Kakali nishadam - lingering on the note

[narayan]

Purely informal analysis follows.
In order of prominence, when singing raga alapana, the following notes are used for long pauses and building patterns around.
1) Sa
In all the rest, the raga should obviously have the relevant note, and in a prominent way (e.g. not like da in Jayantasri!)
2) Pa
3) Antara gadharam
4) Suddha Madhyamam
5) Chatusruthi dhaivatam (e.g. Kambhoji, Kharaharapriya)
6) Chatusruthi rishabam (mostly in the tara sthayi)
7) Kakali Nishadam (Kalyani, Simhendramadhayamam, Voleti for Pantuvarali, etc.)

The rest are used rarely (for pauses, I mean) and done only to make an occasional point, or of course in sruti bhedam parts of the alapana.

Antara gandharam is anyway a pleasing note, for some reason, and one can give some sort of vadi samvadi like arguments around sa and pa to justify the others in 2-6, but 7 is special. In my experience, elaboration around the kakali nishadam is only in ragams that have the prati madhyama (even though prati madhyamam is rarely a resting point). So I conclude that even though we do not rest on M2, we like to know it is there, when resting on the kakali nishadam!

Of course, Hindustani musicians regularly and routinely rest at leisure on almost all notes with ease. That is their style.

[sureshvv]

Very interesting insights. Can we make a table which indicates what are the lingered upon swaras for each raga?

[vasanthakokilam]

Suresh, good idea. I think it will also help with ear training for swara identification if we can at least figure out what the various resting notes of a raga are.

narayan, Interesting. That kalyani Ni is special and there are at least a couple of variations. The Ni used for 'Nilu' of Niluparani Mohamaye ( charanam of Vanajakshiro varnam) is one of the most haunting little phrases for me. The whole 'Nilu' is all extension on Ni with that characteristic oscillation for Kalyani Ni. I do not know which variation is used when they sing it at as a resting point in Kalyani.

In any case, one possible explanation as to why N3 is a resting note for M2 ragas: S-M is a consonant interval with 4 semitones in between ( which kuntalavarali, Vasantha and Khamas put to maximal melodic use in totally different ways).
So is, Pa-Sa with 4 semitones which a lot of ragas exploit. M2 to N3 has that 4 semitone interval. May be there is something to that. Beware, consonance is thought to occur with swaras related to each other by the ratio that connects Sa and Ma and not necessarily the number of semitones between them but I think that is an approximate proxy.

[ganesh_mourthy]

Suresh, good idea. I think it will also help with ear training for swara identification if we can at least figure out what the various resting notes of a raga are.

VK

Are you seriously having that big problem identifying a note?! That should not be for us rasikas.

[sureshvv]

I think VK was speaking for us rasikas over here. Problem though really not that big can certainly be alleviated

[narayan]

I must clarify that I mean lingering on a plain or flat note. This is surprisingly difficult to do for many musicians as they become more sophisticated. Initially children are taught to shake many or all notes as part of the aesthetics of gamakams and later on, many are not able to just sing a plain note convincingly. Niluparani is indeed striking in the Kalyani adi tala varnam and one of the pleasures of listening to youngsters sing, is this phrase sung with a clear voice and with no modulation.

Which notes one can develop raga alapanas, generally speaking, is part of the grammar of the ragam.

[vasanthakokilam]

g_m, It looks like you are overestimating my ability to identify swaras One of my long standing ambitions is to play some film songs I love on the flute, let alone CM songs. Interestingly and perhaps a bit oddly, It is much easier for me to play a song I put together in a raga and tala of my choice than reproducing a song someone else plays. I am amazed every time a violinist instantly shadows a vocalist, They are operating at a level that I can not even relate to.

But as Suresh said, I am talking from a rasika perspective. But I am not sure how easy or difficult it is to gain that swara identification knowledge. What is it one can do to improve that? Speaking for myself, famous swara combinations like 'G3 M1 P, M1 G3', 'S N2 D1 P', 'S P, P M1 G3 R2 G3 M1 P,' are easier since as a chunk they form a relatable unit. Anything songer or shorter is starting to get difficult.

[sureshvv]

Also Kakali Ni is a special case which evokes a kind of "teasing" - the more you sing sangatis ending in it, the more restless the rasika gets. A few artistes specialize in this.

[ganesh_mourthy]

VK

I think you have picked up the wrong techniques. It is not that big deal at all and I have tested it with all my friends and it worked 100%.

I will write about it tomorrow as it a drill to type and type. I am training my voice typing Lady Assistant in Android.

MAKING OUT NOTES IS FUNDAMENTAL IN APPRECIATING MUSIC KNOWLEDGEABLY.

[vasanthakokilam]

Looking forward to it, g_m

[ganesh_mourthy]

VK

I think we will make it a workshop within ourselves in few parts as writing the whole thing can be exhaustive. In the meantime , members can input too with what was the turning point when they were actually turning swara gnanars. (gnanars).. wow...I coined it.

Or is there a thread somewhere already for it as this is not the one I suppose. Lead me to it.
We will make it an exercise with an objective with a time frame.

[vasanthakokilam]

Opened a thread http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=24948 for this. Let us continue the swara gyaya discussions there

[hanquill]

In vivadi swara esp.D3 the ling. Of N3will be smooth.because both have long passage.I feel like this.?

[hanquill]

In kalyani ling of n3 starts from end of d2 and lingers on till sa.I think I amcorrect?pl explain.

[sureshvv]

Check this out for some serious lingering

https://soundcloud.com/carnaticdude/sri ... ivan-yaaro

Around 1:29 and 1:46 on the clip.

[narayan]

After thinking it over, I must clarify further that the lingering note that I had in mind is either as a stage in raga development or at least as a resting point, at some arudhi (ardhi?) in the song or pallavi.

sureshvv, The Kambhoji example is nice and kept me in some suspense as to whether you had mixed up your nishadams or something. Just a bit jarring, I thought. Similarly the slightly annoying pratimadhyamam that some singers stretch out in the second line of the pallavi of Rama rama guna sima in Simhendramadhyamam.

An unusual (good) example of what I have in mind is Jitendra Abhisekhi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PI8en9bIS8A
which made a big impact when first sung, I believe. The prati madhyamam is referred to in the short para below the video.

But then, Hindustani musicians are quite comfortable in all these notes.

[sureshvv]

sureshvv, The Kambhoji example is nice and kept me in some suspense as to whether you had mixed up your nishadams or something. Just a bit jarring, I thought.

For me the suspense was:

1 Have I heard this sangathi before?

2. Has anyone else heard this sangathi before?

In both cases, I am drawing a blank. I think she could file a patent for an "original kambodhi sangathi". RSachi may help her file the intellectual property application.

[vasanthakokilam]

Is this related to Kambhoji being considered a bashanga raga due to its alpa usage of N3 on descent from Tara S to P?

Sriranjani is deliberate there in that Pidi , singing it again.
Another possibility is her school's 'padanthara' for this song, namely sing it the way it has come down to them and not worry too much about such possible deviations from lakshana.

( http://guruguha.org/wp/?p=351 has some in depth info on Kambhoji's bashanga'ness )

[shankarank]

Aren't padams considered a production factory for rAgas ? And the Sringara theme allows for transgressions?

[vasanthakokilam]

Sringara theme allows for transgressions?

[srikant1987]

In kalyANi, rests on pa are often followed up by a ma, or interspersed with ma as a jaNTai.

Many musicians also play (sometimes sing) the AdhAra Shadja sa as a s's. It brings emphasis and clarity