S Sowmya - Tygaraja Day at Vani Mahal, Feb. 17th

[gopalank]

Sowmya, Narmada, J Vaidyanathan
Vani Mahal, T Nagar, Feb 17th, 6.30 pm

(All compositions of Tyagaraja)

Shri Ganapatini - Saurashtram (S)
Entamuddo - Bindumalini (S)
Upacharamu Jese - Bhairavi - Rupakam (RNS)
Okapari - Kalavati
Sukhi Evvaro - Kanada (RS)
Nenendu Vedagudura - Karnataka Behag
Shrikantanee - Bhavapriya
Rama Katha - Madhyamavati (RNST)
Sundara Dasaratha - Kapi
Shobhane (Utsava Sampradaya) - Pantuvarali (Madhyama sruti)
Kshira Sagara Vihara - Anandabhairavi (Madhyama sruti)
Ni Nama Rupamulaku (Mangalam) - Saurashtram

[vijay]

Thanks Gopalank...would've loved to be there but I would've missed a once-in-a-lifetime Patdeep...

BTW, when you say Madhyama Shruti, was the Tambura tuned to Madhyam? I thought this was done only in Hindustani. Also why is this done in a Ragam which contains the Panchamam, especially since the P-S relationship is quite significant in the raagam?

[cienu]

Thanks Gopalank...would've loved to be there but I would've missed a once-in-a-lifetime Patdeep...

BTW, when you say Madhyama Shruti, was the Tambura tuned to Madhyam? I thought this was done only in Hindustani. Also why is this done in a Ragam which contains the Panchamam, especially since the P-S relationship is quite significant in the raagam?

Vijay

Of the 4 strings that the Tambura has , the middle strings are tuned to the tonic note, Sa. The first string is tuned to the fifth perfect, Pa and the last, which is the bass string, to the tonic, Sa, an octave lower. When Madhyama Sruti compositions are sung, the playing of the first string is either completely stopped or it is tuned to the Suddha Madhyama. Normally in CM concerts it is the former and rarely do you see the tambura being re-tuned on the stage.

However with the Radel Shruthi Box which most artists use nowadays, you can actually set to Madhyama Sruthi (Sa , Ma , Sa) at the press of a button , while the tambura artist avoids Panchamam.

Essentially when you say Madhyama Sruthi , the singer treats "Ma" as the base note instead of "Sa" , thus nominally raising the level of the Sruthi. Certain Compositions when sung in Madhyama Sruti enhances the beauty of the song. (There is no hard and fast rule that only ragas that do not have Panchama should be sung in Madhyama Sruthi.) Ragas like Nadhanamkriya , Senjuruti , Kurinji ,Navroj etc lend themselves to be sung in Madhyama Sruthi naturally. Ofcourse singers also sing compositions in Madhyama Sruthi for the Ragas Yaman Kalyani , Kapi , Sindhu Bhairavi etc. The catch here is that while the beauty of the song does get enhanced , the singer should have the range ,confidence and perfection in the upper reaches. If it does come off well it is certainly a delight to hear.

There are ofcourse five/six string Tamburas used in some HM concerts , wherein I have heard that apart from Shadjamam and Panchama , Madhyama & Nishadam are also tuned! Again speaks a lot about the grinding in basics of Sruthi which HM musicians undergo!

[vijay]

Cienu thanks for your highly informed post! I may have a few follow-up Qs once I can breathe a little easier

[arasi]

Yes, Cienu, a lot of things I learnt today!

[jananee]

Vijay..i assume you are referirng to the concert of Sanjay at Hamsadhwani yesterday and the patdeep RTP...i heard a lot about this..any review on this and the other items?

[Sam Swaminathan]

cienu.........brilliant analysis and thank you for that.....

what about instrumentalists....take a violinist...he also needs to bring the "pa" down to "ma". As you have very correctly said, "ma" becomes the adhara "Sa" for the purposes of that song. So for example where he would have played "Sa Ri Ga Ma" he will have to play "Ma Pa Da Ni" based on the normal scale in the original "Sa" string....would this be correct ? Appreciate your clarification....

I am a violinist, but I have always refrained from attempting this, as I am unable to get the logic correct in my head !!

[vasanthakokilam]

If the song's sanchara does not go above the High Sa ( or there abouts ), then it makes sense to shift the Adhara Shadjam by 5 semi tones to the position occupied by Ma before. So, someone who normally sings at 1 katti, will be singing this at 4 Kattai. Same kind of logic applies to other kattais as well.

[vijay]

Thanks VK your clarification was useful. I was wondering how anyone could possibly sing at such a high pitch (well, maybe a Parveen Sulthana!)...I presume, then, the song would dictate this as much as the raga...

Also is the concept of Madhyama Shruti the same in HM (I've heard requests that go "Madhyam ka kucch sunaiye") or is that simply tuning the tambura to S-M instead of S-P? This was what I used to think before Cienu's explanation and I thought it made sense for ragas that either do not have panchamam (like Malkauns/Sriranjani) or which emphasize M1 over P...

[prashant]

[
There are ofcourse five/six string Tamburas used in some HM concerts , wherein I have heard that apart from Shadjamam and Panchama , Madhyama & Nishadam are also tuned! Again speaks a lot about the grinding in basics of Sruthi which HM musicians undergo!

It also says a lot about the concert pattern of HM where one rAgA is taken up for elaboration for a long time. Given the effort and care required to tune a tambura perfectily, such a tambura would be completely impractical for Carnatic music where a whole gamut of ragas are taken up and the tambura would have to be repeatedly retuned.

Also, I've sung with this type of tuning arrangement [where notes in addition than the shaDja or panCama are tuned], and to my personal taste, it's overkill big time. Each dwelling note in a rAgA need not be backed by a corresponding drone string - it's quite intrusive to the music in my personal opinion.

Where HM artistes really succeed is in bringing the tambura front and center into the concer experience - insisting on miking at an appropriate level for the tambura so it flows back to them on the monitor, and also so that the audience can orient themselves to the sruti , and also having their disciples / tambura artistes play the tambura sitting close to them so that they are enveloped in a cocoon of sruti. Sometimes in CM concerts, we see the tambura artiste sitting so far away from the main artiste that the tambura sound carries far less than it could. The tambura should be in the thick of the action just like all other instruments on stage.

[vijay]

Yes I too agree with Prashant and Cienu that CM folk needs to pay more attention to Sruti. I've heard that artistes don't prefer Sruthi to be amplified because they are worried about their apaswaras being caught out! The effect of Tambura in an HM concert is quite haunting especially during the Vilambit alaapana. It is an example that CM would do well to follow.

But I agree that too many drone strings would be an irritation. After all a hint should stop short of being the solution itself! I also find the Surmandal somewhat irritating especially when used repeatedly...

[cienu]

Very true Prashant , tuning swaras other than Sa and Pa on the Tambura would hardly suit the format of a Carnatic Music Concert.

Regarding your other point about the inaudible Sruti in CM concerts , I think that this was also mentioned by TMK in his interview to the Sruti Space Channel that the audience needs to hear the Tambura more.

[rajeshnat]

A very brief review as I was also there in the concert .

Sowmya definitely presented a rich classical cm concert . Particularly liked the upachAramu JesE in bhairavi as it is almost not heard these days. Liked her kAnaDA very much , that too when she delivered kind of mmi crescendo in swaras towards the end . Her rAma katha sudha was just good , All the tukkadas were excellent . Certainly during her kAmavardhini and Anandabhairavi rendition, I was able to spot despite Smt Somya singing in madhyama shruti, unlike in one concert where thiruvAryaru Sekar sang a madhyama shruti sowrAshtram , where I thought it was shenjuruTTi. Sometimes I just keep wondering why there is a madhyama sruti concept in CM, as I feel I need another head to get those googlies of CM.

Smt narmadA (MSG's daughter)was just good .JV's play in the concert was excellent , but however his tani was just plain. Overall a very good concert.

Just a quick question
-----------------------------
I have heard few madhyama sruthi googlies only during tukkadas. Is it usually only sung during tukkadas?

[cienu]

I have heard few madhyama sruthi googlies only during tukkadas. Is it usually only sung during tukkadas?

Yes, Songs with Madhyama Sruthi are generally sung towards the end of the concerts. These are the type of songs which mesmerize the newcomers and bring them into the Carnatic fold. Secondly as the Sruthi is higher not more than one or two songs are sung in Madhyama Sruthi (as the strain on the voice proportionately increases)

[cienu]

So for example where he would have played "Sa Ri Ga Ma" he will have to play "Ma Pa Da Ni" based on the normal scale in the original "Sa" string....would this be correct ? Appreciate your clarification....
I am a violinist, but I have always refrained from attempting this, as I am unable to get the logic correct in my head !!

Hello Sam,

As VK mentions there would be a shift of 5 semi tones from every note.Therfore it will not be Ma Pa Da Ni always for all ragas uniformly.

Hence, if we were to revert back to the original "Sa" as the reference point the notes would be as below. (I have illustrated for 4 Ragas)

Mayamalavagowla - SR1G2M1 - M1M2D2N1
Kalyani - SR2G2M2 - M1PD2N2
Sankarabharanam - SR2G2M1 - M1PD2N1
Todi - SR1G1M1 - M1M2D1N1

[vasanthakokilam]

I have heard few madhyama sruthi googlies only during tukkadas. Is it usually only sung during tukkadas?

Yes, Songs with Madhyama Sruthi are generally sung towards the end of the concerts. These are the type of songs which mesmerize the newcomers and bring them into the Carnatic fold. Secondly as the Sruthi is higher not more than one or two songs are sung in Madhyama Sruthi (as the strain on the voice proportionately increases)

But the fundamental reason is that those songs do not have wide sancharams. Because of that, they will not be suitable for main or sub-main. Also, from an aesthetic point of view, it is better to do it towards the end since it is quite a major change. But then we are conditioned to that as music lislenters and concert goers.

Cienu: Though what you are saying about 'strain on the voice' is true in theory, because the songs do not go too high, that is really not the primary issue. Do you agree?

Regarding tampura sounds other than Sa and Pa, our Akella Sharmaji had written a few times that the pa should be turned off for songs that do not have Pa and if there is a Ma, the tampura should play the Ma note instead. I can not find that post readily now. If someone else can find it, it will be useful to link it here.

[arunk]

While the typical usage of sa-ma-sa drone is for mdayama-sruthi (i.e. shift tonic to ma) songs that span a limited range, this sa-ma-sa "tuning" is/can-be also used for two other cases
1. ragas that skip panchamam
2. Ragas (even those that have pa) where ma, and sa-ma pairing is heavily accentuated

In both cases, the tonic remains in the original sa - so this is not "madyama sruthi".

For the first case, you have hindolam and srIranjani. While most do sing these with the sa-pa-sa. they are also sung with sa-ma-sa. Atleast I remember a BMK (jugalbandi) concert where he switched to sa-ma-sa for hindolam. But it threw me off and I thought he was going to sing suddha-dhanyasi - because I thought the sruthi had shifted to madyama sruthi when it didnt. I had posted about this earlier in some other thread.

For the second case, kuntalavarali. While I have not heard it in a concert, I have tried singing one of the songs I know with a sa-ma-sa tuning and it has a nice effect - somehow makes me (a rank amateur) have a better grip on the sruthi. Note that this song (and other songs) do as high as tara pancamam - i.e. not limited range, but then again as mentioned above we are not shifting sruthi here and so this is sort of a moot point.

Arun

[vijay]

Thanks Arun! Another excellent post in what is developing into a great thread! VK would be reat if someone could trace Sharmaji's post!

[venkatpv]

Manirangu is also sung in madhyama shruti... have heard a couple of renditions.

[cienu]

VK ,

You are right. When I mentioned that Ragas like Nadanamakriya , Senjuruti , Kuruji etc lend themselves to be sung in Madhyama Sruthi , it is because of this reason . that their range is not expansive.

Regarding voice , I would say that in some ragas & compositions , like for example , let us take Jagadhodharana in Kapi. At the highest point , the Anupallavi and Charanam1 , Jagadhodhaarana.... & Anoraneeyana..... would be as follows:
Madhyamam: N1N1 N1N1 N1 P PN1SR2S which would correspond to the orginal base note Shadjamam as G1G1 G1G1 G1 S SG1M1PM1 in the higher octave.

Depending on the condition of the voice the singer may decide not to sing that particular sangathi , particularly as the concert is drawing to a close ! But I agree with you that while this may be a reason , it is not the main reason.

The view of Akkela Sharmaji that "PA" should be turned off for songs not having panchamam is extremely apt. Arunk has also made the same point. Let us take for example the raga Ranjani . A shrewd tambura vidwan will avoid playing panchamam string though the Sruthi is still in Shadjamam and NOT changed to Madhyamam. However I have not heard any artist singing such Ragas to a "SA" MA" SA" drone (while still in Shadjamam Sruti). Should be an interesting attempt as Arunk has mentioned.

BTW which was the song you attempted in Kuntalavarali , Arun?

[arunk]

BTW which was the song you attempted in Kuntalavarali , Arun?

cienu - it was antaryAmi, the annamayya composition.

Arun

[Suji Ram]

Let us take for example the raga Ranjani . A shrewd tambura vidwan will avoid playing panchamam string though the Sruthi is still in Shadjamam and NOT changed to Madhyamam. However I have not heard any artist singing such Ragas to a "SA" MA" SA" drone (while still in Shadjamam Sruti).

But here it is M2 in ranjani.

Maybe the posts in this thread should be moved to sangeeta kalalaya. Otherwise it will be buried in concert reviews.

[arunk]

yep. sa-ma-sa with ma=m1 would not gell well with a raga like ranjani that has m2 and no pa. I would suspect it would have the same "disturbance" as sa-pa-sa - perhaps worse (since pa blends with sa better than ma).

Arun

[Sam Swaminathan]

Thanks Cienu....I am going to try this in my next practice session...I can see my cat is in trouble again !!

[kartikbala]

Bhageshri is another ragam that sounds good when sa-ma-sa tuning is used, and still sung in shadjam shruti.

[prashant]

Yes I too agree with Prashant and Cienu that CM folk needs to pay more attention to Sruti. I've heard that artistes don't prefer Sruthi to be amplified because they are worried about their apaswaras being caught out! The effect of Tambura in an HM concert is quite haunting especially during the Vilambit alaapana. It is an example that CM would do well to follow.

But I agree that too many drone strings would be an irritation. After all a hint should stop short of being the solution itself! I also find the Surmandal somewhat irritating especially when used repeatedly...

Artistes need not and should not be afraid! An intelligent, dedicated tambura artiste can enhance a concert greatly. The responsibility of such an artiste is not just to keep the tambura in tune but to be attuned to what the artiste is singing and make subtle changes to either their strumming or the orientation of the vAdyam. I've noticed in Sri Vijay Siva's concerts that when he dwells on the panCamam or tAra shaDjam, one of his disciples will lean the tambura forward and play a bit louder so that that he can have more sruti support as he hits the high note. Some of Sri TMK's disciples also do this very intelligently. In this case, this is good coaching by these top vidvans and excellent execution by their disciples. Definitely a trend to be followed.

[rajumds]

Regarding tampura sounds other than Sa and Pa, our Akella Sharmaji had written a few times that the pa should be turned off for songs that do not have Pa and if there is a Ma, the tampura should play the Ma note instead. I can not find that post readily now. If someone else can find it, it will be useful to link it here.

http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=1577&p=2
http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=1295

[vijay]

Thanks!

[vasanthakokilam]

Thanks rajumds.

[martin]

..When Madhyama Sruti compositions are sung, the playing of the first string is either completely stopped or it is tuned to the Suddha Madhyama. Normally in CM concerts it is the former and rarely do you see the tambura being re-tuned on the stage....

Yes I have been wondering about that. Sometimes it happened that when I played for carnatic artists who asked me to skip pa.
I was under the notion that this is based on the idea that it would take too long or whatever..but it sounds very poor to me. Other musicians, having more faith or patience, allowed me to retune pa to ma and were initially amazed that this could be done so quickly. From my part, I would never want to miss that incredibly rich sound of a Ma sa sa Sa tuning in the appropriate ragas. Indeed, changing pa to ma on a synthesizerbox is easy, which is why some musicians just leave it out from the real tanpura which is then more or less reduced to background..
I refer to the entry in wikipedia, which I edited and added original text, where some of these matters are addressed.
As an illustration, I sum up the varieties of tuning that I have used in the past, mind you, even in the basic PssS and MssS tunings there are many subtle differences - but that is the meta-tuning part. So this refers strictly to the fundamental pitches.
Using 4 string large vocal tanpura: PssS, MssS, NssS (shuddh and komal N) DssS (shuddh Dha) or 5881,4881,7881,6881. A komal dha is also possible but it is very critical and of a haunting nature and I have never played nor heared it in public.
Using 5-string short scale instruments that sound at the upper octave: 58881, 48881, 57881, 47881 both komal and shuddh ni, which are varieties in use for accompanying stringplaying soloists.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tambura#India