TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Review the latest concerts you have listened to.
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Pratyaksham Bala
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#26 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Pratyaksham Bala » 12 Sep 2018, 19:06

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 18:49
Sivaramakrishnan wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 13:38
Pratyaksham Bala has subtly noted this point (post #3)
I thought he was wondering what the appropriate viruttam would be for a song on Allah. ...
Yes. That was what I was curious about.

Now I note that the viruttam is addressed to Ardhanariswara for the song on Allah. The only link I find is in the language - both are in Tamil.

I was expecting something like “Allah hu samad Lam yalid … …”
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sureshvv
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#27 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 19:23

SrinathK wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 12:19
Do we really need to debate each and every word and concept here? :?
And hardly coherently, to add insult to injury?
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vijay.siddharth
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#28 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by vijay.siddharth » 12 Sep 2018, 19:28

@shankarank is the epitome of coherence, evidently...
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sureshvv
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#29 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 19:31

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 10:31
It was a little difficult for me to catch all the words of the Vrittam that began in Lathangi, but there is another version of it in different ragas at https://soundcloud.com/rajesh-garga/mud ... n-virutham .

Mudiatha tuyaril Naan moozhgikkidakkindren
Moorkam soozhnthida marugith Thavikkindren
Vidiyatha irul pothil vegu dooram kadanthu virainthu vanthu vanthu
ILamai valuvodu padiyeri padiyeri padam thoynthavan
Padum Paadu paarka Parvai thiruppu nee
Madiyeru mugameru malarpola vaadidum manamerumarul Neekku
Maathorubaagane.

He later announced that the Vrittam was a composition of PerumaaL Murugan.


Thank you for the link and the lyrics of the viruttam.

To hear Carnatic Music rendered for the words of a contemporary poet with a socially relevant message is truly awe inspiring.

Kudos to TMK.

Perumal Murugan was interviewed at The Hindu Lit Fest 2017 at Chennai. His story is heart wrenching. This particular passage conveys his agony and despair very well.
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Ranganayaki
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#30 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 20:38

bilahari wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 18:29
Thank you for that heartfelt narration of the concert, Ranganayaki. While I do not care for TMK's rather unfocused political writing, and decreasingly care for his unstructured and often uneven brand of music, I agree very much that art is transcendental, and admire any authentic effort to make it so.
Thank you, Bilahari..

I get to listen to TMK live once in two or three years. AND, I missed his last concert in DC. I think I’ve attended just three concerts of his. But I get to listen to YouTube videos and I find the quality or the standard consistently good. I enjoy it very very much, so much so that I listened to one song continuously every time I got into my car for a whole week. I still haven’t tired of it.

To be frank, his new avatar pleases me much more, he has changed so much, putting music above himself when he sings. I hadn’t seen him sing before 2011 in New Jersey, but his older videos seem to be all about him. In those, which somehow everyone prefers, he seems to be shouting to me, “Look, see what all I can do!” There wasn’t much music in that, it was boring to me. That is totally absent now, and it is no longer about the “viddai” he can demonstrate. Now he is not extending his prowess, but searching for the beauty - that is my view of what he seems to be doing. That’s why I am able to enjoy a single song continuously for a week.

So I’m unable to know what you mean when you say, “uneven brand of music.” Would you care to say what makes it uneven for you?

Thank you for your nuanced view.
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sureshvv
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#31 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 20:41

Pratyaksham Bala wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 19:06

Yes. That was what I was curious about.

Now I note that the viruttam is addressed to Ardhanariswara for the song on Allah. The only link I find is in the language - both are in Tamil.

I was expecting something like “Allah hu samad Lam yalid … …”
Hope you read my post in full and also Sri Soundara Rajan's comment that I was referring to.

"Vanukku thandhai evano, Mannukku moolam evano" could have been a nice possibility.

"Vandha naal mudhal Indha naal varai" is another gem if retuned right.

May be next time ;)
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Ranganayaki
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#32 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 20:49

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 18:49
Sivaramakrishnan wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 13:38
Pratyaksham Bala has subtly noted this point (post #3)
I thought he was wondering what the appropriate viruttam would be for a song on Allah. But Sundara Rajan sir has clarified.
Yes, that’s what I thought too. Anyway Pratyaksham Bala has clarified too and I am glad subtlety wasn’t lost on me 🙂.

Like Sundara Rajan, I too don’t understand the problem with “Allah.” It’s just a word, and we are so comfortable with “God!” While we are so comfortable saying things like our god and their god, we wouldn’t dream of saying our allah and their allah 😁. May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
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harimau
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#33 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by harimau » 12 Sep 2018, 20:56

vijay.siddharth wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 19:01
...not only have the content of your posts become contentious, but the quality of your writing has deteriorated! You forgot the inverted comma between Yesu and s in the phrase 'yesu's dad'!
My posts have always been contentious and intentionally so. I do not switch off my brain nor do I shrink away from expressing an opinion different from The Hindu which is what is being regurgitated ad nauseam here by people who cannot think for themselves.

Before you comment on my writing style, you could consider that perhaps my keyboard got stuck and I had to post and then go back and edit it. It has happened to me quite a few times. But I edited it so quickly, this website doesn't even show that it was edited once. So I could claim that you are seeing things that weren't there but I won't.

Finally, it is not an inverted comma. It is called an apostrophe. Stop reading The Hindu. Your English will definitely improve.
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Ranganayaki
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#34 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 20:56

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 19:31

Thank you for the link and the lyrics of the viruttam.

To hear Carnatic Music rendered for the words of a contemporary poet with a socially relevant message is truly awe inspiring.

Kudos to TMK.

Perumal Murugan was interviewed at The Hindu Lit Fest 2017 at Chennai. His story is heart wrenching. This particular passage conveys his agony and despair very well.
Thank you, you are welcome. Any ready links to that interview with PerumaaL Murugan?

I meant to provide this link too to the song, but forgot to add it in Behag. It is available in other versions sung by many others, but this one is probably lovelier for us - the CM-trained ear.

https://m.soundcloud.com/rajesh-garga/6allahvai-naam
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Ranganayaki
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#35 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 21:01

harimau wrote:
10 Sep 2018, 12:32

Wow!

So, you actually went there!
I wonder why that’s so surprising..
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harimau
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#36 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by harimau » 12 Sep 2018, 21:05

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:49
sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 18:49
Sivaramakrishnan wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 13:38
Pratyaksham Bala has subtly noted this point (post #3)
I thought he was wondering what the appropriate viruttam would be for a song on Allah. But Sundara Rajan sir has clarified.
Yes, that’s what I thought too. Anyway Pratyaksham Bala has clarified too and I am glad subtlety wasn’t lost on me 🙂.

Like Sundara Rajan, I too don’t understand the problem with “Allah.” It’s just a word, and we are so comfortable with “God!” While we are so comfortable saying things like our god and their god, we wouldn’t dream of saying our allah and their allah 😁. May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
Absolute ignorance of history. But that is par for the course.

The Moghul sultans who ruled India were Turkic (read carefully: not Turkish) in origin. They used Persian (Farsi) as their language. When the British took over India in 1757, they continued to use Persian. The college where Englishmen were trained before they were sent to rule India taught them Persian. Only in 1858 was the language of administration changed to English.

If the sultans had continued ruling India, you would all be Ben Dovers.
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bilahari
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#37 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by bilahari » 12 Sep 2018, 21:05

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:38
To be frank, his new avatar pleases me much more, he has changed so much, putting music above himself when he sings. I hadn’t seen him sing before 2011 in New Jersey, but his older videos seem to be all about him. In those, which somehow everyone prefers, he seems to be shouting to me, “Look, see what all I can do!” There wasn’t much music in that, it was boring to me. That is totally absent now, and it is no longer about the “viddai” he can demonstrate. Now he is not extending his prowess, but searching for the beauty - that is my view of what he seems to be doing. That’s why I am able to enjoy a single song continuously for a week.

So I’m unable to know what you mean when you say, “uneven brand of music.” Would you care to say what makes it uneven for you?
I've thought a lot about TMK's music as it has transformed dramatically over the past half-decade.

I enjoyed the pre-disposal of kutcheri paddati TMK for his SSI-esque verve, aesthetic sensibilities, voice range and culture. I still recall being moved to tears listening to his varugalAmo aiyya at the Parthasarathy Swamy Sabha in 2007 (?), and his incredible kIravANi and tODi RTP in Singapore a year or two later.

You are right that his music then was about demonstrating to us his talent and potential, and sizable they are. However, I don't know that that egotism isn't central to his music even now, and I think a lot of what I find difficult in his music now is rooted in doubts of authenticity.

I will say that I am very prejudiced in interpreting his music by his ramblings on The Hindu, and I as much as I try to dissociate the two personas, I cannot. I wonder if what his music is today is just contrarian, counter-culture, and rebellion for the sake of it rather than being driven by a commitment to a higher purpose as he claims. For instance, when he sings in ati-vilamba kAlam, and often at uneven pace, I feel he is trying to sing as slowly as he can and attempting to convey an emotion that he does not feel. In contrast, when MDR sang in vilamba kAlam, and always with a supreme grip over the kAlapramANam, I feel he was truly one with his music and it feels to this day transcendental to me because of that. In an interview, he is quoted as saying 'enakku ippaDitAn varuthu' (this is how it comes to me). I cannot pinpoint exact elements of TMK's music to describe as inauthentic, nor can I MDR's as authentic, but like you allude, some feelings are instinctual and therefore not easily explained.

Other than the sense of inauthenticity, I think I do find his mish-mash of the concert structure a little jarring. I thought I would get used to it, but i have not. I enjoy expositions with depth, where I can immerse myself in the raga and composition. And with frequent shifts as TMK employs in his concerts, I do not find the experience absorbing.

By the same token, I can entirely understand why you find contemporary TMK so appealing. If I can get over my own hangups about him, I might find much that appeals to my sensibilities.
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sureshvv
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#38 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 21:11

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:56

Thank you, you are welcome. Any ready links to that interview with PerumaaL Murugan?
A very short one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwW34TVYens
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harimau
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#39 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by harimau » 12 Sep 2018, 21:13

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 19:31
Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 10:31
It was a little difficult for me to catch all the words of the Vrittam that began in Lathangi, but there is another version of it in different ragas at https://soundcloud.com/rajesh-garga/mud ... n-virutham .

Mudiatha tuyaril Naan moozhgikkidakkindren
Moorkam soozhnthida marugith Thavikkindren
Vidiyatha irul pothil vegu dooram kadanthu virainthu vanthu vanthu
ILamai valuvodu padiyeri padiyeri padam thoynthavan
Padum Paadu paarka Parvai thiruppu nee
Madiyeru mugameru malarpola vaadidum manamerumarul Neekku
Maathorubaagane.

He later announced that the Vrittam was a composition of PerumaaL Murugan.


Thank you for the link and the lyrics of the viruttam.

To hear Carnatic Music rendered for the words of a contemporary poet with a socially relevant message is truly awe inspiring.

Kudos to TMK.

Perumal Murugan was interviewed at The Hindu Lit Fest 2017 at Chennai. His story is heart wrenching. This particular passage conveys his agony and despair very well.
Oh my God!

People sued Perumal Murugan for his book Madhorubhagan for offending the religious sentiments of the people of a village where women in their nakedness worship the local deity once a year. And his story is heart wrenching.

Salman Rushdie was given a fatwa of death for his book Satanic Verses. I suppose you found that hilarious.

I know, I know; we are not like them!
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Ranganayaki
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#40 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 21:21

harimau wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 18:57
Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 10:31

"Om Tatsat. Shri Narayana Tu. Purushottama Guru Tu. Siddha Buddhi Tu. Skanda -Vinayaka Savitaapaavaka Tu. Bramha Mazda Tu. ...-Shakti Tu. Eeshu Tu. Eeshupita Tu. Ramakrishna Tu. Raheem-TaoTu. Rudra-Vishnu Tu. Vishnu Purana Krishna Tu. ... Akaala Nirbhaya Aatma Linga Tu.. Om Tatsat!! "

He forgot the Holy Ghost! Only Yesu and Yesu's Dad. (Not Joseph, but the Big Guy Up There).
Well, it was not his composition.. so it’s not that he forgot. I happened to message TMK on his fb Page ( hadn’t ever done that before this concert was announced) to ask about a phrase in this Viruttam and TMK responded, adding that it was part of a collection of songs that Mahatma Gandhi had put together for the Sabarmati Ashrams. He added that even the Sai Baba Ashrams sing it.

I recently read about the Holy Trinity of the Christians to understand the concept of the Holy Ghost. Turns out that the Holy Ghost seems to be equalent to the Jeevatma in the dualist perspective. It is that source of love and of yearning for the paramatma present in all of us. It is also described as a “counselor” within, which I equate to the notion of Guruguha, the guru in the cave of the heart, our inner voice of our higher Self, etc.

Not just TMK forgetting about the Holy Ghost, we all mostly forget or ignore it. Thank you for reading the lines of the Viruttam.
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sureshvv
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#41 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 21:26

bilahari wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 21:05

You are right that his music then was about demonstrating to us his talent and potential, and sizable they are. However, I don't know that that egotism isn't central to his music even now, and I think a lot of what I find difficult in his music now is rooted in doubts of authenticity.
That was the big turn off for me as well. But when he sings Porambokku or Perumal Murugan's songs, I find no trace of egotism or self-absorption.
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#42 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 21:26

harimau wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 21:05
Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:49
[

May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
Absolute ignorance of history. But that is par for the course.

The Moghul sultans who ruled India were Turkic (read carefully: not Turkish) in origin. They used Persian (Farsi) as their language. When the British took over India in 1757, they continued to use Persian. The college where Englishmen were trained before they were sent to rule India taught them Persian. Only in 1858 was the language of administration changed to English.

If the sultans had continued ruling India, you would all be Ben Dovers.
Yes, right, I forgot. Substitute “Persian” for “Arabic” in my post, and my point remains the same. After all it’s about one word in those languages, and being as comfortable in the use of the conqueror’s language, as we are with English.
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Ranganayaki
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#43 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 21:49

bilahari wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 21:05

However, I don't know that that egotism isn't central to his music even now, and I think a lot of what I find difficult in his music now is rooted in doubts of authenticity.
I wouldn’t let my mind be clouded by doubts. Becaouse they are in our minds and not his. When you have certitude about his inauthenticity, it would be fair to turn away from him. In writing that he has turned away from the old attitude and does not seem to put himself above the music, I am not naive enough to think that he has totally conquered his ego. There must be some, but it does not come through in the sound that he produces. Of course he will get an ego thrill when he sings and produces beauty, but the point is to bring out the beauty that exists for him to showcase. It’s a finer thing.

That said he does have an outlet for his ego, but it does not involve bending and shaping the music. It is his individuality that comes through when he discards the traditional paddhati. But that is a recent construct and is not inherent to the music, and in my view it is not sacrilegious to do so, and frankly it’s just what I wanted. The predictability was getting a bit boring to me.

May be you could set aside your doubts and give it a try for the music? After all, he is not less human than us, perfectly capable of failings. Why can’t we be generous and let him have his private failings?
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Ranganayaki
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#44 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 21:54

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 21:11


A very short one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwW34TVYens
Thanks!
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sureshvv
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#45 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by sureshvv » 12 Sep 2018, 22:21

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:49

May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
Actually they did. How do you think Urdu was born? If you see the Bollywood movies of the 40s and 50s, it was all largely Urdu. The harimeows have done their best to wipe out history in this and many such matters.
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SrinathK
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#46 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by SrinathK » 12 Sep 2018, 22:52

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 22:21
Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:49

May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
Actually they did. How do you think Urdu was born? If you see the Bollywood movies of the 40s and 50s, it was all largely Urdu. The harimeows have done their best to wipe out history in this and many such matters.
I sense that one form of trying to achieve 'oneness' is the explosive approach - conquer and destroy anything different from one's own. Then there is another form, the implosion approach, where we'd like to give up our existence and get taken over by what we consider as a superior form to ours.

These are gigantic extensions of the masculine and feminine paradigms at work on a macroscopic level. But regardless of the means, both are equally sick, one actively so, the other passively so - as I have written elsewhere in more detail. And the end result is the same. A very distorted attempt at creating 'advaita' in 'dvaita'.

And others try to find a middle ground, yield a bit here, push a bit there - good luck with that. Ultimately unity and peace happens due to the commonness of human nature over mutually opposite doctrines - a smile is a smile and a frown is a frown. Really, what keeps the followers of religions harmonious is the naive idea that we're all simple people and it's all the same ultimate thing we're trying to reach -- to a certain extent that is right - the urge to go beyond limitation is the common thread. But the beliefs, concepts, practices, ideas -- they're all totally different and contradictory.

The doctrines say stuff totally different from what we're comfortable believing in (or not), but we've rationalized that away.

Oneness isn't gonna happen in names and concepts and forms.

Anyway, I didn't plan on talking religion here. But just my 2 cents on the whole religious issue.
Last edited by SrinathK on 12 Sep 2018, 23:04, edited 3 times in total.
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Ranganayaki
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#47 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 12 Sep 2018, 22:56

sureshvv wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 22:21
Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 20:49

May be the Muslim conquerors should have made us all speak Arabic the way all educated people speak English. Then we would be able to say Allah while continuing to speak Vedanta. Then what would Hindu-Muslim relations have looked like?
Actually they did. How do you think Urdu was born? If you see the Bollywood movies of the 40s and 50s, it was all largely Urdu.
Yes. I thought of Urdu while I wrote..

But please let's take care to keep this thread about the concert. And about our views on TMK's musical evolution. We will have more opportunity than we need to discuss religious conflict. My apologies too. I didn't mean to go there.
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rajeshnat
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#48 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by rajeshnat » 12 Sep 2018, 23:25

ranganayaki
You are in general sold on TMK's views and his statements in general . With that mindset you are perhaps liking bit more the music than actually considering what the musical concert was . For supposition sake say Harimau has sung this whole concert you may still like the music just here and there and you would have noticed more holes which you did not mention here as it just escaped you . In short there is a global LIKE switch that was already ON before the start of the concert.

TMK taking up lower register notes is very engaging , i loved his kapi inta sowkya where he did the magic which I heard a year of two back . His music is not uniformly engaging as it was like his pre shuffle days, but has indeed taken a different enjoyable trajectory.

Thank you for your review. As usual it was very crystal clear and for a change no shuffle of words.
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Ranganayaki
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#49 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by Ranganayaki » 13 Sep 2018, 00:35

rajeshnat wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 23:25
ranganayaki
You are in general sold on TMK's views and his statements in general . With that mindset you are perhaps liking bit more the music than actually considering what the musical concert was . (...) In short there is a global LIKE switch that was already ON before the start of the concert.
Rajesh, has anyone here ever questioned your views of Sri Suryaprakash's concerts/music? What makes you think it's ok to question my reasons for liking a concert?

You appear here not to believe that anybody can truly like TMK's music, because you are unable to like it because of his views!!! So who has the open mind, surely not you!!

I have clearly expressed my thoughts on his views regarding music - I don't mind them. I LISTEN to music, my reaction is not based on outside behavior, but is completely connected to what I hear. But you are welcome to think I am a naive fool, influenced in listening by his writings. I am probably the one here who reads the least of what he writes - my main source is rasikas.
For supposition sake say Harimau has sung this whole concert you may still like the music just here and there and you would have noticed more holes which you did not mention here as it just escaped you .
I noticed that you are very strong in your disapproval of Shankarank, but not at all of Harimau. Do you have an open mind? Do you base your opinion (on who should be censored here) upon the issue of what is acceptable in this forum or upon your personal friendship with Harimau? My guess is that you don't have an on-going friendship with Shankarank.

If Harimau gave this concert, I would hear it for what it is, I would be amazed that he can show such sensitivity and yet totally contradict that appearance in his thinking. But I would be aware that such a thing is possible. It's not only nice people who can be artists. I would go to Harimau's concerts, because he makes good music and I am drawn to that and I would also feel pained by the rest of his personality. And in my review here (if I wrote one), I would write about my experience, same as TMK, and ignore the rest in the review, but I would continue to openly abhor his behavior here. You don't know me really, so don't try to get inside my mind and tell me how I think, other than what I've expressed.
Thank you for your review. As usual it was very crystal clear and for a change no shuffle of words.
I don't follow your comment. What does "for a change no shuffle of words" mean? To me it sounds like the exact opposite of "As usual it was crystal clear."

I suppose you don't know this, but I am trained to dissociate artistic production from the artist. It is easy for me. It's actually hArder to accept that others can't do it and are quite unaware of this. That's why I appreciate Bilahari's straightforwardness (and self-awareness) in admitting to his inability to dissociate the two, and that's why I felt he MAY be able to give it a try. And that's also why I would never tell Harimau (or you) to open your eyes to the universality of all religions.

I refrain from making personal comments about your musical likes and dislikes, everybody on this forum does so. Kindly return the courtesy to others and don't get personal.
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bilahari
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#50 Re: TMK at Georgetown University Intercultural Center (ICC) Auditorium

Post by bilahari » 13 Sep 2018, 01:49

Ranganayaki wrote:
12 Sep 2018, 21:49
I wouldn’t let my mind be clouded by doubts. Becaouse they are in our minds and not his. When you have certitude about his inauthenticity, it would be fair to turn away from him. In writing that he has turned away from the old attitude and does not seem to put himself above the music, I am not naive enough to think that he has totally conquered his ego. There must be some, but it does not come through in the sound that he produces. Of course he will get an ego thrill when he sings and produces beauty, but the point is to bring out the beauty that exists for him to showcase. It’s a finer thing.

That said he does have an outlet for his ego, but it does not involve bending and shaping the music. It is his individuality that comes through when he discards the traditional paddhati. But that is a recent construct and is not inherent to the music, and in my view it is not sacrilegious to do so, and frankly it’s just what I wanted. The predictability was getting a bit boring to me.

May be you could set aside your doubts and give it a try for the music? After all, he is not less human than us, perfectly capable of failings. Why can’t we be generous and let him have his private failings?
I think it is a perfectly valid point that the doubts are in our minds, and that they are doubts. I listened to the viruttam you posted as well as the porambOku song on YouTube, and I did enjoy both pieces. I do not understand Telugu and I am not religious (to put it mildly), so I find it difficult to appreciate the content of a lot of CM compositions. I did not have that problem at all with these pieces, which made them all the more enjoyable. It is a feeling of greater involvement with the art I rarely feel, and felt first listening to ohO kAlamE.

I also think that regardless of motivations we are responsible to musicians who are trying to make our art more inclusive and more expansive, and that alone merits support.

I will try to keep an open mind and listen to TMK, but I warn you that I am as human and flawed as he is, so my reaction may still remain coloured by my biases. :)
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