Swara Identification Exercises, Instrumental: Post Answers

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cmlover
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#1

Post by cmlover » 18 Sep 2007, 23:48

Not to confuse with the vocal the instrumental exercises may be analyzed and discussed here.
Here is the sample posted by ninja
http://www.cens.nau.edu/~nv9/etc/identi ... ample2.mp3
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arunk
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#2

Post by arunk » 19 Sep 2007, 00:02

should we wait for a bit of time as rajesh requested it and others may feel the same?
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cmlover
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#3

Post by cmlover » 19 Sep 2007, 00:07

Yes indeed!

Please wait till Thursday 20/9/2007 to post answers and comments
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cmlover
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#4

Post by cmlover » 20 Sep 2007, 09:38

Superb mohanam! Perhaps a prelude to the accompaniment of Evarura ? The piece is too long to tease out the svaras. If you can identify a short time frame phrase then we can attempt. I guess it is LGJ. Do spell out what is expected? Do you have the answers?
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Suji Ram
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#5

Post by Suji Ram » 20 Sep 2007, 09:55

artist Mc?

Here is my partial analysis
Mohana- SR2G3PD2S/SDPGRS
The Sruti is at B

Most of the alapana is spanning uttaranga of middle octave and higher octave(starting at 0.13 sec onwards..). Towards the end it winds back to normal octave.

One can hear S`at 1-2 sec
Stopping points are mostly Gandharam . Hear between 0:42-48 it is all G`
You can hear R` at 53-55
P` can be heard at 0:28

Middle G can be heard 1:21-1:22

I did not give swara breakdown of phrases. Someone can attempt and I can comment.
This is easier than abhOgi
Last edited by Suji Ram on 20 Sep 2007, 10:45, edited 1 time in total.
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msakella
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#6

Post by msakella » 20 Sep 2007, 11:47

Dear b/s-members, cmlover & sujiram, The Violinist is neither LGJ nor MC. He must be TNK. amsharma.
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arunk
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#7

Post by arunk » 20 Sep 2007, 20:50

Sample 2: My answers - I am just posting it before looking at any other answers. Hopefully I did a decent job

1. Raga: Mohanam, Structure: S R2 G3 P D2 S S D2 P G3 R2 S
2. Swaras (some exampls):
mandra da and mandra pa: briefly at 1.41 to 1:43 - i cannot decipher this fully
madya ga: 25.8s with a slight kampita
madya pa: 1.22s to 1.24s
madya da: 22.5 (first note after pause before 22.5: it goes like ds'r'g',)

tara Sa: 0.9s to 3.6s
tara ri:
(a) 23.1 (third note after pause before 22.5)
(b) also more prominently at 28s to 29s (held steady before going up to touch tara pa briefly). There is one more "similar" occurence later. Can you identify?
tara Ga: 23. 23.5s (fourth note after pause before 22.5), also more prominently 15.5s to 17.7s. There are many more.
tara pa: briefly around 1:04 (at the same time where this is a firecracker like sound :) )

3. First Phrase (10s)

Code: Select all

g p d s' , s' s', s' s'd (p)/s'   d/r'd   p (d)g p

simpler form: (without those anuswaras which I could be perceiving incorrectly!)

g p d s' , s' s' s' d /s'  /r' p g p
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arunk
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#8

Post by arunk » 20 Sep 2007, 20:51

rajesh - we waited for you. Where is your answer :) ?
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Suji Ram
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#9

Post by Suji Ram » 20 Sep 2007, 22:02

Arun,
I matched your tara R` with mine (different time point) and they are identical.
53-55. is that the one?
Not sure about the P` at firecracker point. Can you check at 28 sec?
Last edited by Suji Ram on 20 Sep 2007, 22:04, edited 1 time in total.
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cmlover
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#10

Post by cmlover » 20 Sep 2007, 22:54

Arun
I concur with you on the first 10 secs.
I also agree it is B
What is the vocalist saying at 36 secs ?
I don't hear a firecracker at 64 secs! Where is it?
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arunk
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#11

Post by arunk » 20 Sep 2007, 23:37

suji - to me 28s sounds like G' the phrase between 26s to 28s seems to r~ r~ r,/g(r) where the two r~ is really R(g)r (nokku). I could be wrong though. I think at 1:04s the slide reaches higher in pitch than here (pa there, ga here.)

53-55 - yep that too for tara ri. I think there is one in later around 1:16-1:17. That was what I was referring to
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arunk
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#12

Post by arunk » 20 Sep 2007, 23:37

cmlover: :You don't hear the firecracker? On Goldwave, it is between 1.03.625 and 1.04.605. So it towards end of 1:03 and beginning of 1:04

I think at 36s the vocalist (SSI?) is simply saying "aa.m" as an approval of the violist.
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cmlover
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#13

Post by cmlover » 21 Sep 2007, 00:09

Thanks got it!
I guess he says again 'aam' at 1:19 !

Thanks Sarmaji for identifying the violinist!
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cmlover
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#14

Post by cmlover » 21 Sep 2007, 00:21

I agree there is nokku at 1.04
also after the sustaint R I guess between 1:03 to 1:06 it is (tara)
RGRG PGS'R'P'P'
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arunk
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#15

Post by arunk » 21 Sep 2007, 01:21

arunk wrote:suji - to me 28s sounds like G' ... I think at 1:04s the slide reaches higher in pitch than here (pa there, ga here.)
suji - I was checking back at my posts and I see in my original answer I had thought at 28s it hit pa just like your answer. But I forgot about it and when you asked and I listened, it seemed like ga :( ! I listened again and I think our orginal answer may be right - Pa but probably touched more briefly than the other places

Arun
Last edited by arunk on 21 Sep 2007, 01:23, edited 1 time in total.
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arunk
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#16

Post by arunk » 21 Sep 2007, 01:29

cmlover wrote:I agree there is nokku at 1.04
also after the sustaint R I guess between 1:03 to 1:06 it is (tara)
RGRG PGS'R'P'P'
This is tough - too many short notes and so I cannot tell for sure. I seem to arrive at

dsr'g'pg'rg' sr'g'p' g s

But this is a shaky guess. The only thing I am sure of is that it reaches pa around the time there is firecracker sound. I don't know which note has the nokku you are referring to.
Last edited by arunk on 21 Sep 2007, 01:31, edited 1 time in total.
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arunk
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#17

Post by arunk » 21 Sep 2007, 02:30

can someone check the above 1:03 to 1:06? i.e. cmlovers vs. mine (or something else).

Arun
Last edited by arunk on 21 Sep 2007, 02:31, edited 1 time in total.
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ramakriya
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#18

Post by ramakriya » 21 Sep 2007, 03:47

arunk wrote:can someone check the above 1:03 to 1:06? i.e. cmlovers vs. mine (or something else).

Arun
This is what it is - I started at 1:02 to start the phrase logically

p d s' r' g' p' g' r' s' r' g' p' r..' s'.. (starting at 1:02) - jAru between P' and R'
p d s' r' g' p'g' r' s' d (etc etc).

-Ramakriya
Last edited by ramakriya on 21 Sep 2007, 03:49, edited 1 time in total.
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cmlover
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#19

Post by cmlover » 21 Sep 2007, 05:57

Arun
It is extremely difficult to tease out the notes of short duration in fast tempo. The hand and bow move too fast and the notes do slur. My RGRG could be your PGRG since the bow moves too fast and our ears have a 'persistence of sound'. We can reliably analyze only the slow notes!By slowing it down 4 times I noticed there are close to 20 notes in that region some are too fleeting. Also the recording is not that good to distinguish the sounds :)
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ninjathegreat
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#20

Post by ninjathegreat » 21 Sep 2007, 09:34

Caught up with work.... Let me just say that Sharmaji was accurate:it is TNK, the rAgam is mOhanam... and cml sir, the vocalist is MMI, and yes, a prelude to evarura... Concert is MA 1964...
Last edited by ninjathegreat on 21 Sep 2007, 09:36, edited 1 time in total.
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arunk
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#21

Post by arunk » 21 Sep 2007, 19:40

cmlover - Yes I agree. Fast/short notes are certainly beyond my abilities and reliability of the answer starts dropping exponentially.
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cmlover
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#22

Post by cmlover » 21 Sep 2007, 20:54

Also since this has been pickedup from an old recording (not of high quality) there is no point discussing the subtle note differentiations. The test piece should be top quality (without contaminating firecrackers or 'aams' :) Need not be by an expert as long as it is clean and unambiguous!
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ninjathegreat
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#23

Post by ninjathegreat » 24 Sep 2007, 06:12

hmmmm.. understood!
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vasanthakokilam
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#24

Post by vasanthakokilam » 30 Sep 2007, 08:06

I am posting this without looking at the answers. After this I will read up and learn. I gave up after a while to decode the swaras since the instrumental piece was a bit fast paced. After several tries to follow along on my flute, I decided to follow another tactic. Internalize the alapana as much as possible and then use that as an inspiration for my own playing without trying to follow note by note. I am enclosing two such attempts. The first one is a bit of a noisy recording ( sorry ).

http://rapidshare.com/files/59202524/In ... s.zip.html
http://www.sendspace.com/file/4fgclb ( alternate download location since bilahari could not download from rapidshare )

Definitely, the alapana is mono-themed.. ;)

Submitting so I can get your feedback.
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Suji Ram
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#25

Post by Suji Ram » 30 Sep 2007, 08:19

Very nice VK, now Im inspired by your playing!
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