Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Miscellaneous topics on Carnatic music
arasi
Posts: 16774
Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

Once again, should we take a deep breath? Not to spar again, but to meditate a bit, then mull over things...?
As we get obsessed over this SK buisness, if only we pause to think how it's shaping up! The way it's going, the minute the curtains come down on the sadas, someone's going to start a new SK awardee for 2019 thread, only to prove that we probably belong in the loony bin. That is how :x we will seem. For those who have seen the Bob Newhart show (old show, you might say, but I mean the old-er version). Week after week, we saw psychiatrist Bob's patient's gather for their group therapy session. It was funny, but the characters were something else :oops:
I think we may end up as a tamAshA when groups of new visitors gather around to watch our free show of utter ridiculousness :(
Spring Cuckoo,
We truly don't need to have special Rasikas badges made. After all, it's another of our 'season'al topic...

kvchellappa
Posts: 3598
Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by kvchellappa »

Thanks, Arasi. You are paying us a rich compliment - that we make others laugh. What can be nobler?

devan
Posts: 165
Joined: 17 Feb 2010, 04:37

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by devan »

Mob lynching. The trend now in India.

ram1999
Posts: 534
Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

arasi wrote: 19 Jul 2018, 08:36 Once again, should we take a deep breath? Not to spar again, but to meditate a bit, then mull over things...?
As we get obsessed over this SK buisness, if only we pause to think how it's shaping up! The way it's going, the minute the curtains come down on the sadas, someone's going to start a new SK awardee for 2019 thread, only to prove that we probably belong in the loony bin. That is how :x we will seem. For those who have seen the Bob Newhart show (old show, you might say, but I mean the old-er version). Week after week, we saw psychiatrist Bob's patient's gather for their group therapy session. It was funny, but the characters were something else :oops:
I think we may end up as a tamAshA when groups of new visitors gather around to watch our free show of utter ridiculousness :(
Spring Cuckoo,
We truly don't need to have special Rasikas badges made. After all, it's another of our 'season'al topic...
This is the problem with this forum. Any one expresses a critical opinion, certain members jump in to showcase a neutral approach. Forums are meant for expressing opinions which are critical or otherwise !!

And if any member is not interested in the discussion or a comment, it is best perhaps to ignore! Not sure if there is a need to comment on every thread !
Last edited by ram1999 on 19 Jul 2018, 15:00, edited 3 times in total.

ram1999
Posts: 534
Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

HarishankarK wrote: 19 Jul 2018, 04:53
ram1999 wrote: 18 Jul 2018, 11:21

This is so so funny - :lol: :lol:
But can we all leave the poor vidushi Aruna Sairam alone
Not sure if AS is poor. Definitely the listeners are 😳

Nick H
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Nick H »

I agree.

If music, or any art, it's too be discussed by its audience (or non-audience!) then there will be negative stuff as well as positive. And either could be strong.

Having said that, I dislike the feeding-frenzy thing that happens here, almost too the point where one artist cannot brush their teeth in the morning without a vitriolic thread rubbishing the action. Of course, international awards for toothbrushing invite some comment - - - but it goes on and on and on.

That doesn't apply here, to an artist that gets only occasional notice from us. And perhaps occasional notice is part of the reason for adverse comment on the award and the institution.

There are many names in our SK threads which cause us to argue only about seniority and order. We do not fight about everyone.

ram1999
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Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

Nick H wrote: 19 Jul 2018, 12:34 I agree.

If music, or any art, it's too be discussed by its audience (or non-audience!) then there will be negative stuff as well as positive. And either could be strong.

Having said that, I dislike the feeding-frenzy thing that happens here, almost too the point where one artist cannot brush their teeth in the morning without a vitriolic thread rubbishing the action. Of course, international awards for toothbrushing invite some comment - - - but it goes on and on and on.

That doesn't apply here, to an artist that gets only occasional notice from us. And perhaps occasional notice is part of the reason for adverse comment on the award and the institution.

There are many names in our SK threads which cause us to argue only about seniority and order. We do not fight about everyone.
Not sure if discussions in this forum has any impact on the artist and the way they perform. Classic case is TMK has been critiqued / ridiculed so much, however, he continues in the path that he has chosen. AS and her music has been bashed enough, she continues to draw crowd more than enough. People who participate here are minuscule and most are just for time pass!
Therefore we need not take it so seriously !
In fact many musicians are not happy the way the concerts are reviewed and I have heard from quite a few musicians that they do not follow what is been reviewed here and they aren’t bothered. So the review quality in here itself is a suspect 🤪🤪🤪

And even Music Academy is not bothered to change their criterion of selection based on what is being spoken about here 🤣🤣🤣🤣

hnbhagavan
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Joined: 21 Jun 2008, 22:06

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by hnbhagavan »

I do not see anything wrong with SK selection discussion.The CM performing fraternity might be seeing Rasikas posts or at least a few of them.It is not a requirement only Praises should be heaped.
Music Academy Management or any other Sabha Management will be least interested in our views.Rasikas.org is a platform for Carnatic Music related topics mainly and at times very informative also.

arasi
Posts: 16774
Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

Discussions are what we are here for--I don't deny that. As one vidwan aptly put it years ago to me, we at Rasikas are those who are engaged in tiNNaip pEchu (chat among friends on the front stoop). I am all for it. The number of my posts don't say otherwise. What pains me is when personal prejudices (the negative kind, especially of the vitriolic kind) creeps in. That's all. Freedom of speech reigns. It's when it's handled in a damaging way that we have to question ourselves. Others have the freedom to spell out: you lot of a certain age, shut up and mind your own geriatric life! But the way in which you say things still matters, I suppose...

kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by kvchellappa »

ithu koncham overthaan. But, then it may be called intolerance on my part!

arasi
Posts: 16774
Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

KVC,
Could you elaborate on the idu (ithu) as to what it refers to?

Ram,
In your post #179 you say, "Forums are meant for expressing opinions which are critical...I agree.
"Or otherwise" I agree to that too, so long as they are not downright insults and border on slander..:(

musi
Posts: 47
Joined: 29 May 2017, 11:52

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by musi »

ram1999 wrote: 18 Jul 2018, 19:38
mohan wrote: 18 Jul 2018, 17:55 Is it time to start a Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2019 thread?
Ranjini Gayathri or TMK

Double dhamaka 🤣🤣🤣
Ranjani Gayatri really deserve it. Be it complex neraval pallavis, bhajans, abhangs , graha bedam, singing unsung ragas, mass appeal - they have everything.

The vid Seetha Narayanan once in 2000-01 (in their early years of vocal) commented on how brilliant gayatri was .
She said that they would both be top artists of their generation given their voices , passion, sincerity and thirst to learn and innovate.
It turns out her prediction was right.

uday_shankar
Posts: 1467
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:37

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by uday_shankar »

musi wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 08:41Ranjani Gayatri really deserve it. Be it complex neraval pallavis, bhajans, abhangs , graha bedam, singing unsung ragas, mass appeal - they have everything.
Totally agree with you. I can't think of a more deserving pair of artists than them... complete masters of the art, and such dedication. I don't listen to them much, but obviously that has nothing to do with whether I think they are great musicians or worthy of the SK title. Definitely the most deserving among all of those around and among the all time greats in CM.

ratanabhinav
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ratanabhinav »

NSG 2019 !

devan
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Joined: 17 Feb 2010, 04:37

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by devan »

Bombay jaisree or Sowmya. They are much senior.

SrinathK
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Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by SrinathK »

arasi wrote: 19 Jul 2018, 18:35 Discussions are what we are here for--I don't deny that. As one vidwan aptly put it years ago to me, we at Rasikas are those who are engaged in tiNNaip pEchu (chat among friends on the front stoop). I am all for it. The number of my posts don't say otherwise. What pains me is when personal prejudices (the negative kind, especially of the vitriolic kind) creeps in. That's all. Freedom of speech reigns. It's when it's handled in a damaging way that we have to question ourselves. Others have the freedom to spell out: you lot of a certain age, shut up and mind your own geriatric life! But the way in which you say things still matters, I suppose...
Arasi, about 10 years ago, rasikas used to be a place where a lot of music sharing used to happen. There were a lot of interesting topics discussed, a lot of rasikas narrating their personal experiences with musicians, many a golden record would be shared up, many a lyric and composer and composition revealed, many mysteries demystified. Much of this has stopped. Now-a-days we don't even want to share off google cloud and youtube.

What I find now is that most of the best contributors have either stopped coming here, grown old, or passed away. Ironically there is now a LOT more music to share (especially free music), many more resources out there and a lot more technology to make it easier to share as well. Even commercial music is more affordable than ever.

To be very blunt the General discussion page is often synonymous with the lounge (which is basically a more luxurious thinnai). I will say that the overall standard of discussions has decreased.

For my part, I ain't just complaining. I have a lot of ideas on how I can keep filling up this place, apart from the new discoveries I keep making in music every other day. But this old spirit needs to come back.
Last edited by SrinathK on 21 Jul 2018, 10:22, edited 2 times in total.

ram1999
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »


ram1999
Posts: 534
Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

arasi wrote: 19 Jul 2018, 18:35 Discussions are what we are here for--I don't deny that. As one vidwan aptly put it years ago to me, we at Rasikas are those who are engaged in tiNNaip pEchu (chat among friends on the front stoop).
Tinnaip pechu - it is nothing but gossip, rather mandai uruttakl. 🤔

And I wonder if the artist who commented was hitting below the belt the quality of the discussion in the most sarcastic manner 🤣
If that is the case does it matter if the expressions of anyone in the forum is passive or aggressive.

All that I am saying is members need not react to every post and participate in every post for the sake of expressing ones opinion.

And discussions lose steam after a few days of discussion.

kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by kvchellappa »

arasi wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 00:03 KVC,
Could you elaborate on the idu (ithu) as to what it refers to?
The relentless criticism of AS's credential as an authentic CM singer. I get a feeling that being popular and singing snake song and madu meikkum have overshadowed her merit (which may not be superlative, but not below par in my view). I see that it is a crime for an artist to be popular. i also see that there is disdain for the rasikas who hear such artists avidly.

harimau
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Joined: 06 Feb 2007, 21:43

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

arunsri wrote: 15 Jul 2018, 21:53 Music Academy --- whose credibility was always questionable has hit a new low. Guess, it cannot get worse... :oops: :?:
I think almost three years back I said that the Music Academy has learnt its lesson from the then UPA government: if one perpetrates one outrage after another, people just get used to it.

Yes, it is going to get worse. Just wait another couple of years.

I am expecting that the band Agam will get Sangeetha Kalanidhi in the future.

Google YouTube for their videos. You can get Rangapura Vihara, Manavyalakincha, Subrahmanyena Rakshitoham, etc. You see young men and women swaying to their music which is usually set in some bar or nightclub.

They are also bringing in new audience to Carnatic Music. :| :twisted: :roll: That ought to qualify them for Sangeetha Kalanidhi!

PS. To my knowledge, they have not yet attempted the monumental swarajathis of Sri Syama Sastri. I hope I get to Hell before that happens. Real Hell cannot be worse than listening to Agam singing Amba Kamakshi in Bhairavi even once.

harimau
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

ram1999 wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 12:11
I gave you a +1 for your deleted post.

You deserve it no matter what your comment may have been! :lol:

kvchellappa
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Joined: 04 Aug 2011, 13:54

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by kvchellappa »

You take us repeatedly there, Harimau! You perhaps are in UPA syndrome yourself.

MaheshS
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by MaheshS »

harimau wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 20:28 I am expecting that the band Agam will get Sangeetha Kalanidhi in the future.

They are also bringing in new audience to Carnatic Music. :| :twisted: :roll: That ought to qualify them for Sangeetha Kalanidhi!
Hmm, they have performed with our latest Kalanidhi, Navotsavam

:)

harimau
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Joined: 06 Feb 2007, 21:43

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

kvchellappa wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 16:16
arasi wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 00:03 KVC,
Could you elaborate on the idu (ithu) as to what it refers to?
The relentless criticism of AS's credential as an authentic CM singer. I get a feeling that being popular and singing snake song and madu meikkum have overshadowed her merit (which may not be superlative, but not below par in my view). I see that it is a crime for an artist to be popular. i also see that there is disdain for the rasikas who hear such artists avidly.
Nothing wrong with being popular. We have the example of Sri Madurai Mani Iyer who was extremely popular and whose Music was extraordinary.

You should come down to Chennai in December to attend her concert at the Music Academy. People, who normally can't be seen at any Carnatic concert, show up for it. Fresh from the beauty parlor with lanky hair (all kinks being ironed out) and wearing saris costing upward of Rs 50,000. They pay a lot of moolah to be able to tell their friends that they attended her Music Academy concert.

It is a fashion thing. You won't understand it unless you go a concert by Agam in a Bangalore nightclub.

harimau
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Joined: 06 Feb 2007, 21:43

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

MaheshS wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 20:35
harimau wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 20:28 I am expecting that the band Agam will get Sangeetha Kalanidhi in the future.

They are also bringing in new audience to Carnatic Music. :| :twisted: :roll: That ought to qualify them for Sangeetha Kalanidhi!
Hmm, they have performed with our latest Kalanidhi, Navotsavam

:)
Don't talk to me about Navotsavam. That and The Hindu November Music Fest are the signs of a society in decline. :evil: :twisted:

harimau
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

kvchellappa wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 20:31 You take us repeatedly there, Harimau! You perhaps are in UPA syndrome yourself.
Yeah, I can see you getting outraged by my comments about your favorite artists.

As I have said, yes, I question the tastes of those who patronize the tup-tup artist and others who pander to the lowest common denominator among those listening to classical music.

You should know better. Or learn from those who know better.

devan
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Joined: 17 Feb 2010, 04:37

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by devan »

Next sk. may be veenai r s Jayalakshmi. The greatest veenai ever born. Unfortunately harimau will be the only audience. She may pay minimum 5000 if you attend the concert. For some musicians audience come paying any money. For

ram1999
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

harimau wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 20:30
ram1999 wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 12:11
I gave you a +1 for your deleted post.

You deserve it no matter what your comment may have been! :lol:
😜🤪🤪

ram1999
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Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

I am currently in UK. Few of my friends who are into organizing concerts say Audience do not have the patience to sit thru more than an hour and a half or 2 and musicians also demand quite a bit of money to perform.

Audience expect light music and not heavy stuff and musicians pander to the audience than educating them. If concerts are organized by Sri Lankan community, they expect no renditions of thyagaraja or dikshitar or Shyama sastry.

Whose fault it is - musicians for not educating the audience and finding an easy way or the audience who do not have the grasp to listen to heavy traditional music !
I am sure this is what is happening in Mecca of Music too.

Specially during dec season where it is more a fancy dress competition of the audience showcasing the Kanchi silks and diamond jewelry and canteen hoppers. More people go to the canteens than to the music halls. Mecca of music perhaps should be renamed musical circus 😢

CRama
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by CRama »

devan wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 21:42 Next sk. may be veenai r s Jayalakshmi. The greatest veenai ever born. Unfortunately harimau will be the only audience. She may pay minimum 5000 if you attend the concert. For some musicians audience come paying any money. For
Even for arguement sake, dont ridicule a senior Guru cum well respected Veena Vidushi like Dr. R.S. Jayalakshmi Mami.

ram1999
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Joined: 26 Nov 2015, 17:20

Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by ram1999 »

ram1999 wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 21:57
Audience expect light music and not heavy stuff and musicians pander to the likes of audience ..

Whose fault it is - musicians for not educating the audience and finding an easy way or the audience who do not have the grasp to listen to heavy traditional music !
I am sure this is what is happening in Mecca of Music too.

Reminds me of Shri T K Rangachari’s bangalore Concert with T Rukmini. The main item is neelambari - the famous kriti of Ponniah Pillai. He goes to say that many of the beautiful kritis and ragas are ignored by musicians and they resort to singing the usual kritis in big 6 ragas which is perhaps an easy affair for both the performer and the audience in appreciating the music. He takes on neelambari / chakravaham / vachaspati and a few more and talks about the beauty and the expanse of these ragas. He says audience should demand good music from musicians else musicians will not take the effort to deliver good music. It is more an admonishing the audience in the most subtle manner for lowering their listening quality 😀. The speech in itself is so beautiful as his music. The alapana is almost a good 10 mins. And a fabulous rendition of Amba Neelambari.

Definitely the class of such musicians are few and rare.

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Ponbhairavi »

From all her innumerable concerts recordings.albums and reviews in her forty five years of full time music career, not a single instance has been adduced regarding any deficiency in her mastery over any aspect of the C M grammar.The only points raised against her are that she has sung maadu meikkum kanne and kalinga narthana tillana.It is painted as though she is unfit for any recognition because she has sung these two.. What sort of bias is this ?
Let us consider these 2 “ untouchables.” which are put forth to nullify all her credentials.
-kaalinga narthana thillana is a composition of Oothukaadu venkata kavi . Nobody can question its classicism as carnatic composition. ( thillana )
- maadu meikkum kanne is a composition of bhajanai sampradayam sung towards the end of divyanaamam.Its tune ,as most of the popular tunes of bhajanai sampradayam , does not violate any carnatic norm.The theme is an imagined dialogue between krishna and yesodha.. It underlines bhakthi bhava in common man’s language.,something like the muddugare yashoda in telegu sung by shri Nedanuri Krishnamurthi . There is no கொச்சை or vulgar word..
Generally rabid bias originates and blurs vision in cases of religious fanaticism,political dogmatism, caste parochialism or linguistic chauvinism..In this case the first three are ruled out.
This gives us a clue as to why some seventy five years ago,in the heart of nadu, reputed tamil vidwans themselves were unwilling and hesitant to sing OOthukadu ,s tamil compositions, as they were erroneously deemed to belong to “bhajanai “or dance sampradhaya which in those days were considered lower.. But which shri chitra veena Ravikiran has now indisputably established that the compositions of Oothukadu are technically in no way inferior to those of the Trinity.

arasi
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

Ponbhairavi,
SariyAi sonnIr (well said)...

mADu mEikkum pATTukku avar pOga mATTArO?
chuDuvarO nalla pATTaiyumE, 'Tup Tup ' enRE?
nADu pugazh MaNiyin gAnathai 'Ai, Uy' enRavarai
kADu vAzh vilangugaLukkoppiDudal aRiyArO?

UTRenap pongi vanda UTRukkADavar pADalai
sITRamoDu siRumai seivarO puliyArumE?
kaTRadellAm ethanai, kaNDaRinadadumE?
veTRu vidaiyai UnRi vaLarpparO isaip payirai?? :(


Won't he go for the cowherd's song?
Would he shoot 'tup tup' at good music?
Those who called Mani's music mere 'Ai Uy'
Were wild beasts, don't we know today?

Eternal spring are UthukkADu kavi's songs
Belittle them, would he, wild feline?
All that he has learned, all perceptions! Yet
Plants empty husks for a harvest of music :(

shankarank
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by shankarank »

Ponbhairavi wrote: 21 Jul 2018, 11:34 Generally rabid bias originates and blurs vision in cases of religious fanaticism,political dogmatism, caste parochialism or linguistic chauvinism..In this case the first three are ruled out.
This gives us a clue as to why some seventy five years ago,in the heart of nadu, reputed tamil vidwans themselves were unwilling and hesitant to sing OOthukadu ,s tamil compositions, as they were erroneously deemed to belong to “bhajanai “or dance sampradhaya which in those days were considered lower.
Oh so convenient!. You left out the intellectual arrogance of the pre- and post- colonial English educated! They were as much responsible for promoting such attitudes as they were the audience!

ஒருமையில் பேசுவதற்கு மன்னிக்கவும் ! உனக்கு சாப்பாடு போடுதுங்கிறதாலே, அதுக்கு அடிமையாக வேண்டியதில்லை !!

As regards vidvans 75 years back, they were focussed on the kritis they learnt and the laya experience that provided. There were musical reasons (for them at that time!) - so don't bring them in. Give them some leeway as they were just getting to establish the modern concert platform.

As has been amply demonstrated, it is that aspect that is deficient, nothing to do with the selection of kritis. A shanmukananda hall recording has Chembai filling the concert with tAyE yaSOda with Sri Palghat Raghu on Mridangam and by no means it was pedestrian!

arasi
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

No harm done in using quotes to Eka vachana sentence. Then, addressing pErAsiriyar ponbhairavi thus doesn't arise.
Also, it was the french govt which fed his family to start with, I think. veLLaikkAran? Yes. AngilEyan? No...

HarishankarK
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by HarishankarK »

Oothukadu compositions are harder to learn and execute and demand superior levels of tamil and tala knowledge
In most of his compositions lyrics flow out of bhakthi paravasam

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Ponbhairavi »

Some factual mistakes:
I am not an “english -educated”
எனக்கு சோறு போடுவது ஆங்கிலம் அன்று.
I am an indian citizen with long years of central govt pensionable service.

shankarank
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by shankarank »

Ponbhairavi , that you was the figurative "you". Not specifically you!!

harimau
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

ram1999 wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 21:57
Audience expect light music and not heavy stuff and musicians pander to the audience than educating them. If concerts are organized by Sri Lankan community, they expect no renditions of thyagaraja or dikshitar or Shyama sastry.
It gets better -- or worse -- depending on your viewpoint.

When a Thyagaraja Aradhana was organized for the first time in Toronto some 40 years ago, a large Sri Lankan crowd arttended, only to be disappointed that it was not about M K Thyagaraja Bhagavathar! :lol: :lol: :lol:

harimau
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by harimau »

HarishankarK wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 09:31 Oothukadu compositions are harder to learn and execute and demand superior levels of tamil and tala knowledge
In most of his compositions lyrics flow out of bhakthi paravasam
As DKP once said, there is way too much sahithyam interfering with Music in Oothukkadu compositions! :lol: :? :twisted:

arasi
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by arasi »

I am almost tempted to say no more sAhityam (words) on my part, so that I can spend more time listening to music!

shankarank
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by shankarank »

harimau wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 19:25
HarishankarK wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 09:31 Oothukadu compositions are harder to learn and execute and demand superior levels of tamil and tala knowledge
In most of his compositions lyrics flow out of bhakthi paravasam
As DKP once said, there is way too much sahithyam interfering with Music in Oothukkadu compositions! :lol: :? :twisted:
அந்த அம்மாவின் சங்கீதத்தில் கனம் எப்பிடி ஏறியது என்பது அந்த அம்மாவிற்கே அவ்வப்போது மறந்து போதும் . தொண்டை கட்டினால் என்ன இன்னிக்கி பட்டம்மா குரலா என்று கேட்பர். அந்த அம்மாவின் சங்கீதம் லயத்தில் நின்ற சங்கீதம் . ராகம் என்னமோ ஒரு தேவை என்பதுதான் உண்மை!

She sometimes forgets how her music accretes weight. Her music stands on the layam. if somebody has a sore throat people would quip , what today are you singing in PaTTammAL's voice? Ragam was just a necessary condition!

sankark
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by sankark »

harimau wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 19:25
HarishankarK wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 09:31 Oothukadu compositions are harder to learn and execute and demand superior levels of tamil and tala knowledge
In most of his compositions lyrics flow out of bhakthi paravasam
As DKP once said, there is way too much sahithyam interfering with Music in Oothukkadu compositions! :lol: :? :twisted:
Really? From soneone who was known for prowess in thiruppugazh? Color me very skeptical.

harimau, back to tall tales?

VISHNURAMPRASAD
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by VISHNURAMPRASAD »

Ten good concerts from the Vidhushi answering all those questions about her vidwath will put an end to the critical views about her. I have heard her concert in the radio (about 2 decades back), found that she was very much in the league of many sangeetha kalanidhis (SK). Of course there are many greats who were beyond SK (too much on top that SK could not see them!) like TNR, MDR, RK, TRS, Somu, Pazhani Subbudu, Srirangam Gopalaratnam, S.Rajam, S.Balachandar, Mali, Voletti and many many Nagaswaram Vidwans who never made it to the academy but when we hear them playing, we would know that they are too much above SK's reach).

sankark
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by sankark »

VISHNURAMPRASAD wrote: 07 Aug 2018, 16:54 Ten good concerts from the Vidhushi answering all those questions about her vidwath will put an end to the critical views about her.
If nothing else, you can guarantee this: they will find something else to gripe about rather than accept they were wrong.

Nick H
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Nick H »

VISHNURAMPRASAD wrote: 07 Aug 2018, 16:54 Ten good concerts from the Vidhushi answering all those questions about her vidwath will put an end to the critical views about her. ... ... ...
Good. When will they happening?

HarishankarK
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by HarishankarK »

VISHNURAMPRASAD wrote: 07 Aug 2018, 16:54 Ten good concerts from the Vidhushi answering all those questions about her vidwath will put an end to the critical views about her. I have heard her concert in the radio (about 2 decades back), found that she was very much in the league of many sangeetha kalanidhis (SK). Of course there are many greats who were beyond SK (too much on top that SK could not see them!) like TNR, MDR, RK, TRS, Somu, Pazhani Subbudu, Srirangam Gopalaratnam, S.Rajam, S.Balachandar, Mali, Voletti and many many Nagaswaram Vidwans who never made it to the academy but when we hear them playing, we would know that they are too much above SK's reach).
Even I think that she has got a lot of vidwath - remember one of her radio concerts where she sang Ardhanareeshwaram and did very nice swaras for Kumudhakriya ragam which is like really rare. The swarams were very beautiful,

Rangadu
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Rangadu »

VISHNURAMPRASAD wrote: 07 Aug 2018, 16:54 Ten good concerts from the Vidhushi answering all those questions about her vidwath will put an end to the critical views about her. I have heard her concert in the radio (about 2 decades back), found that she was very much in the league of many sangeetha kalanidhis (SK). Of course there are many greats who were beyond SK (too much on top that SK could not see them!) like TNR, MDR, RK, TRS, Somu, Pazhani Subbudu, Srirangam Gopalaratnam, S.Rajam, S.Balachandar, Mali, Voletti and many many Nagaswaram Vidwans who never made it to the academy but when we hear them playing, we would know that they are too much above SK's reach).
The great Veenai Dhanammal (who didn't get the award either) is supposed to have said "Academy va? It seems they 'speak' about music there, not sing it." in her usual sarcastic manner. True, the greatest superstars of Carnatic were way above this award.

Rangadu
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Rangadu »

ram1999 wrote: 21 Jul 2018, 11:23
ram1999 wrote: 20 Jul 2018, 21:57
Audience expect light music and not heavy stuff and musicians pander to the likes of audience ..

Whose fault it is - musicians for not educating the audience and finding an easy way or the audience who do not have the grasp to listen to heavy traditional music !
I am sure this is what is happening in Mecca of Music too.

Reminds me of Shri T K Rangachari’s bangalore Concert with T Rukmini. The main item is neelambari - the famous kriti of Ponniah Pillai. He goes to say that many of the beautiful kritis and ragas are ignored by musicians and they resort to singing the usual kritis in big 6 ragas which is perhaps an easy affair for both the performer and the audience in appreciating the music. He takes on neelambari / chakravaham / vachaspati and a few more and talks about the beauty and the expanse of these ragas. He says audience should demand good music from musicians else musicians will not take the effort to deliver good music. It is more an admonishing the audience in the most subtle manner for lowering their listening quality 😀. The speech in itself is so beautiful as his music. The alapana is almost a good 10 mins. And a fabulous rendition of Amba Neelambari.

Definitely the class of such musicians are few and rare.
Is there any recording of this Neelambari available anywhere?

Rangadu
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Re: Sangeetha Kalanidhi 2018

Post by Rangadu »

harimau wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 19:25
HarishankarK wrote: 22 Jul 2018, 09:31 Oothukadu compositions are harder to learn and execute and demand superior levels of tamil and tala knowledge
In most of his compositions lyrics flow out of bhakthi paravasam
As DKP once said, there is way too much sahithyam interfering with Music in Oothukkadu compositions! :lol: :? :twisted:
I think most of what is sung today as Oothukadu's compositions might be Chitraveena Ravikiran's masquerading. What is the big deal about them? They are just like any other songs. Not a patch on Trinity. Certainly far from others like Ramadas, Annamachary or Sadasiva Brahmendral.

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