'RASIKAS'. FORUM ENTERING THE 11th YEAR

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 11 Feb 2018, 11:47

I am a relatively new entrant of this forum. and rather surprised that there is no celebration of this forum entering the 11th year today. . During the last two years, I have gained much by the learned members' comments and elucidations on many aspects of Carnatic music, lyrics. meaning, and ragams. Thank you all. May I suggest a few points for improvement? 1) ' smilies' can be removed. 2) green color can be used for 'likes' instead of red. 3) positive rather than 'negative' posts and comments should be encouraged.If we have a definite perspective, it is worth stating it with conviction and decorum... critical viewpoint should be supported by positive alternative view and information. When we give links, a brief para on the link/ from the link should be given. 4) photos and images should be very sparingly used. ( can be done in the FB version of this forum). Links to videos especially from tube should be avoided. 5) Though I have already mentioned, I would like to repeat my suggestion that a special section can be begun, in which the forum members can write about themselves.( if they want) The section should be editable by the author. any number of times. and no comments by others should be permitted there. It would help in learning about the background, main vocation, residential status , mother tongue, performing musician or hobbyist or rasika , age, educational and professional background, native district, socio-economic-political-literary leanings and such. The section should be strictly optional. 6) This is a forum for Carnatic Music . and should not be used for political remarks. If at all, the remarks should be positive. Negative political remarks trigger response and the exchange meanders into bye-lanes inevitably. 7) As far as possible, personal exchanges notes should be avoided. and the rules of posting should be strictly applicable to ALL members whether recent entrant or 'veteran' member. Let us concentrate on CM as classical music ( both concert type and 'plate music'). 8) Straying away from the title of the thread should be avoided. 9) THREADS should be numbered. for easy search and share along with post number. . 10) rasikas pages are prominently shown in google search. and that is good news as what our erudite scholars and experts post here are shared widely through google. As bad comments and threads also are shared likewise, let us be wary and preserve the reputation of the forum.

sureshvv · Post by **sureshvv** » 11 Feb 2018, 11:56

How about using paragraphs for long posts?

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 11 Feb 2018, 11:58

Wishes to rasikas !
1. " 1) ' smilies' can be removed "
Why ?
2. 3) positive rather than 'negative' posts and comments should be encouraged.
Unfair . The person concerned must take the negative feedback as constructive criticism or ignore it .
3. 4) photos and images should be very sparingly used.
A picture says a thousand words . Pics of concerts , yesteryear musicians contribute to rasikas' rasikatvam .
Kim Jong Un's close friend are you ?

Sachi_R · Post by **Sachi_R** » 11 Feb 2018, 12:12

It is a bit unusual to give a welcome speech after the main address, but here I go.

Ladies and Gentlemen,
Welcome to the Anniversary of Rasikas. I am not good at speaking solemnly, so here I intend to say what I think in verse.

Eleven you are on this eleventh day,
Oh dear Rasikas, Happy Birthday!
Rasikas of every hue are here,
Active, talkative, music we revere.

Carnatic music is rich today and resonant,
If musicians are the vowel, we supply the consonant.

All in all a pretty "pundit" crowd,
Sometimes funny, often loud,
Mathrubhootham may please note,
We do what he does, in the Carnatic moat.

Since the smiley is recommended to be banned,
I might as well use many even if I am panned,
So here you go, Birthday Baby!
Long live, and be great, may be!

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 11 Feb 2018, 12:24

@3-> Perhaps, I should also add that all people who comment here , should have their own website / blog. In that case, they can write big articles on their pet themes and share the link alone here. . I myself have given a link to Smt MS as she appeared in the Hindi Meera premiere at Delhi in 1947 but as a link.in the thread on Smt. Vedhavalli .... How is the reference to Kim relevant here? ( by the way, it may be that Koreans ( even South Koreans) are proud about KIM! and the unification of their fatherland may not be far off!.
I repeat, let us avoid political ' jibes' here please!...
.Nothing in improbable in geo-politics and it may come to pass that USA takes KIM as a 'strategic' partner to contain China! soon. ( as has already happened in Indo-US relations!...with all its dangers and 'benefits' ..If the moderator permits, why not people with strong political convictions begin a new thread on North Korea , perhaps? I do expect a deluge of critical comments with warts and all. and am not going to get trapped . Thank you.

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 11 Feb 2018, 12:28

RSR wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 12:24 How is the reference to Kim relevant here? ( by the way, it may be that Koreans ( even South Koreans) are proud about KIM! and the unification of their fatherland may not be far off!.

You are speaking like a dictator ! Like an associate of Kim Jong Un !

The rules proposed by you are similar to the rules set by Kim Jong Un !

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 11 Feb 2018, 12:32

RSR wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 12:24 If the moderator permits, why not people with strong political convictions begin a new thread on North Korea , perhaps? I do expect a deluge of critical comments with warts and all. and am not going to get trapped . Thank you.

You just mentioned that you didn't want any other discussion ( especially political opinion wars ) other than Indian classical music . Why then this new suggestion ? Want some tamasha ? Feeling bored ? Please go and watch online videos of Aruna Sairam or KBMK !

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 11 Feb 2018, 12:51

Isn't the 10th of Feb Rasikas.org's birthday?
Sachi,
Thanks for the poem and the graphics--flora and fauna and the rest. For your know how, breadth of vision, humor and sharing. How much have we changed in a year? Perhaps the poem I wrote for the tenth anniversary might give us a clue. I can't find it, though...

rajumds · Post by **rajumds** » 11 Feb 2018, 13:00

Congratulations and thanks to srkris and moderators on the mile stone. Running a website without any commercial interest requires commitment, time and resources

It is also time look back and course correct.

Even a congratulatory topic like this has degenerated in to a slugfest with in a few posts. The quality of discussions has definitely gone down and some of the veterans who are extremely knowledgeable no longer post.

I would sincerely request all those who joined in the 2-3 years to sort the topics in the ascending chronological order and read through the posts. You will see the difference. I wish rasikas.org was what it was on its younger days

CRama · Post by **CRama** » 11 Feb 2018, 13:13

Happy eleventh year to the Forum. Congratulations to all the members of the forum to make it lively and a treasure house of information though discordant notes arise many a time. I feel to be proud of being a member of this forum and have come to know some forumites quite personally and keep in touch. If now I am writing some articles for Sruti and other magazines, it is because of the encouragement given by the forumites in the initial years.Thanks to the moderators also.

Sachi_R · Post by **Sachi_R** » 11 Feb 2018, 13:13

CRama · Post by **CRama** » 11 Feb 2018, 13:16

Oh Rasikas is slightly older than I thought. It is the thirteenth birthday. Happy Birthday.

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 11 Feb 2018, 13:36

Rasikas has entered into teens ! Way to go !

This is a site where connoisseurs get together
To discuss the Indian classical music weather
Scrolling through the posts , one gets enriched
Beholding the huge content here, he is bewitched .

We share anything and everything over here
We are a family , miles apart , yet we feel so near .
May you live long ! Span over centuries to come !
I mahini ni samanamevaru ! Nitya jaya mangalam !

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 11 Feb 2018, 15:25

@9-> True. I do not post in all the sections. Whenever I find time, I read all the threads and all the exchanges in all the sections. and have learned a few details but not much. More in the nature of reminiscences than clearing the doubts on raga aspect. and sharing the rare songs' links. And too much stress on concert-stuff only.( not even AIR concerts) . My main intention in joining this forum was getting the translation of songs rendered by Smt.MS and Smt.DKP. to post them in my websites on them. ( sites.google.com/site/homage2mssubbulakshmi) and ( sites.google.com/site/dkpattammalsongs) . I am happy at the outcome. I have also done fairly satisfying work in my other two sites related to music ( sites.google.com/site/ncvasanthakokilam) and ( sites.google.com/site/hindusthaniragams). .So, it is not just finding fault with others.
Nevertheless, we cannot but have some perspective about the aims of CM ( note!.. not music in general but CM only). That is perfectly in resonance with the approach of my icons Smt.MS and Smt.DKP. .. Stating the basic purpose of CM as propounded by Purandharadasa onwards is in no way , pedantic. or parochial. . As far identification of ragams in ragamalikas and a few songs, of MS, I am sorry to say that the forum has not been very helpful. It is more lyric-oriented .
As far your suggestion to go and listen to the named artistes, it is being discussed in a different thread right now.
I am no participant there. Let us throw off per-conceived notions about the tastes of persons who post comment,
It is a facile assumption that new comers to the forum cannot be veteran connoisseurs .

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 11 Feb 2018, 15:34

Rasikas has entered into teens !

Oh god, that explains a lot. The era of grunts, monosylables and sulks.

It's just a phase, they say, he'll grow out of it. And mostly they do.

Hold tight, ladies and gentlemen. It's going to seem like a long time, but it's only a few years. Grit your teeth!

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 11 Feb 2018, 15:42

So, all through the last year, the child was in just 10th year. and lo! today it is is in 13th year.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 11 Feb 2018, 16:46

That's children for you. Especially these days: growing up so fast!

Sachi_R · Post by **Sachi_R** » 11 Feb 2018, 16:53

@#14
RSR
Pls again post links to the Ragamalikas where you wanted the ragas identified.
I would love to give it a try!

aaaaabbbbb · Post by **aaaaabbbbb** » 11 Feb 2018, 18:35

Congratulations to rasikas.org

Entering the teenage.

Happy Birthday.

Many more happy returns.

thanjavooran · Post by **thanjavooran** » 11 Feb 2018, 19:13

Congratulations to all our fellow forumites on this Birthday celebrations.
Wishing very many more happy returns.
Thanjavooran
11 02 2018

Sivaramakrishnan · Post by **Sivaramakrishnan** » 11 Feb 2018, 19:27

Time runs fast.
Let me join the celebrations with dear forumites when rasika(a) steps into her teens.
And a pat to the admin for his big role.

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 11 Feb 2018, 20:54

Many more legacy leaving returns of this day. I have personally benefitted from this forum and through the august members. Thank you Ramakrishnan for being pillar of this forum

shankarank · Post by **shankarank** » 11 Feb 2018, 23:27

ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 Wishes to rasikas !
1. " 1) ' smilies' can be removed "
Why ?

The intellecteratti has no time or patience for emotion - it should be seperated from rationality like seperation of Church and State!

ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 2. 3) positive rather than 'negative' posts and comments should be encouraged.
Unfair . The person concerned must take the negative feedback as constructive criticism or ignore it .

Critical discourse is the sole preserve of approved members of the intellecteratti , who are selected based on peer reviews using gatekeepers of knowledge! They will inject criticism like a venom or slow poison without you knowing it - nothing direct or on the face.

ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 3. 4) photos and images should be very sparingly used.
A picture says a thousand words . Pics of concerts , yesteryear musicians contribute to rasikas' rasikatvam .
Kim Jong Un's close friend are you ?

A picture or an artifact is to be subjected to archaeological investigation using anthropological method - whose flow of logic is approved and accepted in the domain of intellecteratti. Without that they are of no use. Unless they interpet it for you, you have no proper sense to know it yourself.

First you have to uproot yourself from your upbringing, your ancestral values, become a citizen of material reality, which aims to create the perfect material world , where all humans are sinners ( reconstituted as potential oppressors in their framework as the latter is value free characterization!) - and that is the reason why, they ought to be treated as equals - not that equality itself is a virtue! Suspicion ad-infinitum is the critical method - and human existence should function just like the physical world of materials - all logically derivable in a deterministic cartesian reductionist fashion!

vijay.siddharth · Post by **vijay.siddharth** » 12 Feb 2018, 11:48

shankarank wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 23:27 intellecteratti

Is that a word???

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 12 Feb 2018, 16:16

It is a suffix

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 12 Feb 2018, 21:20

shankarank wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 23:27
ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 Wishes to rasikas !
1. " 1) ' smilies' can be removed "
Why ?
The intellecteratti has no time or patience for emotion - it should be seperated from rationality like seperation of Church and State!

ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 2. 3) positive rather than 'negative' posts and comments should be encouraged.
Unfair . The person concerned must take the negative feedback as constructive criticism or ignore it .
Critical discourse is the sole preserve of approved members of the intellecteratti , who are selected based on peer reviews using gatekeepers of knowledge! They will inject criticism like a venom or slow poison without you knowing it - nothing direct or on the face.

ratanabhinav wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 11:58 3. 4) photos and images should be very sparingly used.
A picture says a thousand words . Pics of concerts , yesteryear musicians contribute to rasikas' rasikatvam .
Kim Jong Un's close friend are you ?
A picture or an artifact is to be subjected to archaeological investigation using anthropological method - whose flow of logic is approved and accepted in the domain of intellecteratti. Without that they are of no use. Unless they interpet it for you, you have no proper sense to know it yourself.

First you have to uproot yourself from your upbringing, your ancestral values, become a citizen of material reality, which aims to create the perfect material world , where all humans are sinners ( reconstituted as potential oppressors in their framework as the latter is value free characterization!) - and that is the reason why, they ought to be treated as equals - not that equality itself is a virtue! Suspicion ad-infinitum is the critical method - and human existence should function just like the physical world of materials - all logically derivable in a deterministic cartesian reductionist fashion!

I thought emoticons could express emotions like laughter , anger etc in a concise manner .
Let them inject venom , let us ignore it .
Don't understand what you are trying to say regarding pictures . I feel that pictures of concerts need no interpretation . So do pictures of musicians .
And lastly , I'm not a follower of my ancestral values . I'm a humanist .

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 12 Feb 2018, 23:03

@26-> #23 is not 'against' your post! but actually supporting ! . read between the lines. Tilting at windmills

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 12 Feb 2018, 23:15

@18-> Sachi-> If I mention the songs for which I need ragam information here , it may not be proper as it should be posted in the ragam section. I will place all my doubts in my website page and you can enlighten me regarding the ragams. through the comments. For the moment, however, why not have a look in vasanthakokilam section and join the discussion about the ragam of the opening stanza of 'Pillaip piraayatthile' ? My contention is that it is Tilang. while Sri.VK feels that it is Neelaambari. and has asked for more inputs. to clarify and settle the issue.

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 12 Feb 2018, 23:15

Don't know what Sri . shankarank was trying to convey. Especially the last paragraph seems so out of place .

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 12 Feb 2018, 23:32

@7-> My intention was that YOU can then post YOUR political ideas there, with the permission of the moderator. Better still, why not have a lounge for lousy politics? and tEnglish literature? Continental philosophy which Russell dismisses as no philosophy at all. ? Western Marxism.? deriding deridas? Alas! this forum is strictly for Carnatic music and 'related' disciplines. No need to lose heart. There are plenty of forums out there to share your piercing perceptions. Birthday wishes seem to have tricked down! The thread has to be kept alive at least by slinging.

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 12 Feb 2018, 23:38

In or about 2017, a team of archaeologists led by Nicolò Marchetti of the University of Bologna pieced together the fragments of a Hittite pot from approximately 1700 BC that had been found in Karkamış, Turkey. After it was pieced together, the team saw that it had what appeared to be a large smiley face painted on it

Sachi_R · Post by **Sachi_R** » 13 Feb 2018, 07:39

Intellect+eratti
eratti in Kannada (and perhaps Tamil): people with a tendency for self promotion, bragging, jumping around, throwing comments at people and things, showing off, being unbearable, seeking forums and groups of similar obnoxious people.
And the Intellect presumed or actual is the weapon of choice.

Ranganayaki · Post by **Ranganayaki** » 13 Feb 2018, 07:56

RSR wrote: ↑12 Feb 2018, 23:15 @18-> Sachi-> If I mention the songs for which I need ragam information here , it may not be proper as it should be posted in the ragam section. I will place all my doubts in my website page and you can enlighten me regarding the ragams. through the comments. For the moment, however, why not have a look in vasanthakokilam section and join the discussion about the ragam of the opening stanza of 'Pillaip piraayatthile' ? My contention is that it is Tilang. while Sri.VK feels that it is Neelaambari. and has asked for more inputs. to clarify and settle the issue.

I checked and couldn't find a discussion, so I'm commenting here, if you don't mind. I heard the song, I think too that it is Neelambari.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 13 Feb 2018, 13:19

Sachi_R wrote: ↑13 Feb 2018, 07:39 Intellect+eratti
eratti in Kannada (and perhaps Tamil) ...

In English. Glitteratti might have been been the original common use to have given us this suffix. That word, google informs, was coined in the 1950s in USA. In its turn, it is based on literati, the etymology of which is Latin, and dates back to 1600s.

Of course, Google is not the last word, although I usually accept it as being reliable enough to save me the walk to the bookshelf and lifting the heavy dictionary

. It is possible that they have entirely missed a contribution from Southern India!

But surely India has its own word... I recall a conversation with friends in which is was liberally (that might be a clue!) used, but cannot open the brain cell. But I think it was of northern origin.

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 13 Feb 2018, 13:30

#33-> Ranganayaki( Madam/Sir?)-> Thank you. The discussion is in vidwans-vidhushis
n.c.vasanthakokilam, pages 3,4,5, beginning from post 51 to 112 Sri.VK's comment at 112.
May I request you to add your comment there at 113? Also, reading through all the comments from 51 to 121 may help us to get the ragam correct.

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 13 Feb 2018, 13:54

'literati'...literacy...literature...literate(adj) ..ill-literate(adj) ..semi-literate(adj) .... perhaps ilakkiyam in tamil. ?
glitter..'glitterati'..glittering.( all that glitters....)
intellecterati? yanks and semi-yanks have 'enriched' the language.. here is what I found when googling for the term. "Here's what I love about Cal. Everyone there is freakin' BRILLIANT. I loved being surrounded by an panoply of freaks, geeks and intellecterati. I was a pre-med, and I know a lot of my classmates made it to med school. I swear I was in classes with the future discoverers of the cure for cancer. I know a few who went on to PhD programs at MIT, Harvard, Princeton and other UC schools. Some of my friends were humanities students (philosophy, English, etc.), some were econ, polic sci, busines. But a big chunk of my friends were engineers.But for all their intellect, Cal students are an odd lot (and that's a good thing). By and large, Cal students aren't preoccupied with fashion and showing off.

Sachi_R · Post by **Sachi_R** » 13 Feb 2018, 14:07

@28 RSR,
This seems to be the song, right?
https://youtu.be/IxkyKHMzPJM

The opening strains are Tilang, but quickly the instruments and singer move to an indubitable Nilambari.
So it's a tie!

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 13 Feb 2018, 15:20

https://www.google.co.in/search?rlz=1C1 ... 4fDGEzPe9k

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 13 Feb 2018, 15:33

@37-> yes. it is the song. I still have reservations. as I have mentioned in the thread. please see the lines quoted by me. in the song. Such a foray does not occur in neelaambari. This will be more useful input if posted either in n.c.vasanthakokilam thread or in ragas-> neelAmbari or tilang.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
@38-> intellecterati.....is the word to search for.
----------------------------------------------------------
How avidly Google is following rasikas!.
try the search word 'intellecteratti ' and see!

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 13 Feb 2018, 17:55

Sri . shankarank's writing reminds me of Finnegan's Wake , a novel by James Joyce , known as the most difficult work of fiction to read and understand in the “ English ” language . There’s a reason for those quotation marks— in most places Joyce just made stuff up, including the language he used to write the novel . It's full of neologisms, puns using neologisms, ancient slang, and portmanteau words .
Here's the link
http://www.trentu.ca/faculty/jjoyce/fw-3.htm

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 13 Feb 2018, 20:27

@40-> Have n't had the painful privilege of reading the work mentioned by you. ..but am familiar with 'stream of consciousness'.....'Ulysses'. voluminous tome.. Had a trying time.. long back. and read it religiously as it was famous and wondered how he got Nobel Prize. . but perhaps the committee knew better. Glad that we have some meeting ground.......One of the most erudite and famous musicians of the Golden era , is said to have been a fan of D.H.Lawrence! ( as told by Randor Guy).......... Are not 'benevolent dictators' like Asoka ( pet aversion to some) , better than anarchy of mobocracy? left ,right,center?

ratanabhinav · Post by **ratanabhinav** » 13 Feb 2018, 22:05

RSR wrote: ↑13 Feb 2018, 20:27 One of the most erudite and famous musicians of the Golden era , is said to have been a fan of D.H.Lawrence! ( as told by Randor Guy).......... Are not 'benevolent dictators' like Asoka ( pet aversion to some) , better than anarchy of mobocracy? left ,right,center?

I'm glad too !
Musiri uh ? Or MMI ?
Yes , but democracy and the realm of free expression is a lot better than that .
I'm centrist .

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 14 Feb 2018, 17:11

@32-> there is no such word in tamil. perhaps because there are no such people here who combine all the 'lovable' characteristics. (" people with a tendency for self promotion, bragging, jumping around, throwing comments at people and things, showing off, being unbearable, seeking forums and groups of similar obnoxious people.
And the Intellect presumed or actual is the weapon of choice.")....Save a few epithets for future use. Having a store of 'inexhaustible invectives?"
==========================
Sachi can help in my query posted today, in ragas section.
======================
@42-> Musiri. May be he liked the style rather than the content. MMI was more interested in News . A GEM .

shankarank · Post by **shankarank** » 14 Feb 2018, 19:20

RSR wrote: ↑14 Feb 2018, 17:11 @32-> there is no such word in tamil.

Second time somebody says that after the word "nOTTu" in another thread. Yes there is no "nOTTu" in tamizh, but it has now two meanings when used as : "nOTTulEtAn music irukkudA?" It means "is music only in a note?" - as in music note and "is music only in the note(book)?" as in notations!

You see on SivarAthri day ( I am somewhat late there!), I bettered Sri Sankara Sivam on "silEDai" (Homonyms ) - who asked - quoting TNS from harikatha - "enna tambi irukkumbOdE lEttA?" - meaning "what brother, are you late while living?" as the "Late" prefix is for people who are - you know what.

Only tamizh can do that to English!

Now I am also bettering Vairamuttu on quoting - yeah I am only quoting!!!

That is my brag for the day! I will save you some emoticons as I feel the words have enough force!

RSR · Post by **RSR** » 14 Feb 2018, 23:22

@44-> 'eratti'....is the word I said is not found in tamil. unless it is taken as 'irattai' ( sledai..double meaning-pun). Why such bitterness in a thread supposed to greet one more year of the forum?

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 15 Feb 2018, 09:00

I wanted to join in--even sing its praise in verse. Must have had the wrong address--no cheering came from within. So, I retreated.
Still, I thank heavens for my friends and acquaintances here