Concert by Smt Bombay Jaishsri and party in Los Angeles on

[veeyens3]

Smt Bombay Jaishri and party consisting of Sri Bhaska r on violin, Sri. Manoj Siva on mridangam and young Anirudh Atreya on Kanjeera gave a delightful Carnatic Music concert on June 13 2010 in Los Angeles U.S.A

The song list included the following:
Jaya Janaki in Nattai
Intha Sowkya in Kapi
Sogasu jooda tharama in Kannada Gowla
\Shyama Sundaranga in Danyasi
Karuna Nidhi Thaye in Bowli
Bajare Chitta in Kalyani (Main piece)
Marugelara in Jayantasri
R.T.P in an interesting multi raga format with alapana , thanam and pallavi restricted to Sama and Karnaranjani and swaram in Hindolam, Brindavana Saranga, Ananda Bairavi, Vaasanthi and Parameswari.
The post R.T.P. Session consisted of
Gopala Gokula Vallabi a Tulasidas Bajan, Chinnam Siru Kiliye ( Mahakavi, is the spelling correct?) Desh Tillana and Mangalam

One thing I noticed was the vocalist was :meeting” ( I confess my ignorance of the correct english technical word to describe the action) the Tambor herself while singing, which I have not seen in my lo...ng listening experience done by any C.M artist except for one solitary occasion backin40 s when the one and only inimitable Smt. M.S.S did so for a benefit concert for collecting funds for Smt. Kasturba Ghandhi Memorial with a record collection amounting to more than ten thousand rupees , a very high amount in those days

In keeping with the adage that a guest should depart when the host is expecting him to stay for some more time, a diner should get up when feeling that couple of more mouthful will be in order, the artist concluded her recital in just under three hours when the rasikas were expecting few more songs

Although I am not an Aurangazeb and at the same time not “kalki” krishnamoorthy, who was contributing reviews for Ananda Vikatan under pen name Karnatakam ,the gentle S.V.K, the acerbic Subbudu, or N.M.N whose reviews looked more like composition excercises of high school englsh students, either, I am leaving critical analysis and comments to more knowledgeable rasikas of Los Angeles, except to say that the concert created a feeling of watching a well polished five faced “Kuttu Vilaku” with unflickering light.

May Sri Rama bless the artists as well as all of us

[rshankar]

Sri VNS, thank you for your review and your very precise (a precis, if you will) analysis of the concert.
Smt. Jayashree has 'plucked' the tAnpura herself on many occasions...

[thenpaanan]

Smt Bombay Jaishri and party consisting of Sri Bhaska r on violin, Sri. Manoj Siva on mridangam and young Anirudh Atreya on Kanjeera gave a delightful Carnatic Music concert on June 13 2010 in Los Angeles U.S.A

...
One thing I noticed was the vocalist was :meeting” ( I confess my ignorance of the correct english technical word to describe the action) the Tambor herself while singing, which I have not seen in my lo...ng listening experience done by any C.M artist except for one solitary occasion backin40 s when the one and only inimitable Smt. M.S.S did so for a benefit concert for collecting funds for Smt. Kasturba Ghandhi Memorial with a record collection amounting to more than ten thousand rupees , a very high amount in those days
...

May Sri Rama bless the artists as well as all of us

*meetting* = "Strumming" a tambura?

Indeed it requires a lot of discipline and practice to sing and strum at the same time while on stage. It is especially impressive if Smt Jayashree was able to do neravals and kalpanaswarams at all speeds while keeping a steady beat on the tambura. I have personally never seen a CMusician do this on stage (some HMusicians strum tanpura themselves in their concerts).

Does anyone recall whether this was a north Indian tambura or a south Indian one? The reason I ask is once when I tried to do this myself in a small get-together I found that the north Indian tambura was so loud that I could not hear myself sing (says more about my lack of singing ability) and when I got to singing kalpanaswarams I lost it altogether (I was both strumming the tambura too fast and losing my tALam at the same time ) and had to ask someone else to take over the tambura.

-Then Paanan

[mahakavi]

>> Mahakavi, is the spelling correct?) <<
veeyens3:
I am flattered. You are a venerable and veritable expert. What can I say?
Since you asked, let me say it should be written as "sinnanj ciRu kiLiyE"

In Thamizh we cannot start a word (phonetically speaking) with "ca" (instead of "sa") unless the previous word calls for it. In this case "sinnanj" is the first word with "si" sound at the beginning but the second word has to be "ciRu" instead of "siRu" because there is a mellinam consonant at the end of the first word.

[veeyens3]

re#3, I can only say it was quite thin or slim and the artist carried it as a shoulder bag During neraval, swaraprastharam etc. she was strumming it . I thought that strumming is a term used with guitar Thanks mahakavi fo the tips re. correct pronounciation and spelling of anglisized tamil words

[kssr]

>> Mahakavi, is the spelling correct?) <<
veeyens3:
I am flattered. You are a venerable and veritable expert. What can I say?
Since you asked, let me say it should be written as "sinnanj ciRu kiLiyE"

In Thamizh we cannot start a word (phonetically speaking) with "ca" (instead of "sa") unless the previous word calls for it. In this case "sinnanj" is the first word with "si" sound at the beginning but the second word has to be "ciRu" instead of "siRu" because there is a mellinam consonant at the end of the first word.

I think it is strictly "sinnam siru kiliye". But due the "punarchi vidhis" in Tamil -(roughly to be translated as the rules of conjunction of two words)- it becomes "sinnanj". Mahaakaviaar to correct, if wrong

[mahakavi]

kssr:
I don't think it is "sinnam". sinnam is a noun ( meanings: sign, trumpet, broken piece--recall sinnA binnamAga muRindadu--, loose flowers, a peice of metal etc.).
Here Bharathi is talking about KaNNammA as a kuzhandai (child) and calls her "kiLiyE" (Oh, parrot!). What kind of kiLi? siRu kiLi (tiny parrot). How tiny? sinnanj ciRu kiLi (small tiny parrot). Two adjectives for the noun parrot. It is doubly emphatic.
So the first word is actually "sinna" (small)---an adjective. Now comes your conjunction. sinna + siRu ------> sinnanjciRu
The "nj" is an addition (called tOnRal vikAram in Thamizh). It is like kaDai + teru ----> kaDaitteru (the extra "t" is tOnRal)
By itself we have to write "siRu" with the soft "s" sound. Now because of the extra "nj" in "sinnanj", the soft sound of "siRu" will get a hard sound "c" so that it has to be written as "ciRu" when preceded by "sinnanj". It does not matter whether they are written as two separate words as "sinnanj ciRu" as Bharathi wrote in the song or as a combination as in "sinnanjciRu"

[keerthi]

...


Indeed it requires a lot of discipline and practice to sing and strum at the same time while on stage. It is especially impressive if Smt Jayashree was able to do neravals and kalpanaswarams at all speeds while keeping a steady beat on the tambura. I have personally never seen a CMusician do this on stage (some HMusicians strum tanpura themselves in their concerts).

-Then Paanan

I have seen Sriramprasad, of the MallAdi Brothers, strum the drone, himself; as the duo sing. It is part of the culture of the Dr. pAni school of music, to practise singing while playing the tambUra oneself.

http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/fr/2 ... 380300.htm

I have seen photographs of volETi and GNB strumming [tuning actually,] the tanpura, themselves before radio broadcasts.

Most of the older musicians did it themselves. MahAvaidyanAtha Sivan and rAmaswami shivan, Bangalore nAgaratnammAL strummed their own tambUra-s.


I remember reading a sarcastic comment in the journal Shruti, where a reviewer lamented the disappearance of the 'real' tambUra, except when the artistes pose for the photo that goes on the sleeve of a cassette, wielding a tamburA and a blissful/ rapturous look on the face.

The reviewer looked forward to the day when more appropriately, artiste would hold on to the electronic tambura, and pose for cover photos, with the same devout expressions!

[harimau]

You can count on native Tamils to consistently mispronounce their own language!

You hear all those extolling Tamil by saying "Tamil mozhiyin sirappezhutthu zha" but not getting the "zha" sound correct. Malayalis on the other hand do not claim "zha" is exclusive to Malayalam but pronounce it right.

Tamil also has three different N sounds, and people carefully write "Narayanan" with different letters for all three; however, it is only the Malayalis who can pronounce the first and the last "N" differently though in writing they use the same letter for both.

Thus, it is necessary to ignore Tamils (the people) and their stupidity and look to Malayalam if you want to know the correct pronunciation of a Tamil word.

"Chinnam Chiru Kiliye" is how it will be written in Malayalam.

You can listen to 1940s and 1950s movie songs and the letter "ch" will be correctly pronounced in those songs .

By the 1970s, "ch" became "s' in movies and now in fact it has even become 'sss'! Listen to Unnikrishnan singing any film song; he has to pronounce the words the way the film-maker wants, not the way he was brought up to pronounce. I guess even he would mangle "Chinnam Chiru Kiliye".

People of Tanjore district should be prevented from passing opinions on Tamil pronunciation! After all, these are the folks who used to go around saying "emblathu" for "embathu" (the number 80), claiming they were doing it to differentiate it from "ambathu" (50). :devil:

[mahakavi]

>>People of Tanjore district should be prevented from passing opinions on Tamil pronunciation! After all, these are the folks who used to go around saying "emblathu" for "embathu" (the number 80), claiming they were doing it to differentiate it from "ambathu" (50). <<

harimau:
You are sweeping all ThanjAvUrians with one brush. Not everybody said
"embLadu". I am a ThanjAvUrian by nativity and I never pronounced it that way. By the way it is not "embathu" for 80 but "eNbadu"
OK, can I please have my license to pass opinions on Thamizh pronunciation? ;(

[kssr]

kssr:
I don't think it is "sinnam". sinnam is a noun ( meanings: sign, trumpet, broken piece--recall sinnA binnamAga muRindadu--, loose flowers, a peice of metal etc.).
Here Bharathi is talking about KaNNammA as a kuzhandai (child) and calls her "kiLiyE" (Oh, parrot!). What kind of kiLi? siRu kiLi (tiny parrot). How tiny? sinnanj ciRu kiLi (small tiny parrot). Two adjectives for the noun parrot. It is doubly emphatic.
So the first word is actually "sinna" (small)---an adjective. Now comes your conjunction. sinna + siRu ------> sinnanjciRu
The "nj" is an addition (called tOnRal vikAram in Thamizh). It is like kaDai + teru ----> kaDaitteru (the extra "t" is tOnRal)
By itself we have to write "siRu" with the soft "s" sound. Now because of the extra "nj" in "sinnanj", the soft sound of "siRu" will get a hard sound "c" so that it has to be written as "ciRu" when preceded by "sinnanj". It does not matter whether they are written as two separate words as "sinnanj ciRu" as Bharathi wrote in the song or as a combination as in "sinnanjciRu"

I get it. Thanks. Lost touch with the language for a long time, except for the spoken variety. But still very much relish it.

Now coming to the pronunciation, there is only one 'si' (ich + ee) in Tamil as far as I know. I wonder if there are pronunciation rules laid down in grammer. I guess not. We pronounce in a context sensitive way with enormous individual variations. I have a friend whose official name is 'Chandrasegaran' with a g. Needless to say, he is a tamilian.

[kssr]

Tamil also has three different N sounds, and people carefully write "Narayanan" with different letters for all three; however, it is only the Malayalis who can pronounce the first and the last "N" differently though in writing they use the same letter for both.

I never knew that the two Ns at the beginning and end of Narayanan are to be pronounced differently. 2 suzhi and 3 suzhi 'na' are the only two available pronunciations. The 2 suzhi when it comes at the beginning of the word is the other 'na' in writing. I think it is called thannaharam. To have two 'na's with the same pronunciation is of course an overkill for a language which does not distinguish between ka and ga. But that is part of the language.

Thus, it is necessary to ignore Tamils (the people) and their stupidity and look to Malayalam if you want to know the correct pronunciation of a Tamil word.
Any how "tenkqqqew verry much" - as in malayaalLam!!

[mahakavi]

>>Now coming to the pronunciation, there is only one 'si' (ich + ee) in Tamil as far as I know. I wonder if there are pronunciation rules laid down in grammer. I guess not. We pronounce in a context sensitive way with enormous individual variations. I have a friend whose official name is 'Chandrasegaran' with a g. Needless to say, he is a tamilian.<<

kssr:
Yes, there are phonetic rules in Thamizh grammar. There are what are known as "vallOsai" (hard sound), and 'mellOsai" (soft sound). This is not the place to go into grammatical phonetics. The letter "sa" in Thamizh stands for both "sa" and "ca" or "cha".
Consider the following words:
சங்கிலி The sa here is a soft sound (mellOsai)---sangili. When the letter "sa" occurs at the beginning of a word it gets the soft sound. But if the previous word imposes another rule as in "sinnanj ciRu", then the beginning letter of the second word gets the hard sound.
பச்சை The same letter is used as before but the sound will be vallOsai (hard sound). --paccai or pachchai. In this case the hard sound occurs at the middle of the word . When the hard sound occurs at the middle then the end letter has to be "cai" and not "sai". The consonant doubles here and hence both get the hard sound.
முயற்சி Here the letter "si" gets the hard sound because it follows the vallinam consonant "R". We cannot pronounce it as "muyaRsi" but as "muyaRci"

The rules are elaborate.

As for chandrasEgaran, it is an import from Sanskrit. So you pronounce it the way it is done in Sanskrit. Some people pronounce it as sandrasEgaran. Being a Thamizhan (mother tongue Thamizh) does not mean he will have a pure Thamizh name. Most brahmins and some others will have such Sanskrit names. Sendil is a Thamizh name and it is pronounced with the soft sound. The name of the place on the seashore is "sendUr" (soft) but when you add the prefix "tiru" then it becomes "tiruccendUr"

[rshankar]

As for chandrasEgaran, it is an import from Sanskrit. So you pronounce it the way it is done in Sanskrit.

In sanskrit, it should be candrasEkharan and not chandrasEgaran - I think KSSR was pointing out the fact that being a tamizhan, he and his folks had confused the kh and g sounds.
People born in Pondy are/were particularly susceptible to this, because the French official that registered births wrote out the names as pronounced - so, batamanabhans, mogans, segars etc were very common.

[mahakavi]

I know it is candrasEkharan (moon on the head) in Sanskrit. I wrote it as chandrasEgaran because in Thamizh phonetics you pronounce it as as soft sound "g" (instead of "kh" or even "k") in the middle of a word. That is why Thamizh people will call out "candrasEgarA". I was emphasizing the beginning part as "candra" even though in Thamizh we don't pronounce it as such because we cannot start a word with "c" or "ch".

Likewise, unless it is preceded by another k, the kh by itself will be pronounced only as "g'. That was the second point I made.

[veeyens3]

As a Tanjorian, I file my formal protest to the insinuation in #9 lest I lose my chance to contest later on by default

[sridhar_ranga]

We had a fairly long discussion on Tamil sounds ca,sa,Sa, sha here: http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=9574

[kssr]

We had a fairly long discussion on Tamil sounds ca,sa,Sa, sha here: http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=9574

I went and tried.
Appa! thalai suthuddu or is it chutthudu or.. well, I just give up here .

[mahakavi]

>>Now coming to the pronunciation, there is only one 'si' (ich + ee) in Tamil as far as I know. I wonder if there are pronunciation rules laid down in grammer. I guess not. We pronounce in a context sensitive way with enormous individual variations. I have a friend whose official name is 'Chandrasegaran' with a g. Needless to say, he is a tamilian.<<

kssr:
There is a difference here. The consonants in Thamizh go as "ik", "ich", "iT" etc. The "ich" cannot be pronounced as "is". But when combined with vowels it can take either as sa,sA,si,sI, su, sU..... or ca,cA,ci, cI,cu etc. That depends on the context. Phonetics will come into place as governed by grammar. As I wrote earlier it will be the soft sound at the beginning of the word (unless qualified by the previous word). It will be the hard sound if it occurs in the middle of the word.
Examples: sinna (small), sembu (copper), siluvai (cross), siRuvan (child/boy) etc.
tiruccendUr (the seashore town), paccai (green), accu piccu (moron) etc.

[1920veeyens]

With all dsicussion going on as how to write tamil words in english alphaets, I wish to record an incident which happenned in 1932 or33. We were living in Sanskrit ollege St (next to Sanskrit College, off Royapettah High Road., MylaporeThere was one gentleman named Srisailam living in our house One day he got a post card (at that time costing half anna) from his mother from Udumalpet, near Coimatur, with rhe following address in tamil. As I do not know how to include tamil in the message, I am giving similar sounding english words It said "sadrs kali sirselam melapur' Probably the letter was delivered to the correct addresse because te postman Tiruvengadam knew everybody in the locality very intimately. But how the other postal people involved such as Rms,s, sorters etc routed it correctly is still a mystery to me even after eighty years

[mahakavi]

>>sadrs kali sirselam melapur' <<
1920veeyens:
Did it look like this: சதரஸ் கலி ஸ்ரீசேலம் மேலாப்பூர் or something close?
As for the postal department alll over there is no telling when they will produce a miracle. I once got a letter (when I was living in Kansas city) sent from India (an aerogram) addressed to a person with my name but he was located in some street (with a specific address) in SingappUr with a zip code 64128. The letter was delivered to me at my mailbox within a week of its posting in Madras. Except for the name and zip code every other detail was different. The letter came to the US somehow (because it was an air letter?) and then came to Kansas city (zip code 64128) and since my name matched, the postal department sent it to me. So the name and the zip code were enough for a letter to reach me from Madras to Kansas city.

[kssr]

>>Now coming to the pronunciation, there is only one 'si' (ich + ee) in Tamil as far as I know. I wonder if there are pronunciation rules laid down in grammer. I guess not. We pronounce in a context sensitive way with enormous individual variations.<<

kssr:
There is a difference here. The consonants in Thamizh go as "ik", "ich", "iT" etc. The "ich" cannot be pronounced as "is". But when combined with vowels it can take either as sa,sA,si,sI, su, sU..... or ca,cA,ci, cI,cu etc. That depends on the context. Phonetics will come into place as governed by grammar. As I wrote earlier it will be the soft sound at the beginning of the word (unless qualified by the previous word). It will be the hard sound if it occurs in the middle of the word.
Yes. I get your explanation. But I think the hard and soft "ich" pronunciation alone will not explain all situations. Also, even the beginning and end explanation may not always be true.

Examples: sinna (small), sembu (copper), siluvai (cross), siRuvan (child/boy) etc. What about 'Chandiran' (moon)? needs the hard ich.
tiruccendUr (the seashore town), paccai (green), accu piccu (moron) etc. What about pasumai? needs a soft ich

There may be explanations and grammer points to clarify these issues. But fundamentally, we are trying to use ich in place of SEVEN different alphabets in the devnagri script.
cha- Chandrachuda siva sankara parvati
chha- (second cha)- pacchai, etc., as you have indicated.
ja- jaangri- we have to satisfy ourselves with saangri-of course not a tamil word
jha- jhankaara sruti seykiraai. Another letter introduced (looks similar to the tamil 'ai')
sa- as in sankara, sirappu (greatness), silambu, etc., This is different from chappati, chillarai which is first item above.
sha- usha-we have added a temporary alphabet here. Alternatively we can twist the word itself like Vidam for visham(poison)
sa as in saraswathi. We have once again added an alphabet to cover this.How to write vaasanai (smell).
If the language has survived for thousands of years with this limitation, it will continue to survive. When english manages its phonetics with just 26 letters, we can take comfort in that Tamil is slightly better off!!

[veeyens3]

Re# 21. You are exact. How did you manage to read what was in my mind. This shows that all these external attributes are only means to an end and not an end by themselves

[mahakavi]

kssr:

Examples: sinna (small), sembu (copper), siluvai (cross), siRuvan (child/boy) etc. What about 'Chandiran' (moon)? needs the hard ich.
tiruccendUr (the seashore town), paccai (green), accu piccu (moron) etc. What about pasumai? needs a soft ich[/quote]

There may be explanations and grammer points to clarify these issues. But fundamentally, we are trying to use ich in place of SEVEN different alphabets in the devnagri script.
cha- Chandrachuda siva sankara parvati
chha- (second cha)- pacchai, etc., as you have indicated.
ja- jaangri- we have to satisfy ourselves with saangri-of course not a tamil word
jha- jhankaara sruti seykiraai. Another letter introduced (looks similar to the tamil 'ai')
sa- as in sankara, sirappu (greatness), silambu, etc., This is different from chappati, chillarai which is first item above.
sha- usha-we have added a temporary alphabet here. Alternatively we can twist the word itself like Vidam for visham(poison)
sa as in saraswathi. We have once again added an alphabet to cover this.How to write vaasanai (smell).
If the language has survived for thousands of years with this limitation, it will continue to survive. When english manages its phonetics with just 26 letters, we can take comfort in that Tamil is slightly better off!![/quote]


Kssr:
Perhaps we should stop this discussion here lest we irritate other forumites.
But briefly:
1. Candran is an import. It needs a hard "ich'--agreed. If you don't mind i would use "nilavu". Remember, but for the Brahmins, Candran would not have entered the Thamizh lexicon.
2. yes, pasumai, pasi, rusi, pusi----in all these cases the soft "s" sound is the norm because the previous letter does not impose the requirement I mentioned about 'muyaRci' or the need for doubling the consonants 'ich' and "cha" as in paccai.

No, there is no need to use "ich" in 7 different places. The letter 'sa' has to be adjusted in sound only in two cases "sa" and "ca". As for "cha" (the second cha in Sanskrit) we double the consonant in Thamizh as in "pacchai'. chappAtti and possibly cillaRai are imports too. For cillaraRai we would pronounce it as sillaRai according to the rule.
As for "ja" sound Thamizh invented (?) the grantic alphabet which consists of: ja, sha, ha, ksha, and a couple of others. Without the "ja" , yes we would have called it sAngiri. So what? It is an imported word. If we import it we can modify it to our taste (pardon the pun).

vAsanai (an import modified from vAsana) does not violate our phonetics rule because (as in pasumai) the previous letter does not require the hard sound for "sa". Where required there are alternatives. maNam, naRumaNam are original Thamizh words.

The AzhwArs modified the letters when using Ramayanam words: rAman ----> irAman, irAvaNan for rAvaNan (you can't start a Thamizh word with "r"). vIDaNan for vibhIshaNan, ilakkuvan for lakshmaNa, anuman for hanumAn, and a few others.
iLangO aDigal (in silappadikAram) never mentioned vishNu (he used mAyavan, kariyavan, neDiyOn, tirumAl etc.,), and referred to Balaraman as periyavan.

So the vista is enormous. One has to know the confinements, restrictions, and modifications.

[bhavarasa]

mahakavi:

I see the distinction you are trying to make but if jAngri is not a Thamizh word, then neither is Chandiran, right? It is Sanskrit. The word in Thamizh would be nilavu or nilA, would it not? Same goes for jhankAr, does it not?

In fact, are there are any authentic Thamizh words that actually begin with cha instead of sa?

PS: Pardon my ignorance if I misspoke.

[mahakavi]

bhavarasa:
jhangAra sruti seyguvAy by SuddhAnanda Bharathi is a "Thamizh song" but in maNipravAlam mode. Hence the word "jhangAra' is an import. As I said before the grantic letter available after the 16th century (aruNAcala kavi used them in his rAma nATaka keerttanaigaL) was used by SNB. As you agreed, candra is a Sanskrit word, and accordingly pronounced with a 'ca" sound. But it is still written with the "sa" letter which can change the pronunciation depending on the context I mentioned before.

As for Thamizh words which start with "ca" please refer to my earlier posts in this thread as to when they can occur so. I don't want to repeat them here.

[rshankar]

What I find very hard to understand or even buy is how for words like candrasekhar and jhankAra, as imports, one letter is pronounced like it is in t he language of origin (i.e., the 'c' instead of 's' in candrasEkhar, and the 'j' sound instead of 's' in jhankAra), but other letters in the same word are not - like the 'g' instead of 'kh' in candrasEkhar, and 'g' instead of 'k' in jhankAra....

[mahakavi]

That is the nature of the beast. Very few people can understand the details. Grammar and phonetics linked together can create complex patterns. We cannot unravel all this here. Only experts can do so in some literary forum.
If one letter is modified and another not, then it is the individual who is doing so. If one follows the rules properly then everything will be clear.
Let me state it clearly. If Thamizh pronunciation is to be followed out and out then it is " sandirasEgaran". If a hybrid is used then it is "candrasEgaran'. If pure Sanskrit is used then it is "candrasEkhara"
I hope it is clear now.

[1920veeyens]

Smt. Jaishree pronounced it correctly. If at all any body is to be hanged (or hung) for all these imbroglio, I plead guilty. May Sri Rama bless you all

[mahakavi]

Smt. Jaishree pronounced it correctly. If at all any body is to be hanged (or hung) for all these imbroglio, I plead guilty. May Sri Rama bless you all

That is the important thing----not your hanging but Jaishree's pronunciation!
(If only the world's problems can be solved by hanging one person......)
All is well that ends well

[cmlover]

The language related posts have been moved to
http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=13484
Discussion can please continue there...