TM Krishna@Karthik Fine Arts on Dec 07th,2014

[rajeshnat]

TM Krishna@Karthik Fine Arts(NGS Hall) on Dec 07th,2014
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Vocal : TM Krishna
Violin : HN Bhaskar
Mrudangam : KV Prasad
kanjira : ANirudh Athreya

Concert Type : Nirvana - No concert to follow
Day/Duration : Sunday Morning/ 2 hours and 10 minutes
Concert Type/Crowd : Free concert - ~ 850(80 to 90% main hall full)
Sabha/Hall : Karthik Fine Arts / NGS Main Hall

01. kAlai thooki ninrAdum (N,S) - yadhukula kAmbOdhi - Marimutha pillai
neraval in shengaiyil mAn tUkki shivanda mazhuvai tUkki angattil oru peNNai anudinamum tUkki for 6 mins
swaras for 4 mins

02A. todi alapana for 5 mins and 3 mins violin return of the same todi by HNB
02B. tAnam - janaranjani or poornachandika ?? for 8 mins with both TMK and HNB participating
02C. thillana(S) - poornachandrika - poochi iyengar
with a 2 min swaras
02D. mini tani for 3 mins

03. jAnaki ramana - suddha seemanthani - T
04A. kapi alapana by TMK for 9 mins
04B. kalayE mAma hrdayE - kApi - Mysore Vasudevachar

05A. pankaja lOchana (Raga alapana by violinist, N , S, T) - kalyAni - ST
6 mins violin alapana by HNB
8 mins neraval in shamkuru satatam mE sArasanAbha shaurE
4 mins swaras
04B. tani for 12 mins

05. Ososi - mukhari - kshetragya padam
06. vAthapi ganapathim bhajE (brief raga sketch,S) - hamsadhwani - MD
swaras for 2 mins

[rajeshnat]

It is few years since I heard TMK . I grabbed TMK in sunday morning with a great team support . All the so called changes in patterns is some thing that I have more observed in rasikas site and was more hearsay.As such the last time I heard he was very much singing in ariyakudi typecast mode with the pallavi composed by KAP describing a girl's eye. Putting that aside , I was mentally prepared for accepting what he offers .

TMK started with a mini vilambit submain in yadukula kambOdhi and I liked his aesthetics . His voice opened out wonderfully and the krithi hit a sweet spot of sowkhyam ,this raga's emote is high and i got that . The neraval was a bit of touch and go with equally nice return from bhaskar , but I felt atleast in neraval and the subsequent swaras he could have gone more . Musicians start with a sedate varnam like sahana or an expressive varnam like kambodhi, abhogi etc so my mindset with his yk kambodhi krithi was equivalent to a sedate start like sahana varnam .

TMk moved to todi, the alapana came out well but I felt he could have dwelled bit more on depth. The crisp alapana return by Bhaskar in the same todi was concise and nice. TMK started with tanam with his first shuffle , I was all along thinking janaranjani(as i had aurally more smaranE sukhamu feel in my ears)then a poornachandika thillana makes me put as the preceding tanam as poornachandrika.Few years back even two musicians were at loggerheads in poornachandrika vs janaranjani tussle, so I should be excused there.

The Taanam was in complete madhyama kalam and it was excellent aesthetics by both krishna and bhaskar. The shuffle #2 started where he moved to the thillana tom tom , he gave a bit of a clue in the end of the taanam when he said tOm tOM and I recollected one review of Some one in US , where he did the same taanam followed by thillana in poornachandrika . His voice was more powerful in thillana and he did few round of swaras which to me was just ok. There was also a round of mini tani at the end which went with the thillana's brisk pace. As such the second shuffle was fine.

TMK voice is his asset and his kapi alapana was mandara sthayi at his best . There was not strong aroma of kapi but the brewness was grounded wonderfully in kapi. He never went to mel sthayi in kapi and at the end of alapana he made a small speech some thing like "Naan ithukku apparam padamA irukkurthu nallathu, ithu jokea sollalE ellathukkum neenga sirika vendAm , Annan naan paddalEnanna enna achhunnu ungalukum enakkum theriyum, athukkakagavE ippo krithi padrEn .It was bit unwarranted and I felt a certain planned showmanship there, He ended with the vasudevacharya krithi which I was expecting and he sang well with a lot of emotive touch. Between poornachandrika and kapi the janaki ramana was good but I missed bit more rhythmn..

THe main was kalyani , only Bhaskar played the alapana - it was a text book kalyani. Krishna voice opened out but the imagination was not adequate for me in kalyani. Pankaja lochana neraval could have garnered more sangathis and swaras were just touch and go. Both the percussionist gave a very good tani with Anirudh showing extreme mastery there .

My mind was thinking he will sing Dikshitar krithi some time soon . I think Anirudh asked tmk to sing mukhari padam and Ososi in mukhari was well done , but felt it was not in the league of the previous vilambit like yadukula kambodhi or kapi.Perhaps there was not adequate change in tempo between kapi ,kalyani and mukhari . With a brief ragasketch in hamsadhwani I was thinking he is going to create another shuffle with a dikshitar vathapi. My hunch was right ,before every body thought he was living in that moment with vathapi , I got it . THe hamsadhwani krithi was sung beautfully by TMK the last swaras eneding with murari was again limited which i did not like.

THe violinst HNB played excellently and I liked his tanam the most . THe accompanist both were very good with nice sowkhyam , anirudh had a limited role.

One thing I did not like:
-----------------------------------
Every musician has to be an intelligent showmanship otherwise they will not sing in sabha , they will instead sing only in home or pooja room. But at times he is trying to think he is just living that moment is just fine . for eg vinayaka krithi at the end is also fine . I atleast recollected then in the sabha that in our rasikas concert in manakkal rangarajan house, suryaprakash did not sing even one vinayaka krithi in the beginning but sang towards the end the pallavi on Lord vinayaka duringa vinayaka chaturthi concert . I vaguely recollect even TNS has done too when he sang one krithi on vinayaka as main . I am saying this because I see no big deal in shuffle reorder and perhaps putting a vinayaka krithi at the end . As such my first live experience of shuffle was quite OK.

But I misssed a certain depth in the creative quotient especially in neraval and swaras .Swaras were too measured today and neraval was a mere extension of a krithi , he appearas not to seek raga bhavam with layam changes. He was not attempting more patterns in swaras and neraval. Also his todi was a sudden fullstop. He could have gone more , His voice had no problems this is a biggie concert in the biggest hall on a sunday.I felt at halfpoint the plot of the whole concert was bit muddled, a higher dose of entropy set in.

Overall a very good to excellent concert for 2 hours and 10 minutes.

[hnbhagavan]

Thanks to Sri Rajeshnath for a detailed review in what can be inferred as a an excellent concert.Rasikas now have accepted Sri TMK in his presentation pattern.One of my earlier jottings that main stream performers do not render Vatapi is undone as Sri TMK has included this at the end of concert.

[bombal]

excellent reviewing rajeshnat...you definitely have a great flair for writing well and clearly at that too...ability to express well.. kudos...

after reading this review and all the other concerts reviewed, I was reminded of what MahAvidwan Palghat Mani Iyer said and I quote key words as I understand it

"oru BA exam pass pannanum aanaa rathri muzhuvannum padichchu pass pannyoudalaam aana kutcheri appadi illai..dinam parikshai...oru nalaikku nanna padinaa nanna irrukku nu solluvaa aanaa innorunallakku sumaar aa padinaa, annukki nanna irudhadhu aana innuku konjam sumaar nnu solluvaa"

translation quote
(to pass a BA exam a person studies the whole night and gets rid of it once done, whereas a kutcheri is not like that..daily exam...one day he sings well people will say he sang well but if on an another day he sings slightly below ordinary they will immediately say - that day he sang well but today was below average.)
unquote

this is coming from a MahAvidwan, who in my humble opinion has not faltered in even one of his concerts (so I assume as I have not heard all his concerts!)...this could be nothing other than divine force which made him play the way he did.

:namaste:

[Sivaramakrishnan]

Vataapi ganapatim at the end? Great.
No Mangalam?

[pattamaa]

that would be opening piece, reserved for music academy. A grand sowrastram Ragam, thanam and pavamana with neraval and swarams.... I wouldn't be surprised !

Can't imagine why for the heck of doing it, such artists attempt such things... Atleast, glad that ragas are not yet tampered... why not include compositions in other indian languages like bengali, gujarathi for detailed expositions !!

[CommonMan]

Can't imagine why for the heck of doing it, such artists attempt such things

Besides his personal choice;
a. No senior artist to keep a check on such experiments...I am sure there are enough no of vocalists, mridangists and violinists whose experience is twice the age of this artist; and who have seen doyens who were perhaps more popular and had much more vidwath than TMK. These seniors do not seem to bother about such showmanship either for their own personal interests or because they are fine with it...both of which IMO is not in best taste. I do not think in the present day scenario these senior musicians have the guts to antagonize popular artists, sadly (assuming they are opposed to such experiments).
b. There are enough number of rasikas who do not mind these experiments. I guess this is because of lot of western influence on "freedom of expression, personalization, inclusion etc etc etc. on traditional carnatic music. Added to that the "herd" effect i.e. if there are sufficient no of people to hail whatever a person does, then the band-wagon effect influences many who might have a contrary opinion to follow suit, lest do they want to feel like an outlier. (similar to half of the audience in crowded concerts who do not even understand what they clap for but do so because others do)
c. Not sure, but possible - "inability to handle fame": there are several examples of artists in the past who have fallen into this trap. Beyond a point, if a person is unable to have his/her head on the shoulders or feet on the ground, eccentricity naturally creeps in. perhaps such experiments are an exemplification of "who to question me" or "I am in a status where people will take whatever I give" attitude.

... ... why not include compositions in other Indian languages like bengali, gujarathi for detailed expositions !!

Beacuse there are lots to explore in south Indian languages before looking at Urdu, tulu etc: for ex. senjurutti alapana by the violiist followed by "tamizhukku amudhendru per" - and thani.... and then neraval swaram in "erikarai mele. Then another thani followed by RTP in lalitha with pallavi line in "idhazhil kadahai ezhudhum..."; and closing with ninnukori varnam.
I

[kittappa]

that would be opening piece, reserved for music academy. A grand sowrastram Ragam, thanam and pavamana with neraval and swarams.... I wouldn't be surprised !
Can't imagine why for the heck of doing it, such artists attempt such things... Atleast, glad that ragas are not yet tampered... why not include compositions in other indian languages like bengali, gujarathi for detailed expositions !!

Excellent suggestion. But TMK was not the first to try such ridiculous things. Years ago I heard a Ganesh-Kumaresh concert at the MFAC when Kumaresh started playing Todi alapana, played it for about 10 minutes and suddenly switched over to Karaharapriya. The audience were not amused. Kumaresh expected a thunderous applause and looked expectantly at the audience at the end of his ad-venture. There was a deafening silence in the hall.

[hnbhagavan]

"The proof of pudding is in eating..".It is the Rasika audience who will finally determine the presentation of artists.In this case If the reports are any indication,TMK still enjoys a good audience.The reports from USA also indicated good presence of audience at each and every venue of the concert.
Why would one expect fellow musicians - may be senior to TMK to criticize TMK's methods when the rasikas have already accepted whatever TMK offers.There may be some rasiks and purists who are not happy with the format.Whatever may be the format TMK is capable of holding the audience.
There are no watch dogs in the music community barring the listeners community - knowledgeable or otherwise.

[CommonMan]

"There are no watch dogs in the music community barring the listeners community - knowledgeable or otherwise.

From what you say, looks like you don't believe in guidance for artists from their Guru's or experienced artists, especially of Sri TMK's caliber? Rephrasing what Semmangudi told one of my friends in the 90's "Guru vo ille perivaalo mandaila thattarthuku illenaa chinnanchirusugal tharikattu poidum" (In the absence of Gurus or experienced vidwans' guidance and constant review, the direction of young artist will haplessly wander without a check"

I do understand and know that there are many who like his singing (including me, partly) - which doesn't mean whatever he does does not warrant any comments by more experienced vidwans, sir! We do need the guidance and support of elderly and experienced musicians who have peeped into the past to tell us what is generally good and not so good to preserve this traditional art. It would help to take a humbler approach on this, than saying something to the effect of listeners decide what is good or bad. Of course, By definition they decide what they like and don't - but to develop the art, we do need the services of other musicians and elders too.

[hnbhagavan]

I never meant guidance is not required.Sri TMK himself is a product of Semmangudi school.But over a period of time some individual styles are developed.There are cases -Sri TV Shankaranarayanan a product of Madurai Mani Iyer school has a style of his own.So is the case with Neyveli santanagopalan who is from TN Seshagopalan's school.
Over a period of time after understanding the nuances of carnatic music,TMK has developed his own style and prefers to deviate from the beaten path.He has not tried to change the grammar of any raga or kruti.When he presents Todi,he presents todi raga as per the carnatic rules.But some how he believes that a raga can be complete by itself without following it with kruti.This is his individual opinion and sings as per his thinking.Perhaps Music Academy or a similar body can hold a seminar and invite senior carnatic musician's views on the subject.In fact this can be a question in the Music Academy open house where the experts of carnatic music will be available.

[grsastrigal]

It was originally posted in another TMK-Margazhi mahotsavam with a mistake !!!!. It has to come here.....

Rajeshnat- Such a prolific writer and loved by all, how do you accept Ganapati kriti being rendered at last ? Suryaprakash rendering it at the end, on vinayaka Chaturti day is understandable. Even Mangalam also could be on Vinayaka because it was the day for that God. Middle of the concert is also ok on any occassion.

I don't want "Sangeetha Jnanamu bhakti vinA" from TMK. By writing a book, acting in couple of movies, giving some biased interviews, showing extra martial skills, interviewed in walk the talk saying that he wants to break the tradtions-this is what is all about- It is ridiculous.

I could not attend yesterday's concert as I was out of chennai. I will go again to TMK's concert, but that is different.

You attend many senior vidwans concert and write the review. If you protest, TMK is not going to change. But, you should not accept this and this should be shown in your review at least politely, if not harsh.

[rajeshnat]

GRS
I think at the end of kalyani may be TMK planned to start vathapi or may be some other krithi with Anirudh asking for ososi he went for that and then ended with vathapi. As such I am also for starting with a krithi on lord vinayaka but as such I did not find any problems in shuffling order of krithis. Though singing alapana in one raga and going with another in violin return or a krithi is not that paripoornam- as some how I feel the momentum of that raga goes for a toss and also ideas of that raga goes for a bit of loss .

SRK,
As such this being morning concert with two other concerts following lunch time , i think perhaps it is ok not to end with mangalam.

[kvchellappa]

If TMK reads this (he will not), next time round he will sing mangalam if a concert is to follow. Opposing a custom is the theme.

[Tirunelveli1959]

T M Krishna, in my opinion, is a shrewd businessman. He has serious competition for talent. To differentiate himself, he is selling his concert with "what convention (including his own!!) is he going to break today?" The media is playing along, with The Hindu in the lead giving him pages for mundane opinions. Think about it - he has declared himself beyond criticism by claiming to sing for the soul. Further, by declaring free concerts, he is slowly but steadily building up a following. So, what is there to critique?
Having said this, I am not able to pass any value judgment. Artistes of yesteryear would "cultivate" rich and powerful rasikas - maharajas, mirasdars, senior bureaucrats and the like. You can argue that it was business too! As for me, I will not attend Mr. Krishna's concert because he is missing the critical part of classical music - a sense of discipline. Secondly, carnatic music is also built around bhakthi. What message is he sending by invoking Lord Ganesha at the end of the concert? Overall, it is my opinion that T M Krishna simply does not care what "critics" say because he is supremely confident that he has built a cult following.

[shankarabharanam]

:ymapplause:

T M Krishna, in my opinion, is a shrewd businessman. He has serious competition for talent. To differentiate himself, he is selling his concert with "what convention (including his own!!) is he going to break today?" The media is playing along, with The Hindu in the lead giving him pages for mundane opinions. Think about it - he has declared himself beyond criticism by claiming to sing for the soul. Further, by declaring free concerts, he is slowly but steadily building up a following. So, what is there to critique?
Having said this, I am not able to pass any value judgment. Artistes of yesteryear would "cultivate" rich and powerful rasikas - maharajas, mirasdars, senior bureaucrats and the like. You can argue that it was business too! As for me, I will not attend Mr. Krishna's concert because he is missing the critical part of classical music - a sense of discipline. Secondly, carnatic music is also built around bhakthi. What message is he sending by invoking Lord Ganesha at the end of the concert? Overall, it is my opinion that T M Krishna simply does not care what "critics" say because he is supremely confident that he has built a cult following.

:ymapplause: :ymapplause: :ymapplause: :ymapplause: :ymapplause:

Brilliant. You have echoed my views. I have been wanting to write this for quite sometime but because of the cult behavior of people in this forum I refrained from sharing my views. As you said he is a shrewd over confident person. I prefer not calling him a musician because of his attitude towards music. By acting as pseudo secularist and smartly seeking the support from The Hindu (which is leftists), no one will raise any voice against him. In our journalism field, we call him the elite kurtha clan which talks of supporting of the poor and casteless society but will never do anything concrete. So he is talking about all this nonsensical things about music, knowing very well this will separate him from the crowd and thus he wins the battle.

[sureshvv]

He is doing a few concrete things - like music season in the Olcott kuppam. He is looking for volunteers.

[arasi]

Could we say, he's spreading himself too thin when it comes to music? Not intentionally, but because of all his 'outside of music' activities?

Another tAmravarni rasikA! Welcome to Rasikas.org

[sureshvv]

At this point, the music helps him primarily to pursue his other activities.

[kvchellappa]

To be sure, TMK is a good classical singer and the crowd he gets is because he provides melodious music, though disjointedly under cover of 'aesthetics which eludes me. He is a purist in music, he is true to classicism. He has taken many initiatives to spread CM. On his 'musical offerings', the flaws to my mind are: he says he does not sing to entertain, I go for entertainment. He does not want to sing a concert, which is a unified whole within the aesthetics of music and with ample scope for manodharma, I look for a concert. When I listen to an alapana, I do not get satisfied if it is not followed through with a lyric. He treats the audience as dumb and his subjects, though he would deny it fervently. What else does it mean, when he says, 'Do not clap', 'you do not know aesthetics', 'I will not apologise if I have offended your belief system,' talking and giggling in between songs, not starting the event on time, and so on. There is an intended arrogance. I refuse to believe he has any right to offend my belief system. He has space for his and I for mine.

[Tirunelveli1959]

[quote="arasi"]Could we say, he's spreading himself too thin when it comes to music? Not intentionally, but because of all his 'outside of music' activities?

Another tAmravarni rasikA! Welcome to Rasikas.org

Thank you very much. My Tirunelveli identity is the one thing I proudly proclaim in every conceivable context!

[Tirunelveli1959]

At this point, the music helps him primarily to pursue his other activities.

I respectfully disagree. In my view, he is trying to make it as much, if not more, the other way around.

[Ramasubramanian M.K]

Rajesh: Excellent incisive,thoughtprovoking bold(do not be surprised if you are "ostracised" by TMK and his fans!!!).Keep it up.
Bombai: Thanks for quoting excerpts from PMI's speech.In the same speech(which would be apropo the current debate about introducing "new concepts in concert rendering),he says in Tamil loosely translated would read like this:
Again singing the same songs and ragas might look boring and unimaginative in the beginning but as the years grow,the same songs will acquire a sheen(:merugu" in Tamil was the word he used) and will start to appear as new-" End of Quote!!
How true. Take another example--Sivan's songs have been handled by different Vidwans each adding to its richness and poignancy with their own manodharmas reflected in some sangathis which Sivan may not have composed originally and yet we enjoy Kava Vaa,Idathu Padam thookki,Andavane(both these songs--the LGJ adaptation is superb without debasing the core content--Bhava and Raga swaroopam-that Sivan had infused in these compositions).

My views on TMK have been made known before. I have no objection to non-conformity(Mali/ or TNR were anything but conformists--they had more restrictive boundaries self-imposed than TMK.I enjoyed them despite these but muchas my admire his chaste rendering of raga / krithi setting aside the format variations--he is yet to reach the level of creativity and artistry that those "non-conformist" artistes of yesteryears produced--TMK has the intelligence and worldly-wisdom needed to scale new heights if he would only not get himself side-tracked by activities on the stage and offstage however sincere and well-meant they may seem to him!!

Lastly Tirunelveli1959 Glad to join Arasi in welcoming you to the forum. The tanjoreans still are not giving much vredit to Tirunelveli rasikas(Kaveri still seems to outrun Tamiraparni!!).

[Ramasubramanian M.K]

Tirunelveli1959--a follow-up to the Tirunelveli-Tanjore "divide".

Harikesanallur Muthiah Bhagavathar(HMB) is well known. Tirunelvelian. A story regarding his First debut in Tanjore--it was in a temple somewhere in Tanjore. Just as the artistes were gathering on the staage an interested rasika who had heard of HMB but never "heard" him before innocently asks a "dyed-in-the-wool" Tanjoorian"-- who had come more to jeer HMB than to listen to him --"What is HMB going to do today? harikatha or regular concert--to those forumites who may not be familiar with HMB's repertoire he was excellent in BOTH Harikatha and Concerts. The Tanjoorian replies in Tamil loosely translated--Wait a few minutes--If he (HMB) STANDS it is going to be Harikatha and if he SITS it would be a concert--subtly indicating there is not much difference in HMB's singing!!!

[harimau]

T M Krishna, in my opinion, is a shrewd businessman. He has serious competition for talent. To differentiate himself, he is selling his concert with "what convention (including his own!!) is he going to break today?" The media is playing along, with The Hindu in the lead giving him pages for mundane opinions. Think about it - he has declared himself beyond criticism by claiming to sing for the soul.

In MBA courses, you are taught that, in a crowded field a company must have a USP (Unique Selling Proposition) to stand out.

We now know what is TMK's USP. For others, it is abhangs, the Snake Dance Song or the Blind Monkey Song.

If he is singing for the soul, can it be done in his home so that his soul is satisfied? [-x

I heard that his recent San Jose concert attracted a thousand persons though I can't think of an auditorium capable of handling that many persons. It merely proves P T Barnum was correct in saying that there is a sucker born every day. )

[harimau]

T M Krishna, in my opinion, is a shrewd businessman. He has serious competition for talent. To differentiate himself, he is selling his concert with "what convention (including his own!!) is he going to break today?" The media is playing along, with The Hindu in the lead giving him pages for mundane opinions. Think about it - he has declared himself beyond criticism by claiming to sing for the soul. Further, by declaring free concerts, he is slowly but steadily building up a following.

As to free concerts, one can say that he is charging as much as the traffic will bear! [-x

A sabha secretary once vehemently expressed his opinion about TMK forcing the free concert upon the sabha and demanding that all seats be first-come-first-served. He asked, "What business has TMK got to make our season-ticket holders who are 70+ stand in line starting at 6 in the morning to get a token to get into the auditorium? He may charge no fee for the concert but how are we to pay the accompanying artists without ticket sales? If he wants to do free concerts, let him erect a pandal in P S High School grounds at his own expense and have a free concert there so that the various sabhas are not inconvenienced by his insane demand!"

Let me add to that: TMK can bus his fans in from Mambalam, T-Nagar, Nanganallur, etc., so that they can also listen to the concert though Mylapore is not their neighborhood.

[Ponbhairavi]

Post 136 in my thread under critics and rasikas


and sang: "Vatapi Ganapathim Bhaje" as the last item of the program which brought the curtain down".
"
dream come true quite fast,,!!within seven days

[rajeshnat]

As to free concerts, one can say that he is charging as much as the traffic will bear! [-x

A sabha secretary once vehemently expressed his opinion about TMK forcing the free concert upon the sabha and demanding that all seats be first-come-first-served. He asked, "What business has TMK got to make our season-ticket holders who are 70+ stand in line starting at 6 in the morning to get a token to get into the auditorium? He may charge no fee for the concert but how are we to pay the accompanying artists without ticket sales? If he wants to do free concerts, let him erect a pandal in P S High School grounds at his own expense and have a free concert there so that the various sabhas are not inconvenienced by his insane demand!"

Let me add to that: TMK can bus his fans in from Mambalam, T-Nagar, Nanganallur, etc., so that they can also listen to the concert though Mylapore is not their neighborhood.

Harimau
YOur point is not completely logical to me yet , please explain post reading the following points

TMK has only taken morning slots , usually all morning slots are free in season that is generally a thumb rule. Yes typically musicians mature from non ticketed noon/afternoon(stage 1) to ticketed evening (stage 2)and then non ticketed morning (stage 3). Usually artists who are experienced and lost crowds move from stage 2 to stage 3(musical merit is there but commercial success is lost). TMK is very much a stage 2 performer as of now , he is creating a unique position (Looks like only he is able to do it ) and moves to stage 3 without losing stage 2 status , I would coin this special TMK stage as stage 2.5.

There are few concerts like vanimahal evening which Crama reviewed in another thread . The slot itself is stage 2 but he moves to stage 2.5 . My guess is perhaps he is working with sponsors like vanimahal to dole out money directly to sabha and also to him and his accompanists . This is with a logical assumption that sabhas will always expect their share for that evening concert . Is that assumption right?

On a side note ,I overheard when I walked out of NGS in this concert , that some stage 2 artists are getting marginalized in gate collection as stage 2.5 has a special attraction for crowds(how can payment beat free?) .

Can you explain bit more please and if I have made any wrong assumptions?

[Sivaramakrishnan]

The tanjoreans still are not giving much vredit to Tirunelveli rasikas(Kaveri still seems to outrun Tamiraparni!!).

I believe that most Tanjoreans who have a say on music are settled elsewhere and seek anonymity when it comes to expressing views on music.

[hema]

I am appalled by the many criticisms that come on this forum, not only for TMK but for others too.

I too went to the KFA concert. Rajeshnat's analysis is apt. The highlights for me were the tanam that was followed by the thillana, the todi alaapana was very good -- it was indeed very different, the Kapi was just great -- it was completely in mandara stayi and madhyama stayi. When it finished I was a bit sad -- would have liked a similar exercise from a madhyama stayi to taara stayi (at that time).

Later mulling over it -- I felt is this also not cliched in a sense? Why are we so stuck up on formats? Different artists experiment with different things -- we MUST acknowledge that they are great researchers in their fields, just as many of us in this forum are in our respective fields.

Initially when Sanjay used to take up Tamil songs for the main -- many used to feel that it should be from the Trinity. Now many of us look forward to the new composers that he has discovered who might have otherwise been lost. He does blend in phrases which sound Hindustani -- I remember a "suddha saveri" that had a flavor of durga. There was criticism from some of my friends -- why not?

Similarly an Abishek's todi/khamaas -- violates the grammar of todi/khamaas -- I think we need to be rational. The norm is perhaps that "Vinayakar kriti" is not sung at the end -- so what? I actually feel that Tyagaraja's mangalam is done a lot of disservice in concerts. I have heard that once MDR found that people were leaving when he started the mangalam -- he asked people to leave and then did complete justice -- singing all the charanams. Many who have attended this concert remember it even today.

A Bombay Jayashree -- sings too much Hindustani, etc. etc...

Also, I do feel it is condescending to state the following:

"it felt like MMI," "He reproduced MDR," "She sounds like Brinda/Mukta," "It was like Ramnad Krishnan tatrupam -- I remember once Sanjay commented -- yes, I too have listened to him a lot."

I feel that this forum looses its credibility when we indulge in remarks which are not seriously w.r.t the music. Rajeshnat's review is a very good review of what it was at the concert -- I will agree that it was good to an excellent concert.

The season is just beginning -- let us be constructive when we critique -- so that rasikas and musicians alike take us seriously. This is indeed important for Carnatic Music.

To the scientists, engineers, researchers in other fields -- just imagine being told this, "Oh! her research is very similar to her guide's!" I would surely dislike this -- yes I have learnt a lot from my teachers -- initially my research may have been incremental but I as I went along I hope to believe that I have made significant contribution in my own right.

I am sure this is true of any art too -- everything has its own scientific methodology.

Admin: I dislike the idea that this is anonymous.

[Tirunelveli1959]

I respectfully differ, but fully concede your right to your unique opinions. Once you are in the public domain, accolades and criticisms must be anticipated. Even in academic research, criticism can come in the form of "insignificant contribution". What is insignificant to one may not be to another, and for very valid reasons. In the field of art, emotions play some role in how one reacts to a performance on stage. To me, if the concert delivery distracts from my ability to appreciate the music, it is a problem. However, there is absolutely no reason for anyone to agree with my view of the world of carnatic music. I have listened to TMK several times (although not the specific concert in question). I find him very talented, although I would not yet acknowledge him as a great researcher in his field. That is why I focused on the "other issues" that, in my opinion, TMK is over-indulging in. Your example of MDR and mangalam only supports the argument that MDR perfectly understood the significance of mangalam. He delivered a "full court" prayer for the welfare of those who respected traditions by not walking away during the singing of the mangalam! That is why I strongly oppose singing a song in praise of Lord Ganesha ONLY at the conclusion of the concert (if he had done it at the beginning and the end, that would be fine by me). In my opinion, what he did disrespects widely-held sentiments about Lord Ganesha among Hindus. I am firmly of the view that carnatic music innovations should not upend these beliefs.

[vasanthakokilam]

Admin: I dislike the idea that this is anonymous.

Hema, what are you referring to?

Tirunelveli1959, Your comment that you are ok with the last song being vathapi if the first song is also on Lord Ganesha is interesting. I am trying to correlate that with 'what he did disrespects widely-held sentiments about Lord Ganesha among Hindus'.

On a lighter note, I have a friend who is a staunch believer in such things. One day after finishing a function ( which did start with invocation to Ganesha ) he said to himself 'Vinayaka! Vigenswara!!' as he stepped out. I asked him why he is invoking Ganesha at the end. He laughed and said 'No, that is for my car ride, so nothing bad happens'

[PUNARVASU]

VK, first is a prayer, the last one is a 'thanksgiving'. You ask for something, it is granted, you are duty bound to express your gratitude!

[arasi]

Ask not, it will be granted--
Defer not our thanks
Until the next concert
To invoke His blessings

For the concert to be
Auspicious, let's wait not
Till the very end--so, start
with a shubha mangalam

As a pilgrim in a temple,
We wander around, finding
Sanctums at random--as
Our steps guide us--So!