is like that to me . Nothing explains the nature of the Title Poochi better than the way Ariyakaudi handles Sadhbhakthiyu.....
The chiTTa swaram for this song presented by ARI in addition to the song itself is very enjoyable.
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Ramasubramanian M.K
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#100 Re: Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar

Post by Ramasubramanian M.K » 03 Aug 2010, 23:03

So much to write about the great man.

Rajeshnat_-your point about the reel-to-reel tapes--let me work on it. Re; your "pun" on Aiyakudi.ARI himself--the ever-inquisitive person that he was---he would barge in an intimate conversation between two people(both of them known to him as well!!) without even thinking it is breach of etiquette.Two instances.

One instance when he tried to butt-into the heated discussuions between two people, one of them disgusted at the intrusion--without bothering to find out who was the 'intruder" simply retorted, in Tamil "Ongalukku Theriyavendiya Vishyam Illai" to which ARI promptly replied Inda Ariyakudi ramanujanum Ariyakudiya (need to know)Viishayangal irukkalame Allava!!!.


Another inolving GNB and the late Babu Sir(the Secy of the Madras Music Academy-a staunch friend of ARI/PMI and GNB)--ARI approached them and asks the reason for the heated discussion--GNB says in Tamil--Engalukkulle Ayiram vishayam Irukkalam Neer Summa Irum--ARI promptly replies--Appadi Enral 500 500 aha Pangu vachhukka vendiadu Dane!!(why not split it into 500 each!!)

Srinivasa raghavan's point about anticipating/bowing to rasikas expectattons -- one incident that I was a witness to in a Bombay concert in the late fifties.

It was a pandal Kutcheri --no chairs/sofas--all seated on the floor My father and myself were sitting in the front row. --Midway thro--after the usual varnam-Purvikalyani-Panthuvarali krithis, my Father whispers to ARI loud enough for him to hear"Useniyai ellarum Maranduttele(All of you have forgotten Useni--lament that people were not singing Useni either as Kriti or in the Viruttam or Ragamalika swara).

ARI said Oh Beshaga(Oh sure!!) and rendered his Guru POOchi Iyengar's Krithi Sri Raghukula in Useni-much to the surprise of Rajam Iyer(perhaps it was not in the original list of songs planned!!). My father had not heard that song before--liked it so much that he requested ARI if he could instruct one of his disciples to teach that song for my sister who at that time was learning from one of ARI's older sishyas who had settled down in BOmbay--Mr. Ganesa Iyer(who I believe had borne the brunt of the strict Gurukulavasam that KVN and B Rajam Iyer had been spared later!!!)--promptly Mr.Ganesa Iyer taught that song to my sister and the next year when ARI visited Bombay my sister sang before him-he was pleased with the ARI bani that my sister had learnt(subsequently she learnt from KVN during our visits to Chennai during the summer vacations). ARI always had very high praise for DKP's Vidwath although he could be inexplicably neutral and lukewarm towards MS Amma's music!!!
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