Sangitha Kalanidhi 2009

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 11 Jul 2009, 07:48

They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 11 Jul 2009, 08:09

When he gets to be a seriouly senior vidvAn--after many years?

johnlovescm · Post by **johnlovescm** » 11 Jul 2009, 13:03

srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!

Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME

Rasika911 · Post by **Rasika911** » 11 Jul 2009, 15:13

johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME

Yea because renditions of abhangs and thillanas are the criteria for awarding SK

I wouldnt at all mind seeing bombay sisters get it,
Id love to see kalpagam swaminathan, prof srj, trivadrum venkatraman ect.

hnbhagavan · Post by **hnbhagavan** » 11 Jul 2009, 18:35

HNbhagavan of Bangalore
My candidates are Rudrapatnam Brothers.

They richly deserve the award and are senior vidwans.

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 11 Jul 2009, 18:55

Trichur Ramachandran

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 12 Jul 2009, 07:41

Rasika911 wrote:
johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME
Yea because renditions of abhangs and thillanas are the criteria for awarding SK

I wouldnt at all mind seeing bombay sisters get it,
Id love to see kalpagam swaminathan, prof srj, trivadrum venkatraman ect.

Smt.Kalpakam Swaminathan has already received the 'sangeetha kalA AchArya' award way back in 2002! I don't think a person can receive 2 awards. I am really unsure. Can anybody confirm?

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 12 Jul 2009, 07:45

johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME

Well, john!
Aruna Sairam will definitely get the SK one day, I hope. But, that will take many more decades! She is such an excellent singer, but I wish she appealed to the purists a bit more. She does know a lot of rare compositions that the purists will crave for, but she never sings them. She repeats the same songs in concerts. If she corrects herself in these aspects, she will appeal equally to purists and pragmatists.

johnlovescm · Post by **johnlovescm** » 12 Jul 2009, 09:15

srinivasrgvn wrote:
johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME
Well, john!
Aruna Sairam will definitely get the SK one day, I hope. But, that will take many more decades! She is such an excellent singer, but I wish she appealed to the purists a bit more. She does know a lot of rare compositions that the purists will crave for, but she never sings them. She repeats the same songs in concerts. If she corrects herself in these aspects, she will appeal equally to purists and pragmatists.

Purists are hypocrites in my opinion. What is pure and not pure!
It is our own thinking

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 12 Jul 2009, 09:41

Yes, John, I agree with you.
Purity is one's own scale. What is impure in music? Nothing!
Even I am a great fan of Smt.Aruna Sayeeram. One of the greatest, by far!
I am saying this for her benefit, of course. An artiste has to appeal to all, john. Appealing only to normal people, or pAmara janam is not enough. Even the people who want deeper music should be satisfied, don't they? As I said, Smt.Aruna knows such a lot of compositions, her repertoire is indeed large. But, she has to utilize it to the maximum extent so that everybody is satisfied. If everybody is satisfied only, there will be more recognition for her! She is indeed one of the best singers today, but some criticize her because her concerts are a bit diluted. I never say this! I am merely quoting others. That's all. No offense meant to the artiste nor anybody else. =)

Rasika911 · Post by **Rasika911** » 12 Jul 2009, 13:13

srinivasrgvn wrote:Yes, John, I agree with you.
Purity is one's own scale. What is impure in music? Nothing!
Even I am a great fan of Smt.Aruna Sayeeram. One of the greatest, by far!
I am saying this for her benefit, of course. An artiste has to appeal to all, john. Appealing only to normal people, or pAmara janam is not enough. Even the people who want deeper music should be satisfied, don't they? As I said, Smt.Aruna knows such a lot of compositions, her repertoire is indeed large. But, she has to utilize it to the maximum extent so that everybody is satisfied. If everybody is satisfied only, there will be more recognition for her! She is indeed one of the best singers today, but some criticize her because her concerts are a bit diluted. I never say this! I am merely quoting others. That's all. No offense meant to the artiste nor anybody else. =)

When aruna sairam was singing rare heavy compositions, she was singing to herself in empty halls which is perhaps why she has changed her style.
Johnlovescm, all music is pure. But when one goes to listen to a kutcheri they go with certain expectations. Seeing one ragam rendered briefly followed by a list of thukkudas dont fulfill these expectations. I am not refering to any artiste in particular. It is not nice when u see a small krithis taken for a main or when u see chakkani raja sund with 2 sangathis.

Jigyaasa · Post by **Jigyaasa** » 12 Jul 2009, 14:30

johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME

In the social networking website, Facebook, they have a provision whereby someone can "like" an action performed by someone else, say, like a new photo posted or a comment made. I wish there was a "dislike" option available here which I could exercise right now (each person is entitled to an opinion of their own and there isn't always a necessity to explain it, like this instance) Even then, comparing the Bombay Sisters and Smt Sairam. Lol... And goin further to say the latter deserves it more than the former, rofl!!!

Rasika911 · Post by **Rasika911** » 12 Jul 2009, 18:47

I like ur idea. A like and dislike button will be a good idea.
One problem is that it will become a popularity poll of sorts and aruna sairam will win hands down lol.

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 12 Jul 2009, 18:48

johnlovescm wrote:
srinivasrgvn wrote:They have to give it to the Bombay Sisters. They are really deserving and have waited for a long time!
Aruna Sairam is much more deserving artist than the Sisters. Listen to her Abhangs and thillanas, they are AWESOME

I am not quoting to cook up controversies. But, can anybody tell me if Smt.Aruna has sung any thillana other than the kAlinga nardhana thillAna? This is a genuine doubt. I have never heard her sing any other thillAna. Once again, I repeat, this is a genuine doubt. I am not asking a rhetoric question. =)

Sundara Rajan · Post by **Sundara Rajan** » 13 Jul 2009, 08:28

My vote is for Mankkal Rangarajan, before it is too late. He is the senior most among deserving vocalists in the lists above, with the exception of S.Rajam, who has been awarded AchArya award already.

karthikbala · Post by **karthikbala** » 13 Jul 2009, 15:06

srinivasrgvn wrote: Aruna Sairam will definitely get the SK one day, I hope. But, that will take many more decades! She is such an excellent singer, but I wish she appealed to the purists a bit more. She does know a lot of rare compositions that the purists will crave for, but she never sings them. She repeats the same songs in concerts. If she corrects herself in these aspects, she will appeal equally to purists and pragmatists.

I remember attending her concerts 2000-2002 at Hamsadhwani, KGS etc. with turnouts of maybe 100 rasikas or less. Unthinkable today!!! I last attended a 2007 season NGS concert which was a near-stampede, and although the approach was different, the parts I liked were very satisfying.

The problem with appealing to purists is, we don't know who they are...the mantle in different contexts is donned by the connoisseurs, the tone-deaf, and also the "burning-stomach" cases. At least pleasing the crowds is a more deterministic/definable/quantifiable goal.

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 13 Jul 2009, 20:05

One thing I spotted was someone mentioned talking during the concert. That's definitely makes things interesting, and could be even informative.

Radhika-Rajnarayan · Post by **Radhika-Rajnarayan** » 13 Jul 2009, 20:58

Is there a ban on awarding the SK to S Rajam because he already has got the Kala Acharya? I think that his reputation as a teacher has eclipsed his virtuosity and sheer musical artistry. So what?
Even if it is not awarded to S Rajam, the SK should be awarded to someone really deserving of the title, (look at the meaning of the words 'Sangeetha Kalanidhi'!) not because of State or Gender or vocal / instrument 'quotas' or 'seniority'. This is not a promotion / post in a Government office! We, as a nation are quota and seniority minded, and therefore compromise on excellence and merit in almost every field.
The committee should not look at popularity as a benchmark either. If they do, then they might as well descend to 'Indian Idol' or other 'Super Singer' shows and start the 'SMS voting' stunt!

vallaki · Post by **vallaki** » 13 Jul 2009, 22:53

Aruna Sairam is a Brilliant Musician. She has a very unique voice, tremendous talent, and a capacity to thrill the audience and hold them spellbound..

She enriches Carnatic Music, and has contributed a lot to it's popularity.

Whatever her faults in singing may be(which some so called connosieurs or 'burning stomach' cases like to point out) They are insignificant in comparison to the brilliancy she brings to the art of singing and the efforts to promote this great music of South India.

vallaki · Post by **vallaki** » 13 Jul 2009, 22:54

I Love Bombay Sisters too.

raghavt · Post by **raghavt** » 14 Jul 2009, 05:42

Any update who is INDEED getting the award this time???

karthikbala · Post by **karthikbala** » 14 Jul 2009, 10:53

Radhika-Rajnarayan wrote: The committee should not look at popularity as a benchmark either. If they do, then they might as well descend to 'Indian Idol' or other 'Super Singer' shows and start the 'SMS voting' stunt!

I am not sure the comparison is tenable. SMS voting is a far cry from crowds queueing up for tickets, flocking to a concert in rush-hour Chennai traffic, and after that risking personal injury in a stampede etc. I do not think Carnatic audiences deserve any condescension or contempt. Without the "masses" (if the dwindling tribe may be termed as such), CM would be DEAD.

Certainly popularity is not the only benchmark, but to dismiss it as one is strange...which absolutely mediocre performer has become a sensation in your opinion? As far as I know, all musicians who gained real popularity deserved it. In fact, using popularity as a sole benchmark would probably result in fewer crazy choices even at the price of a few sad omissions. Popularity is a relatively well-defined indicator; it gives you some information, maybe inadequate, but finite, non-zero amount of information. Subjective opinions/criteria can give you "negative" (mis)information. Anyone privy to the workings of committees will be familiar with this. Unanimity is rare as is the absence of vested interests and in some cases even personal animosities.

As the thread deals with the "SK": some prominent deserving musicians who were denied in the past would surely have got it based on popularity. MDR, is often (mistakenly?) mentioned in this forum as an unpopular performer. Correct me if I'm wrong, but in the year before his passing, wouldn't he actually have got it based on popularity instead of.... ?

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 14 Jul 2009, 12:27

Radhika-Rajnarayan wrote:Is there a ban on awarding the SK to S Rajam because he already has got the Kala Acharya? I think that his reputation as a teacher has eclipsed his virtuosity and sheer musical artistry. So what?
Even if it is not awarded to S Rajam, the SK should be awarded to someone really deserving of the title, (look at the meaning of the words 'Sangeetha Kalanidhi'!) not because of State or Gender or vocal / instrument 'quotas' or 'seniority'. This is not a promotion / post in a Government office! We, as a nation are quota and seniority minded, and therefore compromise on excellence and merit in almost every field.
The committee should not look at popularity as a benchmark either. If they do, then they might as well descend to 'Indian Idol' or other 'Super Singer' shows and start the 'SMS voting' stunt!

Hello, hello! If you were referring to my post, I was never telling the SK should not be given to people who already the possess the SKA! I just asked if such a person is eligible! It was a doubt, that's all! Cool down!

srinivasrgvn · Post by **srinivasrgvn** » 14 Jul 2009, 12:36

vallaki wrote:Aruna Sairam is a Brilliant Musician. She has a very unique voice, tremendous talent, and a capacity to thrill the audience and hold them spellbound..

She enriches Carnatic Music, and has contributed a lot to it's popularity.

Whatever her faults in singing may be(which some so called connosieurs or 'burning stomach' cases like to point out) They are insignificant in comparison to the brilliancy she brings to the art of singing and the efforts to promote this great music of South India.

Yes, the purists are a bunch of critiques who never appreciate true talent. They will create notions stressing that the artistes of the past were the only pure musicians! I am always against purists. But still, appealing to all is important. I don't think any musician of the present age can appeal to purists. Purists tend to find out one mistake or the other in every artiste!

As you said, the significant contribution made by Smt.Aruna Sairam to the Carnatic Music world is itself enough to neglect all the small dissatisfaction. She is one of the global musicians who has represented our country in many international festivals. We must be proud of her. Receiving the 'Sangeetha Kalanidhi' is not the greatest thing in the world!

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 16 Jul 2009, 10:59

going by arasi's idea, it is probably a good move for the MA to consider having 2 ppl chair the conference each year. A vocalist and an instrumentalist. Or in case of siblings, they both could do it.

Actually, in the present system of turns, the vocalists have a 33% reservation, while the non-percussion instruments and percussion instruments have 33% each. Which i think is fair and should not be disturbed.

There are many deserving instrumentalists, accepted. There are equally good number of vocalists too in the waiting list. Hence, unless academy decides to amend its rules to have 2 ppl awarded each year, it is better to follow the present system and that way, all sections of the musicians are taken care off. I dont think they should increase the quota for instrumentalists from its present state.

The reservation for vocalist is already just one-third only. lets not reduce it further.

Also, its time they started to recognise and honour dancers.

Smt. (Kumari) Kamala has been waiting to get honoured since decades now. She should have been given the Kalanidhi ages and ages ago.

MA should consider giving some recognition to them. may be institute another award during their dance series, and let somebody chair the dance festival and be awarded with a Nritya Kalanidhi or something...

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 16 Jul 2009, 11:12

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 16 Jul 2009, 19:56

The Sangeetha Kalanidhi is specifically for those who practise music, not for dancers. Its also not for teachers/gurus of music. The main purpose of the award is to honor significant performers who have added value to the world of classical music by their performances.

Hence the suggestion to include dancers in the SK fray seems to be non-intuitive.

MaheshS · Post by **MaheshS** » 16 Jul 2009, 20:33

skris - IIRC T Balasaraswathi got it and she was a dancer wasn't she?

keerthi · Post by **keerthi** » 16 Jul 2009, 23:37

srkris wrote:The Sangeetha Kalanidhi is specifically for those who practise music, not for dancers. Its also not for teachers/gurus of music. The main purpose of the award is to honor significant performers who have added value to the world of classical music by their performances.

Hence the suggestion to include dancers in the SK fray seems to be non-intuitive.

Don't make such categorical comments without research.. Each one of those comments is/can be proved wrong by the history of the kalAnidhi..

1929 T. V. Subba Rao, T. S. Sabesha Iyer and M. S. Ramaswamy Iyer
1930 Harikesanallur Muthiah Bhagavatar and T. V. Subba Rao

How many people remember sri.subba rao for his contribution as a performer.. his seminal contributions are towards rAga lakshana and the comprehension of several musicological concepts.

1933 K. Ponnayya Pillai

How many have heard Ponnaiah pillaivAL perform on stage..? his contribution was as a teacher of music at annAmalai, and as a nAtyAcharya..

1935 Mysore K. Vasudevacharya

Is vAsudevAcharya remebered for his concerts or is he remembered for his musical compositions, writings and teachings..?

1963 Budalur Krishnamurthi Sastrigal and 1969 Madurai Srirangam Iyer both are renown more for their quality as teachers than for concert performances..

1971 Papanasam Sivan
"The main purpose of the award is to honor significant performers who have added value to the world of classical music by their performances. ..?"

1972 Professor P. Sambamoorthy - see above..??

1973 T. Balasaraswati - Listen to that recording of bAlA singing kriSNA nI, look at bharata's definition of sangItam in the nAtya sAstra, and look at the motto printed in every issue of the academy's journal - Santatam pAhi mAm sangItasyAmalE.. Not gAnasyAmaLe..

1974 R. Anantakrishna Sarma - for his contributions towards the rAga laksaNas, critical edition and notation of AnnamAchArya's songs.. Taught and wrote about several aspects of music..

1982 Embar S. Vijayaraghavachariar - Was a harikathA vidwan

1983 Dr. S. Pinakapani - Known for publishing excellent notations of several hundred krthis, several pada-s and upto 100 traditional pallavis. Trained and taught VolEti, nUkala Chinna satyanArAyana, Srirangam gOpAlaratnam, nEdanUri, HyderabAd brothers and mallAdi sUri bAbu, while practising and teaching medicine full-time..

It will be a great loss to the music world if we alienate ourselves from the field of dance.. Several pada-s, swarajati-s and varNA-s have already dissapeared, due to the lack of good singers to perpetuate them..

Performers represent a significant but small percentage of those who help in the preservation and growth of music.. It is a disturbing trend that, while the old committees have recognised this, the later ones seem to have srkris' axiom as their mantra..

rbharat wrote:going by arasi's idea, it is probably a good move for the MA to consider having 2 ppl chair the conference each year. A vocalist and an instrumentalist. Or in case of siblings, they both could do it.

2002 Sikkil Sisters (Neela & Kunjumani) sets a precedent..

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 17 Jul 2009, 01:53

I am sorry if I have offended people by expressing my understanding (or misunderstanding) of the nature of the SK award.

My understanding is it is mainly for performers of saMgItam (music ensemble as in a concert setting) as opposed to even gItam or nAtyam.

karthikbala · Post by **karthikbala** » 17 Jul 2009, 13:39

MaheshS wrote:skris - IIRC T Balasaraswathi got it and she was a dancer wasn't she?

Incidentally, she was a good singer too. I will try to upload some recordings.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 17 Jul 2009, 21:28

srkris wrote:My understanding is it is mainly for performers of saMgItam (music ensemble as in a concert setting) as opposed to even gItam or nAtyam.

Thanks srkris. I did not realize that is what sangItam actually means.

Strictly speaking gItam does not include percussion, right?

Based on the stats keerthi provided, in that 50 years, 12 people were awarded SK, not for sangItam but for other related things. That is a good 20% deviation. So MA itself does not adhere to that strict definition.

keerthi · Post by **keerthi** » 18 Jul 2009, 00:33

srkris wrote:I am sorry if I have offended people by expressing my understanding (or misunderstanding) of the nature of the SK award.

srkris,

My intention was not to pull you up.. Looking back at my post, I seem to have vent some spleen on what is one of my pet peeves, and I probably should have been less critical..

the academy began, I believe, with the natya-SAstra definition of sangIta -

'gItam nrtyam tathA vAdyaM etat sangItam ucyatE'

this translates to - sangIta comprises of music, dance/dramAtic expression and instrumental performance.

Over time, the attitudes of the Meccademy have changed...

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 18 Jul 2009, 03:47

'gItam nrtyam tathA vAdyaM etat sangItam ucyatE' - That is a good explanation and srkris and keerthi are both level headed and willing to admit their process of learning.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 19 Jul 2009, 07:40

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 19 Jul 2009, 08:23

Absolutely. Count me in as one who cares for KSG.

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 19 Jul 2009, 09:09

I also do!

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 19 Jul 2009, 09:58

A highly satisfying performance of Koluva Maragada by KSG is here: http://sangeethamshare.org/tvg/UPLOADS- ... NAN_FLUTE/ As is sometimes done, he joins the mridangamist on the final 3-peat of the Korvai. A liltte snippet of the common aesthetics of kalpanaswarams and thani reveals itself.

prashant · Post by **prashant** » 19 Jul 2009, 13:00

Count me in for Sri KSG... an incredibly gifted artiste.

appu · Post by **appu** » 19 Jul 2009, 17:19

Shri KSG has had a hiatus from music for a long time. As a dear friend and a long time colleague, I am happy to say that he has decided to pick up his flute again. His first performance will be in Kerala next month. Welcome back to the music world vidwan Shri KSG. Hopefully you will consider performing in Chennai too.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 19 Jul 2009, 21:11

Errr....

When do they announce it?

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 19 Jul 2009, 21:15

PUNARVASU · Post by **PUNARVASU** » 19 Jul 2009, 21:29

KSG- He is a genius!

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 20 Jul 2009, 02:39

coolkarni wrote:Nick Is getting impatient or worked up about this

I am indeed... Do I get to blush or gloat?

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 20 Jul 2009, 10:17

very heartening to see a Tavil vidwan get the honours.. really a deserving person...

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 20 Jul 2009, 10:19

coolkarni wrote:Anyone here, cares for a great Practitioner called KS Gopalkrishnan ?
Here atleast, if not at the Academy and Chennai Sabha Circles.

defly yes.

however, KSG has taken a personal decision to not perform at madras. If only he reconsiders his stand...

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 20 Jul 2009, 10:24

appu wrote:Shri KSG has had a hiatus from music for a long time. As a dear friend and a long time colleague, I am happy to say that he has decided to pick up his flute again. His first performance will be in Kerala next month. Welcome back to the music world vidwan Shri KSG. Hopefully you will consider performing in Chennai too.

yes, i do hope he considers to perform in madras... iit music club would love to have him perform for us..

Member_First · Post by **Member_First** » 21 Jul 2009, 15:14

B'coz of the coveted support from the CM of Tamil Nadu, Valayapatti gets SK !!

108talas · Post by **108talas** » 21 Jul 2009, 15:47

'gItam nrtyam tathA vAdyaM etat sangItam ucyatE'

Conversely, in the pooja procedures, it says ' gItam samarpayAmi', vADyam samarpAymi', 'nrtyam samarpayAmi', making three segments seperately, individually.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 21 Jul 2009, 16:05

Member_First wrote:B'coz of the coveted support from the CM of Tamil Nadu, Valayapatti gets SK !!

so what if the MA decides to act in favour of the Government. it has in the past acted to the wims and fancies of many organisations and individuals. and for various coveted reasons known to public and otherwise, people have got the SK, some of them much early in their musical carrier or way past their best, and some of them have been totally ignored.

all that apart, i think we should all appreciate the fact that MA has acted in a fashion that is a good jesture to honour an instrument which has not been honoured at all in the past. The nadasvaram-thavil tradition needs to be given the support and solidarity which they jolly well deserve. And if it is decided that a thavil vidwan should be awarded with the SK, then it is but obvious that Sri Subramanian would be the automatic choice. He is probably the most famous of his generation and seniormost amongst those available with us today.

It is my personal opinion that Sri Subramanian is defly a deserving person. Also, it is very heartening to see the Academy thinking out-of-the-box in choosing to honour musicians.