TM Krishna Cleveland April 18 2009

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 19 Apr 2009, 10:56

TM Krishna - Vocal
RK Sriram Kumar - Violin
Trichy Sankaran - Mridangam
TV Vasan - Ghatam

A stellar line-up, song list and performance.

1. Sadasivam upasmahe - Sankarabharanam - Dikshitar ( S)
2. Teliyaleru Rama - Denuka - Tyagaraja (N, S)
3. Chetashri Balakrishnam - Dwijavanti - Dikshitar (A,S)
4. Gajavadhana - Todi - Kumara Ettendra
5. Geetarthamu - Suruti - Tyagaraja (A,N,S,T)
6. Entati Kuluke - Kalyani
7. Sagara Sayana vibho - Bageshri - MDR
8. Krishna Kalayasaki - Mukhari - Narayanatheertha
9. Nee rama rupamulaku - Sowrashtram - Mangalam (short sketch of madhyamavati)

There are times when no matter what I write is going to convey the display of skill, delivery, teamwork and class that was exhibited by the artistes on stage today. Not to mention the sAdhakam (training) that it takes to reach that level.

TMK has reached the stage where his music is just an emergent property of the moment. His ideas seem to go straight to sound waves, with no need for buffers inbetween. And the stimulus energy that then impinges upon the senses of the listener requires little by way of cognitive mediation...whizzing right past to make the neurons of the auditory cortex jump up in joy. The kind of sensation that makes your hair stand up.

TMK's range extends from the lower sa to the upper Nishadam. He put his vocal range to full use with his open-throated singing style and let the gamakams do their natural curls. The surutti alapanai brought out every aspect of carefully nurtured voice and delivery style. It is hard to put my finger on it, but I think is the balance between authority and ease with which TMK delivers his music, that makes him special.

RKSK was absolutely brilliant. His swaram repartees were crisp, clever and calculative. His Dwijavanti was dripping with the raga essence; the denuka swarams were just top-notch.

Trichy Sankaran really moved the concert to a different plane. His nadham was exquisite (no issues there with the weather, amplification or flatness of sound) and his nadai was majestic. TV Vasan was good, but a bit more subdued than normal.

The applause was thunderous. Standing ovations all around. One just for the tani....

rajaglan · Post by **rajaglan** » 19 Apr 2009, 11:20

Surutii as main is great. I have mostly heard sree venkatesa girisam as submain , not geetharthamu.
chetashri must be the slow one. I have heard him sing (not sure album or live) too slow.

Always_Evolving · Post by **Always_Evolving** » 19 Apr 2009, 15:05

I like TMK's concerts and in this case he appears to have shone more with the powerhouse of accompanists. Suratti is lovely but it's very surprising -- actually weird -- to see a Gajavadana unadorned by improvisational segments followed by Geethartamu main!

balusatya · Post by **balusatya** » 19 Apr 2009, 15:09

Curious to know where neraval could have been explored in Geetharthamu?

raghavt · Post by **raghavt** » 19 Apr 2009, 17:49

"Trichy Sankaran really moved the concert to a different plane. His nadham was exquisite (no issues there with the weather, amplification or flatness of sound) and his nadai was majestic. TV Vasan was good, but a bit more subdued than normal.

The applause was thunderous. Standing ovations all around. One just for the tani..."

I would request rasikas to share the details of the Thani played by Sanakaran sir... I'm sure it would have been majestic and reverberating....

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 19 Apr 2009, 21:42

Mahavishnu,
A great review about a concert which seems to be a 'shouldn't have missed it' affair. What an ensemble! Sriramkumar's accompaniment is truly a plus for a concert. I heard Tiruchy Sankaran play recently, and what an asset he is! His playing is soothing, even with all the intricacies
and drama in it. TMK seems to have been in his element. Would you call it easily the best concert you have heard (heard of) so far, barring perhaps 'the golden girl's' one?

suma · Post by **suma** » 19 Apr 2009, 21:55

T.M. Krishna is one of the best in the Industry and I am sure you must have heard a great concert yesterday. I was feeling bad that I missed this concert, however, someone posted his Boston Concert on you tube. He sung some rare pieces and also explained those ragams. I was happy that atleast I could hear him through you tube on the same day as a consolation.

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 20 Apr 2009, 03:14

balusatya: the neraval was on the line hari vara rUpuDu harahaya vinutuDu.
and Arasi, this concert of TMK's is right up there.

vaidya · Post by **vaidya** » 20 Apr 2009, 09:51

Geetharthamu must have been really a good one.....I have heard that as a main item in one of his concerts.

sappri · Post by **sappri** » 20 Apr 2009, 10:29

Suma - could you give the link pl?

suma · Post by **suma** » 20 Apr 2009, 16:49

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-vOS3WCHWE

newyorker · Post by **newyorker** » 20 Apr 2009, 23:25

Surutti as the main ragam and Trichy Sankaran on the mridangam ... Damn, should have done the 8 hour drive to Cleveland. What a miss!

Why does the Aradhana website have Jayshankar Balan as the violinist for this concert? (It still does)

Common, please tell me someone recorded this concert ... at least the Surutti.

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 20 Apr 2009, 23:45

Newyorker: RKSK was flown in on the last day, due to scheduling changes (probably for all parties concerned).
Not sure if anyone recorded it. TMK is not very fond of people taping his concerts; there was an explicit announcement made by the organizers to turn off any video recording equipment prior to the start of the concert. But this is a concert that should be preserved for posterity.

My only complaint, is that sometimes during the high-speed kalpana swarams, TMK shows a tendency to accelerate the tempo. In tamil we call it Ottam (running). This was especially true for his Denuka swarams. I did go back and listen to a recent commercial release and he does the same thing there with the swarams following Teliyaleru Rama.

I wonder if anyone else has noticed this in Krishna's music. How strict are the puritans and pundits about this (when everything else about the execution is picture perfect)?

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 21 Apr 2009, 00:03

mahavishnu, that Ottam stuff is probably common, even among old masters ( with some exceptions ). Of course, what we mean here is not the perceived increase in speed which is the real intent by packing more swaras per beat but the beat interval itsef is shortened slightly. Having gotten curious about this a while back, I sampled a few finishing climax kalpanaswaram kOrvais of different artists. The beat interval varies by 10-12% sometimes. ( if one avarthanam took 8 seconds initially, it sometimes shrunk to 7.2 seconds ) I am not sure if that is what we perceive as Ottam or not. It is hard to keep all this straight for the rasikas during Korvais, there is intentional off-beat placement of stresses which can pose challenges even for the best layman rasika along with variations in the density of swaras per beat ( which provides for the perception of speed ).

I basically accepted that this kind of 10% variation is normal

and it is not fair to the artists to be measuring this with an accurate stop watch. The overall sowkyam and/or technical wizardry of kapanaswarams trump this anyway.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 21 Apr 2009, 00:51

'Scientist' cuckoo,
Your last line says it all.

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 21 Apr 2009, 01:47

I wonder if my ears can tell the difference between 8 and 7.2 seconds - I was tcikled with the vision of rasikas sitting with stop watches that measure in 1/100 second intervals to time artists!! Sort of like those timers at the Olympics.

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 21 Apr 2009, 03:33

VK, thanks for your interesting analysis. I guess as long as the relative timing is intact, overall tempo variations are ok. I can live with that, as long as it is within a certain margin. I guess we are all "noisy" clocks (by which I don't mean clocks that make noise

).

Ravi: the reason I brought this up was because when the drift/nonstationarity gets to a certain level, everyone notices the Ottam (even without a stopwatch). I would think the difference between 8 and 7.2s is within the detectable range.

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 21 Apr 2009, 05:14

mahavishnu wrote:Ravi: the reason I brought this up was because when the drift/nonstationarity gets to a certain level, everyone notices the Ottam (even without a stopwatch). I would think the difference between 8 and 7.2s is within the detectable range.

One more reason why I am laya challenged, I guess. I don't think I will be able to...

PUNARVASU · Post by **PUNARVASU** » 21 Apr 2009, 10:21

arasi wrote:'Scientist' cuckoo,
Your last line says it all.

It is the 'cuckoo clock'.

rajumds · Post by **rajumds** » 21 Apr 2009, 12:00

I remember a discussion on speeding up of the kalapramanam in our forum 2 years ago. The poster had measured the time taken for 1 avartanam using the stop watch ( cell phone ) during variouss parts of a song and tani. I am unable to locate the thread now. This seems to be quite common even during tani.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 21 Apr 2009, 21:01

Rajesh amazes me with his 'clock work' reviews too.

Ramaprasad · Post by **Ramaprasad** » 21 Apr 2009, 22:00

Rshankar, Consider yourself lucky that you are just laya challenged. I am multi-challenged!

Having said that, I would like to add a few comments. It is a generally held wisdom that analysis is an enemy of pleasure. When I was listening to TMK in Cleveland, my thoughts were far from such intricacies as the above discussion by the learned rasikas. This is my personal view and it follows me which ever kutcheri I am attending.

On another note (no pun here), I have always understood that both in science (my area of limited expertise) and music, it is (small) departures from linearity that have produced breakthroughs in science and great melodies in music. Timing and time keeping are very different.

Ramaprasad

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 Apr 2009, 00:06

Duplicate Post

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 Apr 2009, 00:06

Ramaprasad wrote:Rshankar, Consider yourself lucky that you are just laya challenged.

Ramaprasad - that is all I am 'fessing up to, that's all! Doesn't mean that it is the only area of challenge!

Ramaprasad · Post by **Ramaprasad** » 22 Apr 2009, 00:32

Rshankar,

That was a good reply.

Ramaprasad

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 22 Apr 2009, 06:32

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 22 Apr 2009, 16:02

rajumds wrote:I remember a discussion on speeding up of the kalapramanam in our forum 2 years ago. The poster had measured the time taken for 1 avartanam using the stop watch ( cell phone ) during variouss parts of a song and tani. I am unable to locate the thread now. This seems to be quite common even during tani.

Heh heh...I was the one! True about 90% of the time I noticed variations around or greater than 10% b/w the first avartha of the song and 2nd sweep swaras....to a lesser extent this was also true of mrudangists b/w first avarthana of tani and the farans section...

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 Apr 2009, 16:47

coolkarni wrote:Saloon Challenged ????

You think??

endaroo · Post by **endaroo** » 22 Apr 2009, 20:38

My sincere request to the members, please don't trace out only the faults and keep on discussing the matter to show the ignorence.
Maximum we should enjoy and relax.

cacm · Post by **cacm** » 23 Apr 2009, 08:39

vasanthakokilam wrote:mahavishnu, that Ottam stuff is probably common, even among old masters ( with some exceptions ). Of course, what we mean here is not the perceived increase in speed which is the real intent by packing more swaras per beat but the beat interval itsef is shortened slightly. Having gotten curious about this a while back, I sampled a few finishing climax kalpanaswaram kOrvais of different artists. The beat interval varies by 10-12% sometimes. ( if one avarthanam took 8 seconds initially, it sometimes shrunk to 7.2 seconds ) I am not sure if that is what we perceive as Ottam or not. It is hard to keep all this straight for the rasikas during Korvais, there is intentional off-beat placement of stresses which can pose challenges even for the best layman rasika along with variations in the density of swaras per beat ( which provides for the perception of speed ).

I basically accepted that this kind of 10% variation is normal and it is not fair to the artists to be measuring this with an accurate stop watch. The overall sowkyam and/or technical wizardry of kapanaswarams trump this anyway.

My two cents worth on "Ottam Stuff": MMI was very particular & specific on this point. He not only insisted on Sarvalalaghu but pointed out the hazards of "Kanakku" which can lead to troubles like Ottam etc. His fondness for Vellore Ramabhadran was not just confined to being a Nadabhadran but for his perfection in this regard. I fel MALI& LGJ are the other two whose renderings I feel are without any blemish in this regard. VKV

cmrasika · Post by **cmrasika** » 24 Apr 2009, 16:08

Ottam is almost inevitable in carnatic concerts although the veterans try to keep it within tolerable limits....only a meteronome can be 'the ideal tala'!!!but then there's something else which has been boggling my mind for quite some time now....keeping track of tala during the tani

Especially when greats like Shri UKS are playing the tani and the patterns get more and more comlex, it becomes increasingly difficult to put the tala and invariably ur talam doesn't match with that of the main artist/artist who is putting talam on the dias!!!!The main artist (in most cases) manages to do it with amazing prowess!!! amazing stuff indeed..............i wonder what w'd happen if the main artist somehow doesn't put the talam correctly...will the percussionists still follow the main artist's tala or play according to their own timing sense???

I guess this doesn't happen under normal circumstances bcos the main artist s'd be proficient enough in laya........But still there is this doubt lingering in my mind........

uday_shankar · Post by **uday_shankar** » 24 Apr 2009, 16:58

cmrasika wrote:I guess this doesn't happen under normal circumstances bcos the main artist s'd be proficient enough in laya........But still there is this doubt lingering in my mind........

Yes. I believe Ottam is part and parcel of mel kaala swaraprasthara and tani avartanam. Good taala vadya players as well as main artistes seem to minimize this by subtly and instinctively dragging each other back to the correct kaalapramanam. I've observed how artfully the great ones like UKS bring novice and/or absentminded timekeepers back to the correct tempo. Similarly I have observed so often how artfully a great main artist like chitravina ravikiran brings an over enthusiastic mridangam player back to the correct tempo.

Conversely, I've heard even all time greats like PMI (listen to his tani after SSI's O Rangashayee in a 1980 EMI classic LP/CD) quickly accelerate the kaalapramanam to a convenient tempo for the tani avartanam

.

The great Khanjira maestro Harishankar stood out as a paradigm of unmatched precision both in terms of his fingering as well as his overall kaalapramanam. The Karakudi Mani - Harishankar tani avartanams are a profound study in precision.

cacm · Post by **cacm** » 25 Apr 2009, 09:19

Uday_Shankar wrote:
cmrasika wrote:I guess this doesn't happen under normal circumstances bcos the main artist s'd be proficient enough in laya........But still there is this doubt lingering in my mind........
Yes. I believe Ottam is part and parcel of mel kaala swaraprasthara and tani avartanam. Good taala vadya players as well as main artistes seem to minimize this by subtly and instinctively dragging each other back to the correct kaalapramanam. I've observed how artfully the great ones like UKS bring novice and/or absentminded timekeepers back to the correct tempo. Similarly I have observed so often how artfully a great main artist like chitravina ravikiran brings an over enthusiastic mridangam player back to the correct tempo.

Conversely, I've heard even all time greats like PMI (listen to his tani after SSI's O Rangashayee in a 1980 EMI classic LP/CD) quickly accelerate the kaalapramanam to a convenient tempo for the tani avartanam .

The great Khanjira maestro Harishankar stood out as a paradigm of unmatched precision both in terms of his fingering as well as his overall kaalapramanam. The Karakudi Mani - Harishankar tani avartanams are a profound study in precision.

Generally the accompanists especially the mridangists are forced to do their best to not make the Ottam OBVIOUS. I have been present after the concerts where the great ones like Palghat Raghu have privately commented to the main artist who shall remain nameless
Yane Indha Madhiri Odarai? Aso regarding the Metronome referred to in another post I have subjected PMI'S playing to the Metronome & other tests and found his playing to be impeccable. I have not compared it to an Atomic Clock but my personal view is that his accueacy will stand up to an atomic clock! VKV

uday_shankar · Post by **uday_shankar** » 27 Apr 2009, 08:02

vkv43034 wrote:I have not compared it to an Atomic Clock but my personal view is that his accueacy will stand up to an atomic clock! VKV

vkv sir, with all due respect to both your scientific and musical eminence, I beg to differ

. But we can't debate this without hard data and it is probably not even worth debating because the art of shri mani iyer is beyond debate.

sankirnam · Post by **sankirnam** » 27 Apr 2009, 08:38

Well said, Uday...

sappri · Post by **sappri** » 28 Apr 2009, 09:58

Suma

Thanks a million - truly apologize for the rather belated response.

Thanks again and God Bless!

semmu86 · Post by **semmu86** » 07 May 2009, 12:53

By any chance can we get a recording? atleast the thani??

Thanks

Arvind

Rasika911 · Post by **Rasika911** » 13 May 2009, 18:48

Full recording will be awesome

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 13 May 2009, 18:56

rajeshnat · Post by **rajeshnat** » 13 May 2009, 19:06

srinivasrgvn
For all the performing artist it is better not to ask recordings of the concert. There is always a chance for this site to get into copyright violation. Infact we have this written rule somewhere in the forum.

Hope no one uploads any latest concerts without express permission of the artist(s), as it is by default a strict no no.

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 13 May 2009, 19:09

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 14 May 2009, 06:21

Srinivasgrn, there were explicit instructions from the organizers not to record the concert using handhelds or camcorders. If you are really keen on getting this recording, your best bet would be to write directly to Sri. TM Krishna. I noticed that he had a recording device that was perfectly placed on the proscenium, right between the stage monitors.

I'm sure the aradhana committee has a recording (directly off the sound board, mixed some of the best in the business including Suresh of Charsur), but I'm sure it is meant for some limited commercial circulation. That said, I haven't seen anything released by the committee in the last couple of years. Perhaps, Sri VKV could help you there.

Another option is to wait a few months for the Jaya TV broadcast of some highlights. Now that will makes its rounds on youtube, whether people object or not. You would probably catch Teliyaleru rama, gajavadhana and possibly the Sankarabharanam starter. But it was really the surutti that wrapped this concert together (no pun intended). And that is very long to be broadcast in complete form.

mri_fan · Post by **mri_fan** » 14 May 2009, 08:27

Soon Charsur is going to set up an Itunes-like venture where all of the proceedings from the Cleveland Aradhana will be available for online download price. Suresh was talking about this at Cleveland. Money from the proceedings will go to the Aradhana as well as the artists. (Maybe this is why the Charsur website is down???)

cacm · Post by **cacm** » 14 May 2009, 08:46

I suggest persons interested contact VVS as I have stayed away from recordings of concerts myself. I do know there are complications in accomodating the wishes of the artists as well as commercial organisations like Charsur, Jaya TV, & Rasikas& as well. VKV