Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

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univol
Posts: 6
Joined: 19 Jun 2010, 10:55

Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by univol »

Hello rasikas! My humble salutations to you all! :) I am a 19 year old 'man'. i have been learning carnatic music for few years now. right now i sing in 'A sharp' pitch. I've heard than boys of my age usually sing in C or C#. how is that that i am not able to do that? please convince me! But i even know few of my friends who sing in A. can i gradually raise my pitch to C or C# with constant practice or the pitch is fixed for each individual? The main thing is that the singer should be able to sing in all the three octaves with little effort right? can you guys please sort out these confusions for me!? I'll be really grateful!

[email protected]

VK RAMAN
Posts: 5009
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:29

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by VK RAMAN »

Try to sing at B and then at D thereafter switchover to C, IMHO

univol
Posts: 6
Joined: 19 Jun 2010, 10:55

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by univol »

Thank you Raman sir! I'll try that. I'd like to hear from more rasikas about my questions. Thank you once again! :tmi:

Nick H
Posts: 9473
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by Nick H »

You do not have to worry about your pitch: that is your accompanists' problem! :D

uvr
Posts: 7
Joined: 02 May 2009, 03:17

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by uvr »

univol wrote:I've heard than boys of my age usually sing in C or C#. how is that that i am not able to do that? ... can i gradually raise my pitch to C or C# with constant practice or the pitch is fixed for each individual? The main thing is that the singer should be able to sing in all the three octaves with little effort right?
At 19, you are way too young to consider your pitch "fixed." It is quite possible to change your pitch well into your late 20s (and perhaps even much beyond that) -- but please be sure about WHY you want to do this. What is the "problem" you are trying to solve? Are you just trying to "fit in"? Are you singing in a group with other singers and you are slotted as a singer who must sing 'at C/C#'? Why is it important to you what pitch other men sing at? If you are able to sing 'in all three octaves with little effort' as you put it, I would say you should be happy, the actual frequency of your Sa be damned! Speaking of which, what is the lowest and highest note you can produce (comfortably, with a natural, non-falsetto, voice) singing in A? If you're singing from mandra (lower) Ga to taara (higher) P without effort, maybe you can move your tanpura up to B or even C and simply use a false voice for notes below the lower Pa!

There do exist exercises you can do which will gradually change your pitch, but all of them will essentially require you to change your style/mechanism of voice production, something you should be very careful doing, because it might involve learning some things that are 'unnatural' (to you) and which could be very hard to unlearn should you need to do so. For example, singing "softer", or with more 'kaNTha' (throat) than naabhi (abdomen - literally, navel), and so on. A good (western) voice coach can teach you some tricks to increase your range in the higher octave, which is really what you're looking for here. But be careful -- the vocal chords are a super-sensitive organ and it's very easy to damage them in the pursuit of an unnecessary goal.

Note that, contrary to what you might hear from some quarters, it is not sufficient for changing your pitch just to set your tanpura to a different -- higher -- sruti and start singing 'normally'. The old adage about "if always you do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always gotten" applies to a 'T'.

Having said all this, I'd urge taking NickH's response seriously -- your pitch isn't an issue until you're singing or performing with accompanists. And then, for the most part, it's your accompanists' problem. Unless *you're* the accompanist! Are you?

Nick H
Posts: 9473
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by Nick H »

...the actual frequency of your Sa be damned!
Actually, I wanted to say something like that, but I could not have justified it with the technical weight and knowledge that uvr has posted.

It really doesn't sound to me like there is anything "wrong" with your pitch, but, if there is --- then surely it would be as much your teacher's problem as yours?

thenpaanan
Posts: 671
Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 19:45

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by thenpaanan »

Nick H wrote:Actually, I wanted to say something like that, but I could not have justified it with the technical weight and knowledge that uvr has posted.

It really doesn't sound to me like there is anything "wrong" with your pitch, but, if there is --- then surely it would be as much your teacher's problem as yours?
To add all this great advice, here is my little bit. C/C# happens to the current common pitch among men but that was not always true in the past, so there is nothing sacrosanct about this particular pitch. You should sing at all times at the pitch that makes your voice sound best/rich/smooth -- high or low does not matter. Of course "best" is a subjective term and if there is someone around to listen to you and help you choose that would be better (it is nearly impossible to be the judge of your own voice). The nearest approximation is to sing at the pitch that makes your voice feel comfortable at all parts of your natural range -- if you do it right you can even develop a feeling of well-being when singing. Most important, if singing at C/C# makes your throat hurt, stop. Typically (but not to be taken literally since there are exceptions) singing and talking should be no different exertion-wise (though it does not mean that you have to talk and sing at the same pitch).

If you want to get really serious about voice now or later, the most practical and complete advice in my opinion is at http://sadhanaschoolofarts.com/PDF/SonorousSound.pdf.

-Then Paanan

sramaswamy
Posts: 366
Joined: 24 May 2006, 22:29

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by sramaswamy »

I am singing with B as base shruthi now. That is because my teacher is asking me to, otherwise I will be singing lower. With this I am able to sing at mandhara sa reasonably well but have great trouble touching tarasthayi pa.

The general advice given is to choose a pitch with which you can comforably sing in the range of mandhara ma to tarasthyai pa. This will work as long as you do not need an accompanist. I have heard that accompanists have complained about not enough tension in mrudangam skin / violin strings tuned to these low pitches to play properly (tale heard about playing accompanist to MDR's low pitch). But other than that the pitch should hardly matter. In western you get the option to sing in bass, baritone ... according to your ability. Here you have the freedom to choose what you want.

This post(s) from an earlier thread might be of interest to you.

http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic. ... 720#p99720

VK RAMAN
Posts: 5009
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:29

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by VK RAMAN »

In western you get the option to sing in bass - we get to sing in bass also for bhajans e.g. palli kattu sabarimalaikku - let us not restrict bass for western music only.

univol
Posts: 6
Joined: 19 Jun 2010, 10:55

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by univol »

Thank you uvr sir, nick H! now i am more than satisfied to say that i sing at A/A#.
i chose to raise this topic because in the last moment of a music competition, i had to sing alone without the mrudanga because nobody had one with A/A# tuning, as sramaswami sir pointed out!

thank you everybody once again! :)

karthikbala
Posts: 221
Joined: 05 Feb 2010, 09:58

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by karthikbala »

Prepubescent castration was a method favoured in 18th and to a lesser extent, 19th century Italy which allowed boys to retain their high pitch and resulted in a unique kind of voice with amazing flexibility and power.

Nick H
Posts: 9473
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by Nick H »

I doubt that univol is considering going that far --- and if his pitch is already A/A#, it is probably quite a few years too late!

:lol:

hanquill
Posts: 49
Joined: 20 Jun 2010, 21:25

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by hanquill »

Re-pl help me with my pitch-I have heard {late} kvn-sangita kalanidhi- saying"if a student is able to sing in all the three octaves with ease" that is his pitch-he should not bother about what others sing. :) -hanquill

univol
Posts: 6
Joined: 19 Jun 2010, 10:55

Re: Someone please help me with my PITCH!!

Post by univol »

Nick H wrote:I doubt that univol is considering going that far --- and if his pitch is already A/A#, it is probably quite a few years too late!

:lol:
:o
:grin:
:grin:

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