On reading two of the threads--one on the Cleveland ArAdhanA and the other on the Jugalbandi concert of the Carnatica Brothers--I started thinking about what we rasikAs are all about, especially in expressing our thoughts on the forum. I was away from my computer for nearly a week and hadn't read these postings until now.
Art needs patrons in order to survive. We as rasikAs are vital in this respect for CM--for its health and growth. However, our role as rasikAs is a passive one. The artistes are the ones who are the active players. If they do not make music, we have nothing to appreciate or to discuss about.
I was surprised to read the two threads. How do they serve us--with all the furor that they created? Allowing that all that was said was spoken in earnestness, I had a feeling that it was more like a boxing bout in which some participants expressed their frustrations, punched the 'opponents' either to give vent to their ill feelings or to show how much they knew better, donning Subbudu's mantle.
Constructive criticism is something we speak about once in a while on the forum. Not only that. We practise it. Constructive criticism is not just praises (as some seem to think).
A review is not about a particular artiste (s) in the first place. It is about a particular performance which the critic attended on a particular day. It involves not only those who performed on the stage that day, but also factors like songs selection, the performers' well being, their mood, the sponsors, their part, the audience--and the list goes on. If we were to expect to hear nothing less than what WE expect when we attend concerts, it is just as well that we listen to recorded music at home. If we find flaws in the music, even if we choose to attend a concert, we could always write to or E-mail the performers. That is constructive criticism. For a moment, imagine all the erstwhile mahA vidwAns and vidushis practising music today. Of the thousands of performances they gave in their times, how many were outstanding? Sruti lapses, mispronounciation, straying away from the rAgAs, voice problems and singing not wholeheartedly--were all part of their performances. Yet, we admire them and are in awe of the wonderful legacy they have left us. For modern day performers to follow in their footsteps, make wonderful music (with flaws here and there) and to carry on the legacy of CM, we need to be more positive than what came out in the two threads. Modern media keeps them under scrutiny which their eders did not have to go through.
We come across the expression 'elitism' (meaning snobbery) in the forum. Elitism of that kind is not of any value. If the word stands to mean 'selectivity', then it is fine. Thinking of our valuable critics on the forum--all serve the forum in their own way. They have one thing in common. They all love CM. However keen their critical faculty and rasanA, they have their zeal for preserving CM's health. With that core feeling, they write their criticism. Take others on the forum: Lakshman, who would dedicate himself to the task of finding and feeding the rasika community with their requests for lyrics. Cool, who continues to be awed and thrilled with all good music that he hears, and loves to share. CML, who knows so much about anything and everything including music, and who is like a child in his enthusiasm for music. Aren't they all discerning rasikAs and critics? Or, is the role of a critic (and rasikA) merely dissecting and deriding musicians? Does this make us all patrons of CM?
I do appreciate Shashikiran's sportiveness and maturity in responding to such a tirade.
In our love to preserve CM, let us not demoralize existing talent.
The same thoughts also apply to the Cleveland thread. It is a laudable phenomenon that TyAgarAjA is celebrated continents away from India, bringing musicians from Chennai and elsewhere to Cleveland, and a happening like that does not call for such drivel. This annual event has come to exist because of the love and dedication and perseverence of music lovers (humans, not gods) in freezing Cleveland.
It now brings me to the children--the future of CM--our hope and joy, and the future of the music of the gods is in their hands. Please, there is no room for abuse in the house of Muse, especially when it concerns the children...
Reviews and The Role of A RasikA
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chalanata
- Posts: 603
- Joined: 06 Feb 2010, 15:55
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arasi
- Posts: 16877
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
Chalanata,
Which thread was it? I might have missed some of the postings because of my not keeping up with the threads due to my involvement in other activities. I admit there are times when things get ugly and I tend to keep my distance. Was it one of those times, I wonder? Anyway, it wasn't intentional, and we are all friends here and you know that. I cringe at that kind of 'elitism' you refer to! All the same, I apologize for not paying attention to what was going on...:rolleyes:
Which thread was it? I might have missed some of the postings because of my not keeping up with the threads due to my involvement in other activities. I admit there are times when things get ugly and I tend to keep my distance. Was it one of those times, I wonder? Anyway, it wasn't intentional, and we are all friends here and you know that. I cringe at that kind of 'elitism' you refer to! All the same, I apologize for not paying attention to what was going on...:rolleyes:
Last edited by arasi on 24 May 2007, 08:42, edited 1 time in total.
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coolkarni
chalanata
Dealing with Arasi always reminds me of a recipe I Read long long ago for making Rhubharb pie.
It concluded by saying Muster all the sugar you can
and THEN
DOUBLE IT , before pouring it in .
Invite yourself for breakfast , at their Home If you Can.
You will never forget the experience in your Life.It is such a pity that these forum pages really do not convey our full personalities.
Dealing with Arasi always reminds me of a recipe I Read long long ago for making Rhubharb pie.
It concluded by saying Muster all the sugar you can
and THEN
DOUBLE IT , before pouring it in .
Invite yourself for breakfast , at their Home If you Can.
You will never forget the experience in your Life.It is such a pity that these forum pages really do not convey our full personalities.
Last edited by coolkarni on 24 May 2007, 10:25, edited 1 time in total.
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vgvindan
- Posts: 1430
- Joined: 13 Aug 2006, 10:51
Every musician is a rasika first; looking from that angle and that of rasikas like coolkarni, arasi et al who have the first hand knowledge of all aspects of music, I do not agree that the 'role of rasika is passive one'. True, persons like me who do not have musical training may be passive spectators, well, that also may not be wholly true.Art needs patrons in order to survive. We as rasikAs are vital in this respect for CM--for its health and growth. However, our role as rasikAs is a passive one. The artistes are the ones who are the active players.
I do not have to elaborate more because from reading the remaining portion of arasi's posting, it does not seem that 'rasikas are indeed passive players'.
Rasikas should continue to play an active role in the interest of health and development of the art. By 'active' I do not mean 'motivated' criticism - even such criticism can become a building block.
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chalanata
- Posts: 603
- Joined: 06 Feb 2010, 15:55
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coolkarni
Chalanata
Melancholy !!!!
Wow ! you are now ideally prepared to Receive Hindusthani music ...
I ,for one ,keep myself sane with this priceless bit of advice.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/8xeyex
A 56 second clip of amir Khan that I have treasured for may years.
He ends a Concert with a very melancholic Charukesi and is egged on by the audience.
The clip ends with his reopening of the proceedings with a Bhatiyar.
Almost as if signalling to the audience and Gods that he is aware that the dreamy sadness of the night does give way to the joy of the break of dawn.
Charukesi and Bhatiyar- What a combination !!
So please do pull yourself up.Nothing much has changed , and will only get better.
Melancholy !!!!
Wow ! you are now ideally prepared to Receive Hindusthani music ...
I ,for one ,keep myself sane with this priceless bit of advice.
Here is this advice in pristine musical form, too.Certain things can at the same time be good, bad, and indifferent,
e.g., music is good to the melancholy,
bad to those who mourn, and
neither good nor bad to the deaf.
Baruch Spinoza
http://www.sendspace.com/file/8xeyex
A 56 second clip of amir Khan that I have treasured for may years.
He ends a Concert with a very melancholic Charukesi and is egged on by the audience.
The clip ends with his reopening of the proceedings with a Bhatiyar.
Almost as if signalling to the audience and Gods that he is aware that the dreamy sadness of the night does give way to the joy of the break of dawn.
Charukesi and Bhatiyar- What a combination !!
So please do pull yourself up.Nothing much has changed , and will only get better.
Last edited by coolkarni on 24 May 2007, 20:03, edited 1 time in total.
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arasi
- Posts: 16877
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
Cool,
Your rhubarb serving as a cure for a 'rhubarb'!
In my very first home, we had a clump of rhubarb. Enough for my neighbor to bake pies with tons of sugar and share them with me! I cooked them in sugar syrup and topped them on toast instead of jam. As tart as they are, they have a fragrance which I love. When I came to know that the leaves were poisonous (it is their red stems you use). I dug it up, fearing that my little daughter might nibble on them! Still, a slice of rhubarb pie with coffee is my choice, next only to blueberry.
Listening to Ganesh Kumaresh's 'yArO ivar yArO' as I type. Is it really G&K? Such nidAnam and sukham!
Your rhubarb serving as a cure for a 'rhubarb'!
In my very first home, we had a clump of rhubarb. Enough for my neighbor to bake pies with tons of sugar and share them with me! I cooked them in sugar syrup and topped them on toast instead of jam. As tart as they are, they have a fragrance which I love. When I came to know that the leaves were poisonous (it is their red stems you use). I dug it up, fearing that my little daughter might nibble on them! Still, a slice of rhubarb pie with coffee is my choice, next only to blueberry.
Listening to Ganesh Kumaresh's 'yArO ivar yArO' as I type. Is it really G&K? Such nidAnam and sukham!
Last edited by arasi on 25 May 2007, 06:26, edited 1 time in total.
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arasi
- Posts: 16877
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
Govindan,
As you say, musicians are rasikAs too. And, rasikAs are not passive either. I merely said it in the sense of a performance where the musicians take over and we sit there listening. From the performer's point of view, we ARE active. Still, we have no say in the happening, except be at the receiving end...
By the way, I disagree with you on your calling me someone who knows a lot about music. No, I do not, and coming from
YOU, it makes it even worse!
As you say, musicians are rasikAs too. And, rasikAs are not passive either. I merely said it in the sense of a performance where the musicians take over and we sit there listening. From the performer's point of view, we ARE active. Still, we have no say in the happening, except be at the receiving end...
By the way, I disagree with you on your calling me someone who knows a lot about music. No, I do not, and coming from
YOU, it makes it even worse!
Last edited by arasi on 25 May 2007, 06:28, edited 1 time in total.
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coolkarni
Govindan Said
The Role of the Rasika Vs the Artist has been an issue ,very difficult for me to assess, for a long long time.
There was nothing else in this world that was similar to this relationship.
Until I had an opportunity to live in Kancheepuram for 5 Years.Frequently , I had the task of guiding Foreign Guests with their Silk Purchases (Customers at my Company)
In due course of time I became a regular visitor at some of the well known shops .
Not being interested in the Purchase activity as such, my mind would wander around and absorb the richness of the insides of these shops.
(The ones I frequented had the owners Residences adjoining the shop - like an internal extension and very often I was allowed into portions that were quite interior)
And what a world it was.The Opulence would be so striking and yet standing outside the same shop , it was a different kind of glitter that would attract the undecided buyer.
The Floors were so rich, they seemed to talk in hushed voices , lest the IT guys be alerted.The Door frames, the Curtains , the soft cushions in the drawing rooms- It was a different world altogether.
And that is where the nearest metaphorical equivalent of this relationship struck me .
The same building looks and means so different from the outsides and insides.
And It takes a fine artist to beckon the visitor , with varying levels of appreciation , in to this structure and open up the beauty from the insides.
Every single Concert , Every single Lecture , Every single Demonstration, Every single Composition , why every single sharing of a track or thought can be a point where such images are moved around seamlessly.
The man who is enticing you at the doorstep is a chap who knows all the languages of India (the broker)
and at the other extreme is the simple white clad owner, who knows his silk, travels to surat twice a year , can talk on weaving techniques for hours , and was once a Connoisseur before he became a Marketer.
A great reviewer would be one who is interested in the full process , than just the concert.
Yes NMN was one such name.Mohan Nadkarni, another.
I would like to meet THAT coolkarni one day ..coolkarni, et al who have the first hand knowledge of all aspects of music,
The Role of the Rasika Vs the Artist has been an issue ,very difficult for me to assess, for a long long time.
There was nothing else in this world that was similar to this relationship.
Until I had an opportunity to live in Kancheepuram for 5 Years.Frequently , I had the task of guiding Foreign Guests with their Silk Purchases (Customers at my Company)
In due course of time I became a regular visitor at some of the well known shops .
Not being interested in the Purchase activity as such, my mind would wander around and absorb the richness of the insides of these shops.
(The ones I frequented had the owners Residences adjoining the shop - like an internal extension and very often I was allowed into portions that were quite interior)
And what a world it was.The Opulence would be so striking and yet standing outside the same shop , it was a different kind of glitter that would attract the undecided buyer.
The Floors were so rich, they seemed to talk in hushed voices , lest the IT guys be alerted.The Door frames, the Curtains , the soft cushions in the drawing rooms- It was a different world altogether.
And that is where the nearest metaphorical equivalent of this relationship struck me .
The same building looks and means so different from the outsides and insides.
And It takes a fine artist to beckon the visitor , with varying levels of appreciation , in to this structure and open up the beauty from the insides.
Every single Concert , Every single Lecture , Every single Demonstration, Every single Composition , why every single sharing of a track or thought can be a point where such images are moved around seamlessly.
The man who is enticing you at the doorstep is a chap who knows all the languages of India (the broker)
and at the other extreme is the simple white clad owner, who knows his silk, travels to surat twice a year , can talk on weaving techniques for hours , and was once a Connoisseur before he became a Marketer.
A great reviewer would be one who is interested in the full process , than just the concert.
Yes NMN was one such name.Mohan Nadkarni, another.
Last edited by coolkarni on 26 May 2007, 09:56, edited 1 time in total.
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knandago2001
- Posts: 645
- Joined: 05 Sep 2006, 10:09
The eminent dance critic Walter Terry once wrote:
“The most articulate forefinger in the world of dance made its American debut last evening at the Jacob’s Pillow Dance Festival. It was a forefinger that, employing 2,000 years of gestural dance development, could summon or dismiss, invite or caution, assure or tease, make an airy comment or project an indisputable command. This remarkable forefinger belonged to Balasaraswati….
Of course, Balasaraswati moved more than her forefinger… All of her gestures, employing one or more fingers, the entire hand, the arms and the shoulders spoke musically, or when a story was to be conveyed, symbolically or explicitly as the situation demanded. I mention the forefinger specifically because it characterized the dancer’s special approach to her art, an approach not based upon physical virtuosity but rather upon nuances, shading subtleties. Because she is not flashy, the nearer one sits to the stage, the more affecting is her art, for then the exquisite details – pursing of the mouth, the flicker of an eyelid – are not lost.
Balasaraswati truly… is a great actress-dancer whose purpose is to reveal the feelings of gods and of men and not merely startle the beholder.â€
“The most articulate forefinger in the world of dance made its American debut last evening at the Jacob’s Pillow Dance Festival. It was a forefinger that, employing 2,000 years of gestural dance development, could summon or dismiss, invite or caution, assure or tease, make an airy comment or project an indisputable command. This remarkable forefinger belonged to Balasaraswati….
Of course, Balasaraswati moved more than her forefinger… All of her gestures, employing one or more fingers, the entire hand, the arms and the shoulders spoke musically, or when a story was to be conveyed, symbolically or explicitly as the situation demanded. I mention the forefinger specifically because it characterized the dancer’s special approach to her art, an approach not based upon physical virtuosity but rather upon nuances, shading subtleties. Because she is not flashy, the nearer one sits to the stage, the more affecting is her art, for then the exquisite details – pursing of the mouth, the flicker of an eyelid – are not lost.
Balasaraswati truly… is a great actress-dancer whose purpose is to reveal the feelings of gods and of men and not merely startle the beholder.â€
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vasanthakokilam
- Posts: 10958
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01
Quite an apt analogy, Kji. The passion for anything seems to be originate being a Connoisseur. It is not a requirement to do well in any field but the quality of the output is at a different level when it comes from being a Connoisseur. Of course different people reach there travelling different paths including those who are forced into that role first and then learning to appreciate the nuances and subtlities.who knows his silk, travels to surat twice a year , can talk on weaving techniques for hours , and was once a Connoisseur before he became a Marketer.
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arasi
- Posts: 16877
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
knandago,
What an open mind can evaluate, in response to soaking up the cutural expression of an alien dancer! The times were different, Indian culture was what one read in books about, and what Hollywood portrayed (in a stilted way). Balasaraswathi was not beautiful in the glamorous sense, nor was she svelte. Her art took hold of her and she radiated all that it stood for.
VK,
Funny, you should speak of connoisseurs. The art critic as one, sees through the ambiguities of an art form he is not familiar with--and his response to it is typical of one who has a passion for art, no matter where it comes from. I am thinking of the other thread Ravi posted where a south indian vocalist gets a supercilious treatment from a modern day critic (and the concert happened days ago--not decades ago.The critic is not from another part of this globalized world, either!).
Coming back to Balasaraswathi, she was one of a kind. All that Walter Terry says echo my feelings about the great woman, and I had only seen her dance in my childhood! I wasn't a connoisseur--just a child whose mind got blown, seeing such art!
What an open mind can evaluate, in response to soaking up the cutural expression of an alien dancer! The times were different, Indian culture was what one read in books about, and what Hollywood portrayed (in a stilted way). Balasaraswathi was not beautiful in the glamorous sense, nor was she svelte. Her art took hold of her and she radiated all that it stood for.
VK,
Funny, you should speak of connoisseurs. The art critic as one, sees through the ambiguities of an art form he is not familiar with--and his response to it is typical of one who has a passion for art, no matter where it comes from. I am thinking of the other thread Ravi posted where a south indian vocalist gets a supercilious treatment from a modern day critic (and the concert happened days ago--not decades ago.The critic is not from another part of this globalized world, either!).
Coming back to Balasaraswathi, she was one of a kind. All that Walter Terry says echo my feelings about the great woman, and I had only seen her dance in my childhood! I wasn't a connoisseur--just a child whose mind got blown, seeing such art!
Last edited by arasi on 27 May 2007, 02:37, edited 1 time in total.
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vasanthakokilam
- Posts: 10958
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01
Arasi, quite right. connoisseur may not be the term to capture that quality that comes from passion. I guess the term would be 'one who truly enjoys something but is not elitist about it'.
Another thing I found in many different areas is that the passion leads someone, over time, to see through the artificial complexities in things and strip them out and see the beauty of the core in simple terms. Simplicity does not necessarily have to end in trivializing things. The one who deeply understands and appreciates things has the ability to explain them in an easy to understand manner, emphasizing the core. That core, in many cases, turns out to be simple and beautiful. A reviewer should be able to communicate that beauty to the rasikas, either directly or using relatable metaphors. The student or the reader may not relate to that essence right way but that is OK.
An example from computer science comes to my mind, though it may take it a bit out of scope from this thread. After getting tortured by beginning programming courses where they ask one to generate prime numbers, Fibonacci sequence and do matrix multiplications, the field looked very dry for me. It is also common among beginners to get bogged down in smart tricks rather than writing understandable programs. Luckily, early on, I happened to read on my own the classic book by Niklaus Wirth 'Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs'. That book did not teach me programming specifics but laid bare in simple and beautiful terms what it is all about. To me, he is a Guru in the true sense of the word, passionate about teaching computer science and that shows through clearly in all his writings.
I do not know where that passion to communicate comes from. What is the motivation? Is it a boost to their own ego and validation of their skills by others' praising their contribution? Or is it purely the personal satisfaction they derive that they made someone see the point. I do not want to make a value judgement as to which motivation is better since it does not really matter but if it is the former it may show itself in their reaction to criticism of their work.
Another thing I found in many different areas is that the passion leads someone, over time, to see through the artificial complexities in things and strip them out and see the beauty of the core in simple terms. Simplicity does not necessarily have to end in trivializing things. The one who deeply understands and appreciates things has the ability to explain them in an easy to understand manner, emphasizing the core. That core, in many cases, turns out to be simple and beautiful. A reviewer should be able to communicate that beauty to the rasikas, either directly or using relatable metaphors. The student or the reader may not relate to that essence right way but that is OK.
An example from computer science comes to my mind, though it may take it a bit out of scope from this thread. After getting tortured by beginning programming courses where they ask one to generate prime numbers, Fibonacci sequence and do matrix multiplications, the field looked very dry for me. It is also common among beginners to get bogged down in smart tricks rather than writing understandable programs. Luckily, early on, I happened to read on my own the classic book by Niklaus Wirth 'Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs'. That book did not teach me programming specifics but laid bare in simple and beautiful terms what it is all about. To me, he is a Guru in the true sense of the word, passionate about teaching computer science and that shows through clearly in all his writings.
I do not know where that passion to communicate comes from. What is the motivation? Is it a boost to their own ego and validation of their skills by others' praising their contribution? Or is it purely the personal satisfaction they derive that they made someone see the point. I do not want to make a value judgement as to which motivation is better since it does not really matter but if it is the former it may show itself in their reaction to criticism of their work.