Neurologist on ragas

Miscellaneous topics on Carnatic music
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kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Neurologist on ragas

Post by kvchellappa »

From Swarajya: V S Ramachandran
“The Darbari Kanada scale probably evolved from “peak shifts” and gull chick principle applied to separation cries of infants pleading. The angst of separation from parent got morphed – through gull chick effect into the existentialangst of separation from God! (Oh why have you brought me into this world – this vale of tears – and left me alone) and in the descent (But I know all will end well). Or Abheri (world sorrow) compared with Bhairavi (plaintive personal sadness) and penance (Shubhapantuvarali).”

Sachi_R
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Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 20:20

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by Sachi_R »

Hmmmmm.
I had a very different feel for the raga. And had felt good that its grandeur as depicted by Mia Tansen's compositions (ref. Tansen CD - Music Today) and its profound serenity as expressed by Vid Lalgudi in "Sarvam Brahmamayam" sung by Bombay Jayashri resonated with my own feelings.

See what Raganidhi says:
Image

kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by kvchellappa »

How does Hari Tum Haro sound?

melam72
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Joined: 02 Nov 2016, 16:12

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by melam72 »

I heard that Kunnakudi Vaidyanathan concluded that Anandha Bhairavi increases the yield of milk from cows, and that Charukesi makes paddy in fields grow faster...

Sachi_R
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Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 20:20

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by Sachi_R »

Sri KVC,
Yes, Hari Tum Haro is very sad. I feel the words, the intonations, the movie scene, all make it very sorrowful.
But the raaga? Thanks to you, I did some listening today. I feel Carnatic music has adapted Darbari Kanhada into a sombre persona.

But the Hindustani folks on the other side of the moon dress it up not in tatters and tears but a tiara and turban of majesty. Listen to this, one among many:
https://youtu.be/SQCk50joPLk

Also this! :
https://youtu.be/Bm7VrMnW2vU

arasi
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Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by arasi »

Sachi,

Another fan of the rAga here. To me, this rAgA has a plaintive tone mostly, but how appealing at the same time! Rafi's bhagvAn has not lost its impact after all these years. Some call the Taj Mahal cold, for a monument of its magnitude. Yet, you cannot match it in its beauty. I have also heard durbAri in rAgamAlikAs in CM, in most emotive modes, not depressing at all, but arresting in the way in which it brings out the rich imagery of some lyrics.

cienu
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:40

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by cienu »

Sachi_R wrote: 29 May 2017, 16:21 Sri KVC,
Yes, Hari Tum Haro is very sad. I feel the words, the intonations, the movie scene, all make it very sorrowful.
Interestingly "Hari Tuma Haro" was not part of the film "Meera".
More about the song in the link below
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hari_Tuma_Haro
The song was sent to tune by Sri Vaidyanathan a genius and brother of cine star of yester years Ranjan.
More about the song in the link below
http://www.livemint.com/Leisure/yADn1xi ... -hymn.html

Sachi_R
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Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 20:20

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by Sachi_R »

Cienu,
Thank you. As ever, every story about MSS is so inspiring. I am sorry, the popular You Tube video featuring Hari Tum Haro (https://youtu.be/itUXh4UrTZc) made me think it was a movie song. I daresay that the pathos instilled into the rendering by the 3 great collaborators mentioned in the story bears out the Carnatic approach to the raga Darbari Kanada.
But I still request your response to my feeling that the Hindustani approach stresses majesty and grandeur rather than pathos! After all the Hindustani music has its treasure trove of pathos ragas rather overflowing 🙂, what with Bilaskhani Todi, Bairagi Bhairav, Piloo (on occasion)....

In fact there is a scholarly study of a sample of ragas published by America's NIH that says
ragas with emotion labels of sad/longing/tensed were Malkauns, Shree, Marwa, Miyan ki Todi, Basant Mukhari, Lalit.

rshankar
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by rshankar »

Sachi_R wrote: 31 May 2017, 03:45In fact there is a scholarly study of a sample of ragas published by America's NIH that says
ragas with emotion labels of sad/longing/tensed were Malkauns, Shree, Marwa, Miyan ki Todi, Basant Mukhari, Lalit.
Just a small clarification: the NIH have nothing to do with this publication in the journal, Frontiers in Psychology. The only reason you see 'nih' in the link is that all indexed medical journals are part of the National Library of Medicine (NLM), the world's largest biomedical library, which comes under the purview of the NIH, and is located on the NIH campus in Bethesda.

kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by kvchellappa »

I am listening to Fateh Ali Khan. That is majestically plaintive to my predisposed mind. As I was listening, i googled and found this: "Classical raag Khamaj evokes emotion like peace, happiness, joy, whereas raag Darbari evokes emotion like sad and depression." I can't make head or tail of this technical piece: http://ijcsit.com/docs/Volume%206/vol6i ... 604165.pdf

uday_shankar
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Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by uday_shankar »

rshankar wrote: 31 May 2017, 04:30
Sachi_R wrote: 31 May 2017, 03:45In fact there is a scholarly study of a sample of ragas published by America's NIH that says
ragas with emotion labels of sad/longing/tensed were Malkauns, Shree, Marwa, Miyan ki Todi, Basant Mukhari, Lalit.
Just a small clarification: the NIH have nothing to do with this publication in the journal, Frontiers in Psychology. The only reason you see 'nih' in the link is that all indexed medical journals are part of the National Library of Medicine (NLM), the world's largest biomedical library, which comes under the purview of the NIH, and is located on the NIH campus in Bethesda.
Clarifying further, not all of the articles linked by pubmed (the informal name for the nih website) database are mainstream medicine or science...

For example, here's an article on snake Oil...
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1026931/

And one on astrology...
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17305205
And on voodoo illness...
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1542554

Sachi_R
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Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 20:20

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by Sachi_R »

Ravi,
😀😀😀

rshankar
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by rshankar »

Sachi_R wrote: 31 May 2017, 11:53 Ravi,
😀😀😀
Did you mean to address this to Uday?? :)

Sachi_R
Posts: 2174
Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 20:20

Re: Neurologist on ragas

Post by Sachi_R »

Yes, you're right, Uday of course.
But both Uday and you should read that article and tell what you think. The concept and methodology are quite straight forward.

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