TM Krishna @ Crossroads at RR Sabha

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 19:23

RK Shriramkumar violin
KV Prasad mridangam
BS Purushotham Kanjira
Vignesh Krishnamurthy Tanpura
Vidya Raghavan Tanpura

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 19:46

Obnoxious speech by RR Sabha secretary
O Jagadamba - Anandabhairavi
n@ninnu ne nammi

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 19:52

s@kannada

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 19:59

Begada A

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:02

Yarukkagilum Bhayama Summa Sollattum (response to secretary???)

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:12

s@kasu kusu ena visum

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:17

Khamas A by RKSK

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:18

Pannen Unakkaana Poosai viruttam

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:25

Marubari Talalerura (j)

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:33

s@marubari

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:34

Karnataka Kapi a

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 20:42

Sumasayaka Vidura Varnam

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:08

baro krishnayya following tani

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:15

Bare Panduranga (abhang)

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:21

Mohana Rama

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:31

s@ mohana Rama

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:33

Naan Avan Ivan Uvan viruttam - Mayamalavagowla

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:35

Jaunpuri now

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 18 Nov 2018, 21:37

Eppo Varuvaro - Jaunpuri

Sivaramakrishnan · Post by **Sivaramakrishnan** » 19 Nov 2018, 20:27

vijay ji!
Was the concert over with Jaunpuri?
Pl add your observations.

We are at crossroads.

kvchellappa · Post by **kvchellappa** » 19 Nov 2018, 21:09

I thought TMK was!

SrinathK · Post by **SrinathK** » 20 Nov 2018, 10:22

This ain't twitter.

Sivaramakrishnan · Post by **Sivaramakrishnan** » 20 Nov 2018, 14:08

Come on vijay or any other rasika who made it to the event!

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 20 Nov 2018, 15:59

This concert was over with Jaunpuri

natarajan_rasika · Post by **natarajan_rasika** » 20 Nov 2018, 23:29

vijay.siddharth wrote: ↑18 Nov 2018, 19:46 Obnoxious speech by RR Sabha secretary
O Jagadamba - Anandabhairavi
n@ninnu ne nammi

For those who want to listen to the "obnoxious speech"
https://twitter.com/surnell/status/1064759503617445888

That old mama was just expressing his views just like TMK expresses his.

MaheshS · Post by **MaheshS** » 21 Nov 2018, 02:38

I saw and heard that.

@v@vijay.siddharth -> What in that speech was obnoxious in your opinion?

bhasi · Post by **bhasi** » 21 Nov 2018, 05:26

Thanks natarajan_rasika for posting the link to the video. I watched it and must say that if not obnoxious, it is highly insulting at the very least. That old guy was couching his seemingly benign words in a poorly-veiled attempt at civility, but what he was actually doing was rebuking the performer and openly being hostile to him for his political opinions. He opens by issuing a "request" to adhere to the kacheri paddhatis of yore, but quickly reveals that he was actually using that opportunity and platform to comment on TMK's political opinions and issue a totally unwarranted harangue of sorts, which I find highly inappropriate for the occasion.

kvchellappa · Post by **kvchellappa** » 21 Nov 2018, 08:48

If TMK indulges (not necessarily here) in speech unrelated to music in a concert with people having assembled to hear him sing rather than speak, he perhaps invited it, though civility demanded that the organiser having invited him stick to music and not non-musical aspects.

bhasi · Post by **bhasi** » 21 Nov 2018, 09:11

I'd argue that firstly, inviting a performer and then basically dictating to him the terms of the performance publicly in such a manner is disgraceful, not only to the performer but also the dignity of the Sabha. If such a demand really had to be made of TMK, it could have been made beforehand, in private - no problem with that. Secondly, one insults the intelligence of the audience when one assumes that they are there only to "hear him sing and not speak" - the audience knew fully well what to expect from a TMK performance and willingly came to the Sabha. No need to play Big Brother.

kvchellappa · Post by **kvchellappa** » 21 Nov 2018, 09:30

OK, the rasikas now know what to expect from the organiser.

natarajan_rasika · Post by **natarajan_rasika** » 21 Nov 2018, 10:11

Two sides of coin.
Mama expressed his view.
From the video it looks like TMK took it sportively and then based on the list provided by Vijay Mahoday looks like he sang well too.
Mama expressed his views through the speech and used his seniority to advice TMK, TMK uses the stage to showcase his talent and his ideology.

So all is well that ends well.

natarajan_rasika · Post by **natarajan_rasika** » 21 Nov 2018, 10:13

@bhasi every human is looking for an opportunity to be heard. The Mama got the mike and expressed himself freely. TMK gets the mike and other platforms and he expresses himself without restraint.

SrinathK · Post by **SrinathK** » 21 Nov 2018, 10:58

Time will only tell if TMK's claimed attempt to make CM more formless at the base, more diverse and inclusive at the top, will only result in CM getting out of a Brahminical bhakti oriented form and into a political one, replacing one identification with another, and become much worse down the road. Nature abhors a blank canvas as it abhors a vacuum.

But to be fair to him, the metoo stories (and many other tales in private circles) have revealed a shocking level of politics, denial and lack of integrity under the facade of tradition and spiritual music that is well established. The whole crowd on Facebook and Twitter fanboys that were talking Hindu and Culture was nowhere to be seen in the comments sections when the stuff under the carpet came up. To tell you the truth, the average level of awareness of most of these 'traditional followers' and 'dharmic supporters' is no greater than the ones being a fanboy of their favourite superstar - and that doesn't help matters. The old guard can feel threatened by change, but they would do better to admit how complicit they were in making it inevitable.

The situation is ripe now for the media, caste and politics to try and use Carnatic Music and musicians as a vehicle for it's own goals. To "free CM" truly is tough when it is so easy to create more identifications. Fortunately, CM is not as big as it looks though - it is a pretty small ecosystem right now.

I don't expect that organizer to make a similar speech hoping for the safety of his children or grandchildren in music classes. No sir.

bhasi · Post by **bhasi** » 21 Nov 2018, 11:19

@natarajan_rasika Yes, he does, but I don't think he indulges in such brazen acts of incivility as talking disrespectfully to a person sharing the same stage, so that is a false equivalence you've made. Anyway, I'm just belabouring the point now; I rest my case.

SrinathK · Post by **SrinathK** » 21 Nov 2018, 11:21

@bhasi, Anyway please do introduce yourself. You have taken a fine thread to open your account here.

bhasi · Post by **bhasi** » 21 Nov 2018, 11:51

@SrinathK Hello all! I'm just a newbie rasika. I haven't really learnt CM formally. Most of my knowledge comes from a friend (he's received training for years in his childhood) who was kind enough to initiate me to the world of CM, and from personal explorations on Youtube, blogs, and the like. I also go to all the concerts that take place near me and note down all the songs that are being performed.

I think I'm at that point where I can appreciate the main elements of a CM performance, though I can't claim to recognize all the ragams or talams, though I endeavour to educate myself using the new and unfamiliar songs/ragams I encounter at concerts or otherwise on Youtube randomly. I do, however, recognize a few of the main ragams and compositions. I also enjoy listening to Hindustani (to a lesser degree than CM), but my knowledge in that domain is woefully lacking. I must find another friend to initiate me into Hindustani, I suppose!

I chanced upon this forum a while ago while I was searching for some lyrics of some obscure song or ragam (don't recall at the moment) and then again a few months later while I was searching for an artiste. There are some fantastic threads and spirited discussions by some very intelligent and articulate people here. I wish to not just passively read and learn from the wealth of info that abounds here, but also contribute my two cents on matters that are within my ken.

ram1999 · Post by **ram1999** » 21 Nov 2018, 13:49

SrinathK wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 10:58 Time will only tell if TMK's claimed attempt to make CM more formless at the base, more diverse and inclusive at the top, will only result in CM getting out of a Brahminical bhakti oriented form and into a political one, replacing one identification with another, and become much worse down the road. Nature abhors a blank canvas as it abhors a vacuum.

The inclusiveness is crap and bullshit!. You cannot force people to come and listen to any form of music or that there are restrictions for non bhramins to go to a sabha and listen to CM. It is their own interest and choice. my children run a mile away if i play CM. It is not in their blood and I cannot just force it on them. There are many bhramins who do not like classical music. Therefore, let people be given the freedom to choose what they want.

What krishna is doing is just being destructive and foolish! He is trying to steal the limelight by being a rebel! There are lot of talks about krishna working with missionaries, leaning towards the left etc. I will not dwelve into it as there is no concrete evidence as of now !

I believe that his movement will not sustain for long and will fade in a few years.

As I have said in some other thread, his own students are not following the formless music !

Sivaramakrishnan · Post by **Sivaramakrishnan** » 21 Nov 2018, 15:09

None reviewed the performance!!

SrinathK · Post by **SrinathK** » 21 Nov 2018, 16:30

True. We should. I mean, some visitor comes here and sees 37 posts, out of which 3 quarters are there because they're tweets. What kind of review can we do when the youth of these days think that everything is twitter and Facebook ?

Will someone who attended the concert give us a full fledged review?

ram1999 · Post by **ram1999** » 21 Nov 2018, 16:31

Sivaramakrishnan wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 15:09 None reviewed the performance!!

may be not worth a review and it was more a fashion show exhibiting a colorful lungi

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 22 Nov 2018, 10:20

Raining of tweets
Fritters away time
When in the wings
Sweet music waits...

sureshvv · Post by **sureshvv** » 22 Nov 2018, 10:40

bhasi wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 09:11 I'd argue that firstly, inviting a performer and then basically dictating to him the terms of the performance publicly in such a manner is disgraceful, not only to the performer but also the dignity of the Sabha.

To set matters straight, it was not a Sabha organized concert. It was a third organization that sponsored the ticketed concert and the Sabha just provided the venue. There were also a lot of protests, counter protests and threats against the program and the organizer called the cops who made some preventive arrests before the start of the concert. The Sabha secretary was probably left to handle this headache and conveyed his frustration to TMK and the audience. Given the unnecessary hassle that a Sabha secretary had to go through to facilitate a Carnatic music program, I found his speech to be extremely benign and courteous.

ram1999 · Post by **ram1999** » 22 Nov 2018, 10:46

@bhasi - seems to be new avatar created in support of krishna

bhasi · Post by **bhasi** » 22 Nov 2018, 11:18

@sureshvv Thanks for providing that context. I still stand by my words.

@ram1999 Haha, and you seem to be an old avatar created to disparage Krishna!

sureshvv · Post by **sureshvv** » 22 Nov 2018, 11:29

Sivaramakrishnan wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 15:09 None reviewed the performance!!

May be because it is primarily "political action" for activists.

RasikasModerator2 · Post by **RasikasModerator2** » 22 Nov 2018, 12:33

This thread is an example of just how poor a discussion can get. You'd think that when a thread has over 20 posts, there was something notable in the review to discuss, only to find out all of that is simply whatsapping one liners to beef up the post count followed by the customary rants. RKSK raised the bow will become one post and TMK drank water will become another. Quality posting requires more effort.

OP, first of all, this isn't a livestream concert thread for live one line updates, nor is it a breaking news bulletin. Writing a review on a forum and whatsapping are two different things! & Nxt tym prb I shd prep myslf 2 c 1L revu n sms lang bcoz adu trnd. Sry. TC. TTYL. GN. Y Y Y?

And after 45 posts, no review of the actual concert as such and the sabha mama is the star of the day.

Next gen, if you plan to write a review, learn to write outside of whatsapp as well.

ark07 · Post by **ark07** » 22 Nov 2018, 12:49

There were also a lot of protests, counter protests and threats against the program and the organizer called the cops who made some preventive arrests before the start of the concert. The Sabha secretary was probably left to handle this headache and conveyed his frustration to TMK and the audience.

The organisers of TMK's Mysore concert were also threatened but they are handling it much better.

“We received a few phone calls asking why we are bringing TM Krishna for an event when he is against Hindu religion. We responded to them saying that he is an artist and we are celebrating the art form more than anything else. We have asked them to bring documents and prove why we should not conduct the programme,”

“We do not have to comply with everyone’s wishes and if people have an issue, they can choose not to attend the event,”

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/t ... -say-91665

ark07 · Post by **ark07** » 22 Nov 2018, 12:54

Sivaramakrishnan wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 15:09 None reviewed the performance!!

The videos from the concert will most likely be posted by 'First Edition Arts' on their Youtube channel early next year. You can also find audio of the concert already on Youtube. I won't link to it as the person who has uploaded is probably violating copyright.

SrinathK · Post by **SrinathK** » 22 Nov 2018, 13:09

ark07 wrote: ↑22 Nov 2018, 12:49
There were also a lot of protests, counter protests and threats against the program and the organizer called the cops who made some preventive arrests before the start of the concert. The Sabha secretary was probably left to handle this headache and conveyed his frustration to TMK and the audience.
The organisers of TMK's Mysore concert were also threatened but they are handling it much better.

“We received a few phone calls asking why we are bringing TM Krishna for an event when he is against Hindu religion. We responded to them saying that he is an artist and we are celebrating the art form more than anything else. We have asked them to bring documents and prove why we should not conduct the programme,”

“We do not have to comply with everyone’s wishes and if people have an issue, they can choose not to attend the event,”

https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/t ... -say-91665

Idle brains are devil's workshops. And most followers of anything aren't really evolved beyond Trolls. One only needs to go to the times of india comments section to see the average IQ of the human race.

ark07 wrote: ↑22 Nov 2018, 12:54
Sivaramakrishnan wrote: ↑21 Nov 2018, 15:09 None reviewed the performance!!
The videos from the concert will most likely be posted by 'First Edition Arts' on their Youtube channel early next year.

Thank god. Maybe when that comes out, we can have a full review.

pperumal · Post by **pperumal** » 22 Nov 2018, 23:27

ark07 wrote: ↑22 Nov 2018, 12:49 There were also a lot of protests, counter protests and threats against the program and the organizer called the cops who made some preventive arrests before the start of the concert. The Sabha secretary was probably left to handle this headache and conveyed his frustration to TMK and the audience.

I kicked off this season with this wonderful concert at the hallowed RR Sabha - the hall has many fond memories associated with me and my family!!
I was curious about the speech of this "Sabha Maama" and managed to have a casual conversation with a few of the original organisers of the event (First Edition) and what I learnt was to the contrary.
First, the security for the concert was provided by the Tamil Nadu police at the request of First edition Arts, TM Krishna and a few others. RR Sabha made no efforts to provide/request any kind of security or police.
Secondly this "Sabha Maama" HAD to speak because, apparently, R R Sabha's officials insisted at the last moment that IF AND ONLY IF they were allowed to give this speech with TM Krishna and the artists seated ON STAGE would they allow the concert to take place at their venue!!!

Anyway, the music was pristine!!!!!!!! And to me, it was all that mattered!!!

- PP.