Swara Identification Exercises - Post Questions Here

To teach and learn Indian classical music
cmlover
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#76

Post by cmlover » 13 Oct 2007, 22:12

Thanks ninja for the offer, but that will not be quite useful at present.

Folks

I wonder whether you have an appetite for this smallbit. It is a rare raga and if you guess it you hit the jackpot indeed.
You must get the kaTTai as well as the svaras. Do indicate the MeLam. After you have given your answers I will post the details. This is indeed a test of svaragnaanam! If you are good, you can do it on the fly! (Not me :)
Here is the sample11
http://www.mediafire.com/?djnkgfylcdx

Of course post answers and discussion @
http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?pid=60445#p60445

Happy Navaratri celebrations!
(please re d/l the sample which got clipped. This is the correct one)
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vasanthakokilam
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#77

Post by vasanthakokilam » 13 Oct 2007, 22:53

CML, that was too small a piece. The objective is learning and I am taking baby steps, so we do not want to get into trick questions :) I will give it a try though. Thanks.
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arasi
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#78

Post by arasi » 13 Oct 2007, 23:19

azhagiyadai azhagAga, is how I hear it, though not sure...
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cmlover
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#79

Post by cmlover » 13 Oct 2007, 23:45

Vk
This is an elementary question indeed. The idea is to identify the basic svaras. It is like learning the alphabet! If you can get the notes right then you got it. In the case of an unfamiliar raga you canot be looking for 'known' phrases and you have to look for identifying the notes to get it. Let us discuss the technique of 'ear-trainig' to identify the notes which will be most useful. Trust Arun/suji can help.
Make sure you re u/l the sample since the original one got clipped.

Arasi

Like a true vaggeyakara, you sre trying to put words to fit the svaras! Perhaps you should compose a song in this rare raga once I announce it :)
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vasanthakokilam
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#80

Post by vasanthakokilam » 13 Oct 2007, 23:57

CML, now I understand the reasoning behind the 'rare' raga. Good thinking!!

The new one is also a bit distorted in the beginning ( but differently, you are not doctoring them are you ;) ), otherwise both are of similar length. The initial distortion when you clip an mp3 or wav is not easily avoidable, so we will go with this. The clip length is around 4 seconds, is that correct?
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cmlover
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#81

Post by cmlover » 14 Oct 2007, 00:54

That is correct! I was trying to avoid the vocal contamination which resulted in the clipping. No trick at all :)
If you decipher the raga then you are a genius! Perhaps Lakshman will help when you get the aro/avaro to get the name right :)
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cmlover
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#82

Post by cmlover » 15 Oct 2007, 07:14

VK

Being the navaratri season I was visiting a few houses getting a surfeit of nice music (most were MD the navagraha or navavarna kritis). I had a long chat with an old friend who was a wizard in identifying svaras. His quick answer was that you need practice. Then I asked him how to identify the kaTTai (basic sa). He told me that you have lto isten with a good keyboard all the different kaTTais ( -1 to 7) and internalize them in your memory and then when you listen to music the kaTTai will automatically flash in your mind. Since I have not done it he asked me to identify when some of the folks started singing and without practice I was right about 80% of the time. He said 100% accuracy is easy to obtain. Poor man; he is on remission from cx counting his days but CM is his life blood! Thought I should share this story with you all!
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vasanthakokilam
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#83

Post by vasanthakokilam » 15 Oct 2007, 10:53

Thanks CML for passing along the suggestions from your friend. Actually I was trying a variation on that exercise today with the online virtual keyboard. The real difficulty is in catching on to the 'Sa', once that is done, figuring out the kaTTai itself can be a relatively easy process, though not trivial. I was thinking about why the decoding is so frustratingly challenging. Not that I have an answer but comparing this challenge to the natural language, it is like I can write my own sentences fine, I can write by copying what someone has written but writing down what someone else says is challenging.. It will be strange with natural languages but quite real with music.
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vasanthakokilam
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#84

Post by vasanthakokilam » 15 Oct 2007, 10:55

I thought I will post an exercise.

Afte sivasakthi, this should be easy, sruthi is explicitly given, raga is more mainstream, length of the piece a bit longer than our usual samples of late. Any resemblances to a known krithi is accidental :)

http://www.sendspace.com/file/kl38td

Find the raga and the swaras ( and kaTTai since we are always including that as part of the questions )
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Suji Ram
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#85

Post by Suji Ram » 17 Oct 2007, 11:33

Here's the thirteenth sample

An easy one I dabbled with


http://www.sendspace.com/file/7fq7zg

Listen first and see if you can get the raga (I'm sure it is easy)

Then identify the swaras-

Post answers in answer thread- not here
http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3675&p=7
Last edited by Suji Ram on 17 Oct 2007, 11:37, edited 1 time in total.
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cmlover
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#86

Post by cmlover » 19 Oct 2007, 01:57

OK! here is a followup question for that superb lesson by Suji. It might keep us busy during the victory celebrations of Devi :)
http://www.mediafire.com/?4dz1wdm0fbz
Pl decode the whole series and of course bonus if you can guess the raga (which may not be difficult for some of you veterans!). We might even have a nice discussion of this raga!

Do post answers in answer thread- not here
http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3675&p=7
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arunk
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#87

Post by arunk » 19 Oct 2007, 03:08

Could not resist one more cmlover (i hope you dont mind - i will work on yours too!)

Sample #15: http://www.sendspace.com/file/ov56cr

(note: updated since first post with a sample where I have tried to adjust sruthis of both sample to be closer to each other. I think it is close to D#).

Has two phrases of two ragas

Questions:
1. Can you spot the two ragas for the two phrases.
2. The phrases are not identical. But where do the raga differences show up?
3. Decode the swaras for the two phrases

Arun
Last edited by arunk on 20 Oct 2007, 01:15, edited 1 time in total.
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Suji Ram
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#88

Post by Suji Ram » 19 Oct 2007, 03:15

Ha, I was going to chose one of this raga for my next weeks project.
I will skip this one. I have deadly assignment due dates but may be my passion will override and I may attempt.
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cmlover
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#89

Post by cmlover » 19 Oct 2007, 06:17

Great! The plate is full for the Navarathri season!
Victory to one and all of you!
namastubhyam namastubhyam devi tubhyamEva namO namaH |
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Suji Ram
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#90

Post by Suji Ram » 22 Oct 2007, 07:52

http://www.sendspace.com/file/r54ud1

here's a simple swara identification exercise.

1. Identify all the swaras you hear
2. the swara breakdown
2. Come up with a hypothetical arohana /avarohana based on this clip.


I'm not sure if one can identify raga- it is not so well known raga (I mean not heard in concerts often). But it can take you there. Some of us might have learnt it.

The one below sounds better

http://www.sendspace.com/file/8vs0ef
Last edited by Suji Ram on 22 Oct 2007, 11:43, edited 1 time in total.
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arunk
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#91

Post by arunk » 23 Oct 2007, 05:32

Here is next one (sample 18): http://www.sendspace.com/file/lj43k3

This is a triple threat. Samples are short on purpose. Although I think they are unambiguous, I cannot guarantee it (my perception is colored as I am listening to from a wider perspective). Besides the last ambiguous one turned into a very educational exercise - so perhaps ambiguity is good :)

Exercise:
1. Internalize the phrases. Sruthi (some adjusted from original) - should be at or close to G#
2. Get the swara breakdown of the phrases
3. Make inferences - explain your inferences based on swara breakdown.

Have fun - and of course dont post answers here. Do that in the answers thread.

Arun
Last edited by arunk on 23 Oct 2007, 07:53, edited 1 time in total.
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cmlover
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#92

Post by cmlover » 23 Oct 2007, 07:26

While working on Arun's (usually) tough nuts, here is a reinforcemnt sample to decode with that superb lesson that Suji just gave us :)
http://www.mediafire.com/?8modzpleich
It will be nice to identify the gamakas...
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vasanthakokilam
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#93

Post by vasanthakokilam » 23 Oct 2007, 07:50

We have a numbering problem. Suji's last one was sample 16. CML named his sample 17. Arun, yours though not named as sample 18 will be considered sample 18.
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arunk
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#94

Post by arunk » 23 Oct 2007, 07:53

ok thanks vk. I changed my post to reflect sample 18

Arun
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vasanthakokilam
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#95

Post by vasanthakokilam » 23 Oct 2007, 07:54

CML :) That is not one of the sangathis I learnt. The last little part is different. BTW, Somu does not sing one of the complex sangathis I learnt. ;)
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arunk
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#96

Post by arunk » 25 Oct 2007, 19:34

who is taking up the next one? I know suji wanted a break :)
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Suji Ram
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#97

Post by Suji Ram » 25 Oct 2007, 21:29

arunk wrote:who is taking up the next one? I know suji wanted a break :)
Ill post one interesting combo over the weekend. I really need a break, otherwise I might get an F grade. :( :)
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cmlover
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#98

Post by cmlover » 25 Oct 2007, 21:35

OK Suji!
We break with you :)
(I mean we take a break along with you! Good luck with the course !)
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arunk
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#99

Post by arunk » 25 Oct 2007, 21:42

ok. Let us indeed take a break. Good luck suji!
Last edited by arunk on 25 Oct 2007, 21:43, edited 1 time in total.
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vasanthakokilam
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#100

Post by vasanthakokilam » 25 Oct 2007, 22:48

OK, break is good... I am too busy with other stuff to spend quality time with the clips.

I have one idea in mind for an exercise, it is still gelling.. May be I will do that after Suji's. But if it happens quickly, I may do that tomorrow.
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