Vira,
You are free to express your views but your posts against Mr. Haribabu are unwarranted especially after he has clarified his statements and tendered an apology to Carnatica and other rasikas. Eminent artistes like Vedavali, Sanjay and Thanjavur Sankara Iyer have expressed their disapproval of the keyboard. We have other artistes who have remained fairly neutral by praising the kids in award ceremonies for various reasons but I have not heard of anyone who has come out overwhelmingly in support of the instrument. It's not for rasikas like us to decide what is allowed and what is not. For us, anything that sounds good is acceptable. So, one should not go purely by what a rasika thinks is acceptable or good music. You also have to look at the system as a whole. The system of carnatic music itself has some groundrules that everybody has to adhere to. What those are is not something that rasikas can answer.
This has to be left to a fair and honest experts committee who have to judge if it is indeed able to produce all the essence and nuances of carnatic music. Organisers, rasikas, parents or relatives cannot decide what is allowed and what is not.
Carnatic Idol 2007
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bilahari
- Posts: 2631
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 09:02
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tkb
- Posts: 695
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:14
I introduce myself as T. Krishnababu f/o Mstr K.Sathyanaryanan, a keyboard artist trying to specialise in performing Carnatic on Keyboard. I thank Mr Haribabu for posting this thread for many reasons and I know him as a parent of a child coming to the finals of POGO competiton held last year.
Sathya's entry for the POGO awards was specifically as an artist performing Carnatic on Keyboard. I captured all the 3 finalists' performance, (Links that show's Sathya's track as i have deleted the other http://youtube.com/watch?v=9A6F7Re-hH8) uploaded the same on Sathya's site and requested people to see the performance and vote for the performer they thought was best. Even in this competiton - Carnatic Idol - I did send emails to his well-wishers informing them of the contest and asked them to vote for the best performer of the day.
I also wish to inform certain facts that for this competition no fee was paid by us and also we were under the impression that only one among all contestants was to be awarded the title "Carnatic Idol" (irrespective of whether they were vocalists, instrumentalists etc.). We got into the competition primarily looking at the eminent judges panel and the opportunity to showcase Sathya's efforts in bring out the nuances of Carnatic music on Keyboard as otherwise it is quite difficult to go to every individual and perform.
At the time of writing this post, I do not know the result and even if Sathya does not win it we have no regrets. We feel the success has been tasted at the point of entry into the competiton as our aim was not merely to win. All the judges were full of praise for the contestants when required and for their intense efforts and commendable skills. In this context when Sangetha Kalanidhi Sri T.N. Krishnan called for a special round of applause after Sathya performed the Kambodhi alapana, we were happy that we had achieved one of our major objectives - recognition for the instrument and the artiste from a senior vidwan.
Mr. Haribabu's comment about AIR is very welcome because it is my endeavour to achieve the objective of AIR accepting the keyboard for the CM forum. It is widely known that a senior vidwan like Harmonium exponent, Palladam Sri. Venkataramana Rao (also plays the keyboard) had to struggle and fight with AIR for recognition for the harmonium. I am sure that the mandolin and the saxophone went through similar struggles.
As a CM rasika, I request you all to listen to samples of Sathya's live performances at various places at the following link: http://audiotracksofsathya.blogspot.com/
I would be grateful if you can comment on those samples either in the forum or via personal email [email protected] with regard to what, if any, is lacking and what, if any, are the shortcomings. Of course, all the praise will be welcome too.
All of this will help Sathya in his efforts to explore the nuances at their best in the years to come.
There was a comment about "storing" music on the keyboard and just playing it easily (probably like a cassette player or MP3 player). Sathya, though, does NOT use this feature. He performs each piece manually with no pre-recorded bits and pieces. If there is any doubt at all about this, I welcome you to visit our house or a concert and listen to Sathya live anytime.My contact number is:+91-94443-90193 and we live inWest Mambalam, Chennai.
Sathya has several well-wishers. However, there is no single organisation or forum or network dedicated to promoting Sathya but for our own website and the related blogs where everything is a verifiable fact.Sathya is not the only CM keyboard artiste. A few names: Sangeetha Kalanidhi Sri. T.N. Seshagopalan has released an album where he has started with the Viribhoni varnam, Palladam Sri. Venkataramana Rao whose music samples are available on musicindiaonline.com, Amritavarshini from LA, Abhinav Muralidharan from Chennai, Anush Narayanan from Chennai, Anandhi Sivakumar & Sushmita from Chennai and Aditi who performs HM from Chennai.This probably suggests that the keyboard is gaining in popularity.
It is a matter of fact that promotion, hype and influence in any field can only take someone so far and no further and this applies to Sathya equally.
Sathya's entry for the POGO awards was specifically as an artist performing Carnatic on Keyboard. I captured all the 3 finalists' performance, (Links that show's Sathya's track as i have deleted the other http://youtube.com/watch?v=9A6F7Re-hH8) uploaded the same on Sathya's site and requested people to see the performance and vote for the performer they thought was best. Even in this competiton - Carnatic Idol - I did send emails to his well-wishers informing them of the contest and asked them to vote for the best performer of the day.
I also wish to inform certain facts that for this competition no fee was paid by us and also we were under the impression that only one among all contestants was to be awarded the title "Carnatic Idol" (irrespective of whether they were vocalists, instrumentalists etc.). We got into the competition primarily looking at the eminent judges panel and the opportunity to showcase Sathya's efforts in bring out the nuances of Carnatic music on Keyboard as otherwise it is quite difficult to go to every individual and perform.
At the time of writing this post, I do not know the result and even if Sathya does not win it we have no regrets. We feel the success has been tasted at the point of entry into the competiton as our aim was not merely to win. All the judges were full of praise for the contestants when required and for their intense efforts and commendable skills. In this context when Sangetha Kalanidhi Sri T.N. Krishnan called for a special round of applause after Sathya performed the Kambodhi alapana, we were happy that we had achieved one of our major objectives - recognition for the instrument and the artiste from a senior vidwan.
Mr. Haribabu's comment about AIR is very welcome because it is my endeavour to achieve the objective of AIR accepting the keyboard for the CM forum. It is widely known that a senior vidwan like Harmonium exponent, Palladam Sri. Venkataramana Rao (also plays the keyboard) had to struggle and fight with AIR for recognition for the harmonium. I am sure that the mandolin and the saxophone went through similar struggles.
As a CM rasika, I request you all to listen to samples of Sathya's live performances at various places at the following link: http://audiotracksofsathya.blogspot.com/
I would be grateful if you can comment on those samples either in the forum or via personal email [email protected] with regard to what, if any, is lacking and what, if any, are the shortcomings. Of course, all the praise will be welcome too.
All of this will help Sathya in his efforts to explore the nuances at their best in the years to come.There was a comment about "storing" music on the keyboard and just playing it easily (probably like a cassette player or MP3 player). Sathya, though, does NOT use this feature. He performs each piece manually with no pre-recorded bits and pieces. If there is any doubt at all about this, I welcome you to visit our house or a concert and listen to Sathya live anytime.My contact number is:+91-94443-90193 and we live inWest Mambalam, Chennai.
Sathya has several well-wishers. However, there is no single organisation or forum or network dedicated to promoting Sathya but for our own website and the related blogs where everything is a verifiable fact.Sathya is not the only CM keyboard artiste. A few names: Sangeetha Kalanidhi Sri. T.N. Seshagopalan has released an album where he has started with the Viribhoni varnam, Palladam Sri. Venkataramana Rao whose music samples are available on musicindiaonline.com, Amritavarshini from LA, Abhinav Muralidharan from Chennai, Anush Narayanan from Chennai, Anandhi Sivakumar & Sushmita from Chennai and Aditi who performs HM from Chennai.This probably suggests that the keyboard is gaining in popularity.
It is a matter of fact that promotion, hype and influence in any field can only take someone so far and no further and this applies to Sathya equally.
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arasi
- Posts: 16877
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
vira,
You have your points. While those who did not attend the events have to go by speculation, you were right there, and spoke of your unbiased observations. Before someone questions my views, I hasten to say that whenever a personal element comes into the picture, constructive discussions fade away.
Even the best of surgeons often do not perform surgery on their own children. Why? Emotional bonds interfere.
To judge on the merits of a limited instrument like the keyboard in the CM context cannot be determined until a fair amount of time goes by. TNS plays the instrument admirably because of his tremendous musical capacity. His statement about 'gnAnam' has to be taken in context. Otherwise, I wonder, would he give up singing, kathA kAlakshEpam and the playing of the vINA just to to play the key board?
Mandolin in US's hands 'sings'. Is it the same in the hands of other players?
.
Yes, the vINA is taking a back seat. Why not bring it to the fore and courage the nAgasvaram too?
Let there be all kinds of instruments. Experiments have to be encouraged. After all, we want the youngsters to keep CM alive, but let us not forget that each of these instruments have their place in CM (yes, 'lesser', at least for the time being, in some cases)...
You have your points. While those who did not attend the events have to go by speculation, you were right there, and spoke of your unbiased observations. Before someone questions my views, I hasten to say that whenever a personal element comes into the picture, constructive discussions fade away.
Even the best of surgeons often do not perform surgery on their own children. Why? Emotional bonds interfere.
To judge on the merits of a limited instrument like the keyboard in the CM context cannot be determined until a fair amount of time goes by. TNS plays the instrument admirably because of his tremendous musical capacity. His statement about 'gnAnam' has to be taken in context. Otherwise, I wonder, would he give up singing, kathA kAlakshEpam and the playing of the vINA just to to play the key board?
Mandolin in US's hands 'sings'. Is it the same in the hands of other players?
.
Yes, the vINA is taking a back seat. Why not bring it to the fore and courage the nAgasvaram too?
Let there be all kinds of instruments. Experiments have to be encouraged. After all, we want the youngsters to keep CM alive, but let us not forget that each of these instruments have their place in CM (yes, 'lesser', at least for the time being, in some cases)...
Last edited by arasi on 14 Nov 2007, 22:56, edited 1 time in total.
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musicquest
- Posts: 23
- Joined: 25 Sep 2006, 00:07
I think we are making a grave mistake of comparing different instruments/instrumentalists. I honesty don't know how you can compare a nagaswaram player to a mandloin player, the skill and effort needed is completely different.
I don't support the fact that the key board is eaiser to play, however the violin requires a different skill (not saying it is more difficult or easy since I don't play either of these instruments) but I play the flute and I know that it is not an easy instrument to master, however to hold a Sa or a Pa (or any note ) on the flute to sruti is easier than singing or producing the same note on the violin, since you don't have a fixed place on the instrument . It has to be internalised by the brain to produce the note and hold it to sruti.
With due credit to the Keyboard boy. I find the arguments amusing. In the past I have never heard Mali being compared with Lalgudi (or any other instrumentatlist) or a Ravi Kiran with U.Srinivas and rightly so, since we would not be comparing Apples to Apples.
I think Carnatica might want to think on how to handle this going forward. I would not agree that you need to lump all instrumentalists in one category and make them compete with each other for the top slot.
Lastly, we should just encourage the kids to work hard and do well, and enjoy the music. Ultimately the audience will decide whom they would prefer. Which is the ultimate test in the long run. Since displaying vidwat in a competition and consistenly producing top quality concerts is two different ball games.
I don't think it will do any of these kids any good by us (parents and rasikas) jumping up and down about who won or lost. I believe (and hope) they are too young to care, let them just enjoy their music for the time being. Critisicm or for that matter Praise should and can wait.
Just a few thoughts.............
I don't support the fact that the key board is eaiser to play, however the violin requires a different skill (not saying it is more difficult or easy since I don't play either of these instruments) but I play the flute and I know that it is not an easy instrument to master, however to hold a Sa or a Pa (or any note ) on the flute to sruti is easier than singing or producing the same note on the violin, since you don't have a fixed place on the instrument . It has to be internalised by the brain to produce the note and hold it to sruti.
With due credit to the Keyboard boy. I find the arguments amusing. In the past I have never heard Mali being compared with Lalgudi (or any other instrumentatlist) or a Ravi Kiran with U.Srinivas and rightly so, since we would not be comparing Apples to Apples.
I think Carnatica might want to think on how to handle this going forward. I would not agree that you need to lump all instrumentalists in one category and make them compete with each other for the top slot.
Lastly, we should just encourage the kids to work hard and do well, and enjoy the music. Ultimately the audience will decide whom they would prefer. Which is the ultimate test in the long run. Since displaying vidwat in a competition and consistenly producing top quality concerts is two different ball games.
I don't think it will do any of these kids any good by us (parents and rasikas) jumping up and down about who won or lost. I believe (and hope) they are too young to care, let them just enjoy their music for the time being. Critisicm or for that matter Praise should and can wait.
Just a few thoughts.............
Last edited by musicquest on 15 Nov 2007, 04:50, edited 1 time in total.
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tkb
- Posts: 695
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:14
Dear every one, I am Sathya. Appa just told me about the discussions in the forum. I am only trying my best and i am determined to do my best in all places whether it is kutchery or competition. On the 10th Nov i sincerely said that i am not very familiar with krithis in Varali ragam but was ready to perform alapana. May be i would have gone on playing swara also because i have performed Varali during Pancharatha krithis performances. H/ever Judges wanted me to perform Bhairavi and i took Odi bharaiya. In fact Sashikiran sir also asked if i can be given options and on the approval of judges i was asked to perform.
If i loose this competition i think may be because of this lack of krithi in Varali only. I have take it as a lesson and i have told appa that i will learn & play a krithi in Varali Kaa Vaa vaa or Meenakshi and i will ask him to upload for you to give yr comments.
I have got lot of people praising and have also got criticism on stage itself. I only want to say that i am only exploring the nuances of CM on the board and if you find any lagging please tell me so that i can correct.
In one concert in Machilipatnam a senior guru after the main song took mike and asked me if certain phrases can be performed on keyboard. Soon after he sang appa asked me if i can attempt it and when i did he continued for three more phrases and i repeated to my knowledge and ability. He did appreciate me and said over the years i will grow better and better.
I only request you, please do not have a conception that keyboard cannot be a part of CM. I request you to help me and other KB artists to try and make it a part. I am sure if any one performs with bhava, jeevan one day every one will accept CM on KB.
I am using my appa's id and if there is any mistake in my views please pardon me.
Hope members will take time to listen to my sample tracks and give feed back. Mohan uncle i listened to the Lathangi and yes it is very good.
Seeking blessings always Sathya
If i loose this competition i think may be because of this lack of krithi in Varali only. I have take it as a lesson and i have told appa that i will learn & play a krithi in Varali Kaa Vaa vaa or Meenakshi and i will ask him to upload for you to give yr comments.
I have got lot of people praising and have also got criticism on stage itself. I only want to say that i am only exploring the nuances of CM on the board and if you find any lagging please tell me so that i can correct.
In one concert in Machilipatnam a senior guru after the main song took mike and asked me if certain phrases can be performed on keyboard. Soon after he sang appa asked me if i can attempt it and when i did he continued for three more phrases and i repeated to my knowledge and ability. He did appreciate me and said over the years i will grow better and better.
I only request you, please do not have a conception that keyboard cannot be a part of CM. I request you to help me and other KB artists to try and make it a part. I am sure if any one performs with bhava, jeevan one day every one will accept CM on KB.
I am using my appa's id and if there is any mistake in my views please pardon me.
Hope members will take time to listen to my sample tracks and give feed back. Mohan uncle i listened to the Lathangi and yes it is very good.
Seeking blessings always Sathya
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tkb
- Posts: 695
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:14
Dear Members,
I do discuss all positives and negatives with Sathya as i feel he should be aware. When i told him about this thread he wanted to express his view and he has done it in my id.
While i do understand many vidwans like Smt Vedavalli, Sri Sanjay & others do not accept CM on KB i humbly would like to express there are many who encourages & blesses him too. If given an oppurtunity we would like to have the others blessings also.
Thanks to many forums, CM on KB is being tried and given oppurtunity in many forums and fyi Sathya is presenting a jugalbandhi for Bharat Kalachar on 1st Dec a concert for Bangalore Habba on 4th Dec at Gayana Samaja followed by concerts in Chennai during this Dec season at Vani mahal, MFAC, Thrimurthy Saba - Pazhichalur, Padma Sarangabani Trust, Krishna Gana Sabha, Indian Fine Arts & SrRanjani in different slots. I am sure there are also other KB artists who will be performing in many forums during the season.
I request all to probably spare some time to listen to his concerts and do give your comments. Rest assured all comments are taken in the right spirits and used for Sathya's improvements. I shall try to psot link for Varali krithi by Monday or Tuesday.
I am sorry for the long posts but thought we have duty to explain people. To take the explanations or not is always left to individuals.
I do discuss all positives and negatives with Sathya as i feel he should be aware. When i told him about this thread he wanted to express his view and he has done it in my id.
While i do understand many vidwans like Smt Vedavalli, Sri Sanjay & others do not accept CM on KB i humbly would like to express there are many who encourages & blesses him too. If given an oppurtunity we would like to have the others blessings also.
Thanks to many forums, CM on KB is being tried and given oppurtunity in many forums and fyi Sathya is presenting a jugalbandhi for Bharat Kalachar on 1st Dec a concert for Bangalore Habba on 4th Dec at Gayana Samaja followed by concerts in Chennai during this Dec season at Vani mahal, MFAC, Thrimurthy Saba - Pazhichalur, Padma Sarangabani Trust, Krishna Gana Sabha, Indian Fine Arts & SrRanjani in different slots. I am sure there are also other KB artists who will be performing in many forums during the season.
I request all to probably spare some time to listen to his concerts and do give your comments. Rest assured all comments are taken in the right spirits and used for Sathya's improvements. I shall try to psot link for Varali krithi by Monday or Tuesday.
I am sorry for the long posts but thought we have duty to explain people. To take the explanations or not is always left to individuals.
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mohan
- Posts: 2808
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 16:52
Well done Sathya and keep up the good work! A lot of people do not understand the advances in technology these days and think the keyboard (better called the synthesizer) is just like the harmonium or piano. The new synthsizers can do wonders and can bring out the nuances of Carnatic music but it requires a lot of hard work and depends on the gnanam of the artist.
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kmrasika
- Posts: 1279
- Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 07:55
I did get to attend the Carnatic Idols finals on that Saturday and the contestants all seemed well-prepared to face the scrutiny of the judges. All in all, this does provide a good opportunity for emergence of good new talents and hopefully standards(which has and is a concern these days in our music) are maintained as they carry on tradition for future generations.
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sbala
- Posts: 629
- Joined: 30 Jul 2006, 08:56
Thank you tkb sir and Satya for participating in the right spirit. If AIR or a panel of experts accept the keyboard by doing a honest and fair assessment, that will go a long way in addressing this issue. As akella garu has mentioned, the panel should be completely objective and should not yield to fantatical traditionalism as well as thoughtless innovations. As far as rasikas are concerned, we might have our own personal likes/dislikes which might have nothing to do with the nuances of carnatic music and that will not come in the way of the growth of the system which happens by welcoming genuine innovations and throwing away hacks with equal vigour.
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nadhasudha
- Posts: 382
- Joined: 22 May 2006, 06:40
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manjunath
- Posts: 30
- Joined: 10 Nov 2007, 13:13
Dear TKB Sir ! An advise to you.
The instruments like Vina, Violin,Gotu,Mandolin etc are accepted in Carnatic music because , their clarity of the sound nearly matching the vocalists performance. Indian musicians accepted these instruments due to their original nature in producing sound and cost of the instrument. The aim of our Vidwans were, music should reach the gross root level in the society and influence them to better life by learning music and knowing our culture. These instruments are reachable to all the sectors of people. Any country the common man only thinks about culture and not the rich people. You must have spent more than a lakh rupees to buy the keyboard played by your son. How many parrents/artists in India can effort to buy this keyboard incase if this is accepted in carnatic music. The Vina ,Violin, Mandolin etc are available for few thousands. Musicians think thousand times before accepting the instruments in to music and culture. I was observing some of your team posting mails, calling carnatic music as so called . I think your son want to become idol by using same so called canatic music not anything else.
I have gone through the website of your son. Do you think this much hype is required for the artists .? No musician has this type of sites. Is it not the creation of hype? It is like a story board like traveling to this place and that place mentioning the weather conditions etc., and telling the business of the boy. This is the life of any artiste . Think about poor musicians in the society and compete them in the natural way and not with the value equipment. I do not think other keyboard players in Chennai can buy a keyboard worth above a lakh rupees and try on it. I hope other keyboard players accept this. Rich community never bothered about culture . If at all if you have some respect for Indian culture , do not spoil your son by praising too much . Put him and show the IDOL ness in such original instruments which are acceptable to every one. Please do not compare with Mandolin Srininvas. His invention of Mandolin in to carnatic music is accepted because, he is a born genius and the instrument has the sound features equaling to Vina and violin which are already accepted in carnatic music. And the cost again is reachable to the common man. Respect our Vidwans for their noble cause behind the acceptance of the string instruments in carnatic music. Learning keyboard is not a wrong thing but fighting for acceptance in carnatic music is nonsense. The associations are in business and for the fact that associations need every one to keep them self busy with these type of trails. No doubt your son will be given a carnatic IDOL because of your efforts of creating hype and selling methods . These will definitely make him getting the IDENTITY . As a father of the child your efforts are really appreciable but fighting for entry into classical instruments is not. Hope all vidwans accepts with me.
The instruments like Vina, Violin,Gotu,Mandolin etc are accepted in Carnatic music because , their clarity of the sound nearly matching the vocalists performance. Indian musicians accepted these instruments due to their original nature in producing sound and cost of the instrument. The aim of our Vidwans were, music should reach the gross root level in the society and influence them to better life by learning music and knowing our culture. These instruments are reachable to all the sectors of people. Any country the common man only thinks about culture and not the rich people. You must have spent more than a lakh rupees to buy the keyboard played by your son. How many parrents/artists in India can effort to buy this keyboard incase if this is accepted in carnatic music. The Vina ,Violin, Mandolin etc are available for few thousands. Musicians think thousand times before accepting the instruments in to music and culture. I was observing some of your team posting mails, calling carnatic music as so called . I think your son want to become idol by using same so called canatic music not anything else.
I have gone through the website of your son. Do you think this much hype is required for the artists .? No musician has this type of sites. Is it not the creation of hype? It is like a story board like traveling to this place and that place mentioning the weather conditions etc., and telling the business of the boy. This is the life of any artiste . Think about poor musicians in the society and compete them in the natural way and not with the value equipment. I do not think other keyboard players in Chennai can buy a keyboard worth above a lakh rupees and try on it. I hope other keyboard players accept this. Rich community never bothered about culture . If at all if you have some respect for Indian culture , do not spoil your son by praising too much . Put him and show the IDOL ness in such original instruments which are acceptable to every one. Please do not compare with Mandolin Srininvas. His invention of Mandolin in to carnatic music is accepted because, he is a born genius and the instrument has the sound features equaling to Vina and violin which are already accepted in carnatic music. And the cost again is reachable to the common man. Respect our Vidwans for their noble cause behind the acceptance of the string instruments in carnatic music. Learning keyboard is not a wrong thing but fighting for acceptance in carnatic music is nonsense. The associations are in business and for the fact that associations need every one to keep them self busy with these type of trails. No doubt your son will be given a carnatic IDOL because of your efforts of creating hype and selling methods . These will definitely make him getting the IDENTITY . As a father of the child your efforts are really appreciable but fighting for entry into classical instruments is not. Hope all vidwans accepts with me.
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cienu
- Posts: 2392
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:40
Hello Manjunath,
My personal opinion is that there should be no competitions like "Carnatic Idols" etc as Carnatic Music being essentially a manodharma based Sangeetham, the time given in such competitions is too short for judging and awarding prizes. Worse , such talent search competitions could leave a lot of tender hearts and potential great artists heart broken. Hence though I used to go through the posts , I had no inclination to participate in the discussions.
Notwithstanding the above I personally felt that the tone of your letter was a bit too harsh , especially on TKB. After your letter , I went word by word through TKB and Sathya's letters and found nothing so objectionable so as to warrant such an outburst from your side.
Whether Keyboard is a fit instrument for Carnatic Music , this question will be answered by rasikas of the future. If the people love to hear CM on KB they will flock to Sathya's concerts! In such a case I feel that the question whether KB is an instrument fit for CM will cease to exist.
If not , Sathya will have to plough a lonely furrow ! Ultimately it is the public which decides!
I feel that certain statements from you like "Rich community never bothered about culture" and "Any country the common man only thinks about culture and not the rich people." are certainly not warranted and not relevant to the topic being discussed.
My personal opinion is that there should be no competitions like "Carnatic Idols" etc as Carnatic Music being essentially a manodharma based Sangeetham, the time given in such competitions is too short for judging and awarding prizes. Worse , such talent search competitions could leave a lot of tender hearts and potential great artists heart broken. Hence though I used to go through the posts , I had no inclination to participate in the discussions.
Notwithstanding the above I personally felt that the tone of your letter was a bit too harsh , especially on TKB. After your letter , I went word by word through TKB and Sathya's letters and found nothing so objectionable so as to warrant such an outburst from your side.
Whether Keyboard is a fit instrument for Carnatic Music , this question will be answered by rasikas of the future. If the people love to hear CM on KB they will flock to Sathya's concerts! In such a case I feel that the question whether KB is an instrument fit for CM will cease to exist.
If not , Sathya will have to plough a lonely furrow ! Ultimately it is the public which decides!
I feel that certain statements from you like "Rich community never bothered about culture" and "Any country the common man only thinks about culture and not the rich people." are certainly not warranted and not relevant to the topic being discussed.
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vijay
- Posts: 2522
- Joined: 27 Feb 2006, 16:06
Can we have more decorum on this site please? Such a public battle can do immense harm to young impressionable minds. I am sure both Sathya and Vinay are talented youngsters but their place in musical history will be decided many decades hence and not by Pogo Awards or Carnatic Idols. This mail exchange is certainly not contributing in any way either.
I'd advise parents and well-wishers to focus on the completion of their childrens' musical education rather than on peripheral issues like the ones being discussed here. I feel quite sad to see kids being put through this kind of ordeal...
I'd advise parents and well-wishers to focus on the completion of their childrens' musical education rather than on peripheral issues like the ones being discussed here. I feel quite sad to see kids being put through this kind of ordeal...
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srkris
- Site Admin
- Posts: 3497
- Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 03:34
I would tend to agree with this to an extent - Carnatic music and competitions dont go well together. Just my humble opinion.cienu wrote:My personal opinion is that there should be no competitions like "Carnatic Idols" etc as Carnatic Music being essentially a manodharma based Sangeetham, the time given in such competitions is too short for judging and awarding prizes. Worse , such talent search competitions could leave a lot of tender hearts and potential great artists heart broken.
People, please lay this thread to rest, pushing ideas too much is not good for carnatic music or musicians. Shall I lock this thread?
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tkb
- Posts: 695
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:14
Dear Mr Haribabu
I had started off my 1st post thanking you and i once again thank you now for the same and as a person believing in tradition and culture, i am sure you will take others views also when expressed.
I have given the blog link not for getting publicity but to get us into probably even more strenuous test by exposing our music on KB to forum with people who like and analyze music. Further i have and so has my son, requested all to forward their views after listening, so that he can improve up on. I am sure the members will know to themselves if this is an act of gaining publicity.
Please note in the moment of writing these posts may be you have just forgotten that vidwans like Prof Sri . T.R. Subramaniam, Sri Sikkil Baskaran and Sri Prancham Seetharaman who were there for the prelims and Sri T. N. Krishnan, Sri Ramani, Sri Bakthavatchanlam, Sri A.K. Palanivel, Sri Guruvayur Durai and Sri Neyveli Santhanagopalan who were there for the finals, are all respected by every one for their own rights.
Regarding POGO, I appreciate your magnanimity and may be would have been better if you had mentioned about the mrudhangist. By doing so now you have exposed this person to this forum atleast. H/ever as it was a recorded show, i sincerely feel you had every liberty and right and should have demanded for a professional mrudhangist or like in the prelims of Carnatic Idol should have allowed your son to perform solo (without accompaniments) or best could have just withdrawn mentioning a very valid reason of POGO not arranging a good support artist.
Regarding competition, with your rich experience of conducting same, my suggestion is that one should either check all details & then compete and if not accept the results. I am sure you know that Carnatic Idol - Instrumental artist has been won by Sri Jayanth - Flute artist and i am have no regrets and wishing this winner all the very best.
Yes i am also a firm believer of GOD and i am sure if Sathya does not have talents or if his instrument is not one to be explored and accepted by purists in the long run, this will fade away and i can assure you that CM will never be disturbed in its glory by just one instrument or a child who is only exploring his thoughts on same. As said in my earlier posts any hype, influence and publicity can only take so far and not beyond and this applies to my son also.
I sincerely feel whether it is Vinay or Sathya, if one has talent and commitment they will for sure win the hearts of people no matter which field they are in. I sincerely wish and bless Vinay for a great future and am sure to see him as a great artist.
Tks.
I had started off my 1st post thanking you and i once again thank you now for the same and as a person believing in tradition and culture, i am sure you will take others views also when expressed.
I have given the blog link not for getting publicity but to get us into probably even more strenuous test by exposing our music on KB to forum with people who like and analyze music. Further i have and so has my son, requested all to forward their views after listening, so that he can improve up on. I am sure the members will know to themselves if this is an act of gaining publicity.
Please note in the moment of writing these posts may be you have just forgotten that vidwans like Prof Sri . T.R. Subramaniam, Sri Sikkil Baskaran and Sri Prancham Seetharaman who were there for the prelims and Sri T. N. Krishnan, Sri Ramani, Sri Bakthavatchanlam, Sri A.K. Palanivel, Sri Guruvayur Durai and Sri Neyveli Santhanagopalan who were there for the finals, are all respected by every one for their own rights.
Regarding POGO, I appreciate your magnanimity and may be would have been better if you had mentioned about the mrudhangist. By doing so now you have exposed this person to this forum atleast. H/ever as it was a recorded show, i sincerely feel you had every liberty and right and should have demanded for a professional mrudhangist or like in the prelims of Carnatic Idol should have allowed your son to perform solo (without accompaniments) or best could have just withdrawn mentioning a very valid reason of POGO not arranging a good support artist.
Regarding competition, with your rich experience of conducting same, my suggestion is that one should either check all details & then compete and if not accept the results. I am sure you know that Carnatic Idol - Instrumental artist has been won by Sri Jayanth - Flute artist and i am have no regrets and wishing this winner all the very best.
Yes i am also a firm believer of GOD and i am sure if Sathya does not have talents or if his instrument is not one to be explored and accepted by purists in the long run, this will fade away and i can assure you that CM will never be disturbed in its glory by just one instrument or a child who is only exploring his thoughts on same. As said in my earlier posts any hype, influence and publicity can only take so far and not beyond and this applies to my son also.
I sincerely feel whether it is Vinay or Sathya, if one has talent and commitment they will for sure win the hearts of people no matter which field they are in. I sincerely wish and bless Vinay for a great future and am sure to see him as a great artist.
Tks.
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tkb
- Posts: 695
- Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 11:14
Dear Sri Manjunath,
Thanks for your post and valuable suggestion. I do not find it a mistake to have a website for Sathya which itself has been gifted by Mr Pyarilal - carnaticsangeetham.com and Sathya having a blog for himself which has link in this website. For your information there are many well wishers around the world who has appreciated our efforts. If this has caused any hard feeling to you, i regret for the same.
I do not want to make an argument with you in a forum but can tell you the truth that i am no way a rich man as you might think off. The keyboard which gave life to Sathya was also a gift for him by a unknown person (Until he contacted us) from USA by name Dr Ravi Dattatreya. Well when said that you might again tell me that i am making hype. It is all facts and i leave it to believe it or not.
Reg pampering and spoiling my child, yes i do take your adv and as i have never done pampering and spoiling , will continue on same lines may be with more care. With regard to the instrument the arguments are growing from not producing gamkas to now affordability. I request you to kindly note that it is our wish and goal to get KB into CM and if and if it does not succeed, i am no way going to spend money and offer free keyboard like politician give away free bees, even if have money. On the contrary if and if it is given a status, i am sure all including you will appreciate the efforts of all KB artists including Sathya. Here i also would like to be clear that no where in my posts or in the website, i have compared Sathya with any great artist and i am aware being his father that he is just 12 years and has not even started tracing his route to the Himalayas of becoming great.
Coming to the competition result the Carnatic IDOL has been won by Sri Jayanth - Flute artist and hope you will also be happy as i am on the result. With regard to your opinion of fighting for acceptance of KB in CM deemed as nonsense, i sincerely take it as your opinion and leave it at that.
In our path we do look forward to face difficulties as we have been experiencing nice things too and we will surely be guided by the almighty as we are also firm believers of GOD.
I sincerely do not like to make long posts in any forum and wish to apologize to the members for the same. However i am sue every one will appreciate that having asked / required to make certain clarification, i need to done it to my best of my knowledge.
Tks.
Thanks for your post and valuable suggestion. I do not find it a mistake to have a website for Sathya which itself has been gifted by Mr Pyarilal - carnaticsangeetham.com and Sathya having a blog for himself which has link in this website. For your information there are many well wishers around the world who has appreciated our efforts. If this has caused any hard feeling to you, i regret for the same.
I do not want to make an argument with you in a forum but can tell you the truth that i am no way a rich man as you might think off. The keyboard which gave life to Sathya was also a gift for him by a unknown person (Until he contacted us) from USA by name Dr Ravi Dattatreya. Well when said that you might again tell me that i am making hype. It is all facts and i leave it to believe it or not.
Reg pampering and spoiling my child, yes i do take your adv and as i have never done pampering and spoiling , will continue on same lines may be with more care. With regard to the instrument the arguments are growing from not producing gamkas to now affordability. I request you to kindly note that it is our wish and goal to get KB into CM and if and if it does not succeed, i am no way going to spend money and offer free keyboard like politician give away free bees, even if have money. On the contrary if and if it is given a status, i am sure all including you will appreciate the efforts of all KB artists including Sathya. Here i also would like to be clear that no where in my posts or in the website, i have compared Sathya with any great artist and i am aware being his father that he is just 12 years and has not even started tracing his route to the Himalayas of becoming great.
Coming to the competition result the Carnatic IDOL has been won by Sri Jayanth - Flute artist and hope you will also be happy as i am on the result. With regard to your opinion of fighting for acceptance of KB in CM deemed as nonsense, i sincerely take it as your opinion and leave it at that.
In our path we do look forward to face difficulties as we have been experiencing nice things too and we will surely be guided by the almighty as we are also firm believers of GOD.
I sincerely do not like to make long posts in any forum and wish to apologize to the members for the same. However i am sue every one will appreciate that having asked / required to make certain clarification, i need to done it to my best of my knowledge.
Tks.
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vasanthakokilam
- Posts: 10958
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01
Let me bookend this thread with the following anecdote which hopefully will reduce the intensity of this thread a bit.I'd advise parents and well-wishers to focus on the completion of their childrens' musical education rather than on peripheral issues like the ones being discussed here. I feel quite sad to see kids being put through this kind of ordeal...
Last year, I volunteered to provide input for a kids musical talent show ( mridangam, tabla and host of other rhythm instruments ). During the rehearsals, couple of the moms, though seemed like friends with each other, were mildly complaining to me about how the other mom is pushing her kid to the foreground ( which was true to some extent ). It was really on silly matters and it created quite a bit of anxiety for me how the team is going to work together. Subconsciously I started thinking that the two kids do not get along with each other either.
Half an hour into the first rehearsal, one of the kids did not understand what the teacher was saying. The other kid took this kid into his wings and explained things to him using the western rhythm notation ( they both take music lessons at school ). Wow, all my anxiety about this just disappeared and a great deal of enthusiasm and energy got pumped in with that simple act. The genuineness and the naturally innocent and correct thinking on the part of the kids was a lesson to the parents.
The program itself was a grand success.
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vasanthakokilam
- Posts: 10958
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01
And the moral of the story is to have a Post-Idol celebration of the kids where they put on a show for everyone which is completely organized and run by the kids with the parents completely staying away from it. I do not know if that is possible given that the many of the kids are from outside of Chennai but if it is done ( with promotional support from Carnatica ), it will take some of the sting out of this. It will be quite heartwarming indeed.