Are Cleveland Aradhana competetions rigged?

[rigveda]

"It looks like the competitions are the most major attractions that assures a flood of visitors from CA at least. Turn it into an even prominent affair by making it last the first three days. There can be a preliminary round (to be done regionally by suitable judges), an elimination round and the final round both held in Cleveland. The fee structure can be multitier. As a participant advances to the next level, charge a higher fee for that level. I am sure the number of participants will only keep increasing since competitions such as these are used by 99% percent of the kids to get admission in a top school. Once that is achieved, one hears very little about them until they are employed and ready to perform during “weekends” for a small or no fee."
A valid observation but not very practical. Preliminary rounds will be the most challenging. The best way is to have all the participants send their CDs to the organizers. The organizers can give them to judges in Chennai/USA identifying the CDs only by numbers. The judges should not know whose CD it is. And of course, the CDs of the contestants should not be sent to their teachers as this info will be known only to the organizers. The rest of the show can be in Cleveland
I believe Chiacgo Thyagaraja is doing this already although I read lot of complaints about the final round where everything boils down to "who knows who" and not "who knows what". Some interesting points to ponder over.

[vasanthakokilam]

I believe Chiacgo Thyagaraja is doing this already although I read lot of complaints about the final round where everything boils down to "who knows who" and not "who knows what".

rv: Vast generalizations like this is what shatters the credibility of the complainer and of those who quote such complainers.
I am not involved with CTU in any capacity but I know two of the people who run the competition at CTU, I will volunteer any day to be their character witness and testify for their integrity.

[sureshvv]

Everything boils down to "who knows who" and not "who knows what". Some interesting points to ponder over

After much pondering I regret to report that unfortunately (for the OP) Humans at this stage of evolution tend to be social animals.

[venkatakailasam]

once a man sat in the audience & cracked a joke. All laughed like
crazy. After a moment he cracked the same joke again and a little less
people laughed this time. He cracked the same joke again & again, When there
was no laughter in the crowd, he smiled and said "When u can't laugh on the
same joke again & again, then why do u keep crying over the same thing over
and over again. *'Forget the past & move on'*

venkatakailasam

[rigveda]

I want to make sure that I am no "competition basher" or "aradhana basher". I have some interest in CM. In fact I am the only one in my family who can sit through 3 hours of CM! But I have been invovled in a variety of competitions and I know how important it is to avoid conflict of interest. Some one commented on how Santanagopalan stayed away from judging his daughter. That is the way it should be and there is nothing extraordinary about it.
In fact the concept of integrity extends beyond competitions. Musicians (violin, mridangam, kjhangira) associated with the Aradhana should not force their way into many performances and that too prime slots. If these artists are so good, they will be sought after by many artists and there is no need to use Cleveland as a place to show off their talents. If they insist on appearing on stage, they can participate in one concert to encoruage local talents. If they did this, people and msucians will respect them all the more. But what we see is the spectacle of these artists, closely associated with the aradhana, performing in multiple concerts in prime slots. More than one senior vidwan has told me that they accomodate these artists out of compulsion and not because of their quality. It takes only common sense to deal with these issues as compared to the complicated competition issue!

[Nick H]

I want to make sure that I am no "competition basher" or "aradhana basher"...

Then why does your thread title, even, do just that?

[venkatakailasam]

I think this book ( thread) is a collection of short stories for which you can never find a link between them.

venkatakailasam

[Nick H]

Yes. Perhaps r-v will be telling us, in a forthcoming post, how wonderfully well-run the competitions are!

Or, perhaps another thread: Are the Vedas Rig-ed?


(This pun has been staring me in the face ever since r-v's first post. I knew I would have to use it at some time. I hope no offence caused to anyone)

[cmlover]

Nick
That was a super good joke
I laughed my heart out...
(or whether the biblical Samuel authored the Sam Veda

[Nick H]

Well, I'm not very hot on bible studies either, but, apparently, that Sam was quite a guy, and a very accomplished poet!

CML... I'm amazed every body didn't see it. I guess it comes of having different linguistic spectacles.

Anyway, glad you enjoyed, I was worried that the irreverence might offend.

[cmlover]

Nick
You are right, I didn't see it!
Injection of humour will ease tensions in this thread!
By the by I hope the original poster does not take any offence

[vasanthakokilam]

Nick, that is a good one.

[chennairasiga]

Very Interesting discussion !
About 5-6 years back, when the senior vidwans were involved they were very involved in their work and MOST - repeat MOST of the judging was done in a fair manner manner. However, in the last 3 years things have gone downhill dramatically ! Especially one mrudangam player cuts deals with as many parents of competitors as possible ( includes mridangam and all other categories). He is also in charge of fixing the pakkavadyam ( except for the very well established main artists) for all the concerts in Cleveland Aradhana and assigning judges for various competitions . He leverages ( BY FIXING WINNERS ) this responsibility of his with musicians ( from India ) and parents and makes a tidy $$$ - he is ruthless about making his money in cash or kind.
Mr VV sundaram is very busy trying to get things working and is not able to focus on this aspect of scheduling etc.Now this disease has also spread to the Dance category.
Most volunteers in the cleveland aradhana are passionate about their work and work tirelessly for those two weeks in Cleveland Aradhana taking personal time off. Hats of to them for their work!
However, they are not aware of what is happening..
Its is a open secret that - lot of winners are rigged and you cant feature in the winner list or concert player list unless you take care of this mrudanam player - preferable meet him at home in Chennai !

[VK RAMAN]

Living in Chennai, you have so much information about what is happening in Cleveland like a microscope. Interesting!

[chennairasiga]

Living in Chennai, you have so much information about what is happening in Cleveland like a microscope. Interesting!

VK- All in a days work ! :devil:

[smala]

In these internet days the world has shrunk. Maybe this "wheeling and dealing mridangist" in Chennai - attends the Cleveland fest.

[vasanthakokilam]

Given the willy-nilly allegations in this thread, take everything with a big spoonful of salt and put everything through a thorough credibility filter. That is one of the basic requirements of information consumption in this internet age.

[chennairasiga]

In these internet days the world has shrunk. Maybe this "wheeling and dealing mridangist" in Chennai - attends the Cleveland fest.

he is very much there - gained prominence ( :devil: )in the last 3 years!

[chennairasiga]

Given the willy-nilly allegations in this thread, take everything with a big spoonful of salt and put everything through a thorough credibility filter. That is one of the basic requirements of information consumption in this internet age.

you are so right ! :envy:

[VK RAMAN]

vasanthakokilam - Instead of a pinch, you are suggesting a big spoonful; I am a heart patient!

[rigveda]

NickH
I agree with your right to say what you want. I am an atheist and dead agisnt monoistic religions like Christianity and Islam. But if I were part of India's security department, I will do a background check on you if you were not an Indian! No offense, just a routine check.
I don't know if the Vedas are rigged since I can not learn the vedas as I am not a Brahmin! I belong to a lesser caste.
My humor for all the rasikas is this
If all the rasikas who visit my posting agree to donate a dollar each, I will like to have it sent to the Aradhana people to help with their organization. Don' t send the money to me, send it to a person who will use it for the Aradhana.

[rigveda]

A post script
Can Cleveland committee publish in this thread the following?
(1) The winners of each category during the past three years and the names of their teachers.
(2) Clarify if the teachers sat as judges during the competition.
(3) Did the participants announce the name of the teachers on stage before the competition?

[chennairasiga]

A post script
Can Cleveland committee publish in this thread the following?
(1) The winners of each category during the past three years and the names of their teachers.
(2) Clarify if the teachers sat as judges during the competition.
(3) Did the participants announce the name of the teachers on stage before the competition?

Rig -

Take it easy my vedic bro
All of what you say is very true and let me add my 2 rupees ...( inflation adjusted for 2 paisa !)

the way it works is like this.......

1st two years you attend the competition and figure our nothing is happening to your dear snowflake ...hmmmm, you keep your eyes and ears open and follow the scent to success.. leads to the the mridangam man who will facilitate the win.
Initially, he will be cocky and throw his weight around ( literally !) - then you ask for advice how to improve your snowflakes performance...he will tell how dumb your child's guru is and request one of his latest winners to play a thani or a korvai for all of your family's benefit - you will obviously suck it up - then he will give you gyan on how to meet him later - in the USA and or in Chennai -( the Piranha has now entered ) and you are on the way to the coveted award - congrats 8). He will also promise you a arangetram ( if not done - in Only 10 months). If you both are on the same page by now you and the ward are on autopilot - just make sure the $$$are flowing if not you are finito ! if your child's guru wants to negotiate a group contract, mridangam man is open, but then he will have to negotiate a group rate and your child's guru will also have to become his student and also carry his bags :$

[cmlover]

chennairasiga
you just became a member to post this innuendo!
We don't relish anonymity being used as a mask to sling mud on a respectable organization or its members.
If you are at chennai and aware of malpractices you could bring it directly to the notice of VVS rather than posting it here.

[chennairasiga]

chennairasiga
you just became a member to post this innuendo!
We don't relish anonymity being used as a mask to sling mud on a respectable organization or its members.
If you are at chennai and aware of malpractices you could bring it directly to the notice of VVS rather than posting it here.

Innuendo ! whoa boy !!! take it easy... VVS is very aware of this ! i became a member two months back to be a part of an wonderful group. if you want me to stop posting on this subject I shall - but who are you to cut me off ? are you a member of the committee ? TRUTH IS THE TRUTH ! and please don't ASSU ME :devil:

BY THE WaY - WHO IS WE ? Mubarak's regime or what ?

[vasanthakokilam]

rigveda, it looks like you are taking seriously Nick's pun with words and go off on a deep end with your dispirited comments towards him. Not cool.

chennairasiga, take it easy. No, 'We' do not walk like an Egyptian strongman but you are walking dangerously closely to causing us potential trouble in terms of keeping peace!! I will leave it at that innuendo.

[chennairasiga]

rigveda, it looks like you are taking seriously Nick's pun with words and go off on a deep end with your dispirited comments towards him. Not cool.

chennairasiga, take it easy. No, 'We' do not walk like an Egyptian strongman but you are walking dangerously closely to causing us potential trouble in terms of keeping peace!! I will leave it at that innuendo.

Muummy !!!!

[vasanthakokilam]

Yeah, right. quite mature.

[chennairasiga]

Yeah, right. quite mature.

but...the Ammiii still grinds on.....

[vasanthakokilam]

yes, because I carry chutney for the Cleveland Aradhana!!

[chennairasiga]

yes, because I carry chutney for the Cleveland Aradhana!!

Truth is the truth as long as Chutney is associated with Idly or anything else of substance - i am sure you agree

[cacm]

My humor for all the rasikas is this
If all the rasikas who visit my posting agree to donate a dollar each, I will like to have it sent to the Aradhana people to help with their organization. Don' t send the money to me, send it to a person who will use it for the Aradhana.

As a member of the Aradhana Committee I thank rigveda for his ingenious & innovative original suggestion for donation of a dollar each etc & promise to make sure it is delivered to the Treasurer & get an official receipt from him. It certainly will solve the financial difficulties faced by the aradhana organisers.
Those interested may send any amount-minimum is one dollar- as rigveda's idea has to be properly respected&implemented to: Dr.V.K.Viswanathan, "Srinivas", 690 Los Pueblos, Los Alamos, NM, 87544. USA. I also wish to state that being duly sworn in I am taking this incredible step to raise money for the Aradhana ON MY OWN & ANY unauthorised action on my part might result in my being thrown out of the committee. One has to rise to the occasion& face the challenge. There comes a time when actions have to be taken etc.....
I must confess I am a humourless old man about to reach Senility if not there already & I blame my elders for not getting me icecream at the proper age from the Good Humour ice cream truck man........VKV

[sureshvv]

But if I were part of India's security department...

Actually you are part of a pack of cowardly curmudgeons who can't stand the success of an organization that doesn't want your ilk.

No offense, just a routine observation.

I don't know if the Vedas are rigged since I can not learn the vedas as I am not a Brahmin! I belong to a lesser caste.

So your bitterness is deep seated and may extend beyond the Aradhana. Thank you for the explanation. I apologize on behalf of all our collective rasikas ancestors.

If all the rasikas who visit my posting agree to donate a dollar each...

I see your game... IRS! Please check this guy!

[smala]

...i became a member two months back to be a part of an wonderful group...

By what lovely name did you become a member "two months back" - that would be roughly Nov. 2010. Obviously, it wasn't enough and the wonderful group made you twice-born in your uruvam as Chennairasiga on Jan 2, 2011. Not to worry about Vedas etc. You are now Dwija. So what's the game plan?

[srkris]

Thanks everyone for your views. I fear the discussion is not going on productive lines, and hence is closed.