On the Unsuitability of Western Instruments for Music of Any

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 29 Jan 2010, 16:22

$2 is true value compared to between $3000 and $6000 for the continuum. No doubt within ten years there will be someone giving Carnatic music concerts on the Ipad-bebot!

rajesh_rs · Post by **rajesh_rs** » 29 Jan 2010, 20:20

The Bebot is very interesting - a true example of what technology can do when it is made cheap and easily accessible. Thanks, mohan, for sharing this.

Korg and other music instrument manufacturers have also released touch-pad-based instruments capable of being manipulated to produce interesting music:

http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/mu ... ents/a32a/

Oh, and ThinkGeek is an awesome site, btw. kvlt, as we say.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 29 Jan 2010, 20:22

I am waiting for carnatic Theremin

rajesh_rs · Post by **rajesh_rs** » 29 Jan 2010, 20:25

nick H wrote:I am waiting for carnatic Theremin

Wow. This is truly unique. I remember seeing something like it in an MIT Media lab presentation years ago. I hope it comes through soon.

rajesh_rs · Post by **rajesh_rs** » 29 Jan 2010, 20:30

vasanthakokilam wrote:>Haaken Continuum fingerboard was released

yes, it is an interesting instrument. It is not western or eastern, it is modern. Here the instrument gets out of the way for the most part, putting most of responsibility to the artists. In competent hands, I think carnatic music can be played to arbitrary degree of curves and classicism.

Listen to A. R. Rahman here playing th continuum... this is just one aspect of it. It will be good if TNS or Ravikiran take a stab at this instrument.

http://www.cerlsoundgroup.org/Continuum ... ex248.html

Yes, and Rahman did use the Continuum fingerboard in the new Mile Sur Mera Tumhara, didn't he? The song sucked (If I have to be fair) but that doesn't take away from Rahman's tech savvy to adopt a new instrument so quickly. Some would say it is needed given the fast changing nature of his business (film music) but one like Rahman needn't - and yet he has. I think this sort of open mind is also essential to make good music.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 30 Jan 2010, 09:35

Thanks vasanthakokilam for referring to my son. I do not have a iphone and may be i should by one and use this. Looks very interesting. Thanks Mohan for the link.

Also The Continuum Fingerboard is indeed a great instrument and i am waiting for an opportunity for my son to try it out.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 30 Jan 2010, 23:15

tkb: I think Sathya will have fun with it once he gets a hang of the finger movement mapping to the sound contours and curves.

When I try it, it is quite frustrating not to be able to produce the right CM sound, but once in a while I hit the right curve and it sounds right. Accidentally, a particular slide and a shake produced an Ahiri like sound.

It has its issues. The oscilloscope like sound that is common with all these instruments including the Continuum Fingerboard needs to improve. They need to work on the timbre. It can also use a better post-touch sustained sound. Currently it just stops abruptly.

This continuous touch surface is more like a violin but much more sensitive to small variations ( due to the compressed size, iPad may change that and make it more practical ). That gives a competent player complete flexibility for all the gamakam technicalities but it is quite challenging to manage the sound. Basically this means, there is no auto-tuning of any kind with that setting. There are two kinds of auto tuning available if desired. At one extreme, I can set it to the "full snap" mode where it behaves like a keyboard with fixed swaras. There is an in between auto tuning setting which is interesting. It allows for a smooth transition between swaras which you control with the finger movements on the surface but once your finger stops moving it 'snaps' to the closest swarasthanas. This way, kArvai swaras would never be out of tune.

But it is not easy even there. It sounds quite odd if done naively. The speed of movement of the fingers and the path the fingers take affect the curvature of the sound. 1 out of 10 comes out good, others are just plain awful. But that one curve which is closest to CM is qutie satisfying.

tkb, I would not buy an iPhone/iPod touch just for this program. I do not mean to hype it to that extent. If someone has it, then Sathya can borrow and play with it first.

mahesh3 · Post by **mahesh3** » 30 Jan 2010, 23:26

dundubi or harimau, can u please comment on the continuum and the idea of TNS or "capable hands" taking a stab at it....i want to have a laughing fit!

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 31 Jan 2010, 00:35

certainly a cool one for 2 bucks. My daughter (she is 9) is having a ball as I type and seems to be producing good (albeit not carnatic) music in 5 mins. She also changed scale to Cm5 (in exactly 2 mins after she started) and that started producing some nice tunes (this is a rough suddha-dhanyasi equiv and so sounds quite attractive). It would probably taken me much longer to reach this level

Arun

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 31 Jan 2010, 03:03

ok. This is pretty addictive. Once you figure how to make your own scale, and adjust the zoom level - it allows for some pretty experimentation. I added scales for Dorian (ala kharahapriya), mohanam, amrtavarshini. Of course everything sounds mostly "cinematic" but I am sort of able to figure out a couple of gamakas (well poor imitations of them

)

For $2 this is probably the best iPhone/iPod touch app there is. If this comes on the iPad (I am sure it will), it can be even more fun

Arun

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 31 Jan 2010, 07:56

Arun, same here. Try kunthalavarali also. A lot of fun.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 31 Jan 2010, 13:58

Here is my attempt at kunthalavarali on the bebot: http://www.esnips.com/doc/835730fa-eb51 ... halavarali

Though I had the specific song in mind, I do not know that song well enough to play exactly. I treated it as a variation on that song and majority of it is in the vibe of kalpanaswarams.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 01 Feb 2010, 04:29

vk -

- that was fun. I liked your flourishes. It sort of like Bebot was trying very hard to be "disciplined" (i..e carnaticized) but then couldnt contain "himself" because of the joy of "singing" kuntalavarali and just sorts of freaks out here and there! But kuntalavarali - of that there is no doubt !

Now, Here is mine. My Bebot is outraged at people pooh-poohing his bread and butter genre on this forum, and so has decided to create his own genre. He has christened (he says he will uses this term on purpose just to tick of some people

) "CareNotic Music" - meaning he cares not what people think of this genre and his music. He thinks thus all lowly amateurs should be inspired to create music in it.

But it is supposedly a carnatic based genre, since he has called this piece "Rogue A Malika". He claims even people steeped in carnatic purity should be able to make out the 5 Rogueas ( :rolleyes: ). But he says if those people cant, he "cares not" a hoot otherwise he would be violating the genre's first principles.

http://arunk.freepgs.com/tmp/rogueamalika.mp3

PS: There is a 3-4 second silence in the start. I asked him about that, and he said he was silently praying for both forgiveness and inspiration from the "carnatic overlords". Trinity I asked? No they are the Carnatic Lords. I was praying to the "Overlords". I still dont get it.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 01 Feb 2010, 09:49

Thanks Arun. yes Bebot has that irresistible urge to freak out.

I listened to yours. I like them. The second listen was even better. I could not get all the Rogueas. Let us see if others get them. A specific lakshaNam of CareNotic Music is CareNoCareNoCareNotic! The echo! Sounds good. Noticed those special manipulations of Bebot! Quite creative!! Bebot is the main music performer for Uday's ceremony

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 01 Feb 2010, 14:19

Vk: Thanks for the detailed message and i listened to your efforts which is good and so in arunK's. For your information i was not any way going to buy a iphone just for this, may be not in the near future. If i buy i am sure i will get this application for Sathya to try it out and have fun.

Reg Continuum fingerboard, i communicated to its manufacturer to check if they have any test instruments here in our area and he says only Sri AR Rahman has it in India. It costs around USD 5500 and may be if my son gets the oppurtunity to try it & if he feels he is comfortable performing / bringing out the nuances then may be i will try and buy one.

Carnatic / Karnatic music on Keyboard is probably a laughing matter for many but it is also recognised by some and artists are doing their mite to produce the right nuances which is a evolving process. May be some day in the future, people will start appreciating values and give its due status like Mandolin & Saxophone gets today.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 01 Feb 2010, 15:57

Arun interesting sounds. It seems like a very cool app. I could recognize your shades of Amrutavarshini, Hindolam, Hamsadhwani & Abhogi. Wasn't sure about the last rogue!
vk - the kalpana swaras in kuntalavarali were fun - was the song sri mantra kalike (or something like that?)

Can better glides be incorporated so you can play sahAna or kAnada?

Perhaps you guys will be teaching youngsters the bebot for the sustaining sampradaya series of 2030!

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 02 Feb 2010, 00:18

@tkb - any jest was simply at us (more so at myself) and not at serious performers like Satya. Atleast this applies to what is coming from me (and i am sure vk).

@Mohan - As vk says, it is a challenge because of lack of real estate and also probably requires more control than what we can achieve with finger (the latter may be overcome with time). Perhaps a larger screen (like the upcoming iPad) can help a lot. But then also the instrument will suffer from the "digital/artficial like" sound during gamakas - I think the was synthesizers handle pitch variance is probably the reason. I am amazed at what the little thing can do. And just $2 bucks!! Unbelievable! BTW, amratavarshini and Abhogi right. The other 2 not Bebot was thinking. The last one - is rarer in carnatic and more common in film (e.g. ilayaraja)

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 02 Feb 2010, 01:25

>was the song sri mantra kalike (or something like that?)

I do not know that song. I searched for it now, could not find it yet. Bebot was inspired by Bogindra Sayinam.

>Can better glides be incorporated so you can play sahAna or kAnada?

I am in agreement with what Arun wrote. Even the existing controls are hard to control to produce a sound in the ballpark of CM. There is a possibility that you may conclude that some extra controls are needed for the CM aesthetics. Even for Mohanam, I was trying how to go from S to R via G. My naive attempts to coax Bebot to do that is not satisfactory yet. I do not know how to transition from S to G without any trace of R.

Having said that, it produces some nice sounding new gamakams within the Mohanam scale. I do not think people will accept it as part of Mohanam but it still sounds good. Like, a smooth slide up from D to S sounds great to me but different from what we hear in Mohanam.

Bebot supports 4 simultaneous sounds which are controlled through multi-touch of upto 4 fingers. I am not impressed with the 'chord' sounds it makes, there is some oddity to that polyphonic sound.
For example, playing S and G together at more or less the same volume is quite jarring. But then I thought that is what happens with the tanpura sound. To get a similar effect, I have to reduce the volume of Sa quite a bit by sliding the S finger down. The vertical position controls timbre and volume.

Even on the same note, if four fingers are used, the sound produced is quite rich. Then smoothly slide all the four fingers to the next note, it is quite exotic.

On the multi touch, I have been having fun playing around with ragas. I am trying to get a novice level sense of what Ravi Kiran calls melharmony. This little $2.00 program provides some scope for playing around with such ideas. A multi touch continuous frequency surface along with configuring the surface with auto tunable scales and audio effects is quite a powerful combination.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 02 Feb 2010, 12:33

Here is an example of that trippy slide from lower G-P-D-S in the scale of Mohanam I mentioned above: http://www.esnips.com/doc/a2679570-463f ... pWithBeBot

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 02 Feb 2010, 15:43

vk - Those glides are interesting. Can you set the speed in which the glide is executed. On synthesizers this effect is portamento and there is usually an accompanying portamento time control.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 03 Feb 2010, 00:08

Mohan: I do not see any parameters to control the timing. But there are two things that affect the sound of the slide.

- In the autotune mode, there is a "fast", "slow" option. This refers to how quickly it autotunes to the nearest note when the finger stops moving. "slow" seems to work better for me

- The speed with which you move the finger affects the curvature of the slide. You can move as fast or as slow as you want but the moment you stop moving, it can autotune to the target note. ( closest note ). Of course, the autotune can be turned off in which case you are completely on your own as to where the target note is.

With multi-touch polyphony and those trippy glides, it is easy to make sounds that can be appropriately called 'Ghosti gAnam'

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 03 Feb 2010, 01:07

VK
You had me weeping with that 'plAkkaNaM' mohanam tune

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 03 Feb 2010, 09:10

Here is another - required a lot of effort + many takes + lot of editing (i.e. took snippets from different takes and stitched) + some "effects" (with garageband). This one should show what type of gamakas are possible if you put in the time and effort

- actually it just like learning an instrument. One cannot expect to play complex tunes in a day of casual fiddling around unless one already knows to play instruments. I cannot play melodies on instruments well (i can do guitar chords - that is different). i think Uday would do very well with this - particularly that he knows how to play the chitravina which follows the same concept)

http://arunk.freepgs.com/tmp/bebot2.mp3

I hope the raga and the song being attempted is clear.

Arun

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 03 Feb 2010, 11:27

pretty good Arun. I guess valaji though the song escapes me..
Yes Uday may do a fine job..

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 03 Feb 2010, 11:32

CML, I do not hear Valaji but I hear its graha bedam cousin. I will leave it at that now. It is quite intriguing that you actually heard Valaji there though I can see that if you latched on to a different shadjam than the one I did.

Good job Arun. You have teased out the raga.

Just this evening, I coaxed bebot to sing a little bit of Sahana, in his own odd Shehnaish sound.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 03 Feb 2010, 12:14

VK
I can understand your hearing Abogi but to me valaji comes stronger. Let us hear from Arun...
Let me hear your sahana..

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 03 Feb 2010, 14:28

Arun I can make out the opening lines of the Abhogi varnam clearly. The curves are sound pretty good! I particularly liked the gamaka on the Dha and Ga.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 03 Feb 2010, 23:05

thanks vk, cml and mohan.

cml - as mohan guessed, it is indeed the pallavi of the AbhOgi varnam 'evari bOdhanavini'. I cannot explain why valaji is more apparent to you. ... [deleted text which was based on wrong assumption that valaji is obtained from abhogi on graha-bedham on Ri - it is not - see srikant's post below]

Arun

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 04 Feb 2010, 02:28

...apparently it is the mystique of grahabhedam. Again valaji is one of my favourite raga and I latch on to any valaji sounding phrase. Of course I am getting abhogi definitely. The gamakam's are indeed good; does sound CM...

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 04 Feb 2010, 05:52

arunk,

The dha of abhogi is followed by a sa, which is dha + 3 semitones. The pa of valaji is followed by dha, which is pa + 2 semitones. So how could the dha of abhogi become pa of valaji?

I suppose the dha of abhogi will become the ga of valaji. To get valaji from abhogi, you should make abhogi's ma your new sa, which is kind of like madhyama shruti valaji.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 04 Feb 2010, 06:03

srikant - you are right. I goofed up awfully while transposing - should have tried it on paper - i was sort of doing it in mind, and also for some reason thought R1 of the cakravaham mela was in play - a swara which is not even there in valaji

Arun

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 04 Feb 2010, 06:17

But since arunk has a shrut background, abhogi is obvious.

The sound in the abhogi isn't unlike a gottu vadyam's.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 07 Feb 2010, 04:54

while the world has moved on arunk is still fiddling with a robot.

Here is the next "bolder" attempt: http://arunk.freepgs.com/tmp/bebot3.mp3 - i dont know if (a) i captured what I wanted to play effectively (b) whether it is a reasonable representation of the raga (this is my own "tune" if you could call it - i mean it is not a set piece unless I subconsciously ended up picking one

). And this one has very minimal "editing" of the tune - i mean i got the melody in one cut (almost).

Now, once you listen to that, lend me ears for this one (with preferably a good set of headphones with good dynamic range). It has the EXACT same tune as first but now the "background" is different (and it has some effects in line with the kind of music it aims at).

I originally wanted to blend a "non tampura" drone for the first one, and as I was playing around, I stumbled into this idea (although this isn't a new idea - there are at least 2 pioneers in this type of stuff - Madras String Quartette and Anil Srinivasan - mine is a humble ultra-amateurish attempt). Judge this piece not as "is this bringing out the *correct* mood of the raga - i.e. is it doing justice to the raga as how I am used to hearing it". Instead ask "how does the piece sound overall - is it good, does it bring in other hues/mood?" I think this opened my eyes into how many new dimensions there are to carnatic melodies.

http://arunk.freepgs.com/tmp/bebot3_2.mp3

Thanks
Arun

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 07 Feb 2010, 07:58

Fantastic Arun. Both of them sound great. They have their own individual aesthetic.

The second one definitely provides for a different color of the overall sound and it is enjoyable. It does have that Madras Quarter vibe.

You have gotten better at handling bebot. You have set the bar high now. I am trying my hand at sahana and I am not quite satisfied. Next to your high bar with Ananda bhairavi, that is not going to look good

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 07 Feb 2010, 08:20

WOW Arun! Congratulations. You are graduating to introduce a new instrument in CM (beware of hrimau

Is it indeed a chord since it changes over time?
The gamakams are very well done. The problem is the sharp assault of the notes which is jarring especially the very high ones. Are you at 1 kaTTai?
Reminds me of the whistling attempts in CM (somewhere there is a full concert).
AB is good! Now try your favourite RitigauLai...
(I had d/l problem with IE (which got only the first 5 seconds) and I then used firefox to get the full audio. I wonder why?)
I love the first but the second is more exotic and sounded like a chord accompanying.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 07 Feb 2010, 09:51

Hard to believe a $2 device on a phone can do that - top effort Arun! Keyboard synthesizers that can do glides start at $1000! As you have mentioned once the Ipad is available it will become easier with a bit more space to play with.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 07 Feb 2010, 14:36

My PC sound system is, sadly, currently introducing a machine-gun stutter effect into music from certain software/source, so I cannot enjoy. Some new hardware will be along in two or three weeks. Keep up the good (and interesting) work, Arun

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 07 Feb 2010, 21:06

arunk - Superb effort. Congrats and looking forward to more fro you on this great device.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 07 Feb 2010, 21:30

Thanks vk, cml, mohan and tkb.

@vk - At present, I find that because of being new to it, and the difficulty in precise control with finger AND limited real estate, it is best suited for very slow tempo (so alapana, and even there not too many short transitions). So ragas that are amenable that like (like Anadabhairavi, sahana) may be easier to pull off. Keep plugging away with the Sahana you will get it

@cm - Yes the background is chords - but this is not because it is changing in time. A chord is an element of harmony, which simply means multiple (different) notes at the same time. So even technically tampura is a chord - even though the notes are struck at different times - because of its beautiful sustain and richness of harmonics. You could call it a "5th chord" (as in C5 if C i.e. 1 kattai is base) - as C5 has the tonic and the fifth (i.e. sa and pa). In my case here, I start out with something like C5, but then move to different chords. And yes the base here is 1-kattai. I agree that the sound does get harsh at parts - this is primarily because - the instrument here as an "abrupt attack" (i.e. start of a note). But it is also high in pitch (like flute) and the sound needs better balancing (the "sound engineering" itself is a big profession). Basically it sounds better balanced on very good headphones. But for ones with lesser dynamic range, the higher frequencies dominate and since here the melody is strong in high pitch, it becomes harsh. Atleast this is my half baked theory. Also, I liked your word "exotic" as I find it most apt

.

@mohan - Agreed. I am still amazed it is only $2 bucks! It still doesnt do "decay" well (except for the whistle like I used here - which can be coaxed to a decay). The nice I think about this (and the continuum) is that you have "timbre" control and I think that allows some of gamakas to not sound "too artificial". But even here I find "descent" (say sndp in one note) is not good and can quickly sound contrived. I would think the iPad version would be more expensive but once i convince myself that iPad is necessary (ha-ha!), it would be an easier jump to say "i need bebot on it" (even if it say $50!!)

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 07 Feb 2010, 21:38

(I may be roasted for this

)

but when I compare the two, I find that in CM, once we select a raga, we also select ONE mood . And exactly as Uday mentioned earlier somewhere (in this thread?), we look to savor every detail of it. So for ONE tune in ONE raga, we identify with one generic feel, one mood. There maybe exceptions (we have ragas that have multiple moods in different songs, and the lyrics can force the mood too), but in general you have a certain expectation of the feel you get from say Anandabhairavi.

What chords can do is change that singularity of the mood (within the context of the chosen raga) that and offer potentially more exotic flavors (the one above adds a more dare I say eerie flavor in certain parts). Of course one can certainly (validly) argue that it immediately then ceases to be "CM Anandabharavi" i.e. classical carnatic music, and I would only agree. I think this because, even though we associate most if not all of the mood/color of the raga to the melody itself and its gamakas, it is just one component in the realm of possibilities. By making the drone sound flexible, we can add other hues. In that context, it seems it adds more variety, more spice, more flavor

(of course not everyone like all spices !!)

In any case, I am more amazed at what an ocean the world of sound and music is.

Arun

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 07 Feb 2010, 21:58

VK
now it is your turn ...awaiting the sahana.. don't worry even if it is half baked...

Uday
Where are you? Your technical comments are awaited..

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 07 Feb 2010, 23:26

This is effort of my son performing Ranjani Raaga on keyboard file 1 with just the thambura tone of a new instrument and the file 2 during a private performance.

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=eb18 ... 4a0a3d7385

This is surely not a promotional effort and any comments / suggestions are always welcome.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Feb 2010, 00:08

Just listening. The aalaapana is done elegantly in the lower octaves. But when the taara is reached the oooShing sound (like that of the spaceship) is quite jarring. Also it will be better if the 'attack' of the notes can be muffled. The 'new instrument' shruti does not blend at times. The harmonics have to be adjusted. It is just divine once he starts the kriti. The glides are effortless and elegant. The absence of the violin does not hurt at all. It must be possible to build an electronic filter to correct the problems that I have identified. At least the hurting supersonics can be filtered. There was only one file in the u/l. What do you mean by file1 and file2 ?

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 08 Feb 2010, 02:15

i loved it. excellently done. The known "problem" how the synthesis of wide pitch slides is something that (our cm trained) ears perceive is "not natural" (as in different from say doing the same on a real violin/veena/flute) is there - but that is something technology has to overcome. I thought Satya's control of those various pitch glides (small and wide) is impeccable - and so the artist is bringing out the best out of the instrument - i would think more than what many cm rasikas think is possible with keyboard (but that is because of prejudice

). I also think many perhaps do not realize that there is precise control that needs to executed by the player to achieve this - not unlike what is required from real instruments (and thus to play keyboard to this level is no trivial matter). I felt the piece portrays the sombre mood of ranjani quite easily.

I am in agreement with cml in that the instrument has perhaps too wide a variation in "timbre" between the various stayis. The madhya stayi sounds nice and melodious like a string instrument (say veena, deep acoustic guitar). Mandra stayi sounds a tad too "deep and strong" even compared to madhya stayi - but I am a sucker for bass and so I like it

. As cml mentions, the tara (and higher) is where the timbre morphs in an unfavorable way and thus gets too thin and squealy. This does not gell with say what cm music is used to in one instrument i.e. our instruments do not have this much variation in timbre between stayis (although timbre does vary for them in a subtle way I think). And this is where keyboards as a whole needs to get better (i.e. try to do slides in a way that matches real instruments better). I think it is only a matter of time before the gap is bridged.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 08 Feb 2010, 02:54

Excellently done by Sathya. Great control of those slides CMl and Arun provided the anaysis and feedback which I also agree for the most part. I relate to what CML says about the 'oooShing sound' in the higher sthayi but I sensed that only in couple of places. As Arun says, there is a difference in the overall sound, timbre, in the various sthayis but the raga bhava predominates pushing such issues to the background for me. I am with CML that a violin accompaniment is not missed and in fact I like it better without the violin. Violin can augment the keyboard if it is played strictly in the gaps rather than over the keyboard sound.

Arun, with Bebot, since we have some control over the timbre by the vertical positioning of the finger, I wonder if some of these sthayi differences in timbre can be adjusted. It is easier said that done since that vertical difference is quite sensitive and it is easy to mess it up further.

Anyway, excellent job by Sathya.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 08 Feb 2010, 05:34

VK now it is your turn ...awaiting the sahana.. don't worry even if it is half baked...

Here are three different half-baked dabblings on Sahana on Bebot. As before, my Bebot playing has a Shehnai HM bANi to it. ( a couple of non-sahana'ish phrases had slipped in... sorry )

1. http://www.esnips.com/doc/09a5bb3c-a1a6 ... hanaBebot1

2. http://www.esnips.com/doc/e63f625a-d212 ... hanaBeBot2

3. http://www.esnips.com/doc/ea6851f0-35cc ... hanaBebot3

They are in different instrument sounds but otherwise they are all on the same theme. I am stuck in that aspect of sahana. I need to listen to more sahana for further inspirations.
I got a bit more adventurous on the third one.

CML, those annoying 'key' attack sounds are not avoidable.

I know there is something special about Ni and in general in that third quadrant but I do not know them well. Even the second quadrant, the highly prevalent P M G M R S, there is a variation with P M G M R G R S which I did not exploit...

After I did this, I listened to NSG's sahana... His short alapana itself had many more hues which are so sweet. Long way to go to do something like that.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Feb 2010, 06:13

Well done VK! It is sahana unquestionably. The second was better than the first and the third was simply super. The long notes are very sweet with the gamakam drawl and even the attack is not noticeable and yes very much like the shenai. Your taara sanchaaram also is quite good. I was watching a 'jallykaTTu' program today; you have contrlolled expertly the rambunctious beast Bebot! You are getting locked on to just a few phrases. You need to expand your repertoire and then the instrument will obey. Keep it up...

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 08 Feb 2010, 07:39

thanks cml, arunk & VK for the time spared to listen and also give your feedback.

I shall talk to my son and revert in the evening. Reg the files pls note i have two set of files in this folder 1. with just Ranjani raaga, thanam and a krithi http://www.mediafire.com/?azjn1dmmi2m

and 2. with enhancement team performing in a private function.
http://www.mediafire.com/?dgndvgm2ynd

The former is one i recorded at home.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 08 Feb 2010, 14:02

tkb... I'm confused... is this played on the continuum instrument?

I can play mp3 (just not quicktime) on my ailing PC, and I'm listening to file 1 just now: it is excellent

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 08 Feb 2010, 20:26

nick h - Well i would have loved to have my son play continuum but not within our reach as of now. In fact trying with the manufacturer to put in a word to ARR as he is the only person to our knowledge in India having the instrument. This is performed on a KORG X 50 instrument.

CML - I understand from my son that he is surely working on all the aspects you have mentioned and may be god's grace he should be in a position to get things to the satisfaction of many in teh near future.

CML, VK, arun k nick h - my son expressed his sincere thanks for having spent yor valuable time on his tracks.