D Vardhani, Chennai Fine Arts

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 15 Dec 2008, 14:45

D Vardhani - Ambika Prasad - T R Sundaresan

Chennai Fine Arts, KN Shanmukha Sundaram Hall, Gokhale Sastri Institute.
13 Dec 08. 5 pm

ganapatE suguNanidhE - janaranjani - rUpakam - HMB (R)
RTP - chAyA ranjani - vilOma tisra rUpakam (pancha naDai: beat of lagu in misram, little finger in kaNDam, ring finger in sankIrNam, beat of drutam in catusram, wave in tisram)
ranjani rAganutE srI lalitE mAm pAhi chAyA. eDuppu at the samam of ring finger, 5 akshara aridi.
rAgamAlika svarams in ranjani, srI, lalitA.
tani Avarthanam

The RTP concert had a nice beginning with janaranjani AlApanai. I was expected a RTP in janaranjani, however it got more interesting. The rAgam taken up for the pallavi was chAya ranjani, a janya of simmEndra madhyamam (http://www.karnatik.com/ragasc.shtml#cAyaranjani). The tALam was more interesting.

However, Smt Vardhani did an excellent job in elaborating the rAgam, singing a tAnam and also rendering the pallavi effortlessly doing the trikAlam and also singing rAga mAlikA svarams to appropriate places where the rAgam names comes in the pallavi.

It was very delightful to watch the rendition. The accompanists were very good and gave a fitting accompaniment to the concert.

s_hari · Post by **s_hari** » 15 Dec 2008, 23:16

Is this part of RTP festival? Haven't heard the artists' name before, but seem to be an awsome pallavi. Thanks for the review. Hope to hear such complicated nadai pallavis later in the season

-hari

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 16 Dec 2008, 09:54

yes. it was part of the RTP fest.
she is a senior vocalist from Vijayanagaram and presently in Hyderabad. I also think she is A graded artist of AIR Hyd.

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 16 Dec 2008, 09:58

It is so stressful to but read the review!

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 16 Dec 2008, 10:16

Bharath: That is quite a rhythmical structure indeed. Were the sub-beats of all the beats the same duration?

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 16 Dec 2008, 10:50

vk, i dont get ur question.

the tALam had 5 beats. each beat in a different naDai.

ta ki Ta ta ka di mi - ta ka ta ki Ta - ta ka di mi ta ka ta ki Ta - ta ka di mi - ta ki Ta

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 16 Dec 2008, 11:00

Bharath, I am asking if each of the sollus were the same duration. In other words, were the 5 beats different durations? It looks to be so but please confirm.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 16 Dec 2008, 11:21

yes. the 5 beats were for 5 different durations.

the beat of the laghu was 7 aksharams, misra nadai
little finger was 5 aksharams, kanda nadai
ring finger was 9 aksharams, sankeerna nadai
the beat of the drutam was 4 aksharams, catusra nadai
the wave was 3 aksharams, tisra nadai.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 16 Dec 2008, 11:31

Yup, got it. Thanks Bharath.

sbala · Post by **sbala** » 16 Dec 2008, 11:44

Just keeping the talam correctly itself is tough. Imagine singing all these ragas without losing sruthi or the arudhi. She was just fabulous.

On a side note, Narasimhan, father of Ravikiran, remarked that it should be called pancha jathi pallavi and not pancha nadai pallavi as in a nadai, one has to keep the kalapramanam same. While he may be partly right, I'm not sure if jathi is the right word to describe this kind of pallavi as it is associated only with Laghu.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 16 Dec 2008, 11:51

it is indeed a pancha nadai pallavi.

jaathi is suppose to indicate the number of fingers you count during the laghu. it was viloma tisra jathi rupaka talam. there was no change of jathi. it was only change in naDai and hence it should be called pancha nadai pallavi only...

kmrasika · Post by **kmrasika** » 16 Dec 2008, 12:06

I believe Cool Sir posted clips of her renditions somewhere on the board. She seems to like chhAyA ranjani very much; quite bold. Not very easy trying to descend correctly on the "g2."

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 16 Dec 2008, 13:42

I am (wildly) guessing that while singing kalpana swaras etc. etc., perhaps it becomes "easier" to treat the whole cycle as a 28 pulse cycle rather than a cycle of 5 beats with each one being in a different gait - as expressed by the tala kriyas. Even for 32 pulse adi, its not like the melody and rhythm always goes sarvalaghu in catusra gati all the time - you can have internal grouping that can result in similar kind of internal divisions(say 7+5+4+7+5+4 or 7+5+4+3+3+5+5).
So by simply looking it as 28 pulse cycle, it becomes "sort of" equivalent to taking tiSra tripuTa in catuSra gati (also 28) - and weaving complex internal patterns.

Note I am NOT trivializing the effort, but saying that perhaps looking it as a single tala with various internal gati switches (which it is not so I think - see below) makes it appear a hell of a lot more complex than it perhaps is to the performer. It certainly is a hell of a lot complex for me

- but that would be true for any RTP.

Also I am not sure one can discern the five naDais this way - after all for each "naDai" is represented you have just 1 beat before you go to the next one/ This perhaps gives raise to the question about why this is called "pancha-naDai". But panca-jAti seems less appropriate anyway. Of the two, pancha-naDai is a better fit - although maybe it over-promises(?)

Arun

sbala · Post by **sbala** » 16 Dec 2008, 17:00

I think thats what they do while singing. But, just putting the tala alone (no singing) without missing the kriyas for an hour presents a big challenge in itself. Atleast, I had to keep telling myself that the next one is mishram etc. The positive fallout was the audience knew that this wasn't their favourite Adi talam where they could show-off their clapping skills and wisely refrained from providing any rhythm support.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 16 Dec 2008, 23:51

Arun, I am with you about what they do in kalpanaswaram ( that they ignore the thala angas ) and also how one can treat it as a 28 beat cycle without a predominantly fixed internal anga division.

But if we view it that way by default, it does not leave room for recognizing the higher level periodic rhythmic structures in such RTPs.

At the minimum, in an RTP, the arudhi plays a major role in anchoring the rhythm and so the singer can not reorganize the 28 sub-beats arbitrarily while singing the pallavi. There is still that pUrvAngA/uttarAngA split that is to be obyed.

Secondly, since she has gone to this great trouble of specifying the 5 different groups for the 5 beats, I would expect that the laya of the pallavi will more or less match that structure. It is not just the grouping of sollus but I would expect some distinctive stress points of the laya coinciding with the beat points of the thala.

It may not be for the whole pallavi rendition, but I would think the first few times she sang the pallavi, she would have set up the rhythmic structure based on the Thala Kriya based division. That should be sufficient to establish the base upon which she can then vary it while keeping the arudhi anchor point and the subsequent kArvai.

It will be great if we can find a recording of this RTP and validate our speculations and hypothesis.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 17 Dec 2008, 02:18

On a side note, Narasimhan, father of Ravikiran, remarked that it should be called pancha jathi pallavi

Assuming Sri. Narasimhan views jAthi to be applicable only to the Laghu ( consistent with the general view ), one way to reconcile his statement is if the thala itself is considered to consist of 5 laghus. ( just theoretically speaking ). There is no such thala structure in the saptha thala classification but one does not have to necessarily limit our view to that. One observation is, in RTP construction, the arudhi normally falls on an anga type change and what does one do if all we have are laghus. I do not know if that is a rule or just a convention.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 17 Dec 2008, 07:51

Yes - I would certainly think the pallavi to "fit better" to the 7+5+9+4+3. This would be more so when it starts out, and of course to the arudhi. But IMO, one again should not expect the same level fit to remain (except for arudhi) so for every iteration as the artist applies manodharma. That is sort of like staying in strict sarvalaghu throughout - it would not allow for much variation and vidwat etc. which is more applicable for RTP. The fit certainly wont remain when the artist switches to tri-kalam and applies tisram etc. I actually think one of the challenges (and thus display of vidwat) taken on here is to put a talam that is "unconventional" to this - while applying permutations and combinations of a certain subset of 28 (or multiples of it) pulses. By subset I mean a set that leans favorably towards 7+5+9+4+3. But the permutations and combinations probably soon go beyond the "restrictions" of 7+5+9+4+3. But IMO in taking on that challenge of tala keeping, if someone focuses on the the beats of the talas "too much" (particularly viewing at a mixture of gatis), one is bound to (a) either mess up in melody or (b) be repetitive in the laya of the melody (i.e. go like sarvalaghu to the tala). Neither happens (most of the time) in a carnatic concert. For artists tala keeping is second nature. I was at a NSG concert yesterday - he rarely visually keeps tala but is always very much aware of it.

Arun

sbala · Post by **sbala** » 17 Dec 2008, 09:04

arunk wrote:For artists tala keeping is second nature. I was at a NSG concert yesterday - he rarely visually keeps tala but is always very much aware of it.

Arun

It's quite possible to not display an external manifestation of the tala with Adi or Rupakam or one of those other things that you have grown up with. I have seen many artistes do this when they sing krithis and its not tough. I have not seen many do that while singing swaras or neravals. But, unconventional talas definitely makes it more complex calling for intricate juggling skills.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 17 Dec 2008, 10:12

i would also agree that for uncommon talas one probably would need to put it - however it is possible it applies to talas whose cardinal count is uncommon (say miSra tripuTa). For complex RTPs like this one, I would think that doing the NSG approach would be perilous. But I still think that the tala keeping for the artists is way, way more in the background than it is for us rasikas (as well as amateurs).

BTW, NSG actually did it (or more accurately did NOT do it) also for misra chapu (besides adi, rupaka) and during "neraval" (it wasnt really neraval but sort of kanakku variations of the same line). He also did it for neraval (both speeds) for the adi krithis as well albeit not throughout. Obviously this is not a conscious decision - that is his style.

Arun

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 17 Dec 2008, 10:16

All this leads me to ask, rather seriously, layam exists and if no one keeps the thala externally, does the thala exist?

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 17 Dec 2008, 10:52

It depends on what we know as in "as we know it"

- it certainly exists but IMHO that it an external aid to laya which provides mile-markers that performers use to sync-up (e.g. arudhi, eduppu etc.). Also, just like RTPs, even in krithis the melody lines up with the angas better initially (as in first couple of sangatis) - perhaps indicative of how tala as an external aid helped in structuring the melody.

Arun

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 17 Dec 2008, 11:45

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 17 Dec 2008, 12:30

Thanks Arun. Actually I jumped the gun. That was going to be my second question

First question is: If the perfomer is rearranging the sub-beats ( sollus ) in to different groupings as manodharma demands, do beats exist then during such regroupings?
I think this question is more pertitent to the identity of this kind of nadai pallavi. But I have a feeling the answer may be same as what you had already stated.

sbala · Post by **sbala** » 17 Dec 2008, 15:00

arunk wrote: But I still think that the tala keeping for the artists is way, way more in the background than it is for us rasikas (as well as amateurs).
Arun

I will go to the extent of saying that most students would be able to render the alankaras in chatusra gathi without actually putting the talam. Infact, I would presume many of them would be able to render varnams and krithis without putting the talam. It's just a case of having sung them so many times and having gotten used to it. So, I really think singing kalpita sangitam without keeping talam is not that big a deal.

However, if a musician is able to do manodharma without actually keeping talam, then it is a truly special skill. I'm sure even established artistes would struggle if presented with a new talam or if you suddenly ask them to sing chatusra patterns in khanda gathi. They would still need some time to practise and internalise it. Infact, it is not that uncommon to see greats making mistakes in complex korvais. I was witness to Sanjay fumbling couple of times in a recent concert. But, he did pull it off the third time.
However, there are some people who are just specialists at these things and one can't help but admire their expertise.