Value of OVK's contributions

Carnatic composers (other than performing vidwans)
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chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Dear Rasikas,

I thought this would be a better thread to assess the breadth and depth of OVK's contributions and how invaluable it is to our music and culture. This thread will encourage critical studies by anyone with objectivity. It will also show that some aspects cited as 'weaknesses' or 'mistake's are actually strengths and uniqueness of one of the best composers India has produced. Even a passing acquaintance with a few hundred compositions of OVK will enable one to comprehend the brilliance of the composer and his immense contributions.

My book - "Oottukkadu Venkata Kavi - Life and Contribution" (IFCM 2007), made available online now at http://www.acharyanet.com has given around 230 examples. Though thousands can be given, I did not give more because of paucity of time and space. Secondly, I did not want to convert a basic introduction to too detailed a study.

Nevertheless, this book discussed the following points and proved OVK's mastery beyond doubt:

1. Prasa: The book detailed what a master of prasa OVK was in both Tamil and Sanskrit. 100s of examples prove this. Examples have also been given about certain unique places where OVK colourfully integrated both rules and approaches in some of his compositions). The book covers not only dviteeyakshara prasa but also antyakshara prasa and aadyakshara prasa that OVK has handled.

2. Yati: The book has given several examples of how OVK was a master of not only the common sama and vishama yatis but also colourful in handling srotovaham, gopucham etc.

3. Chanda: After Arunagirinathar, OVK's brilliance in chanda is striking. The manner in which he has handled meter in his madhyamakalas, the ways in which he shifts the meter within a song are all proofs of the composer's command over this feature. Futher proof, if any needed can be had from some of the excellent shlokas that he has composed like Madhava Panchakam, Ranganatha Panchakam etc.

When one sings/plays these compositions after learning them well, one will be able to get a better grasp of the composer's brilliance, originality and contributions. However, even listening to songs like Mummada vezha mukhattu Vinayakan (Nattai), Sundara Natarajam (Kharaharapriya) and others will give listeners a clear idea of the composer's caliber and uniqueness in melody, rhythm and lyrics, using all normal yardsticks. In other words, his knowledge of the conventional is indisputable.

After exhibiting such knowledge for a major portion of his works, if a person explores territories unknown to us, it naturally means that the person was an innovative and inspired genius of a high order.

To draw a parallel, if a player of the caliber of Sachin Tendulkar comes up with a paddle-sweep, after exhibiting his command over the conventional, it is an innovation. However, if a tail-ender not known for batting came up with a shot not in the book, it would be termed as weird, funny or incompetent. And OVK's works show him to be the Bradman class.

Further, my book gave examples of OVK's scholarship and poetic qualities. His brilliant vocabulary, imagination, eye for details, poetic ability to create scenarios and so forth.

Last but not the least, the book has given a plethora of things that OVK has done that almost no other Carnatic composer has (done with equal frequency/prolificity/felicity).

1. Complex talas
2. Gati bhedams
3. Kalai change within a composition
4. Brilliant and extensive use of madhyamakalas
5. Interspersing jatis with lyrics in a colourful fashion
6. Composing the maximum number of operas
7. Saluting the maximum number of historic personalities
8. Composing whole songs on the maximum number of personalities
9. Saluting the maximum number of mythological greats
10. Partitioning a krti in unique ways (Shri Ganeshwara in Shanmukhapriya is a stand out example of this brilliant facet but was confused as some xxxxxxxx bhanga! )
11. Sectioning within a tala

Given this kind of a brilliance, OVK's attitude is one of utmost humility:

His humility is unambiguously reflected in pieces like the first Saptaratna krti, Bhajanamrta (Nattai), which is a tribute to all great saints and devotees regardless of whether they worshipped Krishna, Shiva or Kartikeya. The pallavi says it all:

bhajanaamrta paramaanandabhaagavata santa charana renumnirantaram vahaamyaham hari nija (bhajanamrta)

“Let me float in the dust from the holy feet of great devotees and saints who have immersed themselves in the worship of the Lord.”

This compositions salutes numerous bhagavatas - each of the 10 charanas is a gem.

In the 6th piece in Paras in the same Saptaratna set, he opens with:

ALAavadennALO sivamE un aDiyArkaDiyArkaDiyanAi mILAda (ALAvadennALO)

Oh, Shiva, when do I truly become your devotees' devotees' devotee and become your devotee?

This piece goes on to mention and salute each of the 63 nayanmars - the only single piece in Carnatic literature that has done so.

I will share 100s of other examples whenever time permits - which will enable readers to form their own conclusions.

Before that, I need to address one issue here: It was mentioned somewhere that Semmangudi sir's opinion that 'OVK was on par with Trinity' should not be accepted. I have the utmost reverence for Trinity, OVK or any other great composer and this has clearly been reflected in my life as well as book. I have composed eulogies on Tyagaraja and another on the Trinity. (I have not composed anything yet on OVK though!).

The truth is that even the trinity or OVK cannot match one another in their stand out songs. My book has given examples to support this. So, comparisons are only valid if made objectively and even then, only as a base-index to see overall caliber. Semmangudi sir's statement must only be taken in this light. But its impact is much more because of who he was. Even an opinion of his is weightier than loose statements by people of unknown and/or unproven credentials or proven non-objectivity, however tall their claims be to the contrary.

Given this, if I am compelled to negate a negative by presenting counter or comparitive points, I will not shy away from doing this.

srikanthamshastry
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Joined: 10 Mar 2011, 13:33

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by srikanthamshastry »

Very first kruti sri ganeswara is having dwiteeyakshara praasa dosha; for SRIGA , next line is SREEVI,We can see 3 avrtanam(Actually it should be 4,8,;in this kruthi; Rasikas must read MUHANA PRAASAANTYA PRAASA VYAVASTHA a book, attributed to swathi tirunal . this book gives how to compose a composition without mistakes . by reading this, rasikas themselves can find ovks mistakes......Srikantham nagendra shastry.

Enna_Solven
Posts: 827
Joined: 18 Jan 2008, 02:45

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Enna_Solven »

Refer to the famous nakkeeran episode in thiruviLaiyADal:
sollil kutram irundAl poRukkalAm, poruLil kutram kUDAdhu. (faults in words of a poem can be forgiven but the meaning should be faultless) Not that I accept that there is a mistake in sri ganEshwara, I have no clue about that. Sri Ravikiran will most probably address that.

However, what grand imagination manifests itself in his songs. For example,
kannan varuginra neram-kavadichindu (stanza4):
tAzhai maDal neettu nOkkum
mullai pArkum - 'enna
sowkkiyamO?' enRu ketkum - aDa
mozhi pesiDa iduvo pozhudenavO
adO varum Madhavan
muttu muDiyinil sErvOm - angE
metta pesi pesi nervom

This piece talks about the effect of Krishna's impending arrival on those around him including flowers. The stanza above describes the conversation between two flowers, tazhai and mullai. The former looks at the latter and asks if he is doing well. Mullai says, 'Is this the time for us to chit chat? Let's chat when we have all the leisure in the world as we adorn Lord Krishna's hair.'

Probably no edugai-mOnai (prAsA?) in the stanza above but who cares? When KJY sings this it is sheer bliss...

Instead of just finding faults in his work, why don't you present a complete analysis, both pluses and minuses?

mohan
Posts: 2806
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 16:52

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by mohan »

srikanthamshastry wrote:Rasikas must read MUHANA PRAASAANTYA PRAASA VYAVASTHA a book, attributed to swathi tirunal . this book gives how to compose a composition without mistakes.
Any idea where this book is available. I haven't heard of it before.

Pratyaksham Bala
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Joined: 21 May 2010, 16:57

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Pratyaksham Bala »

srikanthamshastry wrote:Rasikas must read MUHANA PRAASAANTYA PRAASA VYAVASTHA a book, attributed to swathi tirunal . this book gives how to compose a composition without mistakes .
In "garbha shrImAn - The Life & Times of Maharaja Swati Tirunal Rama Varma - Part II
by Dr. P. P. Narayanaswami", it is mentioned that - "Among the poetical work of svAti tirunAL, the most important ones are: ... ...

(iv) muhana prAsantya prAsAdya vyavasta , a work on figures of speech (shabda ala”nkAraM) in musical works, based on the compositions of mArgadarshi sheSa IyengAr"

Ref: http://carnatica.net/special/garbhashriman-ppn2.htm

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Rangaramanuja Ayyangar notes that 'the musical form, krti reached great heights in the hands of OVK'. Types of krtis composed by him include:
(a) krtis with structures familiar to us - P (2 lines), AP (2) and Charanam (4) Eg: Parvai onre (Suruti), Udaja gopa (Umabharanam) etc.

(b) those with samashti charanams (Senapate - Gowla, Tyagaraja paramesha - Chakravakam)

(c) songs with multiple charanams in same tune - Haladharanujam - Manirangu

(d) songs with multiple charanams in different tunes - Saptaratna krtis plus a few others like Ranganatham anisham (Gambheeranattai)

Apart from these, there are numerous other innovations he has brought in within songs.

Let us take Shree Ganeshwara - Shanmukhapriya, to illustrate how OVK has shown new approaches to krti structuring. He has set a beautiful pattern where every section doubles the previous one. With MK being rendered as intended, the Pallavi has 3 cycles, AP 6 and C 12. Even within this, the composer has maintained a beautiful ratio of 2:1 for normal vs MK speeds. This is just one example of how OVK explored novel structures and showcased beautiful geometry within songs .
We can see 3 avrtanam(Actually it should be 4,8,;in this kruthi
This was shown up to be a case of wrong math calculation by the poster in post #90 of the other thread. He has also missed out the composer's innovative value in his quest for bhanga and dosha.

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

MUHANA PRAASAANTYA PRAASA VYAVASTHA
It was shown that such books are only guidelines and conventions in post #90 of

http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php? ... 434a631650

However, OVK had complete command over the conventional and literally thousands of instances can testify to this. Let's take 2nd syllable prAsa. Only the relevant words are listed here, not whole songs, which can be posted on request.

1. raghu kulOttama (Nagasvarali, where the 2nd syllable is gha). - maghavadArpita - agha gana
sharaNagata - karuNarasa - taranga - kuranga

2. vIkShitOham (Kedaragowla) - sAkShi

3. sundara naTarAjam (Kharaharapriya) - sundari - nandi - nandita - indu

4. ArUDham (Kalyani) - pArODu - ArODu

Readers can find hundreds more but let me analyse one syllable 'ja' where OVK has brought in several words that are common in music, yet not generally used as rhyming words.

bhaja - vraja - gaja - bhuja - nija - aja and so forth.

This is not intended as a criticism but fairly early on, I had learnt 4 songs of Tyagaraja (3 start with bhaja and the 4th one with nija) where the first word in anupallavi was always 'aja'. At that time, I was struck by the co-incidence of this, more so since I stand in awe of Tyagaraja's vocabulary and expression even in Sanskrit. Even though T has employed words like bhuja and gaja, it has generally been aja that seemed to flow naturally for him when he started anupallavis in the songs above.

There are rare instances where OVK has deliberately used Tamil kind of prAsa in Sanskrit songs. in Satyam param dheemahi (Shankarabharanam), he rhymes janmAdi with brahmAdi (only in Tamil it would be written as brammAdi).
Very first kruti sri ganeswara is having dwiteeyakshara praasa dosha; for SRIGA , next line is SREEVI,
In post #90 of the other thread, it was established that these are not mistakes but the very root of variety and sophistication of our music, with similar examples from Trinity.

Enna_Solven
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Joined: 18 Jan 2008, 02:45

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Enna_Solven »

Saint Tyagaraja seems to give an answer (or Am I quoting it out of context?)

O Lord! It is not (kAdurA) honourable (mariyAda) (limit)
O Merciful Lord (karuNAkara)! It is not honourable to remain (uNDunadi) always making comparison (sari jEsi cUDu) between that man (vArini) and this man (vIrini)

rshankar
Posts: 13754
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

E_S, perfect....comparisons are odious, another bard said!

mannari
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Joined: 04 May 2011, 14:08

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by mannari »

theliyaleru rama dosha maarga munu

ShrutiLaya
Posts: 225
Joined: 14 Sep 2008, 01:15

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by ShrutiLaya »

I've had a chance to go through the document in the link I posted earlier in the other thread (http://www.rramakrishnan.com/Articles/M ... hukadu.pdf) and I am confused about something basic. Not sure which thread this question belongs in ..

As far as we know, the Trinity's compositions have survived much as they must have been when they were composed (barring the few chittaswarams tacked on later) because of the continuous sishya parampara. Earlier composers like Annamacharya, Purandaradasa, Ramadasu etc., have left us magnificent compositions, but the music is largely lost, and what we hear today is mostly "re-engineered".

What is the situation with OVK's compositions? The document says:

How has this musical heritage travelled during these 250 years or more?

Since Oothukkadu Venkata Kavi is not known to have entertained any disciples.Many of these the songs remained unknown for a number of generations. The few exceptions were the songs learnt by Nadaswara vidwan, Rudra Pasupahi, who is said to have learnt them on the sly.

Kaattu Krishnier, the elder brother of Venkata Kavi wrote down many of the songs sung by the composer.He had three daughters and they along with their descendents preserved the compositions.Kaattu Krishnier's granddaughter's husband Krishna Sastriyar had a number of disciples. Two of them were 'Kutti Kavi' (He called himself by this name which literally translates to 'small poet' because Venkata Kavi was Mahakavi - mega composer) and Ganapati Muni.A leading upanyasa (musical discourse) exponent Raju Sastrigal was captivated when he heard the songs and had them copied. Few of his disciples were proficient professional musicians but they preserved the music and probably made fresh copies of Venkata Kavi's compositions.There is little doubt that quite a few of them have also been lost, especially when one considers the number of songs unavailable in some of Venkata Kavi's operas so far.

One must give full credit to Needamangalam Krishnamurthy Bhagavatar who did his utmost to project the few hundred songs of Venkata Kavi in recent times


It is not clear if Kaattu Krishnier wrote down the lyric alone, or also wrote down musical notation including which beat the song started on. It is not clear if there was an unbroken sishya parampara of Sri.Krishnier who preserved the tunes and the talam, or we are just going by written raaga and taala names.

Given this, is it meaningful to analyze the music and the rhythmic complexities of the compositions?

Can Sri. Ravikiran clarify passages like the following:

Though there is no doubt that he was fervent follower of the Lord, as he considered him his spiritual guru too, several songs of his on other deities have now come to light, revealing his familiarity and fondness for these as well.

it has recently come to light that venkata kavi has composed a set of songs based on the ramayanam. Though the entire set is not available, the few that available ones are mind boggling in their details and captivating allure.


Have new written works with OVK's compositions been discovered recently?

- Sreenadh

Singer_USA
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Joined: 21 Jul 2008, 09:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Singer_USA »

There is a Ragamalika song "Shree Rama Jayame Jayam" that describes Ramayana has been discovered recently. This has five stanzas in the Ragas Nattai, Varali, Arabhi, Gowlai and Manirangu.
Each stanza has Madhyamakalam in it. You can find Shri.Ravikiran and his disciples sing this song as part of the Margazhi Mahotsavam.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY3YdvF0 ... re=related

Some songs on Anjaneya have also been found out. One is in Vasantha "Pavanakumara" and another one in Madhyamavathi "Baktha Baagadeya Anjaneya".



Oottukadu Venkata Kavi has composed songs on Tiruvallikeni Lord ParthaSarathy "Parthasarathy Paramadhayanidhi", "Allikeni karaiyinile", "Gathiyaaha Vendum", on Lord Surya "Padmini Vallabha ", on Goddess Saraswathi of Koothanur "Sarasija Bhava Jaye"

Regards - Seetha

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Enna_Solven wrote:
However, what grand imagination manifests itself in his songs. For example,
kannan varuginra neram-kavadichindu
Absolutely right. OVK has displayed imagination of a rare order in many of his pieces and this folk piece is one of the best.
Probably no edugai-mOnai (prAsA?) in the stanza
1. Actually, this is a fantastic example of not only his prAsa skills but also his skill in chanda. It is a rare instance of a folk song (set in Tishra gati) that also features madhyamakala sections.

2. The composer has employed antyakshara prasa in all the stanzas in this poem, which is extrapolated from the rules of North Indian Sanskrit. OVK brought in some North Indian characteristics to Tamil like this. (He has done the opposite in the example of Satyam param in my post #7). There are also patterns of eduhai/monai in the same spots in every stanza.

3. The pattern in this song is:
First 10 beats are in normal speed (3 units/beat),
next 4 Madhyamakala (6/beat)
the last 8 revert to normal speed.

I have arranged the lyrics of 4 stanzas in a manner that will visually project the prAsa (underlined lines are M K).

kaNNan varuhinra nEram
karaiyOram
tenral kaNDu kozhittadu pArum
indak-
kAnattiDai mOnak-kuyilOShaik-kiDa yAnattaram
mAnak-kuzhalishai kELum
pOna
AviyellAm kUDa mILum -----------------------------------------------------------------1

(Antyakshara prasa in the 1st part: nEram, Oram, pArum and 3rd part: kELum and mELum.)

challa caLanamiTTODum
nadi pADum
vanam tangi tangi shuzhanrADum
nalla
tudi pADiDum aDiyavar manamAnadu idupOl ena
tuLLi tuLLik-kudittODum
pugazh
sholli sholli ishai pADum -------------------------------------------------------------2

(Antyakshara prasa in the 1st part: ODum, pADum, ADum and 3rd part: ODum and pADum.)

kaNNan nahai pOlum mullai
iNai illai
enru kaNDadum vaNDonrum vallai
ivai
kanavO ala ninaivO ena karudAdiru manamE oru
kAlamum poyyonru shollEn
engaL
kaNNan anri vEru illEn -----------------------------------------------------------------------3

(Antyakshara prasa in the 1st part: mullai, illai, vallai and the 3rd part: shollEn and illEn.)

tAzhai maDal nIttu nOkkum
mullai pArkkum
enna saukhyamO enru kETkum
aDa
mozhi pEshiDa iduvO pozhudenavO varu mAdhavan
muttu muDiyinil shErvOm
angE
mettap-pEship-pEshi nErvOm ------------------------------------------------------4

(Antyakshara prasa in the 1st part: nOkkum, pArkkum, kETkum and the 3rd part: shErvOm and nErvOm.)

The poet has also consistently maintained 1st/2nd syllable rhyme in lines 5, 6 and 8.

Line 7 of stanza 3, gives a peep into OVK's own personality: "oru kAlamum poi onru shollEn"

ShrutiLaya
Posts: 225
Joined: 14 Sep 2008, 01:15

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by ShrutiLaya »

Singer_USA wrote:There is a Ragamalika song "Shree Rama Jayame Jayam" that describes Ramayana has been discovered recently.
Yes, but my question is, what does discovered mean? Was a manuscript discovered?

- Sreenadh

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Sreenadh ji,

Please refer to post #27 in the other thread, where I have shared information that I did not possess at the time my book was published. To summarise:

1. The descendants of OVK have preserved most of his compositions and published 300 or so. Several of them were trained in music (even though most of them did not seek to perform) and they have maintained a continous oral tradition. However, some were known well, like Kattu Krishna Iyer (who was OVK's brother's son, not brother, according to the family tree) who was in the Royal Court of Amara Simha timeframe.

2. Needamangalam Krishnamurthy Bhagavatar (NKB), a descendant of this family, made Madras his headquarters from 1940s and made it his life's mission to bring these to the mainstream. NKB has consistently said that OVK's brother's family preserved the music orally and also made copies of the manuscripts periodically (this is the way it is for almost all composers).

3. I have also given clear references of prominent artistes outside of OVK's family who were specialists of OVK's works even in 1800s. These include Mannargudi Raja Shastrigal and his disciple, Krishna Shastri.

4. In chapters 2 and 3 of my book, I have shown with numerous illustrations how the musicianship could not be anyone else's other than a vaggeyakara of the highest order.

5. Much before I came into the picture, OVK's briliance has been acknowledged by great analysts like Prof T V Subba Rao and Rangaramanuja Iyengar and also by intellectual giants like GNB, Semmangudi, T N Seshagopalan and others.

6. I recently interviewed Seshagopalan sir about OVK, some of which were shared in my short series in The Hindu recently. I have given more of the same in an article for a Souvenier for Shruti, in Philadelphia, which I am sure you can access soon.

Recent events:

NKB published a few books in his lifetime but presented thousands of harikathas and also trained hundreds of students.

NKB's son in law, Mr Subbaraman and the latter's sister, Alamelu (who are among the prime disciples of NKB) have continued the work of their guru through harikathas, teaching etc. Mr Subbaraman has written a scholarly thesis on OVK's works from the perspective of his lyrical skills in Tamil, at the Univ of Madras. He is now working on another book project which also covers OVK's Sanskrit creations. I have had most instructive discussions with them.

NKB's wife Ms Rajammal (now in her 80s), has done yeoman service to bring out more books of OVK even after his death. I personally know this lady and the efforts she put in to do this (from funding, compiling to final publishing) almost single-handedly are phenomenal. This is how even 300 plus have been widely disseminated.

However, she is now in her 80s and there still are a few hundred unpublished songs. I have seen many of these unpublished works myself which are in the possession of those mentioned above as well as other leading disciples of NKB.

When I said 'discovered', this is precisely what I meant!

I grew up on almost every other composer except OVK till my late teens. However, the few hundred masterpieces Trinity and other eminent composers my gurus had taught me enabled me to immediately see the quality and power of OVK works, even when rendered by non-performing artistes. Since my father had taught me meanings of almost every Tamil/Telugu/Kannada song with elaborate commentaries and my mother and aunt, being a Sanskrit scholars, had helped us considerably in analysing masterpieces of Dikshitar and others, I could gain at least small insights into OVK's musical and lyrical skills. Learning them was almost automatic for me.

I am no more than a passionate rasika of quality and a collector of songs. I have merely endeavoured to share my observations with all of you rasikas.

rshankar
Posts: 13754
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

Sri Ravikiran, thank you for your clear presentation of the facts and your conclusions; your posts are very well written and make for easy reading and understanding. In order for the discussion to remain interesting and informative, I request that all substantive posts be easy to read; when one has to struggle to read and understand the post, the point of the post becomes lost very quickly, and it will be a shame if we do not get to read and understand the points being made by all.

As far as I am concerned, I have been captivated by the beauty of Sri OVK's compositions from the first line of the first composition I heard (tAyE yaSOdA), and he reeled me in, hook, line and sinker with the words, 'sundara mugattai pArkkum vELaiyil indrajAlam pOl IrEzhu lOkangaLum kATTinAnDi' - even as the dancer on the stage mimed the gOpi fainting, I was enraptured....and as I hear more of his compositions, I remain censlaved! Some favorites are the madhyamakAla passage in 'madanAnga mOhana sukumAranE' - 'rAdhEya vairijAyA sOdara rAdhikA kAnta nanda gOvinda'; my heart cries out with him as he says 'kadari manamuruga nAn azhaikkavO itara mAdaruDan nI kaLikkavO, idu tagumO, idu muraiyO, idu dharmam tAnO?' from 'alaipAyudE'; and as a parent, I feel his hearfelt plea to kRshNa asking him to not dance - 'kaNpaTTu pOnAl manam puNpaTTu pOgumE' in 'ADAdu aSangAdu vA'...the list is endless......So, while this discussion is enormously interesting from an intellectual point of view, and I want to read and understand each and every word from these posts, from an emotional point of view, I react to this composer in a visceral manner, and would love to keep hearing his compositions, and love it as his words help me visualize kRshNa as he dances with his 'mayil pIlI SaTRe vagai kalaindiDavE', regardless of his provenance!

Singer_USA
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Joined: 21 Jul 2008, 09:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Singer_USA »

I had the privilege to learn some compositions of OVK and I would like to share with readers some exceptional skills in his compositions, which blends melody and rhythm with scholarly lyrics.

In 4th Avarana Krti in Anandhabhairavi, I find it interesting how OVK has split the Madhyamakala lines. The thlaa is the 9 unit Khanda Triputa (2 kalais) and this madhyamakala has 4 phrases, each phrase spans 2.5 part of the thala. In other words, he has quadrisected the 9 unit tala.

In the 8th Avarana Krti in Madhyamavathi, set to Adi Talam, the song starts in Chaturashra gati and then the gati shifts to Tishram midway in the second avarthana. It comes back to chaturashram in the 4th cycle. In the Anupallavi, the composer has amazingly started with slow speed tishram using 1.5 aksharas per beat and then shifts to normal tishram with 3 units in the second part. The charanam is in chaturashram in 2 speeds. This kind of song is probably unique in our music.

The Kriti Umamaheshwaratmajam in Raga Umabharanam , which I learnt from the video workshop in http://www.acharyanet.com starts before the beat in Tishra gati. The second line onwards is in Chaturashra. OVK seems to have been a master in this kind of shifts.

ShrutiLaya
Posts: 225
Joined: 14 Sep 2008, 01:15

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by ShrutiLaya »

Thank you, Sri. Ravikiran, for the very informative response! I completely agree with you and many other Rasikas on this thread that OVK's compositions are fascinating, and for precisely this reason, I would like to learn more about them ..
chitravina ravikiran wrote:
However, she is now in her 80s and there still are a few hundred unpublished songs. I have seen many of these unpublished works myself which are in the possession of those mentioned above as well as other leading disciples of NKB.

When I said 'discovered', this is precisely what I meant!
These unpublished works .. can you pl. share if they are saahityam only, or are notated so that the ragam, tune, talam (s), gati bhedam / madhyamakala passages etc., are indicated ? More generally, what proportion of the known OVK Krithis have come down to us through an oral tradition (all?), as opposed to being reconstructed from written works?

- Sreenadh

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Sreenadh ji,
These unpublished works .. can you pl. share if they are saahityam only, or are notated so that the ragam, tune, talam (s), gati bhedam / madhyamakala passages etc., are indicated ?
I have seen a combination - some have been notated and the rest are lyrics. But madhyamakala sections are obvious in most - the meter/word-play etc are pretty clear. But I have not tuned anything other than a shloka, for a devotional album. Over the years, I have gathered (and continue to gather) audios of almost 200 compositions so far, which have been preserved in the OVK parampara.

It should be noted that most of the works of not only OVK but many other major composers were also only karna parampara. The majority of them have been notated retrospectively. I have seen original manuscripts of Shyama Shastri with his family and they are all only lyrics. I have heard that only a few notations of Tyagaraja also have come down to us, through his student, Walajapet Venkataramana Bhagavatar. About 228 of MD's works were published with notations by SSP many years after his death. However, versions have come down to us with varying degrees of accuracy.

I have dealt with this in chapter 1/2 of my book.
More generally, what proportion of the known OVK Krithis have come down to us through an oral tradition (all?), as opposed to being reconstructed from written works?
The family members including NKB have done a combination of both. Apart from learning and passing it on through generations, they have been making copies periodically to ensure that these treasures have come down to us at least to this extent.

Despite that, I am still searching for most of OVK's Ramayana, Mahabharata, Prahlada Charitra, Dhruva charitra and other operatic creations.

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Shankar ji,

I could not agree with you more about the examples you have cited. I will add a few more of songs that are relatively rare.

Here is a song that showcases not only the composer's brilliance in prAsa (colourful rhymes for mummada, tommudalAna and sammada) but also yati and chanda. Of course, the expression and imagination (3rd line of charanam 1) leaves one astounded.

Another interesting thing is the srotOvaha yati in - tattuvam - paratattuvam - parAparatattuvam - paramparApara sattuvam

Recently, this was used by me in a collaborative dance program in Chicago and the song challenged well read Tamil scholars, when we sought the meaning and inner philosophy.

Audio has been made available by: http://www.acharyanet.com

============

mummada. rAgA: nATTai. tALA: Adi

P: mummada vEzha mukattu vinAyakan mei malaraDi paNivOm
mukti namakkadu nicchayamAha mOna nilai adu akshayamAha
bhakti paramparai siddhi perumpaDi paraviDa kaRpagavalli tarum - shiru

A: tommudalAna shivAgamam tarum udAraNangaLidE
tihazhoLi paShAnkusham Ashaik- kaLavu idE tahudi idE
sammadamena tanakkoru karam tanjam enbavarkkoru karam iduvE
taru vArena karabhooShaNa paripooraNattoru mOdakam adu kAraNam

C1: buddhikkum eddikkum pulavarkkum puRavikkum
pudumaikkum pazhamaikkum poduvenum paDi irukkum
eddikkum polinda veLLi malaikkoru tanga giri pirandadO ena
imavAn Irnda magatkoru kumaran ibhamA mukhavan ivanE enavE

C2: tattillAna takatillAna takadhina tOm - taranA taranAv - ena
vittumAhi vikirtamAhi mihudiyadAm mihu mAmaRai Odiya
takr tOm tana takr tOm tanAtana takr tOm tajham tanAkiTa
tattuvam paratattuvam parApara tattuvam paramparApara
sattuva guNa nittiyam pera sattiyam sAniddhiyam tarum

cmlover
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

Ravikiran
That is a very impressive lyric demonstrating the depth of scholarship of OVK, worth relishing.
It will be nice if you can share your debate with the Tamil scholars on the nuances.
Like Arunagiri he has skillfully woven sanskrit terms into literary Tamil and even taking poetic liberty
to satisfy prAsam:
e.g., tol + mudal = tonmudal ('puNariyal' grammatically meaning 'from ancient times') which he slurred (violating grammar) into
tommudal (to match with mummada)
The lyrics and the rhythm are reminiscent of his popular 'Sri vigna rAjam bhajE'.
I think this one was composed just for dancing and also thought Gambhira NaaTTai may fit better...
Is the audio/video available?
Thanks for sharing such beauties with us at the Forum...

rshankar
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

Sri Ravi Kiran - thank you for sharing the lyrics of this beautiful composition - the words dance by themselves; even reading it is enough to reveal the inherent bounce to the words. I am sure the dancers found it a joy to dance to. I love the 4th line of the first caraNam as well - 'imavAn Irnda magaTkoru kumaran ibhamA mukhavan ivanE enavE'

BTW, please call me Shankar! :)

rshankar
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

rshankar wrote:Sri Ravi Kiran - thank you for sharing the lyrics of this beautiful composition - the words dance by themselves; even reading it is enough to reveal the inherent bounce to the words. I am sure the dancers found it a joy to dance to. I love the 4th line of the first caraNam as well - 'imavAn Irnda magaTkoru kumaran ibhamA mukhavan ivanE enavE' the cadence brings up a smile automatically!

I am eagerly looking forward to other examples....

BTW, please call me Shankar! :)

cmlover
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

imavAn Irnda magatkoru kumaran ibhamA mukhavan ivanE
There is probably a typo here.
It must be InRa (given birth) - derived from the verb 'I' (to give birth)
The verb 'Ir' means 'to attract' which does not fit in context here.
I find OVK a consummate Tamil scholar well-versed in both Tamil and sanskrit grammar who 'weighs' and uses the right words in the right context. When he violates the grammar in favour of 'musical grammar' he does it purposely as I have cited previously..

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

CML ji,

Excellent perspective of tommudalAna. I never thought of that angle... You are also right about Arunagirinathar's influence on him. I have seen a couple of yet to be published works which have been set to Tiruppugazh like meters but addressed to Lord Krishna. Will share after I get back to India.
It must be InRa (given birth)
Absolutely correct, it is InRa as in giving birth.
I find OVK a consummate Tamil scholar well-versed in both Tamil and sanskrit grammar who 'weighs' and uses the right words in the right context.
Yes, there are numerous songs which contrast sharply with songs like Alaippayude, which were deliberately composed in colloquial style, because OVK wanted to capture the gopis' style in these songs which we now know to be part of his opera based on Bhagavatam. We can find the same approach used by Saint Tyagaraja in Nowka Charitram too in songs like alla kallOlamAyenammA.
Even musically, it is a masterly exhibition of seamless transitions from chaturashra to tishra. The dancers (from Chicago-based Dr Hema Rajagopalan's company) did a fine job of it.
I am eagerly looking forward to other examples....
Shankar, here is one more example again in Nattai, on Vinayaka.

P: cintittavar nenjil iruppadu shivayOga gaNapatiyE
shrI mahA tripura sundari maDi tanil irundu konjiDum shelva guNa nidhiyE

A: vandittamarum aDi paraviDa mA tava munivarum tudi paraviDa
vakuLa mAlai aNI sogusum adanuDan makuTa oLi azhahu tahudi tahudi ena

C: nilAvai eDutturuvamAkki - oru nIla maNiyai adil shErttu
kalavai ratnakkal padittu kanaka kaTTiDattil izhaittu vaitta
(madhyamakAlam)
kAkSi enattahum mAkSi manattoru sAkSi phalittiDalAkki tiribhuvanam
AkSi sheluttiDum EkAmra kAmAkSi kaTAkSittaruLa oru kaNamum

The final madhyamakala has word play on the Sanskritised syllable of kSi, not often employed in this manner in Tamil krts. The charanam instances his vivid imagination.

Another interesting feature is that except for the first 4 cycles of charanam, the entire song is in madhyamakala, which gives a unique musical movement to the song.

hamsaa
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by hamsaa »

Venkata Kavi has composed many compositions on different deities and I wanted to share the lyrics of a composition on Lord Shanmukha, on whom he has composed in different kshetrams such as Sikkil, Pazhani and so forth.

This is a composition in ragam Kedaram set to Adi talam. It has lovely madhyamakalams and exclusive adjectives and details used to describe the Lord. It brings out the clarity in Venkata Kavi's visualisation and his refreshing approach! The final madhyamakalam in the charanam is a proof to this - (nirantara .... vAmAnga rOham)

Where he describes the lord as -
One who has an eternally dancing peacock as his vehicle
One who is worshipped by the gods, sages and the entire society of good-natured people
One who used innovative war strategies, being the army commander of the devas
One who is perched on the left lap of Lord Shiva

P. gajamukha anujam nitya
kalyANa subramaNyam nityam
bhaja bhaja mAnasa

AP. vraja rAja tanaya bhAginEyam
vidhi nuta charaNam bAhulEyam

MK. vEda nAda praNavAkara bOdham vishva roopam akhila sthiti nAtham
jAta roopa kEyoora makuTadhara shaktyAyudhadharam prateetam

C. ArAdhita sujana samAgama
Ananda bhAshpamEva
dhArA sampAta sthimita pa-
dAmbujam abhijAtam
ksheera varNa bhasmAnkita phAlam ma-
dhyE dyuti kunkuma dharam ati shObham
neerada sama navaneela yavvana
rOhiShajA vallee samEtam

MK. nirantara naTana mayoora vAham
nata sura muni gaNa sujana samooham
sura ripu hara nava veera vyooham
sundarEsha vAmAnga rOham

In the above charanam, in lines 5 to 8, ‘ksheera varNa..... vallee samEtam, he describes the milky coloured ashes that adorn his forehead with the kunkumam (Saffron) in the middle that adds beauty. He also describes his consort “Vallee” who is dark in complexion like the clouds and who was born to a young deer ! A very refreshing approach and visualisation by the divine composer !

cmlover
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

Ravikiran

I guess it must be 'vandittamararum' (worshipping devas)
The style of construction of the lyric is distinctly different from T who generally goes for simple pallavi line construction giving scope for sangati explorations which is the unique pioneering contribution of T. I am sure the sangatis in the pre-trinity OVK's songs are the later innovations by musicians after the Trinity patterns. The concert style of rendering of OVK must be a later innovation IMHO. His multisyllabic run-on sentences are difficult to break for neravels (another innovation of T) without interrupting the flow of ideas. On the otherhand the rhythmic continuous flow of the lyrics is ideal for abhinayam to convey the full complete construct. The other day while listening to Sri Manikkavinayagam (son of Vazhuvoor Ramayya Pillai) i heard him mention that it was his father who first adopted OVK for dance performances. Perhaps the Vazhuvoor adaptations for abhinayam may have stimulated musicians to elaborate appropriate 'neravel' lines not originally intended by OVK. I am thinking of the famous MMI neravel of 'kaalinil chilambu konja' which maybe the feedback from Vazhuvoor naTTuvaangam. The continuous flow also is appropriate in the harikatha style which kept alive the OVK compositions.

These are some of my speculations and perhaps Ravikiran can pursue them more fruitfully now that he has started collaborating on dance choreography so we may see more of OVK choreographed on the dance stage in addition to concert renderings...

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

CML,

These are just a couple of examples of krtis in this style, as I wanted to highlight more on the chanda, prAsa and yati of OVK. There are numerous examples which I will soon be sharing that are not only sparsely worded but also in chowka kala, like Sarasija bhava jaye (Kalyani), Arulalan (Shankarabharanam), Prema swaroopa (Anandabhairavi) and Venugana ramana (Todi). Such songs give tremendous scope for sangatis, neraval/kalpana swaras - as can be seen from renditions of MMI, Shri DKJ, Shri TNS etc.

We can see that almost any high quality composer who was also prolific showcases more than one style of composing. T was as capable of composing short sweet devotional songs as he wa capable of an Enduku peddala or Giripai. MD was as capable of creating lilting English note type melodies as he was capable of deep meditative masterpieces. So also OVK. He has showcased weighty masterpieces that are appropriate for pure music settings just as he has showcased rich abhinaya-drama-harikatha kind of compositions. Some can be appropriate for more than one context. Eg: Taye yashoda.

rshankar
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

chitravina ravikiran wrote: (madhyamakAlam)
kAkSi enattahum mAkSi manattoru sAkSi phalittiDalAkki tiribhuvanam
AkSi sheluttiDum EkAmra kAmAkSi kaTAkSittaruLa oru kaNamum
The final madhyamakala has word play on the Sanskritised syllable of kSi, not often employed in this manner in Tamil krts. The charanam instances his vivid imagination.
WOW! Absolutely wonderful! Thank you for sharing.
In Eka danta vinAyakam bhajAmi aniSam (nATTai), I think we see the first use of the phrase 'guru guha', right? Well before Sri MD who adopted it as his mudra....

cmlover
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

Thanks Ravikiran
I only wish that you share your analysis of OVK with our membership in your objective style step-by-step and responding to 'sensible' queries and ignoring any unnecessary distractions. Our united goal is to restore OVK to his right place in CM history. You have a unique way of appreciating CM compositions highlighting the musical excellences along with lyrical nuances by vitue of your training which is very refreshing. Since we have varied expertise, while lookiing critically at your objective findings we will add our mite in your pursuit of the objective Truth.

To start with a simple query which perhaps you can clarify.
As quoted by Prof SRJ, "Rangaramanuja Ayyangar has recorded that the songs were all preserved in huge bundles of palm leaves lodged in earthern pots and passed on for seven generations among his brother's families". If you had access to those palm leaves they may be carbon dated to establish "objectively" the time-frame of OVK..Even those pots will be an archeologic evidence...

Suji Ram
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Suji Ram »

cmlover wrote:If you had access to those palm leaves they may be carbon dated to establish "objectively" the time-frame of OVK..Even those pots will be an archeologic evidence...
How accurately can carbon dating determine pre or post trinity? -when the rate of accuracy itself is +- 200 years :tmi:

vasanthakokilam
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by vasanthakokilam »

The accuracy of 200 years seems to be for much older samples.

According to this web page: http://www.chem.uwec.edu/Chem115_F00/no ... oject.html
"At most the modern samples aged within the last two hundred years will have an error factor of 25 years.."(p. 167 in the following book).
Geyh, Mebus A., and Helmut Schleicher. Absolute Age Determination: Physical and Chemical Dating Methods and Their Application. Trans. R. Clark Newcomb. Berlin: Springer-Verlag, 1990.

vidya
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by vidya »

Dear Shri.Ravikiran,
While it is interesting to see your analysis and posts on sabdalankara and sahitya aspects such as prAsa and the rhythmic aspects such as nadai/gati bheda, yati etc, I have one question on the raga aspects of these compositions. This pertains especially to those compositions that you say are found "with notations". I ask this because I did not find this information in your book or any of your other posts. These aspects I think would aid in understanding the "raga systems" / "raga structures" used in these compositions by Oothukkadu Venkata kavi. For example: would you be able to throw light on the lakshana, usage and specific phrases that are found in the compositions in the following ragas (a short list based on the ones I saw in your article on OVK).

1.Shuddhasaveri - What form of shuddhasaveri is this? In light of the various differences in name and form of this raga.
2.Anandabhairavi - Some specifics on the Dhaivata used
3.Kannadagowla - Which flavor?
4.Bhairavi - Presence, absence and mixture/ratio of Dhaivata
5.Hamsanadham - Treatment of vivadi phrases
6.Yamuna - On the usage of M1
7.The arohana-avarohana and (possible) lakshana of Kannadamaruva, lalitagandharva and deeparam

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Dear Vidya ji,

Good questions about the melodic aspects of OVK. I will try to share some of my observations here. The best way to analyse them would be with audios - so far, I have managed to bring out around 50-60 including Navavaranams and Saptaratna krtis. Some of these contain excellent examples of Deshakshi, Balahamsa, Bhairavi, Nadanamakriya, Shuddhasaveri, Kharaharapriya, Punnagavarali, Hindolam and Anandabhairavi. I hope to share more pieces in ragas like Manji, Neelambari, Dwijayavanti (that is the way the raga is mentioned in their school, which co-incides with Jaya-jayavanti), etc in due course.

Some general observations before I give you specific answers:

1. The musical movement in krtis in highly populated ragas like Shankarabharanam, Kharaharapriya, Bhairavi, Sahana etc are distinct.

2. His choice of Deshakshi, Balahamsa etc in the Navavarana set definitely is a pointer to those ragas' prominence then.

3. The masterpiece in Hindolam, Sadanandamayi (Sankeerna Mathyam) is in 2 kalais until charanam and shifts to 1 kalai thereafter gives a weighty feel to the raga.

4. The chowka kala masterpieces in Nadanamakriya (Vaiyam alandu) and Jhunjhooti (Muttukrishna) are very illustrative of his grasp of those ragas.

5. I have not yet seen examples of Saveri, so far (even though he mentions the raga name in one of his pieces). I have only seen Varali as one of the ragas in his Ramayana Ragamalika.

6. His penchant for Paras is captivating. The Saptaratna krti Alavadennalo (which lists the names of the 63 nayanmars) gives this raga a sublime feel, even though the krti contains several madhyamakala charanams (that we see in pancharatnas too). Another piece in the same raga, Innum enna venum also is worth learning.

7. Some of his favourites choices seem to be Todi, Shankarabharanam, Kalyani, Kambodhi, Madhyamavati, Nattai & Arabhi.

8. The seamless dhatu-maatu blend in numerous krtis as well as the integration of melody, rhythm and lyrics clearly suggests a mind of a very high order.

9. Last but not the least, the number of musical references in his compositions including gamakas like aahatam, pratyahatam, dalu, kampitam, sphuritam etc and names of the sapta-talas, sarali, jantai varishais and names of several ragas clearly reveal his scholarship in theory too.

Now to your questions:

Shuddhasaveri and Kannadagowla - General flavour (not MD school approach).
Hamsanadam: Kalyanarama doesn't use D3, in the versions I have heard.
Anandabhairavi: Some renditions of Yoga yogeshwari use more of D1. DKJ sir's version of Premaswaroopa doesn't use much of it, if at all.
Yamunakalyani: I don't recall having heard an audio of any piece so far.
Kannadamaruvam: SG3M2PD2N3S- SNDPMGS (53/65/71 minus R). I have learnt a beautiful peice, Vande nandasoonum in this.

I have to refresh my memory about the scale of the other two (will do so upon my return home in a couple of weeks).

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

I think we see the first use of the phrase 'guru guha',
Shankar,

OVK has used this phrase in a couple of other pieces too like sEnApatE namOstutE (gowLa). In this pieces, he splits that into:

dInArti bhanjana sharavaNabhava shivaguru guha dEva dEva (sEnApatE)

There are more than 10 pieces on Lord Subramanya in various kshetras including Pazhani, Sikkil etc. A fascinating opera of OVK is, Pranavopadesham (a single folk-style piece with 83 charanams), which of course highlights how Lord Subramanya attained the stature of guru.

rshankar
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

Sri Ravi Kiran,
Thank you so much for all of this wonderful stuff! It is amazing...rOmAncak!
Is it true that Sri OVK has a composition where he refers to subrahmaNya as having 7 paDai vIDus - the six well known ones, and the seventh being his (OVK's) heart?

chitravina ravikiran
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Is it true that Sri OVK has a composition where he refers to subrahmaNya as having 7 paDai vIDus - the six well known ones, and the seventh being his (OVK's) heart?
Yes. This is in Bilahari - ninRingun aruL kATTum. In the charanam, he says:

OrEzhu paDai vIDu koNDAi - viLangum
ARu paDai vIDum en uLamum shErndAha
IrEzhulaham paNi koNDAi - eninum
engaL tamizh vaLLI ezhil munnE vIzhndAi

The final madhyamakala is also brilliant. However, I am yet to learn this song - I perhaps have got the audio though.

There are several poetic songs on Muruga. For eg: in Huseni (composed in Pazhani), he opens with:

aDi muDi kANAda daivattin mElEri
anju mukham kaNDa daivamE - engaL
Aru mukham koNda daivamE

Another brilliant song in Sama, ADinAn viLaiyADinAn - describes an imaginary game between Subramanya and Vinayaka.

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Ponbhairavi »

In the R.K.post above:
engaL tamizh vaLLI ezhil munnE vIzhndAi
I may be excused for seeking an elementary clarification
Are there (m)any compositions of O V K in telegu ?

Ponbhairavi
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by Ponbhairavi »

aDi muDi kANAda daivattin mElEri
anju mukham kaNDa daivamE - engaL
Aru mukham koNda daivamE
The meaning of these 3 lines is very tricky. my guess is this:Usually adi mudi kAnAdha ( in the meaning of kAnappadAda- passive voice )deivam is Sivan.
mElEri =byepassing or overlooking or ignoring the words of
anju mugam The face on which fear was writlarge viz that of Brahma who could not give the meaning of Pranavam
another explanation seems to be like this.

If we take kAnAda in the active voice one who has not seen either the feet or the head of the Supreme( Brahma failed midway in his mission )
mElEri in the meaning of winning over Brahma he saw his face which showed his fear.
kAnAda and mElEri are beautifully chosen;
the paraphrased version would read like this:
adimudi kAnAda deivathin mElEri
nAnmuganin (implied)
anju mugam kanda deivamE engal
Aru mugam konda deivamE
beautiful sequence of the numbers four five and six.!! ref; Kamaban who repeats the number firve in five meanings in his famous song: anjilE onru petrAn......

vidya
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by vidya »

Thanks shri.Ravikiran for the responses. Yes, it would be of value if a researcher well-versed in music, musicology and research-methods undertakes a detailed
melodic and musical study of these compositions in light of other events in musical/melodic history in the 1700-1800 period This will help validate
and analyze the assumptions.

ShrutiLaya
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by ShrutiLaya »

chitravina ravikiran wrote: The best way to analyse them would be with audios - so far, I have managed to bring out around 50-60 including Navavaranams and Saptaratna krtis.
Dear Sri. Ravikiran,

I heartily second this. While I've been following your posts with great interest, it is hard to completely appreciate the unfamiliar songs from their descriptions or even (for me atleast, as one who is not too familiar with Tamil but can pick out the rough meaning when it is spoken) from the lyrics.

I realize that this is the real world, and there are commercial and copyright issues involved. But to the extent it is possible, it would be good to have audio links - even if the songs are rendered by students - to display what you mean ..

- Sreenadh

cmlover
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Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

aDi muDi kANAda daivattin mElEri
anju mukham kaNDa daivamE - engaL
Aru mukham koNda daivamE
I will interpret this differently..

aDi muDi kANAda daivattin mElEri = Sivanin mElERi = surpassing Sivan
anju mukham kaNDa daivamE = (properly perhaps) anju mukhan kaNDa daivamE
= Sivan darishittha (worshipped) daivamE
(anju mukhan = the five-faced Lord = Sivan
This probably refers to Murugan doing praNavOpadEsham

I also like ponbhairavi's interpretation which is more poetic!

hamsaa
Posts: 33
Joined: 06 May 2011, 21:32

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by hamsaa »

Sreenadh wrote:

"to the extent it is possible, it would be good to have audio links - even if the songs are rendered by students - to display what you mean .."
Here is a link to a few audios that I have personally enjoyed listening to.

http://www.sangeethapriya.org/tributes/ovk/other/

Some of them appear to be from live concerts.

rshankar
Posts: 13754
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

chitravina ravikiran wrote: Yes. This is in Bilahari - ninRingun aruL kATTum. In the charanam, he says:
Thank you!
chitavina ravikiran wrote:Another brilliant song in Sama, ADinAn viLaiyADinAn - describes an imaginary game between Subramanya and Vinayaka.
Is it possible for you to share the lyrics?
cmlover wrote:aDi muDi kANAda daivattin mElEri = Sivanin mElERi = surpassing Sivan
anju mukham kaNDa daivamE = (properly perhaps) anju mukhan kaNDa daivamE
= Sivan darishittha (worshipped) daivamE
(anju mukhan = the five-faced Lord = Sivan
This probably refers to Murugan doing praNavOpadEsham
Why not just 'Sivan (that Siva whose head [muDi] nor feet ([aDi] were seen by vishNu or brahmA) mEl Eri, yArum kANAda SivanArin aindu mukhataiyum kaNDa deivamE, Aru mukham koNDa deivamE!' Where the fact that he saw all five faces of Siva is an index of his (muruga's) prowess.

cmlover
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by cmlover »

Shankar!
That is beautiful!

vasanthakokilam
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by vasanthakokilam »

Ravi: Yes, quite nice. That is quite a prowess, climbing on something whose top was not even found by vishNu or brahmA and see the faces. Quite poetic! So it is a clever and poetic linkage of two different stories, right? But now I do not recall the background behind the 5 faces of Siva.

rshankar
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

AFAIK, Siva's fifth face faced upwards...I am not sure he ever lost it....It was brahmA who lost one of his five faces....

chitravina ravikiran
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Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

That Siva whose head [muDi] nor feet ([aDi] were seen by vishNu or brahmA) mEl Eri, yArum kANAda SivanArin aindu mukhataiyum kaNDa deivamE,
That is the most likely intent of OVK here.
Where the fact that he saw all five faces of Siva is an index of his (muruga's) prowess.
Prowess is definitely one part of it. But there is more here - the line also brings out

(a) the level of intimacy between Shiva and Muruga
(b) only a child of Shiva can ever gain access to Him completely - to the rest in the Universe, He is limitless.
(c) So OVK projects Muruga as having accomplished something beyond even Vishnu and Brahma - a fantastic opening for a song in which Muruga is the hero...
Mr Ponbhairavi wrote: "Are there (m)any compositions of O V K in telegu?"
No. He only used Sanskrit and Tamil for almost all of his works. However, I have seen a small number of pieces in Marathi - a language that gradually lost prominence in Tanjore area from late 1700s.
AFAIK, Siva's fifth face faced upwards...I am not sure he ever lost it....It was brahmA who lost one of his five faces....
Shiva still has 5 faces - none facing upwards: sadyOjAta, IshAna, vAma, aghOra, tatpuruSha.

Tyagaraja says in Nada tanumanisham, Chittaranjani: sadyOjAtAdi pancha vaktra ja SRGMPDN vara saptaswara. (There is a great question that the Kanchi Paramacharya posed related to this and stumped all musicians.) OVK mentions all the 5 names in the final charanam of his Todi Sapataratna, Jatadhara shankara.

Brahma lost his 5th face (upward facing) when Shiva plucked it out because he lied about having seen the head (muDi) of Shiva.

rshankar
Posts: 13754
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:26

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by rshankar »

Sri Ravikiran - thank you for the clarification and corrections!
Chitravina Ravikiran wrote:Brahma lost his 5th face (upward facing) when Shiva plucked it out because he lied about having seen the head (muDi) of Shiva.
Because of which he (Siva) incurred the brahmahatti dOSam...and the skull (kapAla) stuck to his (Siva's) hands as a begging bowl (described by muttutANDavar as talai OTTilE irand-uNDIr enranda uNmaiyai shonnEnO? in Edukittanai mODi; and by purandara dAsaru in the third caraNam of candracUDa- the dOSa was removed when jaganmAtA, pArvati, as annapUrNa offered him bhiksha.

chitravina ravikiran
Posts: 216
Joined: 28 Apr 2011, 10:30

Re: Value of OVK's contributions

Post by chitravina ravikiran »

Shankar, thanks for more on the Shiva story...

Meantime, here are the lyrics of Adinan in Sama. Apart from the vivid portrayal of the manner in which the siblings play, the melodic treatment of Sama in this piece is elaborate. OVK has composed numerous 1-kalai masterpieces of sprawling dimensions.

He has also shown innovation within the krti form in the charanam - splitting the 8-line slow section into 3+3+2, which gives a singular musical movement to the piece. I have expanded upon this in my book.

This song is part of the album, Sundara Natarajam, downloadable on a song by song basis at http://www.acharyanet.com

sAmA - Adi

P: ADinAn viLaiyADinAn ainkaran tannoDu arumukhan tiruviLai (yADinAn)

A: tEDi tEDi vandArum vizhaiya dEvarum yAvarum pU mazhai pozhiya
M K: ADi vanda suralOka sundarihaL AlOlam pADi vara kOlAhalamAha (ADinAn)

C: mUlap-poruLum para mOnap-poruLum onrAi
mundi nI mundi nAn enRADudE - kaNDa -
mozhiyum maraiyum taDumArudE

nIlam iDarkkaiyum neDuvarai peN kaiyum
nErukku nEr ninrADudE kaNDa -
nenjamum Ananda kUttADudE

mElai eRinda pandO kOlam kATTi maraiya
viN kadir tannaip-piDittADudE

M K: viritta shaDai muDi pOna veN madiyum meyyum naDunguravAhavum
vidhi mahan nAradan tudiyinai kUDavum miha miha tonnishai pADavum
tirattinODu Anaka dundubhi oru tanattanantanam pODavum
taN kadir tanadu sukirtamena vikirtamiDa adir peruha tikurtamena viLai (yADinan)

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