Lyrics And Notations-chindai Arindu Vade En Selvakumaran

bala · Post by **bala** » 02 Dec 2006, 15:59

Can anyone give me the lyrics(notations if possible) of the ragamallika: "chindai arindu vade en selvakumaran......
2 para: chinnam chiruvaithil ennai malai itane chirikka chirikka pesi kai valai thotane.
thanks

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 04 Dec 2006, 22:08

Bala,
All I remember is the beginning of the song:

chindai aRindu vADi, selvakkumaran
chendUr iDam thangum pon tAL malar kandan (chindai)

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 26 Jul 2007, 10:04

bala

Can anyone give me the lyrics(notations if possible) of the ragamallika: "chindai arindu vade en selvakumaran......

arasi

All I remember is the beginning of the song:

chindai aRindu vADi, selvakkumaran
chendUr iDam thangum pon tAL malar kandan (chindai)

This is one of the oldest songs, sung in 50s which many would not have heard. How did you come to know about it? In view of such situations/requests I felt it was necessary to start a new thred vide http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?pid=54970#p54970 which please read and help the posterity.

Here is the song in English translieration. Members may help bala with notations:

rAgamAlikai Adi

shaNmukhapriyA

P: cindai aRinduvADi selvakkumaran
cendUr iDam thangum pon tAL malar kandan (chindai)

AP: andO en Asai ellAm koLLai koNDAnE
ARumukha vaDivElan sivabAlan (chindai)

harikAmbOdi

C1: anRu vandu pOnadu avarkku ninaivillaiyO
AriTTa bOdanaiyO anbumanam vallaiyO
onRupaTTirundiDa uRudi manam illaiyO
uddEsam tAn enna cittan magan kuhan (chindai)

SuraTi

C2: cinnam ciRu vayadil ennai mAlai iTTAnE
cirikka cirikkap pEsi en kaivaLai toTTAnE
annam pAlum veRukka avaniyil kaiviTTAnE
aDimaipeNDIrenRu muDiya maRandiTTAnE (chindai)

kApi

C3: kaTTi toTTumE idazhk kani amudam pozhindAn
kadaRi madalai pOlE kumuRi muttam koDuttAn
eTTukkuDi vElavan isaiamudam pozhindAn
enRum piriyEn enRu en kaimEl aDittAn (chindai)

Here is the audio link:http://depositfiles.com/files/1312659

If you cannotdownload please leave your e mail id so that i can send the song as an attachment.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 26 Jul 2007, 13:08

Kutty/Others
Please provide lyrics only in English transliteration in this forum. This has already been mentioned several times. There is no need to provide lyrics in tamil routinely. I have edited your posts. Thanks.

Lakshman · Post by **Lakshman** » 26 Jul 2007, 16:31

Kutty:
Now that we are discussing this song from Sri vaLLi, do you happen to have the audio of the khamAs dance number from the film nAdhru dhru dhIm dhIm tana dhIm tananana sa ma ga mA pA dhA nI sa ni dha pa ma? Thanks.

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 26 Jul 2007, 20:32

I understand that from now on there shall be no Thamizh, Telugu, KannaDa, MalayALam, or Devanagari scripted writings in this forum. Correct me if I misunderstand.

vgvindan · Post by **vgvindan** » 26 Jul 2007, 22:49

drs,
Some times it becomes essential to look critically at the language scripts in order to glean exactly what is meant. Let us not be too strict in implementing language postings.

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 26 Jul 2007, 23:58

drshrikaanth

Kutty/Others

Please provide lyrics only in English transliteration in this forum. This has already been mentioned several times. There is no need to provide lyrics in tamil routinely. I have edited your posts. Thanks.

I protest your unilateral decision. I would like to make a request to all the members on this issue so that clear lines are drawn as to the Do(s) and Don't(s) for our guidance in future. This is a public forum where all sorts of people from different walks of life, religions and languages take part, and there is no place for caste, creed, language or religion, especially in the areas of music, since it is beyond all these boundaries. The decision should be democratic and not an arbitrary one. I must have been consulted before deleting the Thamizh version. I feel that the rules are for all and not for a few and none is having any special privilege, especially the administrator. As per srikris, all members are important and he does not want to lose anyone for trivial cause.

If I am correct, please refer to your posting vide http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?pid= 54396#p54396 (Post #2 on 20.07.2007) where you have provided the kannaDa scripts for the English transliteration for a composition of purandaradAsaru on the request of our member, kelvignanam. Further, there was another thread where you excerpted a long passage in kannaDa script from a kannaDa newspaper (with no English translation whatsoever). I am unable to recollect the identity of the location immediately. The very purpose of vgvindan's or arunk's transliteration editors will be defeated and all their efforts would go wasted if you would like to stick to your view.

I am the last person to encourage any chauvinism. However, I feel it is quite natural for anyone to contribute/provide references in the language(s) one is at ease. In this forum members have insisted that we should provide the kritis or songs in the languages they were made as to understand the correct pronunciation and better appreciation. Thus, I felt that a Thamizh song needs to be given in English for the benefit of non Thamizh and in Thamizh for those who know it. This applies to all the languages. I do not think that we will be wasting pages by doing this since I have been seeing a lot of members discussing non CM matters pages after pages as it would be monotonous to deal with only CM matters and we need break/diversion occasionally. If I am correct, due to such unwarranted domination, the forum has lost some good contributors. However, I will not do that unless Sri Ramakrishnan asks me to do so. If you are unaware, I would like to mention that I am one of those members who are with this forum even before its revival to its present form and my contributions have been lost along with those of others due to a mishap a few years back. srikris knows this.

Till a decision is taken in this regard, I agree with mahakavi's posting that we should have only English transliteration in future irrespective of requests made to this effect.

bala

Please note the correct wordings of the song that you have mentioned in your posting as well as the topic title wrongly.

Lakshman

The audio clipping is an exclusive one for this topic and I do not have Sri vaLLi khamas dance number.

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 27 Jul 2007, 00:25

http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3261
kutty: is this the page to which you are referring?

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 27 Jul 2007, 01:32

kutty:
In reply to a question by a fellow member in a thread
http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2857
srkris posted (post#3) "....I don't mind you posting in tamil script in your posts if you want that....."

I guess the new rule superceded srkris's concession. So be it!

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 27 Jul 2007, 05:56

mahakavi

Thanks. Yes, that's the one I was referring to. There was one more that I am unable to recollect. The instructions of srikris were in common for everyone under normal circumctances. However, he never objected to using the transliterations in languages other than English if the person posting it felt. My posting was for the reason(s) mentioned already and what I object is the arbitrary action and not the action.

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 27 Jul 2007, 16:21

Hi Guys,

Please note that there are no issues about using vernacular languages on this forum (as long as you also are able to post a decent transliteration).

Its not a rule of law that we impose on everyone, its just a request. If a song is in russian (just an assumption), just think how hard it will be for us to understand or appreciate it if we dont have a good transliteration and/or translation!

In the same way, if we use only our respective vernacular scripts, it might be really difficult for the majority that are not familiar with the scripts.

If a song is in Tamil/Kannada/Malayalam/Telugu etc, and we want to post it in the language it was composed, please provide a transliteration using roman(english) alphabets.

What we could better discourage is this:
If a song is in Tamil (for example), we shouldnt post it in any vernacular script other than its native script and the transliterated oman(english) script

The ideal situation would be just to use the english transliteration without using any Indian script, since it saves effort and also minimises conflict, but this doesnt mean its wrong to use the native script of the language in which the song is in.

I hope members give a thought to this and abide by it since its for the benifit of all of us. Thanks.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 27 Jul 2007, 18:01

srikris,
Thanks for making it all very clear. I am sure rasikAs would see it in the proper context now. As you said, it is time consuming to post entire songs twice over, in two languages. I feel that just as we write everything in english here, we write the songs too in roman script. Of course, when a doubt about some words arises, it is very helpful to post the lines (entire lyrics) in the language the song is written. It is also true that not all can read (even if they are proficient in the language) the various scripts on their computers...

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 27 Jul 2007, 19:20

Since this is a Forum devoted to CM and as most of the lyrics posted are in the interest of promoting CM we should encourage everybody to appreciate, popularize and render the lyrics in concerts or elsewhere. As such the Roman script makes it accessible to mostly all. Again the meaning will help the singer to have the right bhava while rendering as also the Rasika to understand the context of the lyric. We should also not unnecesarily wrangle about the format in Roman as long as it is clear from the context since not all (especially Tamil) is not a phonetic language!

I would like to thank our Lakshman our 'lyric Guru' for always posting in the Roman script (in spite of the added time and effort) and his example is worth emulating!

thanjavur · Post by **thanjavur** » 27 Jul 2007, 19:36

arasi wrote:srikris,
it is time consuming to post entire songs twice over, in two languages.

May be for someone like you. Not for many of us who want to see the lyrics posted
in the language in which it was composed (which we think would cut down on stupid
endless "discussions" involving the transliterated words).

thanjavur · Post by **thanjavur** » 27 Jul 2007, 19:38

cmlover wrote:I would like to thank our Lakshman our 'lyric Guru' for always posting in the Roman script (in spite of the added time and effort) and his example is worth emulating!

Please do not bring Lakshman in to this wrangle.

thanjavur · Post by **thanjavur** » 27 Jul 2007, 20:37

drshrikaanth wrote:Kutty/Others
Please provide lyrics only in English transliteration in this forum. This has already been mentioned several times. There is no need to provide lyrics in tamil routinely. I have edited your posts. Thanks.

srkris,
Please restore the Tamil lyrics that was removed by the
insensitive author of this post.

Thanks

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 27 Jul 2007, 23:30

I don't understand the restriction on the posting of lyrics. Yes, this site being operated in English must predominantly transact business in English, which we do. If somebody posts exclusively in one language (e.g.,) http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2510&p=2
(see posts#42 through 45) then somebody might have a gripe. There was also post exclusively in kannada (an excerpt from a newspaper or something). Personally I have no problems with that. If I can't understand the script I just pass through it. I am not going to complain, realizing that the person who posted it exclusively in that language felt like doing so without any second thought.

If a composition in a particular language is requested it must be honored so along with a transliteration in Roman script as a courtesy to others. I would not say it is time-consuming for the person who posts it since he/she wants to do it. Nobody is forced to post. If you cannot oblige so be it. Stay away! But don't prevent others from posting it in two languages. Many times those who do not know a language may not be able to understand it--meaningfully, I might say-- from the transliterated text either. But let us have it there for those who can make sense out of it.

The reason for posting a composition lyrics in the language in which it is composed is to bring out the fidelity of the text for those who can read that language script. One cannot dismiss it as "occupying disk space". On that count there is so much banter going on here which also occupies disk space.

So let harmony prevail. Two languages (the one in which the composition is written and the Romanized version) sound like a good compromise for me (and I suspect for everyone else too)

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 28 Jul 2007, 02:18

thanjavur wrote:Please do not bring Lakshman in to this wrangle.

thanjavur:
You have a point here. Lakshman does a wonderful job catering to umpteen requests. Many times he listens to the tapes, CDs and other audio clips to transcribe the text from the music that is rendered. The singers do not always do justice to the words. That entails some errors in the transcription. When Lakshman posts those lyrics there will be some errors which those of us who are familiar with the words can correct, which is what we do in good spirit.

Now when the Thamizh lyrics are requested Lakshman posts them to the best of his comprehension despite the fact Thamizh is not his mother-tongue and/or he did not learn it as a language in school. Under such circumstances having the Thamizh script text is useful to get sense out of some difficult words. Having the Thamizh version side by side we can go back and correct the transliterated version for full fidelity. That way everybody will benefit. To deny such facility (especially after the efforts of arunk in assembling the editor) is a disservice to the members of this forum.

I would like to say the same thing about other languages too. I once did a transliteration of a song in Malayalam using arunk's editor. One cannot easily measure the value derived from such small efforts.

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 28 Jul 2007, 02:30

cmlover wrote:I would like to thank our Lakshman our 'lyric Guru' for always posting in the Roman script (in spite of the added time and effort) and his example is worth emulating!

Yes, I endorse this statement. However, Lakshman is not well-versed in all the regional languages to know the nuances of specific words. For example he is used to writing "shiriya" for small while it would distort the meaning for the Thamizh reader. That is why even when Lakshman is not prone to posting it in the vernacular others may do the language version using arunk's editor. It will help not only the requester but all other members as well.

But imagine a situation where the requester would really like to see it in his/her own native tongue and you just copy the Romanized version and do the transformation. It is a case of pazham nazhuvip pAlil vizhundadu (the fruit slipped and fell in the milk). Besides, for the person to read it in the Romanized version cannot beat reading it in the native tongue anytime. For all others the English version is there.

As for storage space, this Sahitya thread is the only one among all others in this forum that involves languages other than English. So let us have some common sense.

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 28 Jul 2007, 06:46

There seems to be some reluctance on the part of some members ( who do not care to see the lyrics in regional language script) to use scripts other than Romanized version in sympathy with the administrator's dictum. SAhityam is the lifeblood of CM and the lyrics true to the content conceived by the composer is important. The lame excuse to discourage posting in the original language used by the composer is "extra effort" and "time consuming". Let those people who post it in the regional languages worry about the extra effort and time. The wolf does not have to worry about the goat/sheep getting wet in the rain ( I am sorry if this expression is strong. But that is how I feel about the objections raised for posting lyrics in Indian languages).

If that is so, then what about people writing in Thamizh (in Roman script) all over here and providing meaning in English. I'd recommend prohibiting that too. Write only in English. It is extra effort and time-consuming to write it in Thamizh colloquialisms and providing English translation alongside. Just English expression will do!

To sum up we need to strike a balance and what srkris wrote makes sense. Let us use two languages as needed (when it comes to lyrics and requests) but stick to only English in conveying ideas/opinions.

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 28 Jul 2007, 08:25

I regret that good sense has not yet prevailed in drs for his unwarranted arbitrary action, who is still silent and has not posted his views and justified his action. At least in deference to the wishes of some members and to respect srikris, he should have posted back the deleted portions. It is strange that members who raise all sorts of objections to poor Lakshman's Thamizh in romanised transliterations ( as his MT is not Thamizh) and waste pages after pages on useless discussions and deviating from the main issues, chose to support the issue raised by drs! This is akin to the story of the rat and other animals!!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 28 Jul 2007, 09:15

Folks

DRS acts only in the best interst of the Forum and is not obliged to give explanations or justify his actions. He is as much a scholar in Tamil and other rlanguages as most of us and does not act out of any silly prejudice. Though we are dealing with only Tamil here think of the bedlam if every other linguist starts inundating this system with posting in their languages. In the interest of efficiency some limitations have to be imposed and of course in legitimate cases some exceptions can be made. All members have been told that the mods will edit the posts for 'content' as well as format in the interest of efficiency which is not subject to discussion. Since CM is our ultimate target we would like all to participate and enjoy the materials and discussions here. The common lingua franca happens to be English as also the Roman script. Let us stick to it and not make mountains out of molehills. Do make some compromises in the interest of other Rasika members. Let us all enjoy CM in all languages together without bickering! Kindly put a stop to further analysis and discussion or unnecesary provocations. Thanks

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 28 Jul 2007, 20:18

Cml

I am pained to see a posting from a seasoned and aged member like you that has no substance or justification. Till your posting, I wanted to leave the matter as it is once drs reposted the deleted portions even if he did not tender an apology for his wrongful act. But now I have decided to be firm and put an end to this sort of colourable activities in a forum that has no room for any bias or chauvinism. It is a pity that you chose to act as a proxy (or to be appropriate, a mouth piece) to drs when he should have come out with his side. But you have your own compulsions. Do you think that drs is above all other members including srikris who has appointed him as an admn or he need not give an explanation for his one sided decision without informing me prior hand just because he is a scholar, according to you? Do you want to say that others are not scholars or inferiors to him in such a forum where all members are equal irrespective of his/her assigned forum responsibilities? Please note that there are members here who are highly educated, vast experienced, composers, vaggeyakaras and scholars in many areas not only in languages. They are better informed. Yet they are modest and do not propagate their virtues just because they are well aware that this forum is meant to propagate CM and only CM and not to indulge on irrelevant discussions in the garb of CM. If drs was really impartial he would not have posted the Dasar kritis in Kannada, his mother tongue, when according to him, this has already been mentioned several times even prior to 20.07.2007, the day he posted the Kannada script. Watch his words:

"There is no need to provide lyrics in tamil routinely."

What he wants to say? That other than Thamizh, anyone including him can post in non roman scripts routinely? Caesar's wife must be above suspicion. Had he just informed me and requested not to post the Thamizh version in future, it would have been a sensible approach.

As it is a matter between me and drs, I request not only you but also other members not to offer your views if they are one sided without upholding democratic behaviour which is the essence of such public forums. If you have any soft corner to wards me or drs, it is purely private and should be outside this forum and should not come under the purview of the well defined activities of such forums.

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 28 Jul 2007, 20:20

cmlover wrote:Folks

is not obliged to give explanations or justify his actions.

Though we are dealing with only Tamil here think of the bedlam if every other linguist starts inundating this system with posting in their languages.

In the interest of efficiency some limitations have to be imposed and of course in legitimate cases some exceptions can be made.

All members have been told that the mods will edit the posts for 'content' as well as format in the interest of efficiency which is not subject to discussion.

The common lingua franca happens to be English as also the Roman script.

Wow! What a tall order!

Not obliged to give explanation? Even a CEO in the corporate world can be torn to pieces by a shareholder who owns a measly one share of the company.

What bedlam? srkris was and (I think) still is committed to two languages--English and the regional script--as needed especially when it comes to lyrics. I don't see any bedlam in that. I am perfectly happy to see more people participating in that.

What limitations? What exceptions? Who decides them? Without rhyme or reason?

I have not seen any declaration that mods can edit/delete content at their whims. I agree only in the case of abusive/obscene material they can delete.

If the lingua franca is English, let us not have any prattles in the regional languages (with accompanying translations) either.

Finally when the admin and the website owner posted extensively in regional languages, could one claim with a straight face that only Roman script is permitted?

"All for one and one for all"--shouldn't that be a motto here? If not I'd like srkris to promulgate a new set of rules (his recent post accommodated the two-language concept).

Indians had been second-class citizens during the British rule. Many of us here in this forum would NOT want to be second-class citizens---One rule for mods and above and another for the rest.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 29 Jul 2007, 02:55

Let us stop all finger pointing and only focus on the welfare of this Forum. Kindly stop discussing personalities and let bygones be bygones. In the interest of justice and fairplay let us have a straw poll.

The question is
" Should we have both original language and Roman trasliteration posted at the Forum?"
Answer

A if both original language and Roman be posted
B if only Roman transliteration is sufficient
C if Roman transliteration only be posted with the option of getting the original language from the poster privately or other means and discussions will be confined to the Roman posting since the original language will not be available to all. Exceptions can be made if there is a request from at least three members
D None of the above

Simply answer A, B. C or D and refrain from commenting. Let there be a participation from as many of you as possible. We will close the poll on Monday evening to tally the results. Thanks

Here is mine C

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 29 Jul 2007, 03:32

I abstain from this straw poll unless it is reworded. The answers are ambiguous. If somebody chooses the answer (C) then it should be subject to the provision there should be no discussion in the thread as to which word means what. If somebody discusses such aspects, then it defeats the choice (c) since the inclusion of the original language script would have pre-emptively answered such questions. The discussion would consume more energy and engender frustration for many.

We can circumvent this problem by doing away with posting lyrics in Roman script also altogether. The requester can ask for the lyrics and the provider can send it straight to the requester's email without wasting server space here. Just a two-way communication except using this forum as a medium since it is difficult for the requester to ask the right person on a one-on-one basis.

If the question is reworded to include more choices as answers, I would choose D (none of the above)

Since my choice (D) was given before the revision of the wording of the poll statement, I would like to rescind it unless the choice (D) is reworded to include "no discussion whatsoever". Why bother with all this? Let us have an SI at the top of the thread (just like other "google first", "name the song instead of saying I want lyrics" etc.) which would state "address all lyric requests to be sent to personal email since they will not be posted at this site in any form"

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 29 Jul 2007, 03:45

How is that?

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 29 Jul 2007, 03:52

We should have a more global question such as : Should there be any regional language posting at all in any form (such as lyrics, colloquialisms, proverbs, excerpts from regional newspapers/magazines, or just plain words such as "ayyo" "sabAsh" although they are written in Roman script) in this forum?

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 29 Jul 2007, 04:00

Sub
Now you are making thiis a joke! be serious and let us make a beginning !

mahakavi · Post by **mahakavi** » 29 Jul 2007, 04:20

cmlover:
Henceforth please address me by my screen name. Thanks.

You are making this straw poll unnecessary .

srkris ,in his posting earlier in this thread ,has clearly stated that he has no objection for posting in Romanized version and the regional language scripts.

Read post #12 in this thread:

Please note that there are no issues about using vernacular languages on this forum (as long as you also are able to post a decent transliteration).

I am surprised that you would resurrect a settled issue. Until srkris comes back and voids his statement I think there is no need for your poll .

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 29 Jul 2007, 05:42

Good point mahakavi!

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 29 Jul 2007, 07:52

I am amused at the way a trivial issue is stretched so long by the admn which shows his incapability to bring an amicable end, after having disturbed the tranquility of the forum. I am at a loss to understand what is holding him in re-posting when srikris has directed such action! Since I am not the originator, I insist on his restoring the status quo ante. There is no need to any poll at this stage still this is done. That too, a poll suggested by a member needs to be vetted by all members and approved by the admn/web master. A self arranged poll voted also without this has no locus standi. This gives me a staunch feeling that cml is being used as a shield, after observing his keen interest, certainly not for CM's sake, in spite of my request not to offer any views till the matter is resolved to its logical end. If drs is really interested to promote CM, let him act judiciously on the points raised as I do not want this forum to meet the end of other similar forums including carnatic.com at the hands of persons due to their poor handling of issues. I am the last person to act in any manner detrimental to this beautiful forum but the first to resist if anyone indulges in such activities.This is not a case of bygones be bygones.

kutty · Post by **kutty** » 01 Aug 2007, 06:14

In view of what is stated and responsible posting of srikris, I presume admission of my contention through silence and accordingly, for the benefit of Thamizh knowing members and deference to their wishes, I am reposting the original Thamizh version, the English version of which is on page 1:

ராகமாலிகை ஆதி

ஷண்முகப்ரியா

ப: சிந்தை அறிந்துவாடி செல்வக்குமரன்
செந்தூர் இடம் தங்கும் பொன் தாள் மலர் கந்தன் (சிந்தை)

அப: அந்தோ என் ஆசை எல்லாம் கொள்ளை கொண்டானே
ஆறுமுக வடிவேலன் சிவபாலன் (சிந்தை)

ஹரிகாம்போதி

ச1: அன்று வந்து போனது அவர்க்கு நினைவில்லையோ
ஆரிட்ட போதனையோ அன்புமனம் வல்லையோ
ஒன்றுபட்டிருந்திட உறுதி மனம் இல்லையோ
உத்தேசம் தான் என்ன சித்தன் மகன் குஹன் (சிந்தை)

ஸுரடி

ச2: சின்னம் சிறு வயதில் என்னை மாலை இட்டானே
சிரிக்க சிரிக்கப் பேசி என் கைவளை தொட்டானே
அன்னம் பாலும் வெறுக்க அவனியில் கைவிட்டானே
அடிமைபெண்டீரென்று முடிய மறந்திட்டானே (சிந்தை)

காபி

ச3: கட்டி தொட்டுமே இதழ்க் கனி அமுதம் பொழிந்தான்
கதறி மதலை போலே குமுறி முத்தம் கொடுத்தான்
எட்டுக்குடி வேலவன் இசைஅமுதம் பொழிந்தான்
என்றும் பிரியேன் என்று என் கைமேல் அடித்தான் (சிந்தை)