CM and harmony - a sample

Lakshman · Post by **Lakshman** » 01 Aug 2010, 02:34

Here is a clip of Prashant's experiment with CM and western harmony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-wqJTgMzrw

prashanth12 · Post by **prashanth12** » 04 Aug 2010, 00:39

Cool, didn't know you had posted this here.

But not much response, it seems! ; )

bhavarasa · Post by **bhavarasa** » 04 Aug 2010, 01:35

Maybe if it had been posted under "Light Classical", it would have elicited more responses.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 04 Aug 2010, 05:51

It sounds great. Thanks... Good job Prashanth. Please write about the arrangement, who the players are etc.

msakella · Post by **msakella** » 04 Aug 2010, 06:50

Had more care been taken in respect of Shruti-alignment the response would have been much better. amsharma

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 04 Aug 2010, 07:59

Lakshman,
Is this our good old Prashant?
Our mods know, perhaps.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 04 Aug 2010, 08:19

No. It is another Prashanth. He has introduced himself in the Welcome to new members thread. Lakshman may have more info.

I had that confusion initially as well. ( I changed the title a bit. Hope that is OK )

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 04 Aug 2010, 17:17

I went to the link with all my usual anti-fusion prejudice --- and was surprised to find myself enjoying it!

msakella wrote:Had more care been taken in respect of Shruti-alignment the response would have been much better. amsharma

i wish I had the ear to hear these things. Was it tuned to tempered western scale, rather than native scale?

Had a conversation with Rama Varma once, who told me, "Of course there is harmony in Carnatic music because of the presence of the drone!". Not, though, like the varying chords that usually feature in Western music.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 04 Aug 2010, 19:17

Nick,
I am not sure that Prashant would venture into anything in the genre of fusion (however good it may be). Anyway, you will find him in the audience at your Christmas day (?) concert!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 04 Aug 2010, 20:42

Be assured 'your' Prashant won't show up at this Forum until I commit yet
another 'faux pas'

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 04 Aug 2010, 21:00

Even though it may be a different Prashant, and with respect to msakella's trained and expert ear --- I still liked this, as a sample. It was a bit sugar-sweet, but it served for me (perhaps "for me" should be in bold

) to show that the harmonic addition did not entirely ruin it.

In theory, at least, I know that western harmony, as we know it today, depends on the tempered scale, and carnatic music is not composed or performed according to that scale, so I can understand if it doesn't work for others.

CML... ever the man of mystery!

smala · Post by **smala** » 05 Aug 2010, 00:28

Someone, anyone! please inform if this is the Prashant who sings CM, being referred to here??

I find this voice that dominates and the singing very pleasant. A comment says that S. Shankar is the voice that dominates, as he sings with K.Prashant. Is there any audio with just Prashant singing???

http://www.hummaa.com/music/artist/1748 ... s/Carnatic

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 05 Aug 2010, 02:42

CML,
Your 'words' (carrying no malice though you got carried away) are not the sole cause for Prashant's reaction. I hope Prashant realizes at some point that you have always been a well wisher. I wish that he had said 'A bien tot' instead of 'Adieu' too, but then again, we all have our moments. Friends come and go and we are happy too see them again on the forum.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 05 Aug 2010, 05:01

men (women) may come and men (women) may go
me and arasi will go on for ever !

smala · Post by **smala** » 05 Aug 2010, 05:17

Sounds like a great mutual admiration tag team.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 05 Aug 2010, 07:52

s-p,
You are right. It's called MAS (mutual admiration society). Actually, you will find a lot more rasikas here who belong to this positive group. Big mouths are recognized easily, of course

The idea is to think of the forum as a friendly place where we feel free to exchange information and ideas, kid around a bit and be critical without being personal. Yes, there are others whom you don't hear much from. They also believe in being positive and work quietly to keep the forum going. Of course, spreading a bit of cheer isn't the same as being soppy and sentimental. Still, we don't have to be cynical to be taken seriously.
We all are prone to say something in the rush of emotions. An apology is in order. Then we have to carry on without looking back (both the offender and the others!).
Yes, CML has always cheered folks on, especially me! Cheerleading comes naturally to some of us. It's catchy too. It's not bad for the health of Rasikas either

Some think cheerfulness is boring. I feel that lively arguments are fine if they get us somewhere, if they don't end up in our forgetting the subject at hand; makes us get into a fighting mode, making it all personal and ugly and unproductive.

Why do I come hurrying to defend CML? Because of all the good things he has done and is doing to keep Rasikas going and growing.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 05 Aug 2010, 09:26

In other words, true to topic, you are promoting Harmony in our Carnatic Music Forum!

We all are prone to say something in the rush of emotions.

Indeed, some of us snap sometimes: I keep telling myself that I should, on this and other forums, take several deep breaths before replying. And I keep not listening :$

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 05 Aug 2010, 10:06

Nick,
Blush if you wish but your self-awareness and your readiness in apologizing when you need to--are among some of your appreciable qualities. Lack of sabha etiquette can easily rile you and you may refer to me as madam--so what? Ah, and munch on your sesame seed sweeties in concerts, but you carry them in your fabric bag and not in one of those plastic bags the sound of which drives you crazy

smala · Post by **smala** » 05 Aug 2010, 10:55

..You are right. It's called MAS (mutual admiration society). Actually, you will find a lot more rasikas here who belong to this positive group.

Does the above sound cool - I think not - because MAS by its nature forms coteries, (and sycophancy) insiders and outsiders. True to the style how our Indian Govts. and the parties run. One may be in the Americas, but can spring be far behind. It is one thing, desirable even, to be appreciative, encouraging and quite another, to be fair.

...Big mouths are recognized easily, of course....

Now, is that a wee little jibe tucked into the middle of things or what...

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 05 Aug 2010, 12:53

We are but human, with faults and all! And when I snap, I'll snap at anyone, even though I might have great respect for their knowledge, experience and understanding in another conversation.

...Big mouths are recognized easily, of course....

On another forum, where I have racked up tens of thousands of posts, mostly by talking nonsense, my user name is illustrated by a peacock and, at one time, I used the user description of loud-mouthed noisy bird.

Thank you, Arasi Madam, for your kind comments!

uday_shankar · Post by **uday_shankar** » 05 Aug 2010, 17:53

shyama-priya wrote:.because MAS by its nature forms coteries, (and sycophancy) insiders and outsiders.

I think you're wasting you're time trying to spar with harmless, benign folks. The only question is when you're going realize that

. For the most part, American workpace like friendliness marks this forum and if you don't think so, more's the pity.

shyama-priya wrote:.True to the style how our Indian Govts. and the parties run. One may be in the Americas, but can spring be far behind.

Don't you think that's a tad grandiose for a harmless online discussion forum ?

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 05 Aug 2010, 20:14

Hey For Gods sake !!
This is a rare thread started by our Lji

I agree . There is a lot to admire even if the members belong to a Mutually admiring society.Better than remaining jealous of the gifts we have among us.

Ramasubramanian M.K · Post by **Ramasubramanian M.K** » 05 Aug 2010, 20:26

Shyamapriya; I am with Uday,Arasi,Nick and CM Lover on this issue. Normally I stick to my "knitting"--light-hearted banter, and serious music-related(the singing part)issues for mutual enlightenment. I have immensely benefitted from these discussions Normally I do not comment on posts like yours taking a light-hearted discussion into the stratosphere of banality.
Let's keep our viewpoints to the issue on hand instead of "branding" people into stereotypes--be it MAS or any other 'group" that you may read in-between lines.

Disclosure: I have been on this forum for less than a year and as such my views may not be that enlightened.All of us have a lot more to offer to each other and we need to be a little more inclusive. I have always assumed that the rants so long as they are "civil" spring from genuine passion with no malice or personal innuendos intended.

This post is in the same spirit.

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 05 Aug 2010, 20:28

dear shyama-priya:
In any forum you will notice a certain camaraderie that builds over time amongst its members. Newcomers tend to first obseve, then slowly participate and finally establish a certain rapport with others. It's the same here.
e.g.
- cml and I have a long-standing love-fight relationship. yes, cml? I have huge respect for his vast knowledge and wisdom on life.
- similarly, I have a lot of respect for MK's vidwat in various areas, but we do 'fight' over certain topics (pet peeves?).
- not to forget other greats like harimau, uday, arasi, nick, vk, the forumite previously known as cool

, et al...

In the final analysis, a forum like this can be a microcosm of our own lives in the 'real' world.
MAS to me means 'admiration' mixed with the occasional 'attack'. But hey, that's life too.

ps: I do want to add that I for one have benefited a lot from the very informative posts you have made in this forum. Sincere thanks!

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 05 Aug 2010, 20:40

Thanks, Uday and Thimma for saying what I couldn't!
By 'big mouth' , I meant myself (proof: the number of posts!).
Lakshman, the epitome of a quiet person, a shining member of the MAS. He delivers always, like the ideal mailman whose qualities are etched in stone. Nothing stops him from bringing lyrics to anyone who asks. Mercurial in his deeds (HanumAn) but barely heard

MKR and r-t,
Just saw your posts. You both say it well.

s_p,
I join r-t in his post script.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 05 Aug 2010, 21:22

s-p 's contribution is invaluable.
In fact she is the incentive for MK to provide scientific facts which are his expertise that will benefit
all of us in our personal Health materially. And not forgetting R-T with whom I always have
a Sringaara piNakkam

It is a misnomer to dub us MAS. We appreciate quality and service to CM community all the time.
The praise is always deserved; not just in the opinion of the poster. Without appreciation good human efforts
will perish. Read Gray's famous Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard to understand what happens when there
is no appreciation. Hanuman scaled the ocean only through the appreciation stemming from his accompanists.
Let us all strive our best to bring out the best in the rest of us through encouragement and legitimate appreciation
and positive suggestions.

Now here is a 21 year-old yougster taking his baby steps in innovations in CM through introducing Harmony
in CM which may become a major breakthrough. Let us hear more from him and if possible fertilize him with
new ideas!

Prashant!

We are waiting to hear from you....

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 05 Aug 2010, 21:42

To sum up the above discussions:

Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become your actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, for they become your character. Develop your character, for it becomes your destiny

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 05 Aug 2010, 21:53

...and watch your destiny that leads to your Liberation (mukti)...

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 05 Aug 2010, 22:49

prashanth12 wrote:Cool, didn't know you had posted this here.
But not much response, it seems! ; )

ha.. ha.. prashanth12. What do you say now

( We will move the MAS related posts to the Lounge later )

smala · Post by **smala** » 06 Aug 2010, 03:37

No gripes here at all but since something like MAS was brought up here as an overarching umbrella, my own take was that it was a "tad too grandiose" of an arch especially for benign simple people in the forum.

Be that as it may, I'll let it rest.
Thanks all.

prashanth12 · Post by **prashanth12** » 06 Aug 2010, 03:43

vasanthakokilam wrote:ha.. ha.. prashanth12. What do you say now

I feel like I'm the only stranger on a bus full of old friends

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 06 Aug 2010, 03:54

prashanth
Be assured there is no discrimination because you are the new kid in town

We love and appreciate all our membership democratically!

Do post more of your CM harmony creations for our edification!

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 07 Aug 2010, 02:07

s_p, as you can see there is already an AS for you. Making it a MAS is up to you

( just joking )
Prasanth: Pretty soon there will be an AS for you too!!

smala · Post by **smala** » 07 Aug 2010, 02:53

Dear VK : I am less concerned with admiration any which way than I am with fairness. And a non-select inclusiveness.

When people are offended enough to leave, statements like "friends come and go" are then made, to me it doesn't help at all. Nor does it help when there is an open declaration of MAS - which suggests that in order to be included, you need to exhibit/declare your MAS potential. One can admire, appreciate and recognize without such a thing as you pat my back, I'll pat yours.

I can see that there are CM stalwarts and persons with immense expertise here, with maybe one laggard like me on the less than zero side. Still, one can aspire, one can maybe even learn a thing or two in this lifetime. Although this is a CM centered group with no hopes of the lounge ever taking over

(just look at the stats, Gen. Disc. is more likely to take over than any other subset), perhaps the hope is, OK, one is not good enough for even jAlra pOdal (double meaning intended) but maybe there's some edge room to hang outside the bus. Raga-blind (or tone-deaf ?) CM music enjoyers are needed in order for CM to be successful. The scope of CM is beyond the experts-only landscape, is my point.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 07 Aug 2010, 03:17

s_p, that all makes sense. clique forming and one clique vs the other..etc. are not good... We have one clique based on one common interest, namely music.. Not that everyone has the same point of view on everything far from it as you can see in the various threads.

But you are taking those comments way too seriously.. I do not think it was generally meant in the way you took it...and that was indicated by others. I am not sure if you fully believed that, hence this additional comment reinforcing that point.

Also, contrary to what may be perceived, a whole lot of the members here are just rasikas and not experts and stalwarts in CM. So non expert rasikas should feel comfortable hanging out here. So let us relax, let go of any tightness and enjoy the interactions.

No big deal, this just gave me an opportunity to state a few things which can reset the perceptions to a correct state.
We can move on to the topic of the thread..

smala · Post by **smala** » 07 Aug 2010, 03:48

Thanks again, to R-T and CML for the kind words, to Uday, Thimma and MKR for your varied inputs as well.
Arasi, thank you for your thoughts and VK, thanks for being the cool diplomat, as always.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 07 Aug 2010, 07:32

An important thing that SP is missing here that Each one of the so called MAS know each other personally and have met several times over the past decade.It is that spirit that makes us talk like the way , we do .For Instance , I travelled from Chennai to Blore just to meet Arasi . Most US folks who arrive by midnight are at my door by 8 am. I once recorded 50 DVDs for Srkris in one single night - Not Music- something to with Keralas cultural history and so on.
The point is that once an identity is known or a meeting takes place , it is difficult not to admire , or even say a hurtful word.
And like in my case , Once I say a hurtful word , it is so easy to make amends

smala · Post by **smala** » 07 Aug 2010, 07:55

Yes, Thimma, I see now that familiarity is the key...

btw, you don't answer email via forum? (How can I land up at your door if I don't know where the door is? ;( ) I sent a request for the viruttams you posted earlier, to be sent as files on mediafire.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 07 Aug 2010, 09:52

I have shifted to mediafire already. awaiting commentaries on Pinakapani, Ramnathan and Sankar .
I dont remember your mail through the forum. I can always be reached at [email protected].
Not sure If I reposted the first few links again as mediafire.But will definitely do it over the weekend.

mankuthimma · Post by **mankuthimma** » 07 Aug 2010, 10:04

Ok I now see that I have only put Sankars stuff on mediafire.
Will put up the first six on mediafire over the weekend, SP.
My grey cells are in a bit of a tizzy after I listened to an old recording of Nagamani Srinath- - A major rendering of Neenyako in Dharmavathi.. brilliant neraval at Sabheyaelee seereya selevaga .. Krishnaaaaaa .......embo ........ ninna hangyako....
will put it up on an appropriate thread over the weekend. ksrimech should love ... That krithi is followed by a series of Viruttams and ugabhogas revolving around the Lord Krishna...

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 09 Aug 2010, 03:01

Talking about cliques...
s-p (and others):
I am sure you will enjoy this video clip of Woody Allen, where he quotes the famous Groucho Marx line "I would never want to belong to any club that would have someone like me for a member!"

Sometimes it feels like that here...