AGNI IN RGVEDA------ Opinions and Discussions

rasika_avishesha · Post by **rasika_avishesha** » 21 Jul 2008, 04:27

We are more familiar with the Devas as depicted in the Puranas, ie, as demigods in a lesser heaven, ever indulged in senseless enjoyment, etc. However, the Devas described in the Vedas are completely different. One of the main Devas in Rg Veda is Agni. Although primarily associated with the yajna as a messenger to and from the other Devas, a sensitive and careful reading of the mantras will show that Agni was the Supreme God of the Vedas. Indra was, no doubt, praised the most number of times, but Indra is a more physical Deva, more manifest. Agni, on the other hand, is a subtle and spiritual concept.

There are several mantras in the Rgveda that attest to this higher nature of Agni:

Vishvaamitra says in RV 3.26.7:

agnirasmi janmanaa jaatavedaah ghrtam me cakShuramrtam ma aasan |
arkastridhaatuu rajaso vimaano' jasro gharmo havirasmi naama ||

" I am Agni by birth, known as Jaatavedas, the Light is my Eye and Immortality is my Mouth.
I am the three-fold light filling the universe, the Eternal Heat and the Offering"

This is identically similar to the "Aham Brahmasmi" of the Upanishads. In fact this mantra has the devata as Parabrahma.

Vaamadeva says in the sukta 4.58, which has devata as Agni:

(2)
catvaari shr~ngaa trayo'sya paadaa dve shiirShe sapta hastaaso asya |
tridhaa baddho vrShabho roraviiti maho devo martyaaM aa vivesha ||

" Four horns, three are his feet, two heads, seven hands has he.
Bound three-fold, the Bull roars, the Great God has entered the mortals" -- This mantra has been interpreted by various philosophers according to their views. Even Sayanacarya the ritualist has admitted to a spiritual meaning in this mantra.

(1)
samudraaduurmir madhumaan udaarat upaaMshunaa samamrtatvamaanaT |
ghrtasya naama guhyam yadasti jihvaa devaanam amrtasya naabhih ||

" From the Ocean has come a wave of sweetness, in complete silence, and it has brought Immortality.
It carries the secret name of "Ghrtam" (ordinarily ghee), the speech of the Devas, the Center of Immortality."

Bharadvaaja's sukta 6.9 is a complete spiritual revelation. He is describing his spiritual experience as one who is searching for the Light and struggled, but was rescued by Agni, who revealed His Divine Light to the rishi.

6.9.1:

ahashca krShNamahararjunam ca vi vartete rajaso vedyaabhih |
vaishvaanaro jaayamaano na raajaa avaatirat jyotiShaagnistamaamsi ||

" Days and nights were going by without fruit (ie, no enlightenment).
Finally, Agni Vaisvaanara was born like a king, and he dispelled the darkness by his light"

6.9.3:

ya iim ciketat amrtasya gopaa

" He who knows the Mystery, the protector(or giver) of Immortality"

6.9.4:

ayam hotaa prathamah pashyata imamidam jyotiramrtam martyeShu |

" He is the Supreme Invoker, look! look at Him, this Immortal Light within mortals."

6.9.5:

dhruvam jyotir nihitam drshaye kam mano javiShTham patayatsu antah |
vishve devaah samanasah saketaa ekam kratumabhi vi yanti saadhu ||

" This steady light is well-established (nihitam) for the vision (drshaye), this Bliss (kam), loftier than the mind, and within the senses (patayatsu).
All the Devas being of single mind and single wisdom, follow this One Sacred Act (ie, the act of being single-minded in Agni)."

6.9.6:

vi me karNaa patayato vi cakShur vi idam jyotir hrdaya aahitam yat |
vi me manashcarati duura aadhiih kim svidvakShyaami kimu nuu maniShye ||

" My hearing roams far in search, my sight roams in search for this Light hidden in the heart.
My mind is far off, and so is my intellect, what can I speak or think (about this vision of hidden light)?"

(Perhaps, the rishi is hinting that although he talks about this Light, yet he cannot describe it accurately, through the intellect. This is exactly what Taittiriya Upanishad says " yato vaaco nivartante apraapya manasaa saha", " from which speech along with mind return back, unattained".

6.9.7:

vishve devaa anamasyan bhiyaanaastvaam agne tamasi tasthivaaMsam |
vaishvaanaro' vatuutaye no' martyo'vatuutaye nah ||

" All the devas bowed down in respect and awe to you, Agni, you who dwell even in the darkness.
May Vaishvaanara protect us, may the Immortal One protect us "

Another rishi, Trita Aaptya has a sukta in the tenth maNDala, which is full of mystical and spiritual symbolism.

10.5.1:

ekah samudro dharuNo rayiiNaam asmat hrdo bhuurijanmaa vi caShTe |
siShakti uudharniNyorupasthe utsasya madhye nihitam padam veh ||

" He (Agni) is a vast ocean, a holder of wealth, I saw his innumerable births from my heart.
He suckles on the Mystery's lap; the dwelling of this Bird (Agni) is hidden within the Fountain."

10.5.2:

"rtasya padam kavayo ni paanti guhaa naamaani dadhire paraaNi"

" the Sages protect the dwelling place of Truth, they hold (or bear) the Highest Names in secret"

10.5.7:

asat ca sat ca parame vyoman dakShasya janman aditerupasthe |
agnir ha nah prathamajaa rtasya puurve aayuni vrShabhashca dhenuh ||

" Non-existence and Existence in the Highest Ether, the birth of Daksha in Aditi's womb.
Agni is our First-born of Truth, he was both the Bull and the Cow before creation"

This mantra is my personal favorite. It sums up all the important ideas in the Upanishads. For example in the Taittiriya Upanishad, we have "asadvaa idamagra aasiit ; tato vai sadajaayata", " Non-existence all this was in the beginning, from that Existence came". This is exactly what the above mantra says, that Agni is the Non-existence, which later becomes Existence, and it is the same Brahman which earlier being Non-existence, later becomes Existence.
Then, notice the metaphor " he was both the Bull and the Cow before creation". This also supports the Upanishadic idea that the formless single Brahman produced the world by becoming male and female pairs.
Again, "Agni is our First-born of Truth", meaning, Agni who himself is the Absolute Truth, is also the first manifestation of the Truth in the universe, so he is the first-born of Truth.

There are innumerable mantras which attribute to Agni the characteristics and the nature of Brahman, as seen in the Upanishads. I feel the Agni idea later developed into the Brahman idea.

What do you feel about this? I also wonder why the pure spiritual worship of Agni ceased after the Vedic times.

saranya · Post by **saranya** » 22 Jul 2008, 16:12

rasika_avishesha:

Agni's importance, one can see in mantra pushpam. In the sloka, we will offer the lord several elements as flower. First offering would be Agni. "agnirvA apAm Ayathanam" will be the second sloka after the first introductory sloka. After agni we will offer vayu, stars, moon, cloud etc..

rasika_avishesha · Post by **rasika_avishesha** » 23 Jul 2008, 19:43

saranya:

Thanks for responding. Although in Mantra Pushpam we have importance given Agni, his mystical and/or spiritual aspect is not mentioned. In fact, Rg Veda is unique in praising Agni, although one would think Yajur Veda would be excessively praising of Agni, considering its inseparable relation to yajna.

Also, many of Rg Veda mantras are quoted in Upanishads.

I wonder when and why things changed all of a sudden, and Agni's significance was lost. Later scholars all consider Agni as merely a fire-god. Obviously the later people lost the vision and intuition of the Vedic rishis, but what caused people to abandon the older spiritual religion?

vajradanta5 · Post by **vajradanta5** » 12 Jul 2009, 00:13

AgniÃƒâ€šÃ‚Â´s significance is not lost !!
The " light " is relevant in 6.9.6 which illuminates the Rishi in his moment of Samadhi. What is unsaid in the Vedas is the practical means to illumination. We can only presume and this with considerable certainty, that yogic practises were prevelant anterior to the formation of the Rchas.
Shamanic ecstasy could go as far back as 10 milenium. The Saraswati-Indus valley civilization stretches at least as far back as 5.5 milleneum.

vs_manjunath · Post by **vs_manjunath** » 12 Jul 2009, 04:50

In Yajur Veda, Samida Dhana Mantra - the slokas start with parithwagne................agni samantham parishichya||

adhithenu manya swa...........

agnayE samidhamAhArsham..................... swaha||
A total of 16 slokas prescribed for daily rituals by a Yajurvedi.

Can any one pl provide it's meaning.

Many Thanks in Advance.

krishnaa · Post by **krishnaa** » 14 Jul 2009, 16:21

Willtry and get the slokas then will try and translate them. By the time if anyone has the slokas, pls post them.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 14 Jul 2009, 21:05

The mantras which are part of the 'samidAdhAnaM' are given in Tamil script at
http://my.opera.com/muralikrishnanrb/al ... re=6586484
Note these are intended only for Brhamacaris to be performed every day; and not for grihastas who should perform agnihotraam every day!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 14 Jul 2009, 21:23

Here is the audio of the whole procedure
http://www.raaga.com/play/?id=76245

vs_manjunath · Post by **vs_manjunath** » 14 Jul 2009, 22:45

cmlover- Sir, Thank u very much.

vs_manjunath · Post by **vs_manjunath** » 15 Jul 2009, 15:30

CML- Can you pl provide the link to RIGVEDA agnihothram .

ksrimech · Post by **ksrimech** » 30 Jul 2009, 00:39

The word Agni is derived from the etymology of "agnam nayatIti agnihi" meaning "one who shows the way". Rig Veda verse also corroborates this "agnE naya supathArAyE....." meaning "He Agni show me the correct (best) path". The agni is none other than the antarAtmA, SrimannArAyaNan who clearly explains in Srimad Bhagavad Gita that He controls the jivatma, who in turn, under His control, controls the karmendriyas and gnyanEdriyas.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 30 Jul 2009, 05:57

Dear Manjunath:
Sorry for the delay in responding.
The ritual part as well as the mantras chanted vary from place to place depending on the shAkha of the veda one belongs to and have to be learned from one's acharya. The goal of the agnihotra is to offer the 'dues' (dEva ^RN) to the gods through agni as the agent. The idea is summarized in the very first ^Rk of the Rig veda:
agnimiiLE purOhitam..

This ritual must be performed every morning just before sunrise (and evening too) by every grihasta accompanied by the spouse. The first step is the 'praaNa pratiShTha' followed by the yag~na part (aahuti in fire). The mantras chanted differ according to the vedic shaakha as stated and do considerably differ between smarthas and vaiShnavas. Part of the chants are similar to the samidha daanam but the purpose is different. The procedures are outlined in the grihya sutras (asvalaayana/bOdhAyana/..).

Just for nominal guidance have a look at what Dayananda has advocated (Arya samaj style too..)
http://www.melbournearya.com/Agnihotram ... 0Yajna.pdf

vs_manjunath · Post by **vs_manjunath** » 30 Jul 2009, 13:47

CML- Thanks.

abhi4ever · Post by **abhi4ever** » 24 Sep 2009, 21:45

Very nice topic.. Very informative

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 25 Sep 2009, 17:05

An analysis of the vedic agni (latin: ignis) and the etymology behind his appellation "apAm napAt" with specific reference to the dIrghatamas verse RV 1.143

http://forizslaszlo.com/tudomany/forizs_dirghatamas.pdf

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 25 Sep 2009, 18:34

Thanks srkris for that reference.

Sangeet Rasik · Post by **Sangeet Rasik** » 27 Sep 2009, 02:15

rasika_avishesha wrote:a sensitive and careful reading of the mantras will show that Agni was the Supreme God of the Vedas. Indra was, no doubt, praised the most number of times, but Indra is a more physical Deva, more manifest. Agni, on the other hand, is a subtle and spiritual concept.

There are innumerable mantras which attribute to Agni the characteristics and the nature of Brahman, as seen in the Upanishads. I feel the Agni idea later developed into the Brahman idea.

What do you feel about this?

I feel there is a strong case for this. The connection between Upanishadic Brahman and Vedic Agni is not well explored even by Indian philosophy. It is somewhat of a pity that the Brahma Sutras directly interpret the Upanishadic ideas and only indirectly the Rgvedic ideas (which presumably are "further developed" in the Upanishads). Maybe this was beyond the grasp of the even the greatest intellectuals such as Badarayana.

But even in the Brahma Sutras - analysis of which is a prerequisite for making these connections - the sutras 1.2.24-1.2.30 directly identify Agni Vaisvanara as Brahman. On the other hand, sutra 1.1.28 indirectly identifies Indra as Brahman, based upon his disclosure to Pratardana that he alone is the Prana(Kaushitaki Upanishad).

So how can we understand Agni and Indra ? I do not know the answer, but:

It is important to emphasize that only the views of philosophers who accept the infallibility and non-authored origin of the Vedas can be trusted (if at all) as reference material while proceeding in these matters. Etymological and linguistic speculations (which are currently made by westerners and followed by a few Indians - may their tribe decrease) must be completely disregarded, for they do not understand the significance of the roots of the Vedic words.

The fact that these roots are not humanly created makes it a sheer lunacy to try and assign their meanings based upon historical principles. In other words, no set of historically-derived meanings for Vedic roots is self-consistent and therefore does not merit consideration. In contrast, the Indians wisely focused upon discovering phonetics, syntax, and grammar from the Rgvedic words. Unfortunately, we do not have much knowledge of these works beyond that of Yaska. Nobody has "independently" proved the infallibility of the Vedas but whenever this principle is adhered to, excellent results are obtained. When the Vedas have been rejected or perverted (e.g., by atheists such as the Buddhists as well as colonialists) then absurd results are obtained which do grievous damage to humanity due to the disappearance of dharma.

Even Indian philosophy - specifically the Advaita Vedanta - which can be said to have understood the Upanishads very well, cannot be said to have understood the Veda in detailed terms. Although the realization of the Brahman-concept is a great achievement, it is merely the tip of the iceberg. There is much the Veda that remains to be correctly interpreted.

Best Wishes,
SR

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 27 Sep 2009, 07:12

I don't think I am going to be around when the vEda fnally gets interpreted in the correct way. If and when it is done, it may come with the revelation that only a chosen few are fit to be recipients of the wisdom it brings

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 27 Sep 2009, 21:58

Agni is Brahman, Indra is Brahman, Vishnu is Brahman, Rudra is Brahman, Brihaspati is Brahman, Brahma is Brahman...

Seems there are several contenders for Brahman. But brahman is not a person. So all the contenders lose.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 28 Sep 2009, 00:20

Why agni?
aham brahmOsmi|
tat tvam asi |
sarvam khalvidam brahmam|
By the mahavaakyas You and I are brahman too!
as is everthing in this world ||

Sangeet Rasik · Post by **Sangeet Rasik** » 28 Sep 2009, 00:43

There is no confusion about Agni or Vaisvanara being "persons". What is meant is to understand what these Vedic words really mean. In classical Sanskrit they are assigned various "mundane" meanings such as "fire" or "gastric fire". But this is not what they mean in the Veda (obviously, since translation of many passages seems absurd using these mundane meanings).

The Veda is a code. All that Vedanta has really done is to understand that everything came from one Brahman whose attributes cannot be expressed by our current means. It appears that the Vedanta has successfully reached its logical end. I think we should be in a "post-Brahman" mode now and look into the Veda more carefully. The cosmological details are also extremely important and remain to be "decoded". The Veda is not a text full of pastoralist hymns about cattle, weather, or tribal warfare.

SR

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 28 Sep 2009, 00:49

no set of historically-derived meanings for Vedic roots is self-consistent and therefore does not merit consideration. In contrast, the Indians wisely focused upon discovering phonetics, syntax, and grammar from the Rgvedic words. Unfortunately, we do not have much knowledge of these works beyond that of Yaska

First an overall comment. This is all fairly sophisticated and nuanced subject matter, discussions of this nature need not bring in judgments ( of the name calling sort like 'lunacy', or 'perverted' ). This applies to both sides of the argument. The other side can not violate the axiom and then quibble about the deductions. Just my own value judgment when I read such things is 'Wow, these people really think they understand the stuff. It is too good to be true'. Anyway, having bashed both sides thus....

SR, I want to understand clearly what you are saying above. See if this is right. 'Meaning' strictly arises from Phonetics and Syntactical rules of the vedic sanskrit language. Since the axiom is the whole of the vedas existed forever, the language system of phonetics and syntax existed forever. So there can not be a historically-derived meaning for the 2000 or so Verb roots of Vedic Sanskrit, it has to come from the Vedas themselves.

It is not a far-fetched claim as long as one agrees to play by the rules of the axiom. It can be quite daunting and may actually even be theoretically impossible to solve the full problem ( as set forth by Kurt Godel and later on applied in linguistic and computational systems by Alan Turing ). The theoretical impossibility limitation comes in when a system tries to understand itself.

Back to the problem definition at hand, see if the following is the right analogy: If someone gives me the source code listings of several programs written in a language that I do not know apriori and without telling me what the programs do, can I decipher the syntax and the associated meaning of the various constructs and hence the overall meaning of the programs? It is a tough problem. Where is the Rosetta stone? None exists. Internal consistency is the one way to reason about this process. This has got Kurt Godel and Alan Turing written all over it

You may never reach the end of this analysis for reasonably complex programs.

Comparing this to Vedas, Vedas provide for an additional modality, namely Phonetics, to convey meaning.

I want to make sure that I understood and characterized the problem properly.

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 29 Sep 2009, 03:00

Sangeet Rasik wrote:
rasika_avishesha wrote:a sensitive and careful reading of the mantras will show that Agni was the Supreme God of the Vedas. Indra was, no doubt, praised the most number of times, but Indra is a more physical Deva, more manifest. Agni, on the other hand, is a subtle and spiritual concept.

There are innumerable mantras which attribute to Agni the characteristics and the nature of Brahman, as seen in the Upanishads. I feel the Agni idea later developed into the Brahman idea.

What do you feel about this?
I feel there is a strong case for this. The connection between Upanishadic Brahman and Vedic Agni is not well explored even by Indian philosophy.

Quod Est Absurdum! The meanings are all wrong, it seems, so who can tell if we have a strong case or a weak case for that which we cannot understand?

Sangeet Rasik · Post by **Sangeet Rasik** » 08 Oct 2009, 10:37

vasanthakokilam wrote:It is not a far-fetched claim as long as one agrees to play by the rules of the axiom. It can be quite daunting and may actually even be theoretically impossible to solve the full problem ( as set forth by Kurt Godel and later on applied in linguistic and computational systems by Alan Turing ). The theoretical impossibility limitation comes in when a system tries to understand itself.

That might very well be true, but a "perfect" understanding is often not necessary. One could say that since the physical world is investigated by science using a set of pre-defined valid sources of knowledge, there is an intrinsic limitation.

Internal consistency is the one way to reason about this process. This has got Kurt Godel and Alan Turing written all over it You may never reach the end of this analysis for reasonably complex programs. Comparing this to Vedas, Vedas provide for an additional modality, namely Phonetics, to convey meaning. I want to make sure that I understood and characterized the problem properly.

Yes, I believe this may very well be the problem. On the other hand, "perfect" understanding is not what is desired at the present stage. At this point we know next to nothing regarding the meanng of the vedic words. Something would be better than nothing, as long as useless approaches - as described in my previous post - are immediately discarded to avoid wasting time and spreading false notions in the guise of "scholarly research".

SR

Sangeet Rasik · Post by **Sangeet Rasik** » 08 Oct 2009, 10:43

srkris wrote:Quod Est Absurdum! The meanings are all wrong, it seems, so who can tell if we have a strong case or a weak case for that which we cannot understand?

There is no absurdity here. The question is very specific: are the attributes (i.e., the words) used to describe the entity known as Agni in the Rgveda similar to those use to describe the entity known as Brahman in Vedanta? The answer seems to be Yes.

vakul12 · Post by **vakul12** » 04 Aug 2010, 02:32

http://www.amazon.com/Veda-Mantra-Samhi ... 224&sr=1-4

R L Kashyap has written many books in Rig Veda, Anyone has his full collection? How easy is it to grasp his books?

rasika_avishesha · Post by **rasika_avishesha** » 28 May 2013, 09:06

But even in the Brahma Sutras - analysis of which is a prerequisite for making these connections - the sutras 1.2.24-1.2.30 directly identify Agni Vaisvanara as Brahman. On the other hand, sutra 1.1.28 indirectly identifies Indra as Brahman, based upon his disclosure to Pratardana that he alone is the Prana(Kaushitaki Upanishad).

So how can we understand Agni and Indra ?

Hello SR,

Thank you for the reference from Brahma Sutras. Although I was pleasantly surprised, I guess we should expect it given the fact that Badarayana's goal was to construct a solid defense around the Upanishads. I should say we got lucky that the Upanishad rishis were still "Vedic" in their mode of thought to a large extent, so that they knew what Vaishvaanara really symbolized.

I came across this Rik in RV 10.73.11 that imputes Indra with Supreme God qualities:

vayah suparNaa upa sedurindram priyamedhaa RShayo naadhamaanaah |
apa dhvaantam uurNuhi puurdhi cakShur mumugdhi asmaan nidhayeva baddhaan ||

"The seers came to Indra in the form of beautiful-winged birds singing sweet hymns. They said to Indra: uncover this obstruction, fill our vision, release us who are tied up like birds."

Similarly, VasiShTha in his hymns is particularly devoted to VaruNa. I suppose it's possible that Agni was considered the Omnipresent Consciousness that envelops all other Devas, who are like 'Ishta devatas'.

I agree with you that Rgveda is full of complex symbolism that needs to be deciphered. The BrahmaNas are actually the first great commentaries on the Rgveda that preserve all the symbolism but the whole Yajna system degenerated into a purely ritualistic system over the millenia and so the Upanishad rishis had to step in to take us back to the spiritual path. Obviously that meant getting away from all the intricate symbols and present the case as simple as possible. In fact I think they got away from the older symbols that were now mired in pure ritualism so as to not confuse people.

HariKrishna · Post by **HariKrishna** » 05 Oct 2013, 19:06

rasika_avishesha wrote:We are more familiar with the Devas as depicted in the Puranas, ie, as demigods in a lesser heaven, ever indulged in senseless enjoyment, etc. However, the Devas described in the Vedas are completely different. One of the main Devas in Rg Veda is Agni. Although primarily associated with the yajna as a messenger to and from the other Devas, a sensitive and careful reading of the mantras will show that Agni was the Supreme God of the Vedas. Indra was, no doubt, praised the most number of times, but Indra is a more physical Deva, more manifest. Agni, on the other hand, is a subtle and spiritual concept.
....

What do you feel about this? I also wonder why the pure spiritual worship of Agni ceased after the Vedic times.

Namaste,

It actually has not ceased. In the veda-s (and in some smRiti-s also), brahman is addressed by names normally thought of as denoting other devatas. This is in keeping with the view of brahman having infinite, divine qualities, and thus having all names associated with those qualities. The Rg veda confirms this:

indraṃ mitraṃ varuṇamaghnimāhuratho divyaḥ sa suparṇo gharutmān |
ekaṃ sad viprā bahudhā vadantyaghniṃ yamaṃ mātariśvānamāhuḥ || RV 1.164.46 ||

"They call Him Indra, Mitra, Varuṇa, Agni, and he is heavenly nobly-winged Garutmān. To what is One, sages give many a title they call it Agni, Yama, Mātariśvan." (Rg veda saMhitA 1.164.46 - Griffith)

Some modern, post-colonial Hindu groups incorrectly interpret this as saying that all gods are different forms of the same God. However, literally, this just saying that the one Deity being addressed here (who is Brahman) can be known by all these different names.

Elsewhere it is stated that this Deity is the giver of names to the other devas:

yo naḥ pitā janitā yo vidhātā dhāmāni veda bhuvanāniviśvā |
yo devānāṃ nāmadhā eka eva taṃ sampraśnambhuvanā yantyanyā || RV 10.82.3 ||

"Father who made us, He who, as Disposer, knoweth all races and all things existing, Even He alone, the Deities' name-giver, Him other beings seek for information." (Rg veda saMhitA 10.82.3 - Griffith)

It is my understanding that some schools interpret "nAmadhA" as meaning "bearer of the names." But in either case, the distinction is clear - there is the "Father who made us" who can be known as Indra, Mitra, Varuna, Agni, etc, and then there are the other celestials who receive the names originally denoting brahman.

The shruti-s do not confuse the devata-s agni, indra, etc with brahman. On the contrary, we know from kathopaniShad that the devas perform their duties "out of fear of Him:"

bhayAdasyAgnistapati bhayAttapati sUryaH |
bhayAdindrashcha vAyushcha mR^ityurdhAvati pa~nchamaH || KU 2.3.3 ||

"For fear of Him, fire burns; For fear of Him, shines the sun; For fear of Him, Indra and Vayu function; For fear of Him, death, the fifth, stalks on the earth." (kaTha upaniShad 2.3.3)

Elsewhere, the aitareya upaniShad states that brahman is the creator of these deva-s. And kena upaniShad states that these deva-s (specifically - indra, agni, vAyu) depend on brahman for their victories.

Thus, as per the veda and vedAnta, we have brahman who is also known as indra, agni, and vAyu, and we have other deva-s subservient to brahman who are also known by the same names. This view is accepted by all the major, traditional vedAnta schools, and should not be confused with the modern view of "gods are sometimes supreme and sometimes not supreme" which is an illogical idea advanced by Western Indologists.

regards,

HK

rasikas.org

AGNI IN RGVEDA------ Opinions and Discussions

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