Sandeep Narayan, Music Club IIT Madras

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 28 Jan 2007, 15:32

Sandeep Narayan - Shertalai Sivakumar - R Sankaranarayanan

YOUTHFEST.
MUSIC CLUB IITM. DoMS Hall
10th Jan 07. 6:45 pm

vanajAkshi - kalyANi - kaNDa aTa - Rangaswami
samayamitE - kEdAram - rUpakam - PSI (S)
rAma nI samanA - kharaharapriyA - rUpakam - T (RNS)
kalayAmi raghurAmam - bEgaDa - misra cApu - ST (RNS)
srI rAmam - nArAyaNagauLa - Adi - MD
krupajUcuDaku - chAyAtaraNgiNi - Adi - T
gana naya dEsikA - rishabhapriyA - Adi - KI (RS)
tani Avarththanam
tuma bin - kApi - Adi - Meera Bhajan
bArO krishnayyA - rAgamAlikA - Adi - Dasar Padam
Gayati vanamAli - Hamsadvani - Adi - SB
tillAnA - darbAri kAnaDa - misra cApu - S Kalyanaraman
nI nAma rUpamulaku - saurAshTRam - Adi - T

The concert began with a neat rendition of the kalyANi varNam. The kEdAram kriti was rendered well with a quick set of svarams. The kharaharapriyA AlApanai was good. The kriti was rendered with a good dose of neraval and svarams at 'paluku paluku'. The bEgaDa AlApanai was mixed, the rAga seeming unable to withstand the modern adventurous flourishes. The emphasis on phrase-based singing, which is essential for carnatic music, wasn't apparent with the rendition. The kriti was rendered with neraval and svarams.

Mercifully, most contemporary musicians do not have a grip over the once-popular nArAyaNagauLa. Without improvisations and flourishes, the kriti was rendered well. The rishabapriyA AlApanai was good. The kriti was rendered nicely with a good round of svarams.

The post tani pieces were all rendered nicely.

The vocalist is talented and promising but needs to slow down a bit, provide gaps between phrases during his AlApanAs and create an ambience of sowkyam. Sivakumar, though not his best, provided competent support. SankaranArAyaNan, who is generally capable of adroit support, was again a shade below his usual standard.

bharath

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 28 Jan 2007, 15:48

rbharath wrote:samayamitE

- samayamidE

krupajUcuDaku

- kRpajUcuTaku

Mercifully, most contemporary musicians do not have a grip over the once-popular nArAyaNagauLa.

???!!!

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 28 Jan 2007, 15:53

drshrikaanth wrote:
Mercifully, most contemporary musicians do not have a grip over the once-popular nArAyaNagauLa.
???!!!

i m told nArAyaNagauLa was a very popularly elaborated ragam once upon a time. like the times of maha vaidhyanatha sivan

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 28 Jan 2007, 15:55

Yep= Like nArAyaNagauLa kuppayyar. But why "Mercifully" not elaborated. Thats what nonplussed me. Are you saying, you expect the contemporary elaboration to be so awful that not singing t is merciful? :rolleyes:

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 28 Jan 2007, 15:58

drshrikaanth wrote:Yep= Like nArAyaNagauLa kuppayyar. But why "Mercifully" not elaborated. Thats what nonplussed me. Are you saying, you expect the contemporary elaboration to be so awful that not singing t is merciful? :rolleyes:

well, sort of yes. this is the true opinion after the bEgaDa he presented before the nArAyaNagauLa.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 28 Jan 2007, 16:05

rbharath wrote:well, sort of yes. this is the true opinion after the bEgaDa he presented before the nArAyaNagauLa.

But what you wrote makes a sweeping generalisation about All contemporary musicians, not just this artist on this particular day. Not a good idea Bharath.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 28 Jan 2007, 16:19

drshrikaanth wrote:
rbharath wrote:well, sort of yes. this is the true opinion after the bEgaDa he presented before the nArAyaNagauLa.
But what you wrote makes a sweeping generalisation about All contemporary musicians, not just this artist on this particular day. Not a good idea Bharath.

I havent once heard an elaboration of nArAyaNagauLa as a detailed AlApanai like those in the historical reports. a short sketch here and there, a quick round of svarams or so, that too doyens like SSI or CSP dont make it a popularly sung rAgam.

Any reports or recordings to be prove me wrong, i would be more than happy to listen.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 28 Jan 2007, 16:39

rbharath wrote:Any reports or recordings to be prove me wrong, i would be more than happy to listen.

SO just on the basis that you have not heard any elaboration by conteporary musicians, how can you assume that it is "Merciful" that it is not sung. Sounds a bit like fox and the sour grapes:)

There is nothing to prove here. The onus lies on you to prove that your statement was justified. My point is, you cannot assume poor quality just beacuse someone has not sung it/you have not heard it. Just because no one sings ghaNTA/ AndhALi does not mean necessarily that it is "Merciful" that these rAgas are not sung.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 28 Jan 2007, 18:01

Wanting to know more about upcoming young vocalists, I went to several morning and afternoon concerts. Of course, with all the running around, I couldnt listen to entire concerts. One such concert was Sandeep's at Petachi Hall. He has a rich voice and he seems serious about his music. I heard a very good sEvE srI kAntham and anupama guNAmbudhi. He sang an impressive tODi (kaddanuvAriki) with detailed AlApanAa. He reminded me of John Higgins BhAgavathar! A lovely voice AND intonation--then it struck me--though born of indian parents, he is american. No wonder, he sang aththambu jEkiLa as jEkiLA ('a' at the end becoming 'A') and so on. Charming, the way my grandson pronounces some tamizh words!

Sandeep, aren't you a member of the Forum? I don't see any of your posts these days. Since you are not back in the US, I guess you have taken a year off...

jnaanasoonyam · Post by **jnaanasoonyam** » 28 Jan 2007, 18:50

arasi wrote:No wonder, he sang aththambu jEkiLa as jEkiLA ('a' at the end becoming 'A') and so on. Charming, the way my grandson pronounces some tamizh words!

Ummm... quite charming the way, we Tamilians pronounce Telugu words too. That should be 'addampu cekkiLLacE...' :/

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 28 Jan 2007, 23:11

Sorry, jnAnasoonyam! In my emphasizing the elongation of the A, I typed on without thinking about the other words (and when I learnt the song, that was how I was taught too!) Thanks for pointing it out. I am learning something every day. I repeat after you: addampu cekkiLachE

Jayashri · Post by **Jayashri** » 29 Jan 2007, 07:36

who is his guru?

ram · Post by **ram** » 29 Jan 2007, 07:46

Sri Sanjay Subrahmanyan

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 29 Jan 2007, 08:44

jnaanasoonyam wrote:
rbharath wrote:Any reports or recordings to be prove me wrong, i would be more than happy to listen.
Pls do listen happily to this:
http://www.rogepost.com/n/5582098957

(Smt. S. Sowmya with RK Shriramkumar)

jnaanasoonyam,
We walk a tightrope between our joy when people share music and headaches that come from u/l of tracks which can land us (as a forum) in hot water and threaten our continued existence. As a policy, whenever clips featuring contemporary artists are u/led, we usually ask that you obtain permission from the artists before posting here. I have moved the post temporarily until I hear from you. Please email me thro' the forum if you do have permission. If this is a track that you d/led from another site, just give the url to that site, and not the track please. We do not want to deal with copyright issues again. I hope everyone understands.
Ravi
Moderator.

rasam · Post by **rasam** » 29 Jan 2007, 09:03

Mercifully, most contemporary musicians do not have a grip over the once-popular nArAyaNagauLa

This does not make any sense whatsoever if the interpretation is: "One has to be grateful that contemporary musicians dont have a grip on narayanagowla"

I think what rbharath meant to say is: "given that contemporary musicians have no grip on narayana gowla, one is grateful that they dont go about elaborating it, thereby possibly misinterpreting the ragam and straying into similar ragams".

I dont have any problem with this interpretation as long as it is a personal opinion. I am not saying that I agree with rbharath, I am just saying that its reasonable.

DRS, I dont see why you are nitpicking and taking such an aggressive stance on this when rbharath is only expressing an opinion. Are you acting on behalf of all musicians defending on what they could do with narayana gowla?

gravikiran · Post by **gravikiran** » 29 Jan 2007, 09:10

btw, i have heard atleast three contemporary musicians sing a detailed raga and swaras for narayanagowla....my guru sri tm krishna, sri sanjay subramaniam and smt soumya.
in all these three instances, the alapana was sung for atleast 7-8 minutes.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 29 Jan 2007, 12:54

No matter how you look at it, Nitpicking or otherwise,

"Mercifully, most contemporary musicians do not have a grip over the once-popular nArAyaNagauLa "
Does not make sense.
"Regretfully" , Yes.It makes sense to crave for a hearing for a detailed essay of a raga , that exists only on Paper.
Or even
"Mercifully , Most artists of today do not attempt an elaborate essay of this once popular raga "
(I can understand Bharaths predicament, in this case, since he always sits in the front row , unlike me - I prefer to stay as close to the Exit Door as possible)

rasam · Post by **rasam** » 29 Jan 2007, 13:59

Aaaargh!!!! My first line should read: "This does NOT make any sense" and not the way it is ... I hate it when I make mistakes like this

I have edited this.

Coolkarni, of course you're right. The statement does not make sense as is. If you read my post entirely, I was only trying to make sense out of it apropos to what I thought Bharath had in mind.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 29 Jan 2007, 16:56

rshankar, the link doesnt work...

all i wanted to say was that, if only today's musicians had a good grip over nArAyaNagauLa, then, sandeep would have tried stuff with it, and it would have landed up like the bEgaDa he sang before. i dont wish to have any hand on all other interpretations made by esteemed forum members.

not able to hear good and detailed Alapanais of rAgams like nArAyaNagauLa is however a very geniune crib which i always have.

mahavishnu · Post by **mahavishnu** » 30 Jan 2007, 04:19

On the topic of Narayanagowlai...

Here's an interview with Sanjay Subrahmanyan where he talks about this raga (and its demise)

......"Another fine little story he relates in this regard involves Semmangudi Srinivasa Iyer. â€œMy guru Calcutta Krishnamurthy once said that Surutti was dying and Narayanagaulai was already dead, and he added that Semmangudi sings Narayanagaulai very well. So I went to him and learnt Sriramam (Narayanagaulai) â€“ and I got to learn another uncommon song as a bonus, Srisukra bhagavantam in Paras.â€

jnaanasoonyam · Post by **jnaanasoonyam** » 30 Jan 2007, 11:31

rshankar, the track I uploaded is just an extract, an 8-min clip of the alapana alone from a live concert recording done in the US. I don't see how an illustrative clip can be a problem. Many ppl in the US don't have any problems mailing hard disks full of music to each other, with hardly any benefit to the artistes... and all of a sudden a representative clip poses a copyright problem! Very funny! :/

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 30 Jan 2007, 11:59

to reiterate what i meant to say in a more elaborate fashion.

Each kriti has a set tune and set of sangatis. It is always prefered to hear it in the same tune with all the sangatis that are known. An abridged version, with lesser number of sangatis isnt usually prefered.

many musicians (past and present) tend add up their own frills and flourishing sangatis to kritis. and such instance in case of giants and big vidwans add up to the effect and one such thing once in a while definitely gives a new flavour to the kriti presented. with time, these flourishes can also add up as new sangatis to the kriti, and i m not against this.

however, such flourishing attempts dont really work in some cases. Especially if one tries to do such things with rAgams one is not at home with, then they can be disastrous. In the concert under discussion, after the bEgaDa one heard, one just felt that the singer did not venture into such stuff with nArAyaNagauLa and hence the kriti was far more better to hear, without added frills which can be dangerous.

tylerconscious · Post by **tylerconscious** » 30 Jan 2007, 16:18

I think we all ought to get the artist's name right, before we proceed to discuss the technicalities of his music or music in general. His name is Sandeep Narayan and not Narayanan. Good day!

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 30 Jan 2007, 17:31

Not to worry, tylerconscious--Sandeep, being his guru's student, has also been taught to put up with his name being spelt incorrectly many a time, I guess. Seriously, we are refering to Sandeep Narayan, disciple of Sanjay Subrahmanyan, aren't we? Well, hope this helps...

chalanata · Post by **chalanata** » 30 Jan 2007, 17:53

what difference does it make? ultimately it is only music which is going to establish the name!

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 30 Jan 2007, 17:57

kulkarni or gulgarni ,
kedar or kader ,
yeah, whats the big deal?
I have learnt to live with it for decades !

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 30 Jan 2007, 22:59

So has buTmiNi (padmini)! Remember our discussion on pronounciation in the Language Section?

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 01 Feb 2007, 20:09

chalanata wrote:what difference does it make? ultimately it is only music which is going to establish the name!

Well, it does matter I suppose to the person who is referred. With a long name like mine people (in the US) used to refer to me as Subterranean (as though I am underground), Submarinia (or under water), and a host of other names. Of course for people who are used to monosyllabic names it is a mouthful. I got used to such butcherings and eventually told them all to call me "Sub" as other members in this forum do now. An occasional misspelling or mispronunciation is OK but the person referred to would really like his/her name written and/or pronounced properly. It is proper etiquette too. If you care enough to write or speak about him/her you should care to make sure the name is written/spelled right too. That is my take.

shripathi_g · Post by **shripathi_g** » 03 Feb 2007, 14:59

Well, my full name Sripathi Guruprasannaraj had to be shortened as 'Raj' which is pronounced as 'Rah' sometimes, in Spanish/Mexican influenced California.

manoranjitham · Post by **manoranjitham** » 04 Feb 2007, 08:09

i would concur with Rasam. No point in nitpicking on views expressed honestly. Unless u have an agenda. i do not know whether the comments are from persons who heard the concert. Or one is trying to pick on a single word and embarass an honest opinion.
After hearing Begada , he perhaps felt that Narayanagoula , not being a very popoular raga, escaped being distorted. Why can u not take it that 'merciful' applied to the listener. That is how i would take it.
Also, the greater the rasanai of the listener, the higher is the level of outrage, disappointment etc.
Dont we say " Nalla Kalam. Intha Ragam avarukku nanna theriyathu pol irukku. Namba Thappichom".
i would prefer Bharath to continue with his honest opinions.
For those that may not know, Narayanagoula was the raga chosen by Maha Vaidyanatha Iyer to fox the experts who wanted him to justify the title "Maha".